On 9/15/2017 6:16 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> On 9/15/2017 4:58 PM, Gary wrote:
>> Bruce wrote:
>>>
>>> Gary wrote:
>>>> If all you can be is a dishwasher, try learning a decent skill
>>>> for a better job.
>>>
>>> Is that compulsory?
>>
>> Not at all. There's always the welfare option for the terminally
>> lazy. We have plenty of them around.
>>
> Please don't encourage him.Â* BTW, if you don't have underage children
> residing with you, welfare isn't an option in most states.
>
> Jill

They are the ones going for disability. Your SS money at work.

On 9/15/2017 5:33 PM, dsi1 wrote:

>
> My daughter's boyfriend wants to buy her a car. It was a used BMW that his uncle was selling. I figure an older BMW 3-series would suit her and the baby fine. I was wrong, it wasn't a 3-series. Far from it. I wouldn't mind owning this car for a couple of years but the truth is that I don't have the ability to care for it properly. It needs an owner that's willing to spend a lot of dough on it and pamper it and preserve it for the future. Not bad for a 22 year old car. It's the same age as her boyfriend.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xFbe9Y85pc
>

That would be expensive to own even if free, but it would be fun to have.

On 9/15/2017 5:06 PM, Ding - Dong Daddy wrote:

>>>
>>> One needn't be a Mensa member to make a living wage as a plumber's
>>> helper, while over time they can learn to be more than just a helper
>>
>> Yes, Sheldon. We all know you would prefer everyone to work in a
>> factory or as a plumber's or electricians apprentice. That's fine hard
>> work if you can get it. Unfortunately, those jobs aren't available
>> everywhere.
>
>
> Then people need to migrate to where the jobs are...
>
>

True, but where is that? I wonder what is happening to wages in the
countries that have a large influx of refugees. I doubt employers are
going to increase what they pay for the menial jobs.

"jmcquown" > wrote in message
news
> On 9/15/2017 4:58 PM, Gary wrote:
>> Bruce wrote:
>>>
>>> Gary wrote:
>>>> If all you can be is a dishwasher, try learning a decent skill
>>>> for a better job.
>>>
>>> Is that compulsory?
>>
>> Not at all. There's always the welfare option for the terminally
>> lazy. We have plenty of them around.
>>
> Please don't encourage him. BTW, if you don't have underage children
> residing with you, welfare isn't an option in most states.
>
> Jill


If you consider food stamps/cards and help with rent to be welfare, many
states have the option.

Cheri

"Bruce" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 09:43:46 -0400, wrote:
>

>>One needn't be a Mensa member to make a living wage as a plumber's
>>helper, while over time they can learn to be more than just a helper
>>and eventually get licensed and earn as much as most MDs.
>
> I don't know what an MD is, but not everybody has the ability to
> become a plumber.

Medical Doctor.

Cheri

"notbob" > wrote in message
...
> On 2017-09-15, jmcquown > wrote:
>
>> I was doing fine but lived modestly.
>
> Not a crime, unlike what some would have you believe. I think most of
> us, here, have been in the same situation at some point in out lives.
>
> I know I have, and I still am. I now have a home that I own, but
> I still watch my budget, cuz it's damn CLOSE!
>
> nb
>


Yes, as I say, I've been poor and I've been not so poor, but never been
rich...though I wouldn't mind trying it out.

Cheri

"Ding - Dong Daddy" > wrote in message
speaking of finding better jobs

> Then people need to migrate to where the jobs are...
>
>
> --
> Best
> Greg


And to where they can afford the rent, not some high end areas like San
Francisco, Manhattan etc.

Cheri

On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 17:42:07 -0700, "Cheri" >
wrote:

>"Bruce" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 09:43:46 -0400, wrote:
>>
>
>>>One needn't be a Mensa member to make a living wage as a plumber's
>>>helper, while over time they can learn to be more than just a helper
>>>and eventually get licensed and earn as much as most MDs.
>>
>> I don't know what an MD is, but not everybody has the ability to
>> become a plumber.
>
>Medical Doctor.
>
>Cheri

Brucie not knowing what's an MD solidifies for me he's an uneducated
welfare bum.

On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 17:45:56 -0700, "Cheri" >
wrote:

>"Ding - Dong Daddy" > wrote in message
>speaking of finding better jobs
>
>> Then people need to migrate to where the jobs are...
>>
>>
>> --
>> Best
>> Greg
>
>
>And to where they can afford the rent, not some high end areas like San
>Francisco, Manhattan etc.
>
>Cheri

Where I live very nice housing is very resonably priced (a nice house
on a few acres will go for about 150K), and there's good employment
oportunities if one has marketable skills... even driving a truck to
deliver propane or home heating oil pays a nice living wage. However
a 25 year old with a Phd in philosophy will spend the next forty years
living in their parent's basement... I consider those types severely
mentally deficient/handicapped/worthless dreck.

On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 17:42:07 -0700, "Cheri" >
wrote:

>"Bruce" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 09:43:46 -0400, wrote:
>>
>
>>>One needn't be a Mensa member to make a living wage as a plumber's
>>>helper, while over time they can learn to be more than just a helper
>>>and eventually get licensed and earn as much as most MDs.
>>
>> I don't know what an MD is, but not everybody has the ability to
>> become a plumber.
>
>Medical Doctor.

Thanks.

On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 21:02:22 -0400, wrote:

>On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 17:42:07 -0700, "Cheri" >
>wrote:
>
>>"Bruce" > wrote in message
. ..
>>> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 09:43:46 -0400, wrote:
>>>
>>
>>>>One needn't be a Mensa member to make a living wage as a plumber's
>>>>helper, while over time they can learn to be more than just a helper
>>>>and eventually get licensed and earn as much as most MDs.
>>>
>>> I don't know what an MD is, but not everybody has the ability to
>>> become a plumber.
>>
>>Medical Doctor.
>>
>>Cheri
>
>Brucie not knowing what's an MD solidifies for me he's an uneducated
>welfare bum.

How many languages do you speak?

On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 2:19:26 PM UTC-10, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> That would be expensive to own even if free, but it would be fun to have.

It's a beauty alright but it's not a good idea to give it to a kid. The last time I lent them my truck, it was left with an exploded radiator and no brakes. I had to go retrieve it late at night.

https://www.amazon.com/photos/share/...qzaDRQItAZtILP

> wrote in message
...

> Where I live very nice housing is very resonably priced (a nice house
> on a few acres will go for about 150K), and there's good employment
> oportunities if one has marketable skills... even driving a truck to
> deliver propane or home heating oil pays a nice living wage. However
> a 25 year old with a Phd in philosophy will spend the next forty years
> living in their parent's basement... I consider those types severely
> mentally deficient/handicapped/worthless dreck.


Yes, I've told you many times that you have a beautiful set up.

Cheri

On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:12:48 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
> >>
> >> >Bruce wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
> >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
> >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
> >> >
> >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
> >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
> >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
> >>
> >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
> >> of town.
> >
> >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
> >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
> >in many urban areas.
> >
> >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
> >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
> >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
> >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
> >other living expenses?
> >
> >You are simply not being realistic.
>
> Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
> woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
> accept a very long commute.

Somebody has to live as a dishwasher in those cities.

Ok, let's try something different. A small Midwestern college town.
One bedroom apartments in Ann Arbor are about $1,000 per month.
(Oddly enough, studio apartments are $1,200, but that's probably
about proximity to campus.) At $10 per hour, take-home pay here is
$692 a month. Nope, can't even make rent. The "magic" number that
lefties are agitating for is $15 per hour. That would be a take-home
pay of $1004 per month. Now 100% of the paycheck is going to rent.

The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.

Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
better than dishwasher in a restaurant.

Cindy Hamilton

On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:17:22 PM UTC-4, Gary wrote:
> Bruce wrote:
> >
> > On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > > wrote:
> >
> > >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> > >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> >Bruce wrote:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
> > >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
> > >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
> > >> >
> > >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
> > >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
> > >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
> > >>
> > >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
> > >> of town.
> > >
> > >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
> > >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
> > >in many urban areas.
> > >
> > >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
> > >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
> > >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
> > >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
> > >other living expenses?
> > >
> > >You are simply not being realistic.
> >
> > Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
> > woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
> > accept a very long commute.
>
> If all you can be is a dishwasher, try learning a decent skill
> for a better job.

Not everybody can do that. Some people simply do not have the
intellectual capacity for a better job. Luckily, they probably
don't have to rent their own apartment, either.

Cindy Hamilton

On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 03:50:33 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:12:48 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Bruce wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
>> >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
>> >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
>> >> >
>> >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
>> >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
>> >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
>> >>
>> >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
>> >> of town.
>> >
>> >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
>> >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
>> >in many urban areas.
>> >
>> >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
>> >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
>> >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
>> >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
>> >other living expenses?
>> >
>> >You are simply not being realistic.
>>
>> Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
>> woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
>> accept a very long commute.
>
>Somebody has to live as a dishwasher in those cities.
>
>Ok, let's try something different. A small Midwestern college town.
>One bedroom apartments in Ann Arbor are about $1,000 per month.
>(Oddly enough, studio apartments are $1,200, but that's probably
>about proximity to campus.) At $10 per hour, take-home pay here is
>$692 a month. Nope, can't even make rent. The "magic" number that
>lefties are agitating for is $15 per hour. That would be a take-home
>pay of $1004 per month. Now 100% of the paycheck is going to rent.
>
>The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
>in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
>1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
>apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.
>
>Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
>by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
>better than dishwasher in a restaurant.

I'm not saying that's not happening. I'm saying it's wrong. I'm also
not saying it's only wrong in the US. It may be wrong in many
countries.

I still say that if you give 40 working hours a week to a job, you
should be able to live off it, no matter how modestly. But without
roommates and with health insurance.

Maybe restaurant prices in Michigan have to go up. Maybe certain
things are so cheap because the poor are being exploited. Maybe there
shouldn't be such a thing as a $1 hamburger.

On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 7:02:54 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 03:50:33 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:12:48 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> >> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >Bruce wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
> >> >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
> >> >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
> >> >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
> >> >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
> >> >>
> >> >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
> >> >> of town.
> >> >
> >> >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
> >> >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
> >> >in many urban areas.
> >> >
> >> >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
> >> >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
> >> >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
> >> >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
> >> >other living expenses?
> >> >
> >> >You are simply not being realistic.
> >>
> >> Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
> >> woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
> >> accept a very long commute.
> >
> >Somebody has to live as a dishwasher in those cities.
> >
> >Ok, let's try something different. A small Midwestern college town.
> >One bedroom apartments in Ann Arbor are about $1,000 per month.
> >(Oddly enough, studio apartments are $1,200, but that's probably
> >about proximity to campus.) At $10 per hour, take-home pay here is
> >$692 a month. Nope, can't even make rent. The "magic" number that
> >lefties are agitating for is $15 per hour. That would be a take-home
> >pay of $1004 per month. Now 100% of the paycheck is going to rent.
> >
> >The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
> >in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
> >1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
> >apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.
> >
> >Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
> >by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
> >better than dishwasher in a restaurant.
>
> I'm not saying that's not happening. I'm saying it's wrong. I'm also
> not saying it's only wrong in the US. It may be wrong in many
> countries.
>
> I still say that if you give 40 working hours a week to a job, you
> should be able to live off it, no matter how modestly. But without
> roommates and with health insurance.

"Should". Well, there's a lotta should, but we have to live in the
real world.

What's the problem (not your problem, but in general) with having
to have a roommate? I had three different roommates when I
was younger (four, technically, since I shared an apartment with
a boyfriend-girlfriend pair). Two of them were after I divorced
my first husband and couldn't make ends meet without them. They
were people I already knew, not some stranger answering a classified
ad.

> Maybe restaurant prices in Michigan have to go up. Maybe certain
> things are so cheap because the poor are being exploited. Maybe there
> shouldn't be such a thing as a $1 hamburger.

Places with a $1 hamburger don't have dishwashers, because they don't
have dishes. Places with a $10 hamburger probably pay their dishwashers
above-average pay for dishwashers, to be able to hire the very best
dishwasher they can.

Of course the poor are exploited. That's nothing new. They are less
exploited than at any other time in history.

Cindy Hamilton

On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 04:13:45 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 7:02:54 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 03:50:33 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:12:48 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
>> >> >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
>> >> >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
>> >> >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
>> >> >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
>> >> >> of town.
>> >> >
>> >> >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
>> >> >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
>> >> >in many urban areas.
>> >> >
>> >> >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
>> >> >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
>> >> >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
>> >> >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
>> >> >other living expenses?
>> >> >
>> >> >You are simply not being realistic.
>> >>
>> >> Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
>> >> woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
>> >> accept a very long commute.
>> >
>> >Somebody has to live as a dishwasher in those cities.
>> >
>> >Ok, let's try something different. A small Midwestern college town.
>> >One bedroom apartments in Ann Arbor are about $1,000 per month.
>> >(Oddly enough, studio apartments are $1,200, but that's probably
>> >about proximity to campus.) At $10 per hour, take-home pay here is
>> >$692 a month. Nope, can't even make rent. The "magic" number that
>> >lefties are agitating for is $15 per hour. That would be a take-home
>> >pay of $1004 per month. Now 100% of the paycheck is going to rent.
>> >
>> >The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
>> >in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
>> >1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
>> >apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.
>> >
>> >Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
>> >by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
>> >better than dishwasher in a restaurant.
>>
>> I'm not saying that's not happening. I'm saying it's wrong. I'm also
>> not saying it's only wrong in the US. It may be wrong in many
>> countries.
>>
>> I still say that if you give 40 working hours a week to a job, you
>> should be able to live off it, no matter how modestly. But without
>> roommates and with health insurance.
>
>"Should". Well, there's a lotta should, but we have to live in the
>real world.

That doesn't mean we can't try to improve things.

>What's the problem (not your problem, but in general) with having
>to have a roommate? I had three different roommates when I
>was younger (four, technically, since I shared an apartment with
>a boyfriend-girlfriend pair). Two of them were after I divorced
>my first husband and couldn't make ends meet without them. They
>were people I already knew, not some stranger answering a classified
>ad.

For an adult, it should be a temporary thing. Like it was in your
case.

>> Maybe restaurant prices in Michigan have to go up. Maybe certain
>> things are so cheap because the poor are being exploited. Maybe there
>> shouldn't be such a thing as a $1 hamburger.
>
>Places with a $1 hamburger don't have dishwashers, because they don't
>have dishes. Places with a $10 hamburger probably pay their dishwashers
>above-average pay for dishwashers, to be able to hire the very best
>dishwasher they can.
>
>Of course the poor are exploited. That's nothing new. They are less
>exploited than at any other time in history.

So? What a lame excuse.

"Cheri" wrote:
><penmart01 wrote:
>
>> Where I live very nice housing is very resonably priced (a nice house
>> on a few acres will go for about 150K), and there's good employment
>> oportunities if one has marketable skills... even driving a truck to
>> deliver propane or home heating oil pays a nice living wage. However
>> a 25 year old with a Phd in philosophy will spend the next forty years
>> living in their parent's basement... I consider those types severely
>> mentally deficient/handicapped/worthless dreck.
>
>Yes, I've told you many times that you have a beautiful set up.
>
>Cheri

Yes, but that wasn't about me.

> wrote in message
...
> "Cheri" wrote:
>><penmart01 wrote:
>>
>>> Where I live very nice housing is very resonably priced (a nice house
>>> on a few acres will go for about 150K), and there's good employment
>>> oportunities if one has marketable skills... even driving a truck to
>>> deliver propane or home heating oil pays a nice living wage. However
>>> a 25 year old with a Phd in philosophy will spend the next forty years
>>> living in their parent's basement... I consider those types severely
>>> mentally deficient/handicapped/worthless dreck.
>>
>>Yes, I've told you many times that you have a beautiful set up.
>>
>>Cheri
>
> Yes, but that wasn't about me.


What? "Where I live very nice housing is very reasonably priced" is not
about you? If not you, then who is it about?

Cheri

Dave Smith wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On 2017-09-15 3:42 PM, notbob wrote:
> >On 2017-09-15, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
> >
>
> > OTOH, a Hawaiian fast food take-out opened in Livermore (where I
> > usta live, in the SFBA) jes before I moved. Looked like a fast-food
> > Chinese take-out. I never bothered. Too heavy on the rice.
>
> I was puzzled about why someone would open a Hawaiian restaurant in
> our town. It never appealed to me, but I went there and gave it a
> try. It was a major disappointment. Just about everyone I know who
> has been there has been there was as disappointed as I was. It's been
> there for more than two years now and that surprises me.
>
> My disappointment was for a number of reasons. The first two are in
> connection to the serving sizes. I had a tiny piece of mahi mahi, I
> would say less than two ounces of fish. OTOH, there were two big
> piles of starchy food, a huge scoop of rice and a huge scoop of
> potato salad. The third problem is not Hawaiian food, but about the
> bed of greens the fish was served on. They were soggy, dark and
> stinky. Half the greens were downright rotten.
>
>
>
> >
> > Other than coconuts and poi, jes what have the Hawaiians given us,
> > cuisine wise? Don't not even mention Spam!
> >
>
> There cuisine is so bad that they actually like Spam.

Sounds like that one place was bad. The cuisine however is generally
loaded differently there so that may have been part of the issue you
had. True Hawaiian eating was based (like all) on what was available
and that meant more starch, fruit, and vegetable, and less meat
(includes fish there). Outside influences have shifted 'what the
starch etc. are', but the basic balance is still there.

The rule of thumb is the average westerner will eat 1/2- 2/3 C rice
with a meal. The average Asian (includes Hawaii) will eat 1-2C *per
meal*.

Although very area dependent in USA (excepting Hawaii), I think it's
fair to say as an average that most have rice once a month? A lot have
it more often but i think that balances with those who have it once a
year. In Hawaii and at least eastern Asia, it would be odd to have a
day without rice (and in parts of Asia, any meal without rice).

The greens on that plate may have been kelp...

--

dsi1 wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 11:34:55 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:
> >
> > I was puzzled about why someone would open a Hawaiian restaurant in
> > our town. It never appealed to me, but I went there and gave it a
> > try. It was a major disappointment. Just about everyone I know who
> > has been there has been there was as disappointed as I was. It's
> > been there for more than two years now and that surprises me.
> >
> > My disappointment was for a number of reasons. The first two are in
> > connection to the serving sizes. I had a tiny piece of mahi mahi, I
> > would say less than two ounces of fish. OTOH, there were two big
> > piles of starchy food, a huge scoop of rice and a huge scoop of
> > potato salad. The third problem is not Hawaiian food, but about
> > the bed of greens the fish was served on. They were soggy, dark
> > and stinky. Half the greens were downright rotten.
> >
> > There cuisine is so bad that they actually like Spam.
>
> Next time, don't get the mahimahi. You're really taking a chance with
> Hawaiian fish on the mainland. I wouldn't order it on this rock
> either - unless it was poke. If I was operating a restaurant on the
> mainland, I'd make it suitable for mainlanders - rice tends to gross
> them out. Too much starches grosses them out. White folks would
> automatically get the haole plate. Potatoes and a tossed salad. Also,
> don't ever eat that greens stuff under the fried food. I sure
> wouldn't. That would gross me out.

LOL! Better not feed ME the Haole version!

--

On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 04:13:45 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 7:02:54 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 03:50:33 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:12:48 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
>> >> >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
>> >> >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
>> >> >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
>> >> >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
>> >> >> of town.
>> >> >
>> >> >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
>> >> >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
>> >> >in many urban areas.
>> >> >
>> >> >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
>> >> >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
>> >> >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
>> >> >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
>> >> >other living expenses?
>> >> >
>> >> >You are simply not being realistic.
>> >>
>> >> Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
>> >> woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
>> >> accept a very long commute.
>> >
>> >Somebody has to live as a dishwasher in those cities.
>> >
>> >Ok, let's try something different. A small Midwestern college town.
>> >One bedroom apartments in Ann Arbor are about $1,000 per month.
>> >(Oddly enough, studio apartments are $1,200, but that's probably
>> >about proximity to campus.) At $10 per hour, take-home pay here is
>> >$692 a month. Nope, can't even make rent. The "magic" number that
>> >lefties are agitating for is $15 per hour. That would be a take-home
>> >pay of $1004 per month. Now 100% of the paycheck is going to rent.
>> >
>> >The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
>> >in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
>> >1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
>> >apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.
>> >
>> >Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
>> >by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
>> >better than dishwasher in a restaurant.
>>
>> I'm not saying that's not happening. I'm saying it's wrong. I'm also
>> not saying it's only wrong in the US. It may be wrong in many
>> countries.
>>
>> I still say that if you give 40 working hours a week to a job, you
>> should be able to live off it, no matter how modestly. But without
>> roommates and with health insurance.
>
>"Should". Well, there's a lotta should, but we have to live in the
>real world.
>
>What's the problem (not your problem, but in general) with having
>to have a roommate?

I spent 4 years living with about 400 roommates. My small living
space was shared by about 40 roommates. I had a narrow bunk in a
space too small to sit up in bed. often sleeping on a hard floor was
more comfortable... and everything I owned had to fit into a 4 cu ft
locker. The bathroom was down the hall and I don't remember ever
being in the bathroom with less than a half dozen roommates. I
worked my ass off in a hot kitchen for as many hours as required and
was paid $82/mo. Yes, I could eat all I wanted and got free medical.
I received no protection from the US Constitution, instead I was
subject to the UCMJ: http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/ucmj.htm

>I had three different roommates when I
>was younger (four, technically, since I shared an apartment with
>a boyfriend-girlfriend pair). Two of them were after I divorced
>my first husband and couldn't make ends meet without them. They
>were people I already knew, not some stranger answering a classified
>ad.
>
>> Maybe restaurant prices in Michigan have to go up. Maybe certain
>> things are so cheap because the poor are being exploited. Maybe there
>> shouldn't be such a thing as a $1 hamburger.

I don't consider those $1 hamburgers an adult portion, they are barely
a sufficient meal for a one year old toddler.

>Places with a $1 hamburger don't have dishwashers, because they don't
>have dishes. Places with a $10 hamburger probably pay their dishwashers
>above-average pay for dishwashers, to be able to hire the very best
>dishwasher they can.

Fast food employees can very easily be replaced with vending
machines... In fact when I visited someone in small community hospital
a few months ago there was a cafeteria with all foods (hot/cold)
dispensed from vending machines... I bought a saw-seege n' pepper on a
roll for $2, was as good as from any deli. I wish they'd bring back
the Automat and get rid of all the fercocktah fast foods, Harn &
Hardart served excellent food from vending machines:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horn_%26_Hardart
I've changed my mind, no burger flipper is worth more than $1.50/hr.

>Of course the poor are exploited. That's nothing new. They are less
>exploited than at any other time in history.
>
>Cindy Hamilton

Today the poor are exploiting the system/taxpayer... they must like
being poor, otiose and unproductive.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/otiose

On 9/16/2017 7:13 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 7:02:54 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:


>>> The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
>>> in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
>>> 1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
>>> apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.
>>>
>>> Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
>>> by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
>>> better than dishwasher in a restaurant.
>>
>> I'm not saying that's not happening. I'm saying it's wrong. I'm also
>> not saying it's only wrong in the US. It may be wrong in many
>> countries.
>>
>> I still say that if you give 40 working hours a week to a job, you
>> should be able to live off it, no matter how modestly. But without
>> roommates and with health insurance.
>
> "Should". Well, there's a lotta should, but we have to live in the
> real world.
>
> What's the problem (not your problem, but in general) with having
> to have a roommate? I had three different roommates when I
> was younger (four, technically, since I shared an apartment with
> a boyfriend-girlfriend pair). Two of them were after I divorced
> my first husband and couldn't make ends meet without them. They
> were people I already knew, not some stranger answering a classified
> ad.
>
>> Maybe restaurant prices in Michigan have to go up. Maybe certain
>> things are so cheap because the poor are being exploited. Maybe there
>> shouldn't be such a thing as a $1 hamburger.
>
> Places with a $1 hamburger don't have dishwashers, because they don't
> have dishes. Places with a $10 hamburger probably pay their dishwashers
> above-average pay for dishwashers, to be able to hire the very best
> dishwasher they can.
>
> Of course the poor are exploited. That's nothing new. They are less
> exploited than at any other time in history.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>

Go back a generation. It was fairly common is some cities for entire
families to share apartments. It was also common to have
multi-generation families sharing a house.

When I met my wife, the household consisted of parents, two sisters,
grandfather, uncle. The uncle was 40 when he moved out and got married
and it was not a question of economics, more of convenience.

My parents divorced when I was 17. We moved to my grandmother's house.
She was living alone in a 4 bedroom house so it made sense to move with
her putting three generations together. It was also nice because my
grandmother made my brother and I a nice breakfast every morning and a
good dinner every night. At 20, I bought a house, got married. and yes,
daughetr moved back in with kids for a while too.

On 9/16/2017 6:51 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:17:22 PM UTC-4, Gary wrote:

>> If all you can be is a dishwasher, try learning a decent skill
>> for a better job.
>
> Not everybody can do that. Some people simply do not have the
> intellectual capacity for a better job. Luckily, they probably
> don't have to rent their own apartment, either.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>

I've seen a lot of that. Over the years we've employed some unskilled
workers and paid a little more than minimum wage and offered some
benefits. Some lived at home, others did not for various reasons. They
often lived in what we would consider deplorable conditions, but they
had no problem with it. A mattress in someone's basement, a "hotel"
with shared bathrooms, a friend's sofa. They are not equipped to live
in what we know as middle class today.

On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 09:50:38 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

>Go back a generation. It was fairly common is some cities for entire
>families to share apartments. It was also common to have
>multi-generation families sharing a house.
>
>When I met my wife, the household consisted of parents, two sisters,
>grandfather, uncle. The uncle was 40 when he moved out and got married
>and it was not a question of economics, more of convenience.
>
>My parents divorced when I was 17. We moved to my grandmother's house.
>She was living alone in a 4 bedroom house so it made sense to move with
>her putting three generations together. It was also nice because my
>grandmother made my brother and I a nice breakfast every morning and a
>good dinner every night. At 20, I bought a house, got married. and yes,
>daughetr moved back in with kids for a while too.

My father read the writing on the wall and sent my mother back to her
mother from HK just before WWII hit it. We lived with my grandmother
during the war years and I liked the multi generational touch.

We were living on our own with kids over here when my father died and
I had to bring my mother back with me from Spain. I worried a bit but
it was a good thing for our kids, they learned much more give and
take. When she developed a brain tumour, they had to learn to be very
tolerant when she became very repetitive. I wouldn't not do it again,
I think it almost should be mandatory, it was a real learning
experience for all.

On 2017-09-16 9:50 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 9/16/2017 7:13 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:

> Go back a generation.Â* It was fairly common is some cities for entire
> families to share apartments.Â* It was also common to have
> multi-generation families sharing a house.

My parents were married in 1944. My father has finished he operational
tour and was not allowed to fly over Europe because of his experience
with the resistance movement so he was assigned to a training unit near
Vancouver as a flight instructor. At the end of the war they moved back
to Toronto and had to live with my grandparents because there was no
housing available. A married brother and a married sister and their
spouses were also living there.


> My parents divorced when I was 17.Â* We moved to my grandmother's house.
> She was living alone in a 4 bedroom house so it made sense to move with
> her putting three generations together.Â* It was also nice because my
> grandmother made my brother and I a nice breakfast every morning and a
> good dinner every night.Â* At 20, I bought a house, got married. and yes,
> daughetr moved back in with kids for a while too.

I feel sorry for parents who lose their empty nests. It was hard enough
for us when our son was in Africa for a year and came back for a year
while he went to university. He then changed schools and moved to
Montreal. He was there for 10 years and then in Toronto for a few years
before moving back this way. He had had to give up his apartment in
Toronto to attend an 18 week training session for his new job and did
not know where he would be placed. He ended up locally but needed a
place to stay for a few weeks until he found a place and started getting
paid. It was difficult for all of us to get accustomed to sharing space
again.

jmcquown wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On 9/15/2017 4:08 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> > On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> >>On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Bruce wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should
> > > > > have been able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time
> > > > > means you give all your working hours. I think that should
> > > > > mean you can live off it.
> > > >
> > > > If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
> > > > job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
> > > > Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
> > >
> > > No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable
> > > part of town.
> >
> > Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
> > affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
> > in many urban areas.
> >
> > A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
> > year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
> > a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
> > enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
> > other living expenses?
> >
> > You are simply not being realistic.
> >
> > Cindy Hamilton
> >
> How can you expect a clueless person to be realistic?
>
> Jill

LOL! I renewed my resume 4 months ago on Monster.com as it was about
to go away. Mind you I am happy with my job and while a little
underpaid for skill level and job in my area, it's not by much and the
job is so fun, willing to accept that.

Good Lord! SPAM erupted! Most totally ignored that I was not willing
to relocate.

2 of hilarous note:
- Long Island (NYC) offer, 32k-42K
- DC offer, 35K-50K

Now before you freak, most had no pay range and the others that did
were pretty reasonable for the areas. There were however a a trending
theme I have seen. They want to call something a 'Junior ...' then add
what takes 10-15 years work experience to aquire. By calling it
'junior' they descale the pay but want far more than starting skill
levels.

--

On 9/16/2017 10:30 AM, cshenk wrote:
> LOL! I renewed my resume 4 months ago on Monster.com as it was about
> to go away. Mind you I am happy with my job and while a little
> underpaid for skill level and job in my area, it's not by much and the
> job is so fun, willing to accept that.
>
> Good Lord! SPAM erupted! Most totally ignored that I was not willing
> to relocate.
>
> 2 of hilarous note:
> - Long Island (NYC) offer, 32k-42K
> - DC offer, 35K-50K
>
> Now before you freak, most had no pay range and the others that did
> were pretty reasonable for the areas. There were however a a trending
> theme I have seen. They want to call something a 'Junior ...' then add
> what takes 10-15 years work experience to aquire. By calling it
> 'junior' they descale the pay but want far more than starting skill
> levels.

Those job search sites are a joke. They use bots to search for keywords
in your resume and that's all they do. It doesn't matter if you specify
you aren't willing to relocate. Or specifiy you're looking for a job
within (for example) 25-50 miles. A reasonable commute. I'd get emails
about jobs in Charleston (125 miles away) or Columbia, SC (much further
than that). One job might have been great, except I'm not moving to
Pennsylvania!

Even if local, the "matches" were ridiculous. Sorry, I said clerical
work. I'm not an auto body mechanic. LOL

Jill

On 2017-09-16 10:48 AM, jmcquown wrote:

> Those job search sites are a joke.Â* They use bots to search for keywords
> in your resume and that's all they do.Â* It doesn't matter if you specify
> you aren't willing to relocate.Â* Or specifiy you're looking for a job
> within (for example) 25-50 miles.Â* A reasonable commute.Â* I'd get emails
> about jobs in Charleston (125 miles away) or Columbia, SC (much further
> than that).Â* One job might have been great, except I'm not moving to
> Pennsylvania!
>
> Even if local, the "matches" were ridiculous.Â* Sorry, I said clerical
> work.Â* I'm not an auto body mechanic. LOL
>

A couple years ago I signed on with Linkedin and posted my current
position and retirement recreation consultant. Every once in a while I
get messages from them about job opportunities, usually in banking and
financial services.

On 9/16/2017 10:27 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2017-09-16 9:50 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

>> My parents divorced when I was 17.Â* We moved to my grandmother's
>> house. She was living alone in a 4 bedroom house so it made sense to
>> move with her putting three generations together.Â* It was also nice
>> because my grandmother made my brother and I a nice breakfast every
>> morning and a good dinner every night.Â* At 20, I bought a house, got
>> married. and yes, daughetr moved back in with kids for a while too.
>
> I feel sorry for parents who lose their empty nests.Â* It was hard enough
> for us when our son was in Africa for a year and came back for a year
> while he went to university. He then changed schools and moved to
> Montreal.Â* He was there for 10 years and then in Toronto for a few years
> before moving back this way. He had had to give up his apartment in
> Toronto to attend an 18 week training session for his new job and did
> not know where he would be placed. He ended up locally but needed a
> place to stay for a few weeks until he found a place and started getting
> paid.Â* It was difficult for all of us to get accustomed to sharing space
> again.


I left out some other details. We had our slider replaced with a
revolving door!

When my MIL was getting sick we moved her up here for a couple of years.
At different times, we had a nephew, niece, daughter with 3 kids,
grandson on 2 different occasions, granddaughter, The revolving door has
now been removed and replaced by steel reinforced brick wall.

On 9/16/2017 10:59 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2017-09-16 10:48 AM, jmcquown wrote:
>
>> Those job search sites are a joke.Â* They use bots to search for
>> keywords in your resume and that's all they do.Â* It doesn't matter if
>> you specify you aren't willing to relocate.Â* Or specifiy you're
>> looking for a job within (for example) 25-50 miles.Â* A reasonable
>> commute.Â* I'd get emails about jobs in Charleston (125 miles away) or
>> Columbia, SC (much further than that).Â* One job might have been great,
>> except I'm not moving to Pennsylvania!
>>
>> Even if local, the "matches" were ridiculous.Â* Sorry, I said clerical
>> work.Â* I'm not an auto body mechanic. LOL
>>
>
> A couple years ago I signed on with Linkedin and posted my current
> position and retirement recreation consultant.Â* Every once in a while I
> get messages from them about job opportunities, usually in banking and
> financial services.
>
LOL We all know banking is recreational!

Jill

On 9/16/2017 9:50 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> Go back a generation.Â* It was fairly common is some cities for entire
> families to share apartments.Â* It was also common to have
> multi-generation families sharing a house.
>
A generation or two! When my mother was growing up, my grandparents
brought grandma's parents over from Scotland. They lived in rooms
grandpa had finished in the attic. During the Depression grandma took
on the occasional boarder. I always thought the man referred to as
Uncle Bill was just a boarder. Turns out he was grandma's brother, but
he did pay room and board so technically... All this while my
grandparents were raising four young children.

My mother never made it sound like there was anything bad about it. It
was just the way things were.

Kinda like 'The Walton's'.

Jill

> When I met my wife, the household consisted of parents, two sisters,
> grandfather, uncle.Â* The uncle was 40 when he moved out and got married
> and it was not a question of economics, more of convenience.
>
> My parents divorced when I was 17.Â* We moved to my grandmother's house.
> She was living alone in a 4 bedroom house so it made sense to move with
> her putting three generations together.Â* It was also nice because my
> grandmother made my brother and I a nice breakfast every morning and a
> good dinner every night.Â* At 20, I bought a house, got married. and yes,
> daughetr moved back in with kids for a while too.

On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 3:26:34 AM UTC-10, cshenk wrote:
> dsi1 wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
> > On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 11:34:55 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:
> > >
> > > I was puzzled about why someone would open a Hawaiian restaurant in
> > > our town. It never appealed to me, but I went there and gave it a
> > > try. It was a major disappointment. Just about everyone I know who
> > > has been there has been there was as disappointed as I was. It's
> > > been there for more than two years now and that surprises me.
> > >
> > > My disappointment was for a number of reasons. The first two are in
> > > connection to the serving sizes. I had a tiny piece of mahi mahi, I
> > > would say less than two ounces of fish. OTOH, there were two big
> > > piles of starchy food, a huge scoop of rice and a huge scoop of
> > > potato salad. The third problem is not Hawaiian food, but about
> > > the bed of greens the fish was served on. They were soggy, dark
> > > and stinky. Half the greens were downright rotten.
> > >
> > > There cuisine is so bad that they actually like Spam.
> >
> > Next time, don't get the mahimahi. You're really taking a chance with
> > Hawaiian fish on the mainland. I wouldn't order it on this rock
> > either - unless it was poke. If I was operating a restaurant on the
> > mainland, I'd make it suitable for mainlanders - rice tends to gross
> > them out. Too much starches grosses them out. White folks would
> > automatically get the haole plate. Potatoes and a tossed salad. Also,
> > don't ever eat that greens stuff under the fried food. I sure
> > wouldn't. That would gross me out.
>
> LOL! Better not feed ME the Haole version!
>
> --

Opps - sorry!

jmcquown wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On 9/16/2017 10:30 AM, cshenk wrote:
> > LOL! I renewed my resume 4 months ago on Monster.com as it was
> > about to go away. Mind you I am happy with my job and while a
> > little underpaid for skill level and job in my area, it's not by
> > much and the job is so fun, willing to accept that.
> >
> > Good Lord! SPAM erupted! Most totally ignored that I was not
> > willing to relocate.
> >
> > 2 of hilarous note:
> > - Long Island (NYC) offer, 32k-42K
> > - DC offer, 35K-50K
> >
> > Now before you freak, most had no pay range and the others that did
> > were pretty reasonable for the areas. There were however a a
> > trending theme I have seen. They want to call something a 'Junior
> > ...' then add what takes 10-15 years work experience to aquire. By
> > calling it 'junior' they descale the pay but want far more than
> > starting skill levels.
>
> Those job search sites are a joke. They use bots to search for
> keywords in your resume and that's all they do. It doesn't matter if
> you specify you aren't willing to relocate. Or specifiy you're
> looking for a job within (for example) 25-50 miles. A reasonable
> commute. I'd get emails about jobs in Charleston (125 miles away) or
> Columbia, SC (much further than that). One job might have been
> great, except I'm not moving to Pennsylvania!
>
> Even if local, the "matches" were ridiculous. Sorry, I said clerical
> work. I'm not an auto body mechanic. LOL
>
> Jill

I'm with ya Jill! My favorites have india sounding names, say I am a
match and to send them an updated resume for more information.

--

On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 3:21:54 AM UTC-10, cshenk wrote:
>
> Sounds like that one place was bad. The cuisine however is generally
> loaded differently there so that may have been part of the issue you
> had. True Hawaiian eating was based (like all) on what was available
> and that meant more starch, fruit, and vegetable, and less meat
> (includes fish there). Outside influences have shifted 'what the
> starch etc. are', but the basic balance is still there.
>
> The rule of thumb is the average westerner will eat 1/2- 2/3 C rice
> with a meal. The average Asian (includes Hawaii) will eat 1-2C *per
> meal*.
>
> Although very area dependent in USA (excepting Hawaii), I think it's
> fair to say as an average that most have rice once a month? A lot have
> it more often but i think that balances with those who have it once a
> year. In Hawaii and at least eastern Asia, it would be odd to have a
> day without rice (and in parts of Asia, any meal without rice).
>
> The greens on that plate may have been kelp...
>
> --

We go through a 20 lb bag every two months. We don't even eat that much rice these days.

The green stuff under the fish was probably shredded cabbage. You're not supposed to eat that. That's typically the way it's served here. Back in the old days, it was to keep the oil from going through the paper plate in a plate lunch. In these days of styrofoam containers, I suppose it's to keep the hot oil from melting the plastic. It could also be just traditional.

The practice has it's origin with the way the Japanese served fried foods. These days, the Japanese will serve tempura on paper. The old school way is on a bed of finely shredded cabbage.

http://www.tastyislandhawaii.com/ima...mahi_chips.jpg

Cindy Hamilton wrote:

> On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:17:22 PM UTC-4, Gary wrote:
> > Bruce wrote:
> > >
> > > On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> > > >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> >Bruce wrote:
> > > >> >>
> > > >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
> > > >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
> > > >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.

On 9/16/2017 12:40 PM, cshenk wrote:
> jmcquown wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
>> On 9/16/2017 10:30 AM, cshenk wrote:
>>> LOL! I renewed my resume 4 months ago on Monster.com as it was
>>> about to go away. Mind you I am happy with my job and while a
>>> little underpaid for skill level and job in my area, it's not by
>>> much and the job is so fun, willing to accept that.
>>>
>>> Good Lord! SPAM erupted! Most totally ignored that I was not
>>> willing to relocate.
>>>
>>> 2 of hilarous note:
>>> - Long Island (NYC) offer, 32k-42K
>>> - DC offer, 35K-50K
>>>
>>> Now before you freak, most had no pay range and the others that did
>>> were pretty reasonable for the areas. There were however a a
>>> trending theme I have seen. They want to call something a 'Junior
>>> ...' then add what takes 10-15 years work experience to aquire. By
>>> calling it 'junior' they descale the pay but want far more than
>>> starting skill levels.
>>
>> Those job search sites are a joke. They use bots to search for
>> keywords in your resume and that's all they do. It doesn't matter if
>> you specify you aren't willing to relocate. Or specifiy you're
>> looking for a job within (for example) 25-50 miles. A reasonable
>> commute. I'd get emails about jobs in Charleston (125 miles away) or
>> Columbia, SC (much further than that). One job might have been
>> great, except I'm not moving to Pennsylvania!
>>
>> Even if local, the "matches" were ridiculous. Sorry, I said clerical
>> work. I'm not an auto body mechanic. LOL
>>
>> Jill
>
> I'm with ya Jill! My favorites have india sounding names, say I am a
> match and to send them an updated resume for more information.
>
Yes indeed! Someone named (e.g) Patak or Patel [whatever] emails me
once in a while, says found you a match! Uh, no you didn't. Those jobs
are always temporary assignments (but might turn into permanent!) in
another state. Sorry, I'm not interested.

Jill

Cindy Hamilton wrote:

> On Saturday, September 16, 2017 at 7:02:54 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> > On Sat, 16 Sep 2017 03:50:33 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > > wrote:
> >
> > >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 4:12:48 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> > >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 13:08:18 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > >> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> >On Friday, September 15, 2017 at 3:53:36 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> > >> >> On Fri, 15 Sep 2017 15:40:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> >Bruce wrote:
> > >> >> >>
> > >> >> >> I think that's wrong. If it was a full-time job, you should have been
> > >> >> >> able to live modestly of it at least. Full-time means you give all
> > >> >> >> your working hours. I think that should mean you can live off it.
> > >> >> >
> > >> >> >If you are uneducated and unskilled and accept a minimum wage
> > >> >> >job, you can live fine but you have to adapt to the situation.
> > >> >> >Live with roommates to split monthly costs, etc.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> No, not roommates! A little 1 bedroom apartment in an affordable part
> > >> >> of town.
> > >> >
> > >> >Would that be an affordable part of Manhattan, or an
> > >> >affordable part of Peoria? I think "no roommates" is unrealistic
> > >> >in many urban areas.
> > >> >
> > >> >A studio apartment in Manhattan is $2500 per month, or $30,000 per
> > >> >year. As an example of a low-paying job, let say a dishwasher in
> > >> >a restaurant. What restaurant could afford to pay a dishwasher
> > >> >enough that, after taxes, he could pay that much rent plus all
> > >> >other living expenses?
> > >> >
> > >> >You are simply not being realistic.
> > >>
> > >> Clearly, Manhattan isn't an affordable part of town then. I also
> > >> woudln't try to live as a dishwasher in Paris or London. Unless I'd
> > >> accept a very long commute.
> > >
> > >Somebody has to live as a dishwasher in those cities.
> > >
> > >Ok, let's try something different. A small Midwestern college town.
> > >One bedroom apartments in Ann Arbor are about $1,000 per month.
> > >(Oddly enough, studio apartments are $1,200, but that's probably
> > >about proximity to campus.) At $10 per hour, take-home pay here is
> > >$692 a month. Nope, can't even make rent. The "magic" number that
> > >lefties are agitating for is $15 per hour. That would be a take-home
> > >pay of $1004 per month. Now 100% of the paycheck is going to rent.
> > >
> > >The average dishwasher in Michigan makes $9.24 per hour. Margins
> > >in the restaurant business aren't high enough to pay the dishwasher
> > >1.5 times what he makes now, let alone enough to rent his own
> > >apartment and pay for all of the rest of life's necessities.
> > >
> > >Roommates, or live with Mom, or something. It's the only way to get
> > >by on some very low-level jobs. And, yes, some people will never do
> > >better than dishwasher in a restaurant.
> >
> > I'm not saying that's not happening. I'm saying it's wrong. I'm also
> > not saying it's only wrong in the US. It may be wrong in many
> > countries.
> >
> > I still say that if you give 40 working hours a week to a job, you
> > should be able to live off it, no matter how modestly. But without
> > roommates and with health insurance.
>
> "Should". Well, there's a lotta should, but we have to live in the
> real world.
>
> What's the problem (not your problem, but in general) with having
> to have a roommate? I had three different roommates when I
> was younger (four, technically, since I shared an apartment with
> a boyfriend-girlfriend pair). Two of them were after I divorced
> my first husband and couldn't make ends meet without them. They
> were people I already knew, not some stranger answering a classified
> ad.


Back in the day many folks in lower - level jobs lived in rooming houses, even schoolteachers and the like; those have pretty much disappeared from the landscape (zoning laws, privacy entitlements, "class" expectations, etc.).. Or folks lived - and many still do, especially immigrants - in an "extended family" situation. When I was a kid, many of the beginning school teachers would rent a room, this was 50 - 60 years ago...elderly (or even younger) relatives would share a home, especially the widowed, singles, or spinsters.

The concept that every single adult has to have their own flat/apartment/home is a fairly new concept...since WWII at least.

Look at an older movie, say the 1951 "The Day the Earth Stood Still" - Patricia Neal's character is a government clerk, the other boarders have similar jobs: Michael Rennie's alien character walks the streets of DC, until he finds a "Room for Rent" sign and walks in...

[PS: I love that the landlady (IIRC) is Francis Bavier aka "Aunt Bea" of the "Andy Griffith Show"...she's perfectly in character here...!!!]


> > Maybe restaurant prices in Michigan have to go up. Maybe certain
> > things are so cheap because the poor are being exploited. Maybe there
> > shouldn't be such a thing as a $1 hamburger.
>
> Places with a $1 hamburger don't have dishwashers, because they don't
> have dishes. Places with a $10 hamburger probably pay their dishwashers
> above-average pay for dishwashers, to be able to hire the very best
> dishwasher they can.
>
> Of course the poor are exploited. That's nothing new. They are less
> exploited than at any other time in history.


This is true...

--
Best
Greg

On 9/16/2017 1:03 PM, Ding - Dong Daddy wrote:

>> Not everybody can do that. Some people simply do not have the
>> intellectual capacity for a better job. Luckily, they probably
>> don't have to rent their own apartment, either.
>
>
> I'm in workforce development, which means I assist low - income folks to get better jobs. You are correct, some are simply not able to function in even a lower - level job. Or, some are content with a lower - level job. I could go on and on about this subject, but I will spare y'all...
>
> ;-}
>
>

I've seen it. I know of a couple of people that are good at their jobs
and have been offered promotion but turned it down. They make enough
money to fill their modest needs and don't want the additional
responsibility. Early in my working life I was sometimes offered
overtime and took what I could get. Others would not work 10 minutes
past their 40 hours no matter how easy the job.