Has anyone tried Dagoba's couvertures, or any others that can be purchased
in bulk? I'm interested in finding something that has a fairly assertive
flavor, like El Rey.

at Sat, 29 Oct 2005 01:44:02 GMT in <CtA8f.370$UW5.264@trndny09>,
(Janet Puistonen) wrote :

>Has anyone tried Dagoba's couvertures, or any others that can be
>purchased in bulk? I'm interested in finding something that has a fairly
>assertive flavor, like El Rey.

The field:

Dagoba Conacado - Worthless. Bitter, woody, horrible. Avoid.

Dagoba Pacuare - Not much better. Once again, woody and monotonous.

Green & Black's 72% - Much better, at least, than their 70%. Earthy and
smoky, hints of raspberry. Decent basic chocolate.

Dagoba 74% - Good but not exceptional, decidedly bitter, mostly
coffee/cocoa flavour. A bit flat.

Dagoba 73% - More floral than the 74%, although with similar bitterness.
Earthy side notes. About the same as the 74% quality-wise.

Dagoba Milagros - Good, very distinctive. Stongly floral in character. May
recede a bit into the background with strong flavours.

Valrhona Cao Grande 70% (available soon in 1kg blocs). Sort of typical -
fruity, molasses, woody, but not bad.

Callebaut 67.5% - Good basic chocolate flavour. A lot of woodiness on the
side. Better than most of the field, still not great.

Rapunzel 55% - Excellent chocolate, tastes a lot of the sugar, but complex,
tropical flavour. Low potency, though.

Dagoba 59% - Better still, more depth, more complexity. Fruity, coffee, and
tobacco all play roles. Excellent everyday choice, although at 59% sweet
and less assertive than some.

Rapunzel 70% - One of the earliest of the bittersweet organics continues to
impress. Very complex, fruity flavour. High cocoa butter content means that
it's milder than some, but also that its melting and couverture properties
are superb. Very fluid.

Dagoba Los Rios - The only non-disappointment among the Dagoba single-
origins. Very characteristic Arriba flavour, blackberry, molasses, floral.
A winner.

It must be said that the very best organic chocolate, namely Domori
Absolute (which is awe-inspiring, chocolatey, strawberry, earthy, just a
total exploration of the world of chocolate taste) isn't available in bulk,
at least not yet, but is so much better than any of the above that it's
worth getting for special occasions.

You didn't say which El Rey you liked. "Fairly assertive flavour" probably
implies Gran Saman. Closest to that flavour profile of the chocolates
listed is the Green & Blacks, but while acceptable, it's not what I would
call great chocolate. I'd go with Los Rios. Good strong flavour and the
best of the organics available in bulk


--
Alex Rast

(remove d., .7, not, and .NOSPAM to reply)

Alex Rast wrote:
<snip fabulous list>

> You didn't say which El Rey you liked. "Fairly assertive flavour"
> probably implies Gran Saman. Closest to that flavour profile of the
> chocolates listed is the Green & Blacks, but while acceptable, it's
> not what I would call great chocolate. I'd go with Los Rios. Good
> strong flavour and the best of the organics available in bulk

Gran Saman is indeed what I had in mind. I also use Mijao, Caoba, and Icoa.
(I use Mijao instead of Bucare because it is more fluid and better for
dipping. Bucare thinned with cocoa butter, which I have had to resort to
upon occasion, produces an inferior result.) Caoba is not my absolute
favorite milk chocolate, but the one I've had that I prefer (Valrhona Jivara
Lactee) is too expensive. When I first started making chocolates, I used
Callebaut, since that was what was available locally. I found them bland in
contrast to the El Rey suite. (Particularly the white, of course.) And there
is a difference between chocolate that one might simply eat as is, and how
chocolates perform when mixed with other things. That's where the
assertiveness helps, IMHO.

I'd be interested in your estimation of the various El Rey chocolates, as a
matter of comparison, if you wouldn't mind?

at Sat, 29 Oct 2005 14:09:44 GMT in <IoL8f.2979$bD.1408@trndny01>,
(Janet Puistonen) wrote :

>Alex Rast wrote:
><snip fabulous list>
>
>> You didn't say which El Rey you liked. "Fairly assertive flavour"
>> probably implies Gran Saman. Closest to that flavour profile of the
>> chocolates listed is the Green & Blacks, but while acceptable, it's
>> not what I would call great chocolate. I'd go with Los Rios. Good
>> strong flavour and the best of the organics available in bulk
>
>Gran Saman is indeed what I had in mind. I also use Mijao, Caoba, and
>Icoa. (I use Mijao instead of Bucare because it is more fluid and better
>for dipping. Bucare thinned with cocoa butter, which I have had to
>resort to upon occasion, produces an inferior result.) Caoba is not my
>absolute favorite milk chocolate, but the one I've had that I prefer
>(Valrhona Jivara Lactee) is too expensive.

You might try Guittard's Cru Sauvage Lait. Since it's a domestic brand,
it's considerably cheaper, and it's very good indeed, better than Jivara,
exceeded only perhaps by Cluizel's Mangaro Lait, which again puts you back
into the too-costly arena. Guittard is IMHO one of the top 3 chocolatiers
in the world (the other 2 being Cluizel and Domori) and in general much
better than Valrhona.

> When I first started making
>chocolates, I used Callebaut, since that was what was available locally.
>I found them bland in contrast to the El Rey suite. (Particularly the
>white, of course.)

Well, for white chocolate there is no substitute. El Rey is the best,
without any shadow of a doubt. El Rey tends to be earthier than Callebaut,
which in general leans towards the fruity side of things. I think this is
what you're looking for. Earthy chocolates often seem to have more depth of
flavour, because the fruitier components in chocolate die out quickly in
the length, so if fruity is all a chocolate's about, it will tend to seem
"thin". The best depth of flavour actually comes from chocolates that lean
towards molasses, prune, grape, and those sorts of components.

> And there is a difference between chocolate that one
>might simply eat as is, and how chocolates perform when mixed with other
>things. That's where the assertiveness helps, IMHO.

Well, what you want to do is make sure the flavour of the chocolate
harmonises with the ingredient(s) you're using it with. For instance, an
earthy chocolate is somewhat jarring with red fruits such as strawberries
or raspberries - it flattens them out. Thus if you make the classic
chocolate decadence with raspberry sauce, using an earthy chocolate, the
result more than likely will seem a little like a dense mud pie. The
tartness of the sauce will clash with the rich and deep earthiness of the
chocolate. But with something that has nuts, an earthy chocolate is a good
pairing. There are chocolates that are risky with virtually anything, such
as Domori Porcelana whose lightness and delicacy washes out in most diluted
preparations. And extremely assertive chocolates will annihilate delicate
counterpoints. So Amedei Chuao with lemon or with floral flavours just
doesn't work - you'll never taste the other ingredient.

>I'd be interested in your estimation of the various El Rey chocolates,
>as a matter of comparison, if you wouldn't mind?

Actually, you can check out my reviews on http://www.seventypercent.com for
a pretty comprehensive look. But a capsule summary:

Apamate - somewhat mild, VERY earthy.
Gran Saman - Wow! What intensity. Fruitier than some of El Rey's other
chocolates.
Macuro - Superb. The best Rio Caribe. Complex, raisin/spicy. This is in the
high-depth-of-flavour category.
San Joaquin - Perhaps *too* much winy/molasses. Good, although with its
pedigree you expect more.
Mijao - Where's the chocolate? Washed out.
Bucare - Excellent. The same tropical/earthy mix as Gran Saman, but more
harmonious in presentation.
Caoba - Not strong enough. Very caramelly.
Irapa - Better than Caoba. Interesting fruit and nut mix in the flavour.
Icoa - Great. The only white chocolate you should ever buy

And in order of quality:

Icoa
Macuro
Bucare
San Joaquin
Gran Saman
Apamate
Mijao
Irapa
Caoba


--
Alex Rast

(remove d., .7, not, and .NOSPAM to reply)