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Kitchen Renovation - Appliances
Hi all,
We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just wondering if they're really as good as all the others. Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more expensive. Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy efficient as possible. And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar heating, would love to hear from you! Thanks! |
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>(CJRA) applies:
> >We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, >plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing >everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. > >My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all >Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > >Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all >others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have >experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. >These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing >stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just >wondering if they're really as good as all the others. >Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more >expensive. > >Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop >separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just >because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. > >Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, >but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy >efficient as possible. > >And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar >heating, would love to hear from you! Isn't this something you should be discussing with your banker... I mean like the bottom line for you is all about price... I hope you're not here for a loan. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>(CJRA) applies:
> >We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, >plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing >everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. > >My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all >Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > >Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all >others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have >experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. >These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing >stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just >wondering if they're really as good as all the others. >Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more >expensive. > >Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop >separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just >because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. > >Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, >but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy >efficient as possible. > >And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar >heating, would love to hear from you! Isn't this something you should be discussing with your banker... I mean like the bottom line for you is all about price... I hope you're not here for a loan. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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"CJRA" > wrote in message
om... > Hi all, > > We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, > plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing > everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. > > My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been > looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all > others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have > experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. > These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing > stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just > wondering if they're really as good as all the others. > Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more > expensive. We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper (which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. Just one experience. -- Thomas C Royer Lead Engineer, Software Test The MITRE Corporation "If you're not free to fail, you're not free" -- Gene Burns > > Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop > separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just > because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. > > Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, > but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy > efficient as possible. > > And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar > heating, would love to hear from you! > > Thanks! |
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"CJRA" > wrote in message
om... > Hi all, > > We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, > plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing > everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. > > My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been > looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all > others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have > experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. > These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing > stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just > wondering if they're really as good as all the others. > Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more > expensive. We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper (which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. Just one experience. -- Thomas C Royer Lead Engineer, Software Test The MITRE Corporation "If you're not free to fail, you're not free" -- Gene Burns > > Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop > separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just > because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. > > Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, > but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy > efficient as possible. > > And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar > heating, would love to hear from you! > > Thanks! |
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CJRA wrote:
> My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Do *NOT* make the huge mistake I almost did when I redid my kitchen. Leave room for a real sized refrigerator. You will thank me down the road. I thank my kitchen guy for ignoring my design that called for only the room for a 19 whatever cf refrigerator. nancy |
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CJRA wrote:
> My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Do *NOT* make the huge mistake I almost did when I redid my kitchen. Leave room for a real sized refrigerator. You will thank me down the road. I thank my kitchen guy for ignoring my design that called for only the room for a 19 whatever cf refrigerator. nancy |
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CJRA wrote:
> My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Do *NOT* make the huge mistake I almost did when I redid my kitchen. Leave room for a real sized refrigerator. You will thank me down the road. I thank my kitchen guy for ignoring my design that called for only the room for a 19 whatever cf refrigerator. nancy |
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>"Tom Royer" writes:
> >"CJRA" wrote: >> >> We're completely renovating. >> >> My question involves recommendations for appliances. >> >> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >> looking at the Amana ones. > >We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. >I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main >compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper >(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've >lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs to work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. Also, because of how the entire freezer section needs to slide out it's the worst case scenerio for proper sealing/insulating of the compartment... all else being equal bottom freezer units are definitely not as energy efficient as top freezer units, and due to the slide mechanism are more prone to malfunction and therefore misalignment of the seals. But you should be able to regulate the temperature balance so that the veggie bin doesn't freeze, if not there could possibly be a partial blockage in the air ducts, sometimes a misplaced piece of insulation, or a sticking divertor flap... it's always a good idea to call for service within the first year with any major appliance, even if you need to make up some malfunction, like you're hearing strange noises. I bet some of yoose hear strange noises all the time, so you're not really lying. I called the service tech to check out my clothes washer recently, only had it nine months (Whirlpool), nothing was obviously malfuntioning, but it did seem rather noisy and I found myself contantly rearranging clothes due to excessive vibration... I kept chalking it up to my overloading the unit, but actually as I found out later I wasn't. But since it was still under the free in-house service warranty the tech came to check it out. He removed the back panel and made some adjustments, tightened a few bolts (they were obviously loose), and said while he had it apart he'd change the drive belt even though it was still okay but rather loose... the machine did run much more smoothly and quietly afterwards... very few appliances get tested at the factory. I learned to do this many years ago from a neighbor who was a Sears appliance serviceman... always call for service on new appliances before the first year, might catch something just before it's about to fail. This also documents that the unit has "some" pre-existing condition, essentially lengthens your warranty. If that drive belt broke after the first year (but before 5 yrs) the manufacturer would supply a new part at no cost but after the first year I'd pay at least $100 for the service call and labor. The service tech that changed my belt said the belt had been strained due to those loose mounting bolts and and had stretched, it would probably have lasted a couple more years but eventually would fail prematurely... and probably in the interim cause damage to the drive mechanism. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>"Tom Royer" writes:
> >"CJRA" wrote: >> >> We're completely renovating. >> >> My question involves recommendations for appliances. >> >> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >> looking at the Amana ones. > >We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. >I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main >compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper >(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've >lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs to work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. Also, because of how the entire freezer section needs to slide out it's the worst case scenerio for proper sealing/insulating of the compartment... all else being equal bottom freezer units are definitely not as energy efficient as top freezer units, and due to the slide mechanism are more prone to malfunction and therefore misalignment of the seals. But you should be able to regulate the temperature balance so that the veggie bin doesn't freeze, if not there could possibly be a partial blockage in the air ducts, sometimes a misplaced piece of insulation, or a sticking divertor flap... it's always a good idea to call for service within the first year with any major appliance, even if you need to make up some malfunction, like you're hearing strange noises. I bet some of yoose hear strange noises all the time, so you're not really lying. I called the service tech to check out my clothes washer recently, only had it nine months (Whirlpool), nothing was obviously malfuntioning, but it did seem rather noisy and I found myself contantly rearranging clothes due to excessive vibration... I kept chalking it up to my overloading the unit, but actually as I found out later I wasn't. But since it was still under the free in-house service warranty the tech came to check it out. He removed the back panel and made some adjustments, tightened a few bolts (they were obviously loose), and said while he had it apart he'd change the drive belt even though it was still okay but rather loose... the machine did run much more smoothly and quietly afterwards... very few appliances get tested at the factory. I learned to do this many years ago from a neighbor who was a Sears appliance serviceman... always call for service on new appliances before the first year, might catch something just before it's about to fail. This also documents that the unit has "some" pre-existing condition, essentially lengthens your warranty. If that drive belt broke after the first year (but before 5 yrs) the manufacturer would supply a new part at no cost but after the first year I'd pay at least $100 for the service call and labor. The service tech that changed my belt said the belt had been strained due to those loose mounting bolts and and had stretched, it would probably have lasted a couple more years but eventually would fail prematurely... and probably in the interim cause damage to the drive mechanism. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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PENMART01 wrote:
> . . . it's always a good idea to call for > service within the first year with any major appliance, even if you need to > make up some malfunction, like you're hearing strange noises. I bet some of > yoose hear strange noises all the time, so you're not really lying. I called > the service tech to check out my clothes washer recently, only had it nine > months (Whirlpool), nothing was obviously malfuntioning, but it did seem rather > noisy and I found myself contantly rearranging clothes due to excessive > vibration... I kept chalking it up to my overloading the unit, but actually as > I found out later I wasn't. But since it was still under the free in-house > service warranty the tech came to check it out. He removed the back panel and > made some adjustments, tightened a few bolts (they were obviously loose), and > said while he had it apart he'd change the drive belt even though it was still > okay but rather loose... the machine did run much more smoothly and quietly > afterwards... very few appliances get tested at the factory. I learned to do > this many years ago from a neighbor who was a Sears appliance serviceman... > always call for service on new appliances before the first year, might catch > something just before it's about to fail. This also documents that the unit > has "some" pre-existing condition, essentially lengthens your warranty. If > that drive belt broke after the first year (but before 5 yrs) the manufacturer > would supply a new part at no cost but after the first year I'd pay at least > $100 for the service call and labor. The service tech that changed my belt > said the belt had been strained due to those loose mounting bolts and and had > stretched, it would probably have lasted a couple more years but eventually > would fail prematurely... and probably in the interim cause damage to the drive > mechanism. > Very sound advice. jim |
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PENMART01 wrote:
> . . . it's always a good idea to call for > service within the first year with any major appliance, even if you need to > make up some malfunction, like you're hearing strange noises. I bet some of > yoose hear strange noises all the time, so you're not really lying. I called > the service tech to check out my clothes washer recently, only had it nine > months (Whirlpool), nothing was obviously malfuntioning, but it did seem rather > noisy and I found myself contantly rearranging clothes due to excessive > vibration... I kept chalking it up to my overloading the unit, but actually as > I found out later I wasn't. But since it was still under the free in-house > service warranty the tech came to check it out. He removed the back panel and > made some adjustments, tightened a few bolts (they were obviously loose), and > said while he had it apart he'd change the drive belt even though it was still > okay but rather loose... the machine did run much more smoothly and quietly > afterwards... very few appliances get tested at the factory. I learned to do > this many years ago from a neighbor who was a Sears appliance serviceman... > always call for service on new appliances before the first year, might catch > something just before it's about to fail. This also documents that the unit > has "some" pre-existing condition, essentially lengthens your warranty. If > that drive belt broke after the first year (but before 5 yrs) the manufacturer > would supply a new part at no cost but after the first year I'd pay at least > $100 for the service call and labor. The service tech that changed my belt > said the belt had been strained due to those loose mounting bolts and and had > stretched, it would probably have lasted a couple more years but eventually > would fail prematurely... and probably in the interim cause damage to the drive > mechanism. > Very sound advice. jim |
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On 05 Nov 2004 19:11:23 GMT, (PENMART01) wrote:
>>"Tom Royer" writes: >> >>"CJRA" wrote: >>> >>> We're completely renovating. >>> >>> My question involves recommendations for appliances. >>> >>> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >>> looking at the Amana ones. >> >>We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. >>I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main >>compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper >>(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've >>lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. > >Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs to >work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. Sorry, bub. You're wrong. Top & bottom freezer models are comparable in efficiency, all else being equal. Side by sides, or any models with ice cube makers or water dispensers are the least efficient of all, so if you want to parade around in a green yarmulke, get your facts straight. What refrigerators have pumps in them? Here...find out how they work: http://home.howstuffworks.com/refrigerator2.htm Most of the rest of the post is BS, too, and too bothersome to deal with. Boron |
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Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:
> We have separate gas cooktop and wall oven in our apt. They probably > date from the 1960s. I can see how they mount and don't see any > problem replacing them if we want. And, one can be replaced without > disturbing the other. > > Onr thing we like is that the oven door makes a nice temporary shelf > for dishes being loaded. Also, not having to bnend down to use the > oven. Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can burn the living crap out of your right boob. At any rate, in my house, the wall oven, being old, was not easily replaceable as they no longer made that size. New kitchen for me. No new wall oven, thank you. nancy |
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Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote:
> We have separate gas cooktop and wall oven in our apt. They probably > date from the 1960s. I can see how they mount and don't see any > problem replacing them if we want. And, one can be replaced without > disturbing the other. > > Onr thing we like is that the oven door makes a nice temporary shelf > for dishes being loaded. Also, not having to bnend down to use the > oven. Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can burn the living crap out of your right boob. At any rate, in my house, the wall oven, being old, was not easily replaceable as they no longer made that size. New kitchen for me. No new wall oven, thank you. nancy |
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"Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
... > On 05 Nov 2004 19:11:23 GMT, (PENMART01) wrote: > > >>"Tom Royer" writes: > >> > >>"CJRA" wrote: > >>> > >>> We're completely renovating. > >>> > >>> My question involves recommendations for appliances. > >>> > >>> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been > >>> looking at the Amana ones. > >> > >>We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. > >>I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main > >>compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper > >>(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've > >>lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. > > > >Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs to > >work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. > > Sorry, bub. You're wrong. Top & bottom freezer models are comparable > in efficiency, all else being equal. Side by sides, or any models with > ice cube makers or water dispensers are the least efficient of all, > so if you want to parade around in a green yarmulke, get your facts > straight. > > What refrigerators have pumps in them? Here...find out how they work: > http://home.howstuffworks.com/refrigerator2.htm > > Most of the rest of the post is BS, too, and too bothersome to deal > with. > I agree - bottom freezer units work perfectly well and do not "fly in the face of physics" any more than the basic idea of refrigerators does. We have had an Amana bottom freezer unit for 5 years and are very happy with it. We had some minor problems with items in the veg drawers freezing but some simple adjustments took care of it. -- Peter Aitken Remove the crap from my email address before using. |
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"Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
... > On 05 Nov 2004 19:11:23 GMT, (PENMART01) wrote: > > >>"Tom Royer" writes: > >> > >>"CJRA" wrote: > >>> > >>> We're completely renovating. > >>> > >>> My question involves recommendations for appliances. > >>> > >>> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been > >>> looking at the Amana ones. > >> > >>We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. > >>I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main > >>compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper > >>(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've > >>lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. > > > >Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs to > >work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. > > Sorry, bub. You're wrong. Top & bottom freezer models are comparable > in efficiency, all else being equal. Side by sides, or any models with > ice cube makers or water dispensers are the least efficient of all, > so if you want to parade around in a green yarmulke, get your facts > straight. > > What refrigerators have pumps in them? Here...find out how they work: > http://home.howstuffworks.com/refrigerator2.htm > > Most of the rest of the post is BS, too, and too bothersome to deal > with. > I agree - bottom freezer units work perfectly well and do not "fly in the face of physics" any more than the basic idea of refrigerators does. We have had an Amana bottom freezer unit for 5 years and are very happy with it. We had some minor problems with items in the veg drawers freezing but some simple adjustments took care of it. -- Peter Aitken Remove the crap from my email address before using. |
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>Moron "Bubba" Elgar writes:
>>(PENMART01) wrote >>>"Tom Royer" writes: >>>"CJRA" wrote: >>>> >>>> We're completely renovating. >>>> >>>> My question involves recommendations for appliances. >>>> >>>> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >>>> looking at the Amana ones. >>> >>>We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. >>>I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main >>>compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper >>>(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've >>>lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. >> >>Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs >to >>work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. > >Sorry, bub. You're wrong. Top & bottom freezer models are comparable >in efficiency, all else being equal. Side by sides, or any models with >ice cube makers or water dispensers are the least efficient of all, >so if you want to parade around in a green yarmulke, get your facts >straight. > >What refrigerators have pumps in them? Here...find out how they work: >http://home.howstuffworks.com/refrigerator2.htm Not speaking about how "refrigeration" is accomplished or how "refrigerant" is moved, but how cold air is circulated (pumped) within and between the refrigerator compartment and freezer compartment... how friggin' old is your ice box, eh? Why are you such moron, Bubba... ya momma dropped you on yer pointy pinhead head. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>Moron "Bubba" Elgar writes:
>>(PENMART01) wrote >>>"Tom Royer" writes: >>>"CJRA" wrote: >>>> >>>> We're completely renovating. >>>> >>>> My question involves recommendations for appliances. >>>> >>>> Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been >>>> looking at the Amana ones. >>> >>>We have the Amana bottom freezer and wouldn't buy another one. >>>I don't think it's insulated well between the freezer and the main >>>compartment. While nothing thaws in the freezer, items in the crisper >>>(which is directly above the freezer) frequently freeze. We've >>>lost a lot of lettuce in celery over the six years +- that we've had it. >> >>Bottom freezer units scream in the face of basic physics... the unit needs >to >>work so much harder to pump cold air *up* to the fridge compartment. > >Sorry, bub. You're wrong. Top & bottom freezer models are comparable >in efficiency, all else being equal. Side by sides, or any models with >ice cube makers or water dispensers are the least efficient of all, >so if you want to parade around in a green yarmulke, get your facts >straight. > >What refrigerators have pumps in them? Here...find out how they work: >http://home.howstuffworks.com/refrigerator2.htm Not speaking about how "refrigeration" is accomplished or how "refrigerant" is moved, but how cold air is circulated (pumped) within and between the refrigerator compartment and freezer compartment... how friggin' old is your ice box, eh? Why are you such moron, Bubba... ya momma dropped you on yer pointy pinhead head. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 17:16:57 -0500, Nancy Young >
wrote: >Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote: > >> We have separate gas cooktop and wall oven in our apt. They probably >> date from the 1960s. I can see how they mount and don't see any >> problem replacing them if we want. And, one can be replaced without >> disturbing the other. >> >> Onr thing we like is that the oven door makes a nice temporary shelf >> for dishes being loaded. Also, not having to bnend down to use the >> oven. > >Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can >burn the living crap out of your right boob. > >At any rate, in my house, the wall oven, being old, was not easily >replaceable as they no longer made that size. New kitchen for me. >No new wall oven, thank you. > Point taken. Doesn't sound like fun. But we use the door as a shelf when cooking on the stove, not when the oven is hot. Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a "WooWooism lives" Anon grafitto on the base of the Cuttyhunk breakwater light |
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On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 17:16:57 -0500, Nancy Young >
wrote: >Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote: > >> We have separate gas cooktop and wall oven in our apt. They probably >> date from the 1960s. I can see how they mount and don't see any >> problem replacing them if we want. And, one can be replaced without >> disturbing the other. >> >> Onr thing we like is that the oven door makes a nice temporary shelf >> for dishes being loaded. Also, not having to bnend down to use the >> oven. > >Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can >burn the living crap out of your right boob. > >At any rate, in my house, the wall oven, being old, was not easily >replaceable as they no longer made that size. New kitchen for me. >No new wall oven, thank you. > Point taken. Doesn't sound like fun. But we use the door as a shelf when cooking on the stove, not when the oven is hot. Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a "WooWooism lives" Anon grafitto on the base of the Cuttyhunk breakwater light |
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Nancy wrote:
> Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can > burn the living crap out of your right boob. Well, nude stovetop cooking is hazardous for long-legged people like me... (My girlfriend is VERY insistent that I wear an apron whenever I cook.) Bob |
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Nancy wrote:
> Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can > burn the living crap out of your right boob. Well, nude stovetop cooking is hazardous for long-legged people like me... (My girlfriend is VERY insistent that I wear an apron whenever I cook.) Bob |
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>: Rodney Myrvaagnes writes:
>>Nancy Young > >wrote: > >>Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote: >> >>> We have separate gas cooktop and wall oven in our apt. They probably >>> date from the 1960s. I can see how they mount and don't see any >>> problem replacing them if we want. And, one can be replaced without >>> disturbing the other. >>> >>> Onr thing we like is that the oven door makes a nice temporary shelf >>> for dishes being loaded. Also, not having to bnend down to use the >>> oven. >> >>Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can >>burn the living crap out of your right boob. >> >>At any rate, in my house, the wall oven, being old, was not easily >>replaceable as they no longer made that size. New kitchen for me. >>No new wall oven, thank you. >> >Point taken. Doesn't sound like fun. But we use the door as a shelf >when cooking on the stove, not when the oven is hot. You're far from alone in discovering your little trick, which is why every owners manual regardless of oven type warns NOT to use the open oven door as a shelf, besides risking springing the door so it no longer closes properly they're not designed for weight bearing, and in fact relatively little pressure in the full open position may unlatch the door removal mechanism... this is a very dangerous habit, cease and desist immediately. Btw, with free standing stoves placing weight on the open door is not likely to have the above occur, because well before the door springs or releases, the entire stove will tip, causing whatever is cooking inside the oven to slide out into your lap and whatever is cooking on the top burners to go crashing to the floor, causing whomever is nearby to be rushed to the local burn unit. Be sure to properly install the anti-tip device that accompanies all stoves (the majority do not, they're idiots), but still do NOT place anything on the open oven door. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>: Rodney Myrvaagnes writes:
>>Nancy Young > >wrote: > >>Rodney Myrvaagnes wrote: >> >>> We have separate gas cooktop and wall oven in our apt. They probably >>> date from the 1960s. I can see how they mount and don't see any >>> problem replacing them if we want. And, one can be replaced without >>> disturbing the other. >>> >>> Onr thing we like is that the oven door makes a nice temporary shelf >>> for dishes being loaded. Also, not having to bnend down to use the >>> oven. >> >>Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can >>burn the living crap out of your right boob. >> >>At any rate, in my house, the wall oven, being old, was not easily >>replaceable as they no longer made that size. New kitchen for me. >>No new wall oven, thank you. >> >Point taken. Doesn't sound like fun. But we use the door as a shelf >when cooking on the stove, not when the oven is hot. You're far from alone in discovering your little trick, which is why every owners manual regardless of oven type warns NOT to use the open oven door as a shelf, besides risking springing the door so it no longer closes properly they're not designed for weight bearing, and in fact relatively little pressure in the full open position may unlatch the door removal mechanism... this is a very dangerous habit, cease and desist immediately. Btw, with free standing stoves placing weight on the open door is not likely to have the above occur, because well before the door springs or releases, the entire stove will tip, causing whatever is cooking inside the oven to slide out into your lap and whatever is cooking on the top burners to go crashing to the floor, causing whomever is nearby to be rushed to the local burn unit. Be sure to properly install the anti-tip device that accompanies all stoves (the majority do not, they're idiots), but still do NOT place anything on the open oven door. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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Bob wrote:
> > Nancy wrote: > > > Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can > > burn the living crap out of your right boob. > > Well, nude stovetop cooking is hazardous for long-legged people like me... > > (My girlfriend is VERY insistent that I wear an apron whenever I cook.) (laugh) Funny thing is, I remember what I was making. Considering that I must have been *hammered* to pull such a stupid stunt. Chocolate chip cookies. I also remember that getting dressed for work the next day wasn't a whole lot of fun, either. nancy |
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Bob wrote:
> > Nancy wrote: > > > Another advantage is is you are short and cook in the nude, you can > > burn the living crap out of your right boob. > > Well, nude stovetop cooking is hazardous for long-legged people like me... > > (My girlfriend is VERY insistent that I wear an apron whenever I cook.) (laugh) Funny thing is, I remember what I was making. Considering that I must have been *hammered* to pull such a stupid stunt. Chocolate chip cookies. I also remember that getting dressed for work the next day wasn't a whole lot of fun, either. nancy |
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CJRA wrote:
> Hi all, > > We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, > plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing > everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. > > My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been > looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all > others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have > experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. > These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing > stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just > wondering if they're really as good as all the others. > Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more > expensive. > > Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop > separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just > because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. > > Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, > but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy > efficient as possible. > > And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar > heating, would love to hear from you! > > Thanks! Gas cooktop and built-in electric oven. Did that when I did my kitchen and have never regretted it. I also have an 'instant' hot water appliance under the sink. It has a .9 gallon tank and delivers almost boiling water. It has worked well - my only criticism is it's flow is slow - possibly just a function of my setup. As to solar hot water a Google search "solar hot water" returns many hits. The first (sponsored link) is http://www.apricus-solar.com/index.htm This is the type of collector you should be considering. Very efficient almost anywhere regardless of climate or latitude and not all that expensive. Regards. Ken. -- http://www.rupert.net/~solar Return address supplied by 'spammotel' http://www.spammotel.com |
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CJRA wrote:
> Hi all, > > We're completely renovating an 1890s house. That means new wiring, > plumbing, etc. Also ripping out the old kitchen and replacing > everything. Fortunately the kitchen is big enough to play with. > > My question involves recommendations for appliances. We're doing all > Energy Star. But cost is of course an issue. > > Refrigerators- we want bottom freezer, and only 18-20 cu ft. Been > looking at the Amana ones, which are substantially cheaper than all > others (by at least $500 up to $2000 less). DOes anyone have > experience with Amana? I'm wondering why they're *so* much cheaper. > These are their highest rated energy star models. We're not doing > stainless steel because the price is just prohibitive for us, I'm just > wondering if they're really as good as all the others. > Kenmore and Maytag have some in a closer range, but still more > expensive. > > Cooktops/ovens - Will be gas. Any comments on having the cooktop > separate from a built in oven? I'm kind of leery of built-ins, just > because if something goes wrong, fixing/replacing is a PITA. > > Dishwashers - any suggestions helpful? It's not something we use much, > but will install because it's a resale issue. We want as energy > efficient as possible. > > And anyone who's familiar with tankless water heater systems or solar > heating, would love to hear from you! > > Thanks! Gas cooktop and built-in electric oven. Did that when I did my kitchen and have never regretted it. I also have an 'instant' hot water appliance under the sink. It has a .9 gallon tank and delivers almost boiling water. It has worked well - my only criticism is it's flow is slow - possibly just a function of my setup. As to solar hot water a Google search "solar hot water" returns many hits. The first (sponsored link) is http://www.apricus-solar.com/index.htm This is the type of collector you should be considering. Very efficient almost anywhere regardless of climate or latitude and not all that expensive. Regards. Ken. -- http://www.rupert.net/~solar Return address supplied by 'spammotel' http://www.spammotel.com |
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Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES buy an Amana refrigerator!
I speak from bitter experience having owned three of them, and high-end models at that. One was so bad that Amana changed it out for a brand new and later model that failed immediately. We've had freezer liners split open...water filters that were inoperative because none of three different Amana service techs could get the filter to open...two compresser assemblies fail and require replacement, three icemakers fail, water dispenser valves fail on two units and a horde of other minor, but annoying, service problems. And the competence of the Amana factory service techs is abysmal. We have waited for weeks to obtain parts ordered by one tech only to have a second tech look at the refrigerator and say. "you don't need these parts. All you need is an adjustment." I live in a major metro area so it's not because we're isolated and can't get good service. I'm convinced that the Maytag repairman (they just bought Amana) is running his ass off these days. Please! Think twice before spending a single dollar on Amana. Pixmaker in FLL ========================== It's not the heat, it's the humidity! ========================== (...Think the humidity's bad? You should watch us vote!) |
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Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES buy an Amana refrigerator!
I speak from bitter experience having owned three of them, and high-end models at that. One was so bad that Amana changed it out for a brand new and later model that failed immediately. We've had freezer liners split open...water filters that were inoperative because none of three different Amana service techs could get the filter to open...two compresser assemblies fail and require replacement, three icemakers fail, water dispenser valves fail on two units and a horde of other minor, but annoying, service problems. And the competence of the Amana factory service techs is abysmal. We have waited for weeks to obtain parts ordered by one tech only to have a second tech look at the refrigerator and say. "you don't need these parts. All you need is an adjustment." I live in a major metro area so it's not because we're isolated and can't get good service. I'm convinced that the Maytag repairman (they just bought Amana) is running his ass off these days. Please! Think twice before spending a single dollar on Amana. Pixmaker in FLL ========================== It's not the heat, it's the humidity! ========================== (...Think the humidity's bad? You should watch us vote!) |
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Thanks to all who responded. I was away all week so couldn't respond
til now. The consensus seems to be against Amana, so I'll keep that in mind. I have seen consumer reports, but I like to get personal comments as well. Freezer on the bottom - we are 100% sold on that already. I've used and been happy with that style whilst living outside the US and prefer it for a number of reasons. It's been common in Europe for years, but seems to only be slowly making way in the US. Size - again, we've used smaller fridges and are quite happy with that. The one disadvantage is that in the US, it's not so easy to do frequent shopping, but we manage ok. separate cooktop/oven - responses are split. We have no huge preference on that, tho DH is leaning towards the separate system. That appears to be much more expensive,however, so we'll have to balance that. Thanks again to all for the advice and comments. |
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>(CJRA)
>Newsgroups: rec.food.cooking >Date: 12 Nov 2004 07:37:18 -0800 >Organization: http://groups.google.com >Lines: 23 >Message-ID: > >References: > >NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.110.71.206 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >X-Trace: posting.google.com 1100273839 26071 127.0.0.1 (12 Nov 2004 15:37:19 >GMT) >X-Complaints-To: >NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 15:37:19 +0000 (UTC) > > > >Thanks to all who responded. I was away all week so couldn't respond >til now. > >The consensus seems to be against Amana, so I'll keep that in mind. I >have seen consumer reports, but I like to get personal comments as >well. > > Freezer on the bottom - we are 100% sold on that already. I've >used and been happy with that style whilst living outside the US and >prefer it for a number of reasons. It's been common in Europe for >years, but seems to only be slowly making way in the US. Not making it's way into the US, bottom freezer models have for a long time making their way *out* of the US. At one time just about every manufacturer produced bottom freezer models but since they have not proven to be very popular, and still aren't, now only a few manufactures produce them. I've been very happy with the GE Profile top freezer unit... GE makes a Profile bottom freezer unit but since I've never had one (and wouldn't) I really can't comment. http://www.geappliances.com/shop/prdct/rfr_frz/ ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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