On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
> use on gas burners,

OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work, have you had some problem or is this just some FUD over a newfangled thing? According to everyone 20 years ago when I bought a house with a glass cooktop I would scratch or damage it by using cast iron pans. Well, the separate oven died 6 or 7 years ago, but that glass top is still fine and I use cast iron all the time.

So, what problem would using a cast iron pan with a rim on the bottom cause?

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, VA

On Sat, 8 Nov 2014 10:35:11 -0800 (PST), "
> wrote:

> On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> > As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
> > use on gas burners,
>
> OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work, have you had some problem or is this just some FUD over a newfangled thing? According to everyone 20 years ago when I bought a house with a glass cooktop I would scratch or damage it by using cast iron pans. Well, the separate oven died 6 or 7 years ago, but that glass top is still fine and I use cast iron all the time.
>
> So, what problem would using a cast iron pan with a rim on the bottom cause?
>
I think you need complete contact with the entire bottom of the pan
for induction to work as intended.


--
Avoid cutting yourself when slicing vegetables by getting someone else to hold them.

On Saturday, November 8, 2014 8:48:12 AM UTC-10, sf wrote:
> On Sat, 8 Nov 2014 10:35:11 -0800 (PST), "
> > wrote:
>
> > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> > > As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
> > > use on gas burners,
> >
> > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work, have you had some problem or is this just some FUD over a newfangled thing? According to everyone 20 years ago when I bought a house with a glass cooktop I would scratch or damage it by using cast iron pans. Well, the separate oven died 6 or 7 years ago, but that glass top is still fine and I use cast iron all the time.
> >
> > So, what problem would using a cast iron pan with a rim on the bottom cause?
> >
> I think you need complete contact with the entire bottom of the pan
> for induction to work as intended.
>
>
> --
> Avoid cutting yourself when slicing vegetables by getting someone else to hold them.

Induction is the transference of energy through space so you do have some leeway as far as the contact range goes. I'm guessing I could put a plate between the cooking surface and the pan and it would still work. OTOH, doing that might cause some overheating of the induction coils and shut the burner off.

Anyway, my cast iron works just spiffy on the range because iron just sucks up magnetic fields. I don't like to use it much because a heavy pan with a rough surface just don't seem right on glass.

On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
> On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
>> use on gas burners,
>
> OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the
> surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work....

From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."

It's an inverse square relationship.

> According to everyone 20 years ago when I bought a house with a glass cooktop
> I would scratch or damage it by using cast iron pans....

You could, if you shake or slide the pan around often while it's on the
cooktop. Especially if you have a current crappy Wagner with the rough
bottom.

> So, what problem would using a cast iron pan with a rim on the bottom cause?

Reduced heating due to the added distance between the coil and the pan;
potential aggravated scratching from all the weight focused on the
[perhaps rough] rim.

-- Larry

In article >, pltrgyst >
wrote:

> On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
> >> use on gas burners,
> >
> > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the
> > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work....

What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
it.

> From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
> field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
>
> It's an inverse square relationship.

I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
more important.

Isaac

On 11/10/2014 12:51 AM, isw wrote:
> In article >, pltrgyst >
> wrote:
>
>> On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
>>> On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>>>> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
>>>> use on gas burners,
>>>
>>> OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the
>>> surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work....
>
> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
> it.
>
>> From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
>> field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
>>
>> It's an inverse square relationship.
>
> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
> more important.
>
> Isaac
>

I believe you are correct.

On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
> In article >, pltrgyst >
> wrote:
>
> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended for
> > >> use on gas burners,
> > >
> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to the
> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should work....
>
> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
> it.
>
> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
> >
> > It's an inverse square relationship.
>
> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
> more important.
>
> Isaac

In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat transferred back to the glass.

"dsi1" > wrote in message
...
> On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
>> In article >, pltrgyst >
>> wrote:
>>
>> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
>> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended
>> > >> for
>> > >> use on gas burners,
>> > >
>> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to
>> > > the
>> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should
>> > > work....
>>
>> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
>> it.
>>
>> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
>> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
>> >
>> > It's an inverse square relationship.
>>
>> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
>> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
>> more important.
>>
>> Isaac
>
> In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
> causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
> having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
> transferred back to the glass.

Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
contact with the hob:

'Induction hob converter'

http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...FarKtAod4VcA_w

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On 11/10/14, 1:45 AM, Travis McGee wrote:

>>> It's an inverse square relationship.
>>
>> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
>> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
>> more important.
>
> I believe you are correct.

He is. My bad statement, sorry.

-- Larry

On 11/10/14, 5:01 AM, dsi1 wrote:

>
> In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
> causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
>having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
> transferred back to the glass.

You might also note that manufacturers specifically warn against using
such cookware in the manuals for both induction and radiant glass cooktops.

-- Larry

On 11/10/14, 5:30 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>
> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
> contact with the hob:
>
> 'Induction hob converter'

Well no, because their pans won't make full contact with this disc either.

All these discs do is reduce the available heat by injecting another
contact surface into the equation. They're useful only if you want very
low heat for a delicate task, and your induction burner won't go that
low -- which is very, very rare.

-- Larry

"pltrgyst" > wrote in message
...
> On 11/10/14, 5:30 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
>> contact with the hob:
>>
>> 'Induction hob converter'
>
> Well no, because their pans won't make full contact with this disc either.
>
> All these discs do is reduce the available heat by injecting another
> contact surface into the equation. They're useful only if you want very
> low heat for a delicate task, and your induction burner won't go that
> low -- which is very, very rare.

Ok I don't have an induction hob but I had seen those things around.

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On Monday, November 10, 2014 12:51:30 AM UTC-5, isw wrote:
>
> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
> more important.
>
> Isaac

Inverse square law only refers to point sources. With extended
sources or different geometries it does not apply.

http://www.richardfisher.com

On Monday, November 10, 2014 12:31:01 AM UTC-10, Ophelia wrote:
> "dsi1" <> wrote in message
> ...
> > On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
> >> In article >, pltrgyst >
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
> >> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> >> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended
> >> > >> for
> >> > >> use on gas burners,
> >> > >
> >> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to
> >> > > the
> >> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should
> >> > > work....
> >>
> >> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
> >> it.
> >>
> >> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
> >> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
> >> >
> >> > It's an inverse square relationship.
> >>
> >> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
> >> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
> >> more important.
> >>
> >> Isaac
> >
> > In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
> > causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
> > having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
> > transferred back to the glass.
>
> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
> contact with the hob:
>
> 'Induction hob converter'
>
> http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...FarKtAod4VcA_w
>
> --
> http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

I think this full contact thing is overblown but the product might work fine if you want to use non-induction pans and don't mind a big drop in efficiency. If your pans are not flat you probably should be using a different pan. I did have a problem with my flat bottom wok bulging out a little and the pan not sitting flat. It still worked fine but was unstable. Putting a slight concave surface on the bottom made for a very stable wok. Glass surfaces really accentuate pans that have high points on the bottom.

On Monday, November 10, 2014 3:38:32 AM UTC-10, pltrgyst wrote:
> On 11/10/14, 5:01 AM, dsi1 wrote:
>
> >
> > In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
> > causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
> >having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
> > transferred back to the glass.
>
> You might also note that manufacturers specifically warn against using
> such cookware in the manuals for both induction and radiant glass cooktops.
>
> -- Larry

They want to cover their ass in case someone does something stupid. As it goes, my cast iron pan works fine on my range. The range is quite sensitive to overloading the induction coils i.e., if there's a problem with the transfer of energy to the pan i.e., if the pan is not made of suitable material, or is too far from the magnetic field, or is too small. My guess is that cast iron works great with induction and probably has the most efficient transfer of energy of any pan material. I won't use it because it's too heavy..

"dsi1" > wrote in message
...
> On Monday, November 10, 2014 12:31:01 AM UTC-10, Ophelia wrote:
>> "dsi1" <> wrote in message
>> ...
>> > On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
>> >> In article >, pltrgyst >
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
>> >> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>> >> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings,
>> >> > >> intended
>> >> > >> for
>> >> > >> use on gas burners,
>> >> > >
>> >> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough
>> >> > > to
>> >> > > the
>> >> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should
>> >> > > work....
>> >>
>> >> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
>> >> it.
>> >>
>> >> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the
>> >> > magnetic
>> >> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
>> >> >
>> >> > It's an inverse square relationship.
>> >>
>> >> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
>> >> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing
>> >> even
>> >> more important.
>> >>
>> >> Isaac
>> >
>> > In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
>> > causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
>> > having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
>> > transferred back to the glass.
>>
>> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
>> contact with the hob:
>>
>> 'Induction hob converter'
>>
>> http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...FarKtAod4VcA_w
>>
>> --
>> http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/
>
> I think this full contact thing is overblown but the product might work
> fine if you want to use non-induction pans and don't mind a big drop in
> efficiency. If your pans are not flat you probably should be using a
> different pan. I did have a problem with my flat bottom wok bulging out a
> little and the pan not sitting flat. It still worked fine but was
> unstable. Putting a slight concave surface on the bottom made for a very
> stable wok. Glass surfaces really accentuate pans that have high points on
> the bottom.


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

"dsi1" > wrote in message
...

> I think this full contact thing is overblown but the product might work
> fine if you want to use non-induction pans and don't mind a big drop in
> efficiency. If your pans are not flat you probably should be using a
> different pan. I did have a problem with my flat bottom wok bulging out a
> little and the pan not sitting flat. It still worked fine but was
> unstable. Putting a slight concave surface on the bottom made for a very
> stable wok. Glass surfaces really accentuate pans that have high points on
> the bottom.

Did you see the comments after the advert? Several people were talking
about using it with non induction pans.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On Monday, November 10, 2014 7:55:22 AM UTC-10, Ophelia wrote:
> "dsi1" <> wrote in message
> ...
>
> > I think this full contact thing is overblown but the product might work
> > fine if you want to use non-induction pans and don't mind a big drop in
> > efficiency. If your pans are not flat you probably should be using a
> > different pan. I did have a problem with my flat bottom wok bulging out a
> > little and the pan not sitting flat. It still worked fine but was
> > unstable. Putting a slight concave surface on the bottom made for a very
> > stable wok. Glass surfaces really accentuate pans that have high points on
> > the bottom.
>
> Did you see the comments after the advert? Several people were talking
> about using it with non induction pans.
>
>
>
> --
> http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

It was my understanding that this was it's intended purpose.

"dsi1" > wrote in message
...
> On Monday, November 10, 2014 7:55:22 AM UTC-10, Ophelia wrote:
>> "dsi1" <> wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>> > I think this full contact thing is overblown but the product might work
>> > fine if you want to use non-induction pans and don't mind a big drop in
>> > efficiency. If your pans are not flat you probably should be using a
>> > different pan. I did have a problem with my flat bottom wok bulging out
>> > a
>> > little and the pan not sitting flat. It still worked fine but was
>> > unstable. Putting a slight concave surface on the bottom made for a
>> > very
>> > stable wok. Glass surfaces really accentuate pans that have high points
>> > on
>> > the bottom.
>>
>> Did you see the comments after the advert? Several people were talking
>> about using it with non induction pans.

> It was my understanding that this was it's intended purpose.

Ahh very probably


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

In article >,
Helpful person > wrote:

> On Monday, November 10, 2014 12:51:30 AM UTC-5, isw wrote:
> >
> > I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
> > real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
> > more important.
> >
> > Isaac
>
> Inverse square law only refers to point sources. With extended
> sources or different geometries it does not apply.

Yup. And for magnetics, monopoles (which, AFAIK, are not yet being used
in induction cooktops.)

Isaac

In article >,
"Ophelia" > wrote:

> "dsi1" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
> >> In article >, pltrgyst >
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
> >> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
> >> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings, intended
> >> > >> for
> >> > >> use on gas burners,
> >> > >
> >> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough to
> >> > > the
> >> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should
> >> > > work....
> >>
> >> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
> >> it.
> >>
> >> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the magnetic
> >> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
> >> >
> >> > It's an inverse square relationship.
> >>
> >> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
> >> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing even
> >> more important.
> >>
> >> Isaac
> >
> > In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
> > causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
> > having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
> > transferred back to the glass.
>
> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
> contact with the hob:
>
> 'Induction hob converter'
>
> http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...nduction-hob-c
> onverter-prodst09262i/?gclid=CIyZlI_q78ECFarKtAod4VcA_w

It turns a highly efficient induction unit into an ordinary "pan on a
hot metal plate" cooker. What's the point of that? Why not just use the
regular cooktop?

Isaac

On Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:44:04 -0800, isw > wrote:

> In article >,
> "Ophelia" > wrote:
>
> > "dsi1" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> > Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
> > contact with the hob:
> >
> > 'Induction hob converter'
> >
> > http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...nduction-hob-c
> > onverter-prodst09262i/?gclid=CIyZlI_q78ECFarKtAod4VcA_w
>
> It turns a highly efficient induction unit into an ordinary "pan on a
> hot metal plate" cooker. What's the point of that? Why not just use the
> regular cooktop?
>
Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?


--
Avoid cutting yourself when slicing vegetables by getting someone else to hold them.

"isw" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> "Ophelia" > wrote:
>
>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
>> >> In article >, pltrgyst >
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
>> >> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>> >> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings,
>> >> > >> intended
>> >> > >> for
>> >> > >> use on gas burners,
>> >> > >
>> >> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough
>> >> > > to
>> >> > > the
>> >> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should
>> >> > > work....
>> >>
>> >> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to maximize
>> >> it.
>> >>
>> >> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the
>> >> > magnetic
>> >> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
>> >> >
>> >> > It's an inverse square relationship.
>> >>
>> >> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
>> >> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing
>> >> even
>> >> more important.
>> >>
>> >> Isaac
>> >
>> > In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry pan
>> > causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
>> > having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
>> > transferred back to the glass.
>>
>> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
>> contact with the hob:
>>
>> 'Induction hob converter'
>>
>> http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...nduction-hob-c
>> onverter-prodst09262i/?gclid=CIyZlI_q78ECFarKtAod4VcA_w
>
> It turns a highly efficient induction unit into an ordinary "pan on a
> hot metal plate" cooker. What's the point of that? Why not just use the
> regular cooktop?

It doesn't turn the hob into a regular cook top! How in the world can it do
that??? What it does is to allow you to use your regular pans on the
induction hob!
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On 11/11/2014 5:28 AM, Ophelia wrote:
> "isw" > wrote in message

>> It turns a highly efficient induction unit into an ordinary "pan on a
>> hot metal plate" cooker. What's the point of that? Why not just use the
>> regular cooktop?
>
> It doesn't turn the hob into a regular cook top! How in the world can it
> do that??? What it does is to allow you to use your regular pans on the
> induction hob!

The converter is heated by induction. The heat from that is then
transferred (conduction) to the 'regular' pan. So it does, indeed,
function in a similar manner to an ordinary electric hob, with none of
the advantages of induction.

"S Viemeister" > wrote in message
...
> On 11/11/2014 5:28 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>> "isw" > wrote in message
>
>>> It turns a highly efficient induction unit into an ordinary "pan on a
>>> hot metal plate" cooker. What's the point of that? Why not just use the
>>> regular cooktop?
>>
>> It doesn't turn the hob into a regular cook top! How in the world can it
>> do that??? What it does is to allow you to use your regular pans on the
>> induction hob!
>
> The converter is heated by induction. The heat from that is then
> transferred (conduction) to the 'regular' pan. So it does, indeed,
> function in a similar manner to an ordinary electric hob, with none of the
> advantages of induction.

Strange stuff.


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

"Ophelia" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> "isw" > wrote in message
> ...
>> In article >,
>> "Ophelia" > wrote:
>>
>>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> > On Sunday, November 9, 2014 7:51:30 PM UTC-10, isw wrote:
>>> >> In article >, pltrgyst >
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> > On 11/8/14, 1:35 PM, wrote:
>>> >> > > On Saturday, November 8, 2014 11:07:34 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>>> >> > >> As Boron said, avoid the older pieces with the smoke rings,
>>> >> > >> intended
>>> >> > >> for
>>> >> > >> use on gas burners,
>>> >> > >
>>> >> > > OK, I have to ask, why? As long as the cast iron is close enough
>>> >> > > to
>>> >> > > the
>>> >> > > surface to have the magnetic field induce eddy currents it should
>>> >> > > work....
>>> >>
>>> >> What you want to do is not just have *some* induction, but to
>>> >> maximize
>>> >> it.
>>> >>
>>> >> > From Wikipedia: "Cookware must have a flat bottom since the
>>> >> > magnetic
>>> >> > field drops rapidly with distance from the surface."
>>> >> >
>>> >> > It's an inverse square relationship.
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm pretty sure it's an inverse cube relation (theoretically, which
>>> >> real-world devices rarely are), which makes minimizing the spacing
>>> >> even
>>> >> more important.
>>> >>
>>> >> Isaac
>>> >
>>> > In the real world, the raised rim on the bottom of my cast iron fry
>>> > pan
>>> > causes no problems. In fact, I like the idea of the bottom of the pan
>>> > having an air gap between it and the glass surface. There's less heat
>>> > transferred back to the glass.
>>>
>>> Would this help those who have problems with their pans not making full
>>> contact with the hob:
>>>
>>> 'Induction hob converter'
>>>
>>> http://www.coopersofstortford.co.uk/...nduction-hob-c
>>> onverter-prodst09262i/?gclid=CIyZlI_q78ECFarKtAod4VcA_w
>>
>> It turns a highly efficient induction unit into an ordinary "pan on a
>> hot metal plate" cooker. What's the point of that? Why not just use the
>> regular cooktop?
>
> It doesn't turn the hob into a regular cook top! How in the world can it
> do that??? What it does is to allow you to use your regular pans on the
> induction hob!

Well there you go, Isaac) Did you read Sheila's comment? You were
correct after all) Who knew?


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/

On Monday, November 10, 2014 8:38:32 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>
> You might also note that manufacturers specifically warn against using
> such cookware in the manuals for both induction and radiant glass cooktops.

Well, we're starting to go in circles here. That is one of the reasons I asked about *why*. According the manufacturers' recommendations I should have ruined my glass cooktop by using cast iron on it (and other things they advise against) but it's been over 20 years and it still works fine and hasn't cracked or been badly scratched or anything else. My question was specifically about induction, since I've found through empirical processes that the glass smooth top is not nearly as fragile as some would have me believe.

I did some Googling after posting and the idea of inverse square or cubed law is certainly something to think about. It doesn't apply to "near field" induction. Now, how far is near field at the wavelengths involved, I don't know and I don't feel like doing the math. I was hoping for someone with actual experience instead of the speculation most have been engaging in. I do believe one person said it works for them with their CI frying pan.

I suppose I should just buy one, or borrow one from my wife, and try it with my smooth bottomed vs. the one pan I have with a slight ring and see if there is any practical difference. If I do, I'll post results.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, VA

On 11/11/2014 7:56 AM, wrote:
> On Monday, November 10, 2014 8:38:32 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>>
>> You might also note that manufacturers specifically warn against using
>> such cookware in the manuals for both induction and radiant glass cooktops.
>
> Well, we're starting to go in circles here. That is one of the reasons I asked about *why*. According the manufacturers' recommendations I should have ruined my glass cooktop by using cast iron on it (and other things they advise against) but it's been over 20 years and it still works fine and hasn't cracked or been badly scratched or anything else. My question was specifically about induction, since I've found through empirical processes that the glass smooth top is not nearly as fragile as some would have me believe.
>
> I did some Googling after posting and the idea of inverse square or cubed law is certainly something to think about. It doesn't apply to "near field" induction. Now, how far is near field at the wavelengths involved, I don't know and I don't feel like doing the math. I was hoping for someone with actual experience instead of the speculation most have been engaging in. I do believe one person said it works for them with their CI frying pan.
>

You better believe that at least one person said that CI works fine on
an induction range. Forget about the guys with the theories and the
manufacturers trying to cover their asses - that little ridge on the
bottom of the pan does not affect the operation. CI works well with
induction and why not? Iron just loves magnetic fields and vice-versa!
Just don't use a pan with 3 legs on it. :-)

OTOH, I don't use CI on my range because of the weight and the glass
top. If you don't have any reservations with that then go for it. Be
aware that induction will have hot spots on cast iron the same as with
any other electric range.

> I suppose I should just buy one, or borrow one from my wife, and try it with my smooth bottomed vs. the one pan I have with a slight ring and see if there is any practical difference. If I do, I'll post results.
>
> Bill Ranck
> Blacksburg, VA
>

sf wrote:
>
> Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?

All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
serious about cooking every day. Gas is best for serious cooks,
electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.

I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world). Turn up the
heat, instant more heat. Turn it down or off and instant no more heat.
Doesn't matter what pans you use....they all work and none will break
the burner grill off.

Again...glass top stoves are great for show kitchens, not for serious
cooks.

G.

On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 15:40:38 -0500, Gary > wrote:

> sf wrote:
> >
> > Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?
>
> All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
> these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
> serious about cooking every day. Gas is best for serious cooks,
> electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.
>
> I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world). Turn up the
> heat, instant more heat. Turn it down or off and instant no more heat.
> Doesn't matter what pans you use....they all work and none will break
> the burner grill off.
>
> Again...glass top stoves are great for show kitchens, not for serious
> cooks.
>
Gas is less expensive than electric and that's most assuredly the main
reason why it's used in restaurant kitchens. I've watched open
kitchens in operation. Line cooks don't waste time turning heat up or
down. The gas is turned up all the way and when they want less heat,
they lift the pan.



--
Avoid cutting yourself when slicing vegetables by getting someone else to hold them.

On 11/11/14, 12:56 PM, wrote:
> On Monday, November 10, 2014 8:38:32 AM UTC-5, pltrgyst wrote:
>>
>> You might also note that manufacturers specifically warn against using
>> such cookware in the manuals for both induction and radiant glass cooktops.
>
> Well, we're starting to go in circles here. That is one of the reasons I asked about *why*. According the manufacturers' recommendations I should have ruined my glass cooktop by using cast iron on it (and other things they advise against) but it's been over 20 years and it still works fine and hasn't cracked or been badly scratched or anything else. My question was specifically about induction, since I've found through empirical processes that the glass smooth top is not nearly as fragile as some would have me believe.
>
> I did some Googling after posting and the idea of inverse square or cubed law is certainly something to think about. It doesn't apply to "near field" induction. Now, how far is near field at the wavelengths involved, I don't know and I don't feel like doing the math. I was hoping for someone with actual experience instead of the speculation most have been engaging in. I do believe one person said it works for them with their CI frying pan.
>
> I suppose I should just buy one, or borrow one from my wife, and try it with my smooth bottomed vs. the one pan I have with a slight ring and see if there is any practical difference. If I do, I'll post results.

Well, a couple of years before we went induction, we had three portable
induction hobs. I also had a beautiful Griswold large logo 10-inch
skillet with a smoke rim, that I used mostly on my outdoor grill. Two of
the three portable induction hobs would cycle on and off continuously
when I tried to use that particular pan.

I ended up giving it to my brother for use on his Viking gas stove, so I
never got to try it on our GE induction cooktop....

I would expect the amount of heat loss due to a smoke rim to vary quite
a bit among various induction burners due to technology and specific
design and manufacturing details.

-- Larry

"Gary" > wrote in message ...
> sf wrote:
>>
>> Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?
>
> All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
> these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
> serious about cooking every day. Gas is best for serious cooks,
> electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.
>
> I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world). Turn up the
> heat, instant more heat. Turn it down or off and instant no more heat.
> Doesn't matter what pans you use....they all work and none will break
> the burner grill off.
>
> Again...glass top stoves are great for show kitchens, not for serious
> cooks.
>
> G.

I've never seen a chef that used anything but gas, especially when cooking
sauces and things like that where different heats are necessary.

Cheri

On 11/11/2014 10:40 AM, Gary wrote:
> sf wrote:
>>
>> Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?
>
> All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
> these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
> serious about cooking every day. Gas is best for serious cooks,
> electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.
>
> I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world). Turn up the
> heat, instant more heat. Turn it down or off and instant no more heat.
> Doesn't matter what pans you use....they all work and none will break
> the burner grill off.

The reality is that induction has a faster response than gas. That
rational doesn't ring true to anybody that has used induction.

My guess is that gas has the ability to deliver a higher amount of heat
than induction but not every restaurant cooks full blast like a Chinese
restaurant. As it goes, gas is popular with commercial cookeries and
manufacturers because it's so damn cheap. They'd be dumb or
irresponsible to use anything else if it's possible. It's going to
continue to be cheap for quite a while.

>
> Again...glass top stoves are great for show kitchens, not for serious
> cooks.
>
> G.
>

On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 13:01:35 -0800, sf > wrote:

>On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 15:40:38 -0500, Gary > wrote:
>
>> sf wrote:
>> >
>> > Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?
>>
>> All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
>> these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
>> serious about cooking every day. Gas is best for serious cooks,
>> electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.
>>
>> I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world). Turn up the
>> heat, instant more heat. Turn it down or off and instant no more heat.
>> Doesn't matter what pans you use....they all work and none will break
>> the burner grill off.
>>
>> Again...glass top stoves are great for show kitchens, not for serious
>> cooks.
>>
>Gas is less expensive than electric and that's most assuredly the main
>reason why it's used in restaurant kitchens.

WRONG! Gas is used in restaurant kitchens because it's far more
versatile than electric... gas is instant on/instant off. There is no
one who cooks with electric at home who is any kind of cook[period]

On 11/11/2014 1:54 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>
> WRONG! Gas is used in restaurant kitchens because it's far more
> versatile than electric... gas is instant on/instant off. There is no
> one who cooks with electric at home who is any kind of cook[period]
>

This seems plausible - if you believe that professional cooks set up and
run their kitchens like a commercial one and that they cannot separate
their professional life from their regular life. I do not believe that
either is true[exclamation point]

In article >,
sf > wrote:

> On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 15:40:38 -0500, Gary > wrote:
>
> > sf wrote:
> > >
> > > Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?
> >
> > All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
> > these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
> > serious about cooking every day. Gas is best for serious cooks,
> > electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.
> >
> > I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world). Turn up the
> > heat, instant more heat. Turn it down or off and instant no more heat.
> > Doesn't matter what pans you use....they all work and none will break
> > the burner grill off.
> >
> > Again...glass top stoves are great for show kitchens, not for serious
> > cooks.
> >
> Gas is less expensive than electric and that's most assuredly the main
> reason why it's used in restaurant kitchens. I've watched open
> kitchens in operation. Line cooks don't waste time turning heat up or
> down. The gas is turned up all the way and when they want less heat,
> they lift the pan.

I'm only cooking at home, but I do that too. It takes only one hand,
while you're stirring with the other. How do you do that with induction?
Doesn't the thing shut off completely when you raise the pan?

Isaac

On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 20:37:31 -1000, dsi1
> wrote:

> On 11/11/2014 1:54 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> >
> > WRONG! Gas is used in restaurant kitchens because it's far more
> > versatile than electric... gas is instant on/instant off. There is no
> > one who cooks with electric at home who is any kind of cook[period]
> >
Mr. Blowhard, spews his BS again.
>
> This seems plausible - if you believe that professional cooks set up and
> run their kitchens like a commercial one and that they cannot separate
> their professional life from their regular life. I do not believe that
> either is true[exclamation point]

Chances are good that their wives do the cooking at home (if they live
anything near a functional lifestyle).


--
Avoid cutting yourself when slicing vegetables by getting someone else to hold them.

On 2014-11-12, dsi1 > wrote:

> On 11/11/2014 1:54 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

>> WRONG! Gas is used in restaurant kitchens because it's far more
>> versatile than electric...

> This seems plausible...

It's nonsense.

Commercial kitchen stoves have burners (hobs) that will go way low in
temp. Most household gas stoves do not. Commercial kitchen stoves
often have areas dedicated to solid CI surfaces to absorb/dissipate
burner heat. Home stoves rarely do. Gotta buy a "diffuser".

I've been cooking on a gas stove for the last 6 yrs. Still wish I had
at least one electric hob. Besides, home ranges don't typically cost
$5-15K.

nb

In article >, says...
>
> sf wrote:
> >
> > Isn't it used for pans that normally can't be used on induction units?
>
> All this talk about glass top stoves and induction units, etc. IMO,
> these are all pretty kitchen appliances for people that are not
> serious about cooking every day.

Rubbish. If you had cooked on one, you'd know that a glass top is
MORE adjustable than a gas hob, instantly responsive, cooler, cleaner.

Gas is best for serious cooks,
> electric is 2nd best but a far 2nd place.
>
> I use gas (as does most every restaurant in the world).

You use gas because you're a renter, too poor to choose your own
stove. Landlords supply what's cheapest and least vulnerable to
accidental damage. So do restaurant owners.

Restaurants use gas because it's cheaper, not subject to power cuts,
and the structure is most durable for commercial purposes. Restaurant
cooks working in a crowded high speed high pressure environment tend to
slam heavy pans around and drop stuff,and metal gas hobs and burners are
the toughest to withstand rough treatment.

A glasstop wouldn't survive long in any commercial kitchen. That's why
you won't see one in restaurants.


Janet UK

On Wednesday, November 12, 2014 5:05:41 AM UTC-10, sf wrote:
> On Tue, 11 Nov 2014 20:37:31 -1000, dsi1
> > wrote:
>
> > On 11/11/2014 1:54 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> > >
> > > WRONG! Gas is used in restaurant kitchens because it's far more
> > > versatile than electric... gas is instant on/instant off. There is no
> > > one who cooks with electric at home who is any kind of cook[period]
> > >
> Mr. Blowhard, spews his BS again.
> >
> > This seems plausible - if you believe that professional cooks set up and
> > run their kitchens like a commercial one and that they cannot separate
> > their professional life from their regular life. I do not believe that
> > either is true[exclamation point]
>
> Chances are good that their wives do the cooking at home (if they live
> anything near a functional lifestyle).
>

That's a good point although "spouses" rather than "wives" would be more politically correct.

>
> --
> Avoid cutting yourself when slicing vegetables by getting someone else to hold them.