On 13/06/2016 8:02 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
>
>>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in small
>>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
>>> Graham
>>
>> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
>
> I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
> indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.

We weren't looking! We just did by passing the time of day with people
and eating and drinking in small cafés etc.
We stopped to watch a petanque tournament in a small village and a local
photographer engaged us in conversation about the difference between
their game and the lawn bowls that my father played in the UK. He then
offered to send us a video of the competition.
He was in his right mind!
Graham

On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 15:32:35 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

> In article >,
> says...
> >
> > On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 14:57:11 +1000, Bruce >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > In article >,
> > > says...
> > > >
> > > > On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 15:55:19 -0700, sf > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 18:33:38 -0400, Dave Smith
> > > > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > >> A river cruise, OTOH, is
> > > > >> a sightseeing tour. It is an added bonus that they have meals. From my
> > > > >> experience, European buffets tend to be excellent. I can see myself
> > > > >> doing one of those.
> > > > >
> > > > >Mediterranean cruises and Caribbean cruises are popular too. Like
> > > > >river cruises, you're in a new port every day. If you like a
> > > > >particular port or country, you can return for a more in depth look on
> > > > >your next vacation. At least that was our theory, but it hasn't
> > > > >worked out that way - because we like cruising.
> > > >
> > > > So really, you add 'countries and places' to your list but don't
> > > > really know anything about them or the people.
> > >
> > > I agree. I think that people who do cruises, aren't really interested in
> > > other coutries or cultures. They just want a bit of effortless,
> > > superficial entertainment. Each to their own, I guess.
> >
> > It's called sight seeing. We do that here too.
>
> Like on the Mississippi?

Like in a car.

--

sf

JanetB, "Marrakesh Express" in the series "Brunch at Bobby's" is on again this morning on
The Cooking Channel at 11:00-11:30 a.m. Central Daylight Time. I hope you can catch it.

N.

On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 08:40:15 -0700 (PDT), Nancy2
> wrote:

>JanetB, "Marrakesh Express" in the series "Brunch at Bobby's" is on again this morning on
>The Cooking Channel at 11:00-11:30 a.m. Central Daylight Time. I hope you can catch it.
>
>N.
Ooops! in 9 minutes thanks
Janet US

In article >,
says...
>
> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 11:59:05 +0100, "Ophelia" >
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > wrote in message
> .. .
> >
> >>>Mediterranean cruises and Caribbean cruises are popular too. Like
> >>>river cruises, you're in a new port every day. If you like a
> >>>particular port or country, you can return for a more in depth look on
> >>>your next vacation. At least that was our theory, but it hasn't
> >>>worked out that way - because we like cruising.
> >>
> >> So really, you add 'countries and places' to your list but don't
> >> really know anything about them or the people.
> >
> >I think a lot of people like doing that but then maybe they haven't been
> >lucky enough to have been able to live in those places. Or maybe that is
> >the last thing they want to do and prefer to be on the move.
>
> However, you don't need to live somewhere to know the locals, you just
> need to stay locally and mingle in markets, cafes etc.

I live in a high tourism area. Trust me, in high season here, people
who rent a house for their holiday, mostly meet other holidaymakers
doing the same thing.

The locals are either
working too hard to mingle with anyone,
keeping out of the the cafes because they are mobbed with
holidaymakers,
avoiding the crowds by shopping very early, before the holiday makers
get out of bed and start ambling around at snails pace.

Coming into a
> port city, picking a couple of tours to do in three, four hours, tells
> you nothing about anywhere. I often see busses of cruise passengers
> here whipping around town before leaving again late afternoon.

But you probably won't have noticed the cruisers who took off on
their own to explore on foot, or a hired bike.

Janet

On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
>
>>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in small
>>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
>>> Graham
>>
>> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
>
>I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
>indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.



That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
to you, but I know otherwise.

Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.

Before you
>jump into any bizarre assumptions about my travel style, I have never
>been on a cruise or an organized vacation tour, though I have been on a
>boat and minibus tour of Paris, and I learned a lot about the city and
>its history. More important, I has a chance to look around and get
>oriented so that I knew which places to go back to on my own.
>
>I once vacationed in Europe withe a rail pass but on my other trips I
>rented cars and wandered around more or less aimlessly. I stayed in
>small hotels in small towns and I avoided eating in restaurants at or
>close to major tourist draws.
>
>FWIW, I live near Niagara Falls and spend a lot of time there. It is
>interesting to see the tours and to see how differently some of them are
>run. I noted that English, French and German tourists tend to come in
>September and October and their tour usually involves a trip to the
>hardwood forest regions for the fall colours. Those bus tours usually
>bring the tourists to various locations and drop them off for several
>hours so they can look around on their own.
>
>Then there are the Japanese tour buses and their trips are tightly
>scheduled to pack as many things as they can into a short period of
>time. For instance, they will drop their tour at the parking lot closed
>to Table Rock, the edge of the falls. A guide shepherds her charges over
>to the brink of the falls, gives them about 5 minutes to snap as many
>photos as they can and then leads them back to the bus and they head off
>to the next point of interest. Basically, they just want to arrive at
>some place, take a couple pictures and then check it off their lists.
>

In article >,
says...
>
> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
> >
> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in small
> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
> >>> Graham
> >>
> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
> >
> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
>
>
>
> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
> to you, but I know otherwise.
>
> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.

The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the Netherlands
("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.

"Bruce" > wrote in message
T...
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
>> >
>> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in
>> >>> small
>> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
>> >>> Graham
>> >>
>> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
>> >
>> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
>> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
>>
>>
>>
>> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
>> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
>> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
>> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
>> to you, but I know otherwise.
>>
>> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
>> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
>> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
>
> The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
> towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the Netherlands
> ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.

Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering ... you
wanextacycocaine....................

I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 15:46:45 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>but then there are lots of others who, despite the economic benefits of
>tourism, consider the tourists to be a major pain in the ass. Being a
>major tourist draw means that there very little parking downtown, and
>that you likely have to pay to park, and pay a lots. You get all sorts
>of stupid gift and knickknack shops but can't buy underwear. Local
>restaurant prices go up. You get a lot of traffic and have a yard time
>getting around because the people in front are sightseeing and possibly
>lost.

You've just described many of the places I have lived... tourism
ruined the Northern Territory (Australia) for me. Caravans/trailers
are also a major PITA. Another place (Eumundi, QLD)you literally had
to drive to another town to buy anything on Saturdays as there was
absolutely no parking due to the markets.

On 2016-06-13 5:15 PM, Je�us wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 15:46:45 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> but then there are lots of others who, despite the economic benefits of
>> tourism, consider the tourists to be a major pain in the ass. Being a
>> major tourist draw means that there very little parking downtown, and
>> that you likely have to pay to park, and pay a lots. You get all sorts
>> of stupid gift and knickknack shops but can't buy underwear. Local
>> restaurant prices go up. You get a lot of traffic and have a yard time
>> getting around because the people in front are sightseeing and possibly
>> lost.
>
> You've just described many of the places I have lived... tourism
> ruined the Northern Territory (Australia) for me. Caravans/trailers
> are also a major PITA. Another place (Eumundi, QLD)you literally had
> to drive to another town to buy anything on Saturdays as there was
> absolutely no parking due to the markets.
>


Our town is trying hard to become a cycling venue. I don't know why.
It's not like the spend money. They tend to drive down for the day,
bring their own food and bottled water, clog our roads as they travel
around in gaggles, 2-3 abreast, refusing to move over to let cars by.
There are a number of races each year and they involve a bunch or road
closures that make it damned difficult for the locals to get around.

I used to have riding lessons on Sunday mornings at a place about 6
miles from me. A few times a year I would be scooting over to the
stables for my 9 am lesson and find the road closed and have to drive
miles out of my way. It might not have been quite so bad if they had had
the courtesy to put up signs warning of closures ahead.

I have asked some of the local stores and restaurants about the impact
of the races on their businesses and they said they don't get any
business from the racers, and that none of their regulars can make it in.

In article >,
says...
>
> "Bruce" > wrote in message
> T...
> > In article >,
> > says...
> >>
> >> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in
> >> >>> small
> >> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
> >> >>> Graham
> >> >>
> >> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
> >> >
> >> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
> >> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
> >>
> >> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
> >> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
> >> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
> >> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
> >> to you, but I know otherwise.
> >>
> >> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
> >> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
> >> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
> >
> > The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
> > towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the Netherlands
> > ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.
>
> Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering ... you
> wanextacycocaine....................
>
> I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!

Yes, there is that too. City centre Amsterdam is a terrible place.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 05:20:41 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

> In article >,
> says...
> >
> > On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> > > wrote:
> >
> > >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
> > >
> > >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in small
> > >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
> > >>> Graham
> > >>
> > >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
> > >
> > >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
> > >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
> >
> >
> >
> > That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
> > the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
> > generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
> > where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
> > to you, but I know otherwise.
> >
> > Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
> > did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
> > conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
>
> The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
> towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the Netherlands
> ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.

We enjoyed Amsterdam... we stayed with friends, but spent the days
exploring on our own and we were there during the Queen's Day
celebrations (which was not planned).

--

sf

On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 19:25:18 -0600, graham > wrote:

>On 12/06/2016 4:04 PM, Je?us wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 15:27:18 -0600, graham > wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/06/2016 12:09 AM, sf wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 11 Jun 2016 20:34:31 -0400, Doris Night
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> BUT... did your neighbors say how they liked the Rhine cruise? DH and
>>>>> I are doing that cruise in September.
>>>>
>>>> We cruised from Amsterdam to Budapest along the Rhine, Main
>>>> (pronounced like “mine” in English), and Danube rivers a few years ago
>>>> and it was fantastic! You won't be sorry.
>>>>
>>> The thought of a cruise doesn't appeal to me at all. However, 2 friends
>>> so enjoyed their Danube cruise last year that they are soon going on a
>>> similar one in Italy.
>>> I prefer to cycle - then one can bike off the calories gained by
>>> indulging the evening befo-)
>>
>> I like the idea of cycling OS, something I'll keep in mind in the
>> future.
>
>My b-i-l and I have had cycling holidays in Provence, the Dordogne,
>Burgundy, Bordeaux and, this year, Alsace. All thoroughly enjoyable and
>memorable, even with the occasional lousy weather.

That sounds great to me, you're lucky you are only a short flight over
to Europe.

On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 17:31:11 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2016-06-13 5:15 PM, Je?us wrote:
>> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 15:46:45 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> but then there are lots of others who, despite the economic benefits of
>>> tourism, consider the tourists to be a major pain in the ass. Being a
>>> major tourist draw means that there very little parking downtown, and
>>> that you likely have to pay to park, and pay a lots. You get all sorts
>>> of stupid gift and knickknack shops but can't buy underwear. Local
>>> restaurant prices go up. You get a lot of traffic and have a yard time
>>> getting around because the people in front are sightseeing and possibly
>>> lost.
>>
>> You've just described many of the places I have lived... tourism
>> ruined the Northern Territory (Australia) for me. Caravans/trailers
>> are also a major PITA. Another place (Eumundi, QLD)you literally had
>> to drive to another town to buy anything on Saturdays as there was
>> absolutely no parking due to the markets.
>>
>
>
>Our town is trying hard to become a cycling venue. I don't know why.
>It's not like the spend money. They tend to drive down for the day,
>bring their own food and bottled water, clog our roads as they travel
>around in gaggles, 2-3 abreast, refusing to move over to let cars by.
>There are a number of races each year and they involve a bunch or road
>closures that make it damned difficult for the locals to get around.
>
>I used to have riding lessons on Sunday mornings at a place about 6
>miles from me. A few times a year I would be scooting over to the
>stables for my 9 am lesson and find the road closed and have to drive
>miles out of my way. It might not have been quite so bad if they had had
>the courtesy to put up signs warning of closures ahead.
>
>I have asked some of the local stores and restaurants about the impact
>of the races on their businesses and they said they don't get any
>business from the racers, and that none of their regulars can make it in.

Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...

"Bruce" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "Bruce" > wrote in message
>> T...
>> > In article >,
>> > says...
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in
>> >> >>> small
>> >> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
>> >> >>> Graham
>> >> >>
>> >> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
>> >> >
>> >> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
>> >> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
>> >>
>> >> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
>> >> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
>> >> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
>> >> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
>> >> to you, but I know otherwise.
>> >>
>> >> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
>> >> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
>> >> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
>> >
>> > The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
>> > towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the Netherlands
>> > ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.
>>
>> Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering ... you
>> wanextacycocaine....................
>>
>> I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!
>
> Yes, there is that too. City centre Amsterdam is a terrible place.

Too many lovely places though to worry too much about that one. I guess
every country has its problems.

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

In article >,
says...
>
> "Bruce" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >,
> > says...
> >>
> >> "Bruce" > wrote in message
> >> T...
> >> > In article >,
> >> > says...
> >> >>
> >> >> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals in
> >> >> >>> small
> >> >> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged" tour.
> >> >> >>> Graham
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
> >> >> >
> >> >> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
> >> >> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
> >> >>
> >> >> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that all
> >> >> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals - who
> >> >> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to see,
> >> >> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots. According
> >> >> to you, but I know otherwise.
> >> >>
> >> >> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries who
> >> >> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
> >> >> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
> >> >
> >> > The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
> >> > towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the Netherlands
> >> > ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.
> >>
> >> Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering ... you
> >> wanextacycocaine....................
> >>
> >> I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!
> >
> > Yes, there is that too. City centre Amsterdam is a terrible place.
>
> Too many lovely places though to worry too much about that one. I guess
> every country has its problems.

Yes. Tourist hotspots tend to deteriorate fast. Especially when they're
centered around a red lights district and drugs I guess the canals
are nice though.

"Bruce" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "Bruce" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > In article >,
>> > says...
>> >>
>> >> "Bruce" > wrote in message
>> >> T...
>> >> > In article >,
>> >> > says...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals
>> >> >> >>> in
>> >> >> >>> small
>> >> >> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged"
>> >> >> >>> tour.
>> >> >> >>> Graham
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
>> >> >> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that
>> >> >> all
>> >> >> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals -
>> >> >> who
>> >> >> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to
>> >> >> see,
>> >> >> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots.
>> >> >> According
>> >> >> to you, but I know otherwise.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries
>> >> >> who
>> >> >> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
>> >> >> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
>> >> >
>> >> > The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
>> >> > towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the
>> >> > Netherlands
>> >> > ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.
>> >>
>> >> Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering ...
>> >> you
>> >> wanextacycocaine....................
>> >>
>> >> I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!
>> >
>> > Yes, there is that too. City centre Amsterdam is a terrible place.
>>
>> Too many lovely places though to worry too much about that one. I guess
>> every country has its problems.
>
> Yes. Tourist hotspots tend to deteriorate fast. Especially when they're
> centered around a red lights district and drugs I guess the canals
> are nice though.

If you don't look up ... ;-) The first time I went I noticed some girls
sitting in a shop window. They waved at me lol I was so naive I didn't
realise what they where until I was told <g>





--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

In article >,
says...
>
> "Bruce" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >,
> > says...
> >>
> >> "Bruce" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > In article >,
> >> > says...
> >> >>
> >> >> "Bruce" > wrote in message
> >> >> T...
> >> >> > In article >,
> >> >> > says...
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> >> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the locals
> >> >> >> >>> in
> >> >> >> >>> small
> >> >> >> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged"
> >> >> >> >>> tour.
> >> >> >> >>> Graham
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their time
> >> >> >> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that
> >> >> >> all
> >> >> >> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals -
> >> >> >> who
> >> >> >> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what to
> >> >> >> see,
> >> >> >> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots.
> >> >> >> According
> >> >> >> to you, but I know otherwise.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries
> >> >> >> who
> >> >> >> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
> >> >> >> conversation with them while pointing them in the right direction.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to be
> >> >> > towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the
> >> >> > Netherlands
> >> >> > ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.
> >> >>
> >> >> Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering ...
> >> >> you
> >> >> wanextacycocaine....................
> >> >>
> >> >> I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!
> >> >
> >> > Yes, there is that too. City centre Amsterdam is a terrible place.
> >>
> >> Too many lovely places though to worry too much about that one. I guess
> >> every country has its problems.
> >
> > Yes. Tourist hotspots tend to deteriorate fast. Especially when they're
> > centered around a red lights district and drugs I guess the canals
> > are nice though.
>
> If you don't look up ... ;-) The first time I went I noticed some girls
> sitting in a shop window. They waved at me lol I was so naive I didn't
> realise what they where until I was told <g>

lol I guess you had already been exchanging email addresses with them
when you realized.

"Bruce" > wrote in message
T...
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "Bruce" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > In article >,
>> > says...
>> >>
>> >> "Bruce" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> > In article >,
>> >> > says...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> "Bruce" > wrote in message
>> >> >> T...
>> >> >> > In article >,
>> >> >> > says...
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 10:02:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>> >> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >On 2016-06-13 9:40 AM, wrote:
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >>> Some of the delightful conversations we've had with the
>> >> >> >> >>> locals
>> >> >> >> >>> in
>> >> >> >> >>> small
>> >> >> >> >>> villages and towns, one wouldn't experience on a "packaged"
>> >> >> >> >>> tour.
>> >> >> >> >>> Graham
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> That's right. Guess thee and me is odd
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >I wonder who in their right mind wants to have to spend their
>> >> >> >> >time
>> >> >> >> >indulging tourists who are looking to absorb local culture.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> That is not at all what I meant. I suppose I must conclude that
>> >> >> >> all
>> >> >> >> the interesting chats and conversations I have had with locals -
>> >> >> >> who
>> >> >> >> generally love to tell you about their home, where to go, what
>> >> >> >> to
>> >> >> >> see,
>> >> >> >> where the best local eating is etc. all came from idiots.
>> >> >> >> According
>> >> >> >> to you, but I know otherwise.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Additionally I have sometimes seen tourists in various countries
>> >> >> >> who
>> >> >> >> did not know where to find something, where to eat and enjoyed a
>> >> >> >> conversation with them while pointing them in the right
>> >> >> >> direction.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > The more touristy a place is, the more obnoxious locals tend to
>> >> >> > be
>> >> >> > towards tourists. I recommend that anybody who visits the
>> >> >> > Netherlands
>> >> >> > ("Holland"), avoid Amsterdam.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Not counting the sleezy characters who slope past you whispering
>> >> >> ...
>> >> >> you
>> >> >> wanextacycocaine....................
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I loved everywhere there except Amsterdam!
>> >> >
>> >> > Yes, there is that too. City centre Amsterdam is a terrible place.
>> >>
>> >> Too many lovely places though to worry too much about that one. I
>> >> guess
>> >> every country has its problems.
>> >
>> > Yes. Tourist hotspots tend to deteriorate fast. Especially when they're
>> > centered around a red lights district and drugs I guess the canals
>> > are nice though.
>>
>> If you don't look up ... ;-) The first time I went I noticed some girls
>> sitting in a shop window. They waved at me lol I was so naive I didn't
>> realise what they where until I was told <g>
>
> lol I guess you had already been exchanging email addresses with them
> when you realized.
>

Nahh too long ago)


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On Monday, June 13, 2016 at 5:30:10 PM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:

> Our town is trying hard to become a cycling venue. I don't know why.
> It's not like the spend money. They tend to drive down for the day,
> bring their own food and bottled water, clog our roads as they travel
> around in gaggles, 2-3 abreast, refusing to move over to let cars by.
> There are a number of races each year and they involve a bunch or road
> closures that make it damned difficult for the locals to get around.
>
> I used to have riding lessons on Sunday mornings at a place about 6
> miles from me. A few times a year I would be scooting over to the
> stables for my 9 am lesson and find the road closed and have to drive
> miles out of my way. It might not have been quite so bad if they had had
> the courtesy to put up signs warning of closures ahead.
>
> I have asked some of the local stores and restaurants about the impact
> of the races on their businesses and they said they don't get any
> business from the racers, and that none of their regulars can make it in.

We have college football. Happily, the same roads are always closed,
and local businesses (restaurants especially) get a big windfall. It's
annoying to say, "What time does the game let out? Can we go out to
dinner?" but it's tolerable when the population of Ann Arbor doubles
on a Saturday. A least it's predictable.

I'm pretty sure regular shop owners count on us townies to come out during
the game to do our shopping, as we skulk around the fringes of the city
trying to avoid the mess.

I used to rent a house on a major thoroughfare between the stadium and
the freeway. It was changed from two-way to one-way outbound after every
game. Five lanes of traffic all trying to get to the freeway. They
also blocked off the exit ramps so that freeway traffic would not add
to the load.

Cindy Hamilton

On 2016-06-14 2:23 AM, Je�us wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 17:31:11 -0400, Dave Smith

>> I have asked some of the local stores and restaurants about the impact
>> of the races on their businesses and they said they don't get any
>> business from the racers, and that none of their regulars can make it in.
>
> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>

They dress up like a European bike racer and think they are ready for
the Tour de France. Actually, one ofour neighbours was in that won, wore
the yellow jersey for a few days and ended up coming in fourth. Most of
the rest of the clubs are just older folks out for an social activity.

I always get a kick out of people who try so hard to dress the part. It
is always refreshing to see people cycling in normal clothing. I see
lots of motorcyclists who have big expensive bikes, dress up a la biker
with all the Harley regalia and stupid patches as if they were outlaws,
and when they are slowing down, starting or or going slowly they have to
do the kiddie car shuffle so they don't fall over.

Skiers are much the same. The best I ever saw was a guy who had a really
expensive set of skis, bindings and boots, a very expensive looking
outfit and top of the line googles. They had to stop the chairlift for
him when he was unable to get on and then again when he failed at
getting off.

Then there was Bad New Mike in our kayak club, the nickname we used to
distinguish him from another new member named Mike. The guy had shown up
at our annual meeting. Even in the middle of winter he had one all sorts
of kayaking clothing, all name brand or branded. He talked a good like.
He knew more terms than I did. I thought he was going to be a hard one
to keep up with. He showed up for the first club paddle of the year.
He had a really nice composite kayak, an ergonomic designed paddle and
another for a spare, an expensive dry suit, skirt, and a bunch of other
gear. It took him forever to get everything ready because he didn't know
what he was doing. Then he dumped trying to get into his boat, and he
dumped again later when he was getting out at the end of the paddle.

On 14/06/2016 12:21 AM, Je�us wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 19:25:18 -0600, graham > wrote:
>
>> On 12/06/2016 4:04 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>> On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 15:27:18 -0600, graham > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 12/06/2016 12:09 AM, sf wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 11 Jun 2016 20:34:31 -0400, Doris Night
>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> BUT... did your neighbors say how they liked the Rhine cruise? DH and
>>>>>> I are doing that cruise in September.
>>>>>
>>>>> We cruised from Amsterdam to Budapest along the Rhine, Main
>>>>> (pronounced like €œmine€� in English), and Danube rivers a few years ago
>>>>> and it was fantastic! You won't be sorry.
>>>>>
>>>> The thought of a cruise doesn't appeal to me at all. However, 2 friends
>>>> so enjoyed their Danube cruise last year that they are soon going on a
>>>> similar one in Italy.
>>>> I prefer to cycle - then one can bike off the calories gained by
>>>> indulging the evening befo-)
>>>
>>> I like the idea of cycling OS, something I'll keep in mind in the
>>> future.
>>
>> My b-i-l and I have had cycling holidays in Provence, the Dordogne,
>> Burgundy, Bordeaux and, this year, Alsace. All thoroughly enjoyable and
>> memorable, even with the occasional lousy weather.
>
> That sounds great to me, you're lucky you are only a short flight over
> to Europe.
>
I have to fly from Canada first:-)
Graham

On 14/06/2016 6:44 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-06-14 2:23 AM, Je�us wrote:
>> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 17:31:11 -0400, Dave Smith
>
>>> I have asked some of the local stores and restaurants about the impact
>>> of the races on their businesses and they said they don't get any
>>> business from the racers, and that none of their regulars can make it
>>> in.
>>
>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>>
>
> They dress up like a European bike racer and think they are ready for
> the Tour de France. Actually, one ofour neighbours was in that won, wore
> the yellow jersey for a few days and ended up coming in fourth. Most of
> the rest of the clubs are just older folks out for an social activity.
>
> I always get a kick out of people who try so hard to dress the part. It
> is always refreshing to see people cycling in normal clothing.

Really? I'm an OFIL (old fart in lycra) and I dress for comfort (lycra
shorts) and safety, to be seen by motorists (lurid bike shirt).
Graham

On 2016-06-14, graham > wrote:

> I'm an OFIL (old fart in lycra)....

Is that like those fat ol' French geezers who vacation in Nice and
wear Speedo's on the beach?

nb

On 2016-06-14 10:48 AM, graham wrote:

>> I always get a kick out of people who try so hard to dress the part. It
>> is always refreshing to see people cycling in normal clothing.
>
> Really? I'm an OFIL (old fart in lycra) and I dress for comfort (lycra
> shorts) and safety, to be seen by motorists (lurid bike shirt).

The trend in cycling gear these days seems to be gray and/or black. They
match the roads really well. A few dress in florescent greens and
yellows, and it is interesting that they appear to be safetey conscious,
but then they fly through stop signs and traffic lights.

"Jeßus" wrote:
>
> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...

You have *them* there too? OMG.
I hate all those arrogant older kids.
I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)

On 14/06/2016 8:58 AM, notbob wrote:
> On 2016-06-14, graham > wrote:
>
>> I'm an OFIL (old fart in lycra)....
>
> Is that like those fat ol' Walmart geezers who vacation in Florida and
> wear Speedo's on the beach?
>
> nb
>
At 6'4" and 172lbs, I don't think so:-)

On 14/06/2016 9:47 AM, Gary wrote:
> "Jeßus" wrote:
>>
>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>
> You have *them* there too? OMG.
> I hate all those arrogant older kids.
> I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)
>
At least they are getting some exercise rather than sitting around on
their fat arses watching the daytime soaps!!!!!!

"graham" > wrote in message
...
> On 14/06/2016 9:47 AM, Gary wrote:
>> "Jeßus" wrote:
>>>
>>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>>
>> You have *them* there too? OMG.
>> I hate all those arrogant older kids.
>> I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)
>>
> At least they are getting some exercise rather than sitting around on
> their fat arses watching the daytime soaps!!!!!!

Or posting to newsgroups.

Cheri

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 04:11:34 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>I used to rent a house on a major thoroughfare between the stadium and
>the freeway. It was changed from two-way to one-way outbound after every
>game. Five lanes of traffic all trying to get to the freeway. They
>also blocked off the exit ramps so that freeway traffic would not add
>to the load.
>
>Cindy Hamilton

I used to live on W. Ann. Mayhem in all directions on game days.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 13:37:03 -0400, Boron Elgar
> wrote:

> On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 04:11:34 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> >I used to rent a house on a major thoroughfare between the stadium and
> >the freeway. It was changed from two-way to one-way outbound after every
> >game. Five lanes of traffic all trying to get to the freeway. They
> >also blocked off the exit ramps so that freeway traffic would not add
> >to the load.
> >
> >Cindy Hamilton
>
> I used to live on W. Ann. Mayhem in all directions on game days.

I lived in North Lake Tahoe full time for a ski season. We were just
off the main highway on the access road to a major ski resort. One
thing we did was make sure we didn't need to gas up during the weekend
and stayed off the road during daylight hours because traffic was
bumper to bumper on 89.

--

sf

On 2016-06-14, graham > wrote:

> At least they are getting some exercise rather than sitting around on
> their fat arses watching the daytime soaps!!!!!!

Actually, they're jes following the American Dream®, which is to buy
everything even remotely related to bicycling. I saw a couple guys
who had spent over $8K on their mountain bikes. Damn bikes had more
hi-tech and computer power than my home network and my car, combined.

I won't even go into their clothing. Near as I can tell, almost any
sport/activity requiring specialize clothing is gonna cost AT LEAST
$2,000 jes to get outfitted minimally. It's consumerism at its most
ugly, but it's the American way.

BTW, I can spend $2K on a "home entertainment center" without batting
an eyelash. (not even including the couch!)

nb

On 14 Jun 2016 19:04:28 GMT, notbob > wrote:

> BTW, I can spend $2K on a "home entertainment center" without batting
> an eyelash. (not even including the couch!)

Oh, god yes! Our brand new ultra high HDTV cost $1500 and that was on
sale.

--

sf

In article >, says...
>
> "Jeßus" wrote:
> >
> > Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>
> You have *them* there too? OMG.
> I hate all those arrogant older kids.
> I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)

You missed a few developments. Nobody wants to be Lance Armstrong
anymore.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 08:44:53 -0600, graham > wrote:

>On 14/06/2016 12:21 AM, Je?us wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 19:25:18 -0600, graham > wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/06/2016 4:04 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 12 Jun 2016 15:27:18 -0600, graham > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 12/06/2016 12:09 AM, sf wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 11 Jun 2016 20:34:31 -0400, Doris Night
>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> BUT... did your neighbors say how they liked the Rhine cruise? DH and
>>>>>>> I are doing that cruise in September.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We cruised from Amsterdam to Budapest along the Rhine, Main
>>>>>> (pronounced like “mine” in English), and Danube rivers a few years ago
>>>>>> and it was fantastic! You won't be sorry.
>>>>>>
>>>>> The thought of a cruise doesn't appeal to me at all. However, 2 friends
>>>>> so enjoyed their Danube cruise last year that they are soon going on a
>>>>> similar one in Italy.
>>>>> I prefer to cycle - then one can bike off the calories gained by
>>>>> indulging the evening befo-)
>>>>
>>>> I like the idea of cycling OS, something I'll keep in mind in the
>>>> future.
>>>
>>> My b-i-l and I have had cycling holidays in Provence, the Dordogne,
>>> Burgundy, Bordeaux and, this year, Alsace. All thoroughly enjoyable and
>>> memorable, even with the occasional lousy weather.
>>
>> That sounds great to me, you're lucky you are only a short flight over
>> to Europe.
>>
>I have to fly from Canada first:-)

Yes... but you don't have to fly from just north of Antarctica like I
do

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 11:47:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:

>"Jeßus" wrote:
>>
>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>
>You have *them* there too? OMG.

Oh yes. They're like zombies or something. Seen them in most places in
Australia.

>I hate all those arrogant older kids.
>I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)

I hate the ones who make a point about asserting their rights on the
road, to the point where they deliberately disrupt traffic.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 08:44:23 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2016-06-14 2:23 AM, Je?us wrote:
>> On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 17:31:11 -0400, Dave Smith
>
>>> I have asked some of the local stores and restaurants about the impact
>>> of the races on their businesses and they said they don't get any
>>> business from the racers, and that none of their regulars can make it in.
>>
>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>>
>
>They dress up like a European bike racer and think they are ready for
>the Tour de France. Actually, one ofour neighbours was in that won, wore
>the yellow jersey for a few days and ended up coming in fourth. Most of
>the rest of the clubs are just older folks out for an social activity.
>
>I always get a kick out of people who try so hard to dress the part. It
>is always refreshing to see people cycling in normal clothing. I see
>lots of motorcyclists who have big expensive bikes, dress up a la biker
>with all the Harley regalia and stupid patches as if they were outlaws,
>and when they are slowing down, starting or or going slowly they have to
>do the kiddie car shuffle so they don't fall over.
>
>Skiers are much the same. The best I ever saw was a guy who had a really
>expensive set of skis, bindings and boots, a very expensive looking
>outfit and top of the line googles. They had to stop the chairlift for
>him when he was unable to get on and then again when he failed at
>getting off.
>
>Then there was Bad New Mike in our kayak club, the nickname we used to
>distinguish him from another new member named Mike. The guy had shown up
>at our annual meeting. Even in the middle of winter he had one all sorts
>of kayaking clothing, all name brand or branded. He talked a good like.
>He knew more terms than I did. I thought he was going to be a hard one
>to keep up with. He showed up for the first club paddle of the year.
>He had a really nice composite kayak, an ergonomic designed paddle and
>another for a spare, an expensive dry suit, skirt, and a bunch of other
>gear. It took him forever to get everything ready because he didn't know
>what he was doing. Then he dumped trying to get into his boat, and he
>dumped again later when he was getting out at the end of the paddle.

All the same sort of theme there. It's like some people with
tattoos... you *know* it's cold and so do they, but they wear shorts
and/or t-shirts and somehow 'don't feel the cold'.

In article >, says...
>
> On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 08:44:53 -0600, graham > wrote:
>
> >On 14/06/2016 12:21 AM, Je?us wrote:

> >> That sounds great to me, you're lucky you are only a short flight
> >> over to Europe.
> >>
> >I have to fly from Canada first:-)
>
> Yes... but you don't have to fly from just north of Antarctica like I
> do

LOL. Launceston is as close to Antarctica as the French/Spanish border
is to the North Pole.

On 2016-06-14 5:29 PM, Je�us wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 11:47:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
>
>> "Jeßus" wrote:
>>>
>>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>>
>> You have *them* there too? OMG.
>
> Oh yes. They're like zombies or something. Seen them in most places in
> Australia.
>
>> I hate all those arrogant older kids.
>> I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)
>
> I hate the ones who make a point about asserting their rights on the
> road, to the point where they deliberately disrupt traffic.
>

Amen.
My brother told me about one he passed just down the road from my place.
He moved way over to give the cyclist lots of room and just as he was
about to pass... leaving lots of room... the cyclist swerved way out
into the lane and then started screaming at my brother and giving him
the finger.

I have fun with some of them. When on my one bike and a cyclist blows a
stop sign I keep going and yell out that I am not stopping either.

On 14/06/2016 5:31 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-06-14 5:29 PM, Je�us wrote:
>> On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 11:47:38 -0400, Gary > wrote:
>>
>>> "Jeßus" wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Don't get me started on the lycra wearing bicycle set...
>>>
>>> You have *them* there too? OMG.
>>
>> Oh yes. They're like zombies or something. Seen them in most places in
>> Australia.
>>
>>> I hate all those arrogant older kids.
>>> I call them LAW Bikers...(Lance Armstrong Wannabee Bikers)
>>
>> I hate the ones who make a point about asserting their rights on the
>> road, to the point where they deliberately disrupt traffic.
>>
>
> Amen.
> My brother told me about one he passed just down the road from my place.
> He moved way over to give the cyclist lots of room and just as he was
> about to pass... leaving lots of room... the cyclist swerved way out
> into the lane and then started screaming at my brother and giving him
> the finger.
>
> I have fun with some of them. When on my one bike and a cyclist blows a
> stop sign I keep going and yell out that I am not stopping either.
>
>
>
OTOH A driver here deliberately doored a cyclist after passing a group
dangerously. The RCMP refused to charge the *******.
Graham