A couple of years ago, it was determined that some persistant digestive
problems I had were due to allergies to wheat and corn. When I eliminated
them (and that's not easy!), I improved greatly. Good, but not a happy
situation for a bread lover! I later learned that some people allergic to
wheat can safely eat spelt, and tentatively tried some products, finding
that I could handle them much better than wheat.

I wasn't particularly pleased with any commercial spelt baked good, other
than one decent yeast- and dairy-free white spelt bread, with a sourdough
style. I bought some flour and started to experiment on my own. I learned
that I could handle white spelt, but whole grain gave me similar problems
as wheat, although to a lesser extent.

The problem is, I haven't been able to really bake well with it (not that
I was much of a cook with wheat, either.) Quick breads and drop biscuits
come out quite well, as do shortbread style cookies and usually, scones.
Yeast breads generally fail miserably, way too dense, not rising or
staying "up" properly. Cookies like oatmeal-raisin and chocolate chip rise
in the oven, but collapse before they are finished baking and firm up.
They taste great, but are flat and chewey, even tough, not the style I
intended! In general, I have found that it takes a little more flour or
less liquid, and probably more chemical leavening than AP wheat flour, but
I don't have the bakery experience that some of the folks on here have, to
analyze the problems and work around them.

I'd appreciate any suggestions from the group!

Thanks,

Dave

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
ea.net...
> A couple of years ago, it was determined that some persistant digestive
> problems I had were due to allergies to wheat and corn. When I eliminated
> them (and that's not easy!), I improved greatly. Good, but not a happy
> situation for a bread lover! I later learned that some people allergic to
> wheat can safely eat spelt, and tentatively tried some products, finding
> that I could handle them much better than wheat.
>
> I wasn't particularly pleased with any commercial spelt baked good, other
> than one decent yeast- and dairy-free white spelt bread, with a sourdough
> style. I bought some flour and started to experiment on my own. I learned
> that I could handle white spelt, but whole grain gave me similar problems
> as wheat, although to a lesser extent.
>
> The problem is, I haven't been able to really bake well with it (not that
> I was much of a cook with wheat, either.) Quick breads and drop biscuits
> come out quite well, as do shortbread style cookies and usually, scones.
> Yeast breads generally fail miserably, way too dense, not rising or
> staying "up" properly. Cookies like oatmeal-raisin and chocolate chip rise
> in the oven, but collapse before they are finished baking and firm up.
> They taste great, but are flat and chewey, even tough, not the style I
> intended! In general, I have found that it takes a little more flour or
> less liquid, and probably more chemical leavening than AP wheat flour, but
> I don't have the bakery experience that some of the folks on here have, to
> analyze the problems and work around them.
>
Your problems with wheat flour are probably due to the gluten content which
is much lower in spelt. Unfortunately, it is this ingredient that allows
bread to rise and trap the carbon dioxide. High gluten bread flours are too
strong for cakes etc., and so cake flour has a low gluten content. Spelt
has a low gluten content so makes lousy bread, unless mixed with some normal
wheat flour for support.
Graham

"graham" > wrote in message
news:M0hGc.29602$WB5.13646@pd7tw2no...
>
> "Dave Bell" > wrote in message
> ea.net...
> > A couple of years ago, it was determined that some persistant digestive
> > problems I had were due to allergies to wheat and corn. When I
eliminated
> > them (and that's not easy!), I improved greatly. Good, but not a happy
> > situation for a bread lover! I later learned that some people allergic
to
> > wheat can safely eat spelt, and tentatively tried some products, finding
> > that I could handle them much better than wheat.
> >
> > I wasn't particularly pleased with any commercial spelt baked good,
other
> > than one decent yeast- and dairy-free white spelt bread, with a
sourdough
> > style. I bought some flour and started to experiment on my own. I
learned
> > that I could handle white spelt, but whole grain gave me similar
problems
> > as wheat, although to a lesser extent.
> >
> > The problem is, I haven't been able to really bake well with it (not
that
> > I was much of a cook with wheat, either.) Quick breads and drop biscuits
> > come out quite well, as do shortbread style cookies and usually, scones.
> > Yeast breads generally fail miserably, way too dense, not rising or
> > staying "up" properly. Cookies like oatmeal-raisin and chocolate chip
rise
> > in the oven, but collapse before they are finished baking and firm up.
> > They taste great, but are flat and chewey, even tough, not the style I
> > intended! In general, I have found that it takes a little more flour or
> > less liquid, and probably more chemical leavening than AP wheat flour,
but
> > I don't have the bakery experience that some of the folks on here have,
to
> > analyze the problems and work around them.
> >
> Your problems with wheat flour are probably due to the gluten content
which
> is much lower in spelt. Unfortunately, it is this ingredient that allows
> bread to rise and trap the carbon dioxide. High gluten bread flours are
too
> strong for cakes etc., and so cake flour has a low gluten content. Spelt
> has a low gluten content so makes lousy bread, unless mixed with some
normal
> wheat flour for support.
> Graham
>
>
Thing is, the OP can't eat wheat. I've seen raw gluten in the health food
section of my local grocery store.
~Peggy

On Mon, 5 Jul 2004, graham wrote:

> Your problems with wheat flour are probably due to the gluten content which
> is much lower in spelt. Unfortunately, it is this ingredient that allows
> bread to rise and trap the carbon dioxide. High gluten bread flours are too
> strong for cakes etc., and so cake flour has a low gluten content. Spelt
> has a low gluten content so makes lousy bread, unless mixed with some normal
> wheat flour for support.
> Graham

Spelt does of course contain gluten, and I'm not so sure there is less of
it, per se, but I understand it is more fragile, therefore less suitable
for breads. Another side of the gluten/allergy issue is that there are two
proteins that form the gluten, when worked in the presence of water. I am
given to understand that spelt and wheat share one of the two identically,
but the other protein differs between them. It may be the latter protein
that I am primarily allergic to...

At any rate, I do want to avoid adding wheat flour, just to increase the
gluten. What other ways are there to "toughen" a bread dough? Increased
working/kneading time, perhaps?

Dave

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
ea.net...
> On Mon, 5 Jul 2004, graham wrote:
>
> > Your problems with wheat flour are probably due to the gluten content
which
> > is much lower in spelt. Unfortunately, it is this ingredient that
allows
> > bread to rise and trap the carbon dioxide. High gluten bread flours are
too
> > strong for cakes etc., and so cake flour has a low gluten content.
Spelt
> > has a low gluten content so makes lousy bread, unless mixed with some
normal
> > wheat flour for support.
> > Graham
>
> Spelt does of course contain gluten, and I'm not so sure there is less of
> it, per se, but I understand it is more fragile, therefore less suitable
> for breads. Another side of the gluten/allergy issue is that there are two
> proteins that form the gluten, when worked in the presence of water. I am
> given to understand that spelt and wheat share one of the two identically,
> but the other protein differs between them. It may be the latter protein
> that I am primarily allergic to...
>
> At any rate, I do want to avoid adding wheat flour, just to increase the
> gluten. What other ways are there to "toughen" a bread dough? Increased
> working/kneading time, perhaps?
>
> Dave
You could try it, I suppose. However, I've never had much success with
spelt in other than a minor proportion of the total flour content. High
spelt content breads have, for me, always turned out cakey.
Repost on alt.bread.recipes where you might get more specialised answers.
There are several experts there who might be able to help.
Graham

On Tue, 6 Jul 2004, graham wrote:

> You could try it, I suppose. However, I've never had much success with
> spelt in other than a minor proportion of the total flour content. High
> spelt content breads have, for me, always turned out cakey.
> Repost on alt.bread.recipes where you might get more specialised answers.
> There are several experts there who might be able to help.
> Graham

Yhanks, I'll try that. And yes, that's pretty much what happens with my
breads. Cakey, and dense at that. Is it the same sort of mechanism that
causes cookies to collapse, too?

Dave

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
ea.net...
> On Tue, 6 Jul 2004, graham wrote:
>
> > You could try it, I suppose. However, I've never had much success with
> > spelt in other than a minor proportion of the total flour content. High
> > spelt content breads have, for me, always turned out cakey.
> > Repost on alt.bread.recipes where you might get more specialised
answers.
> > There are several experts there who might be able to help.
> > Graham
>
> Yhanks, I'll try that. And yes, that's pretty much what happens with my
> breads. Cakey, and dense at that. Is it the same sort of mechanism that
> causes cookies to collapse, too?
>
I don't know. On a.b.r. there are a couple of professional bakers who might
be able to answer this one.
Graham

>Dave Bell
>Date: 7/5/2004 8:47 PM Central Standard Time
>Message-id: et>
>
>On Mon, 5 Jul 2004, graham wrote:
>
>> Your problems with wheat flour are probably due to the gluten content which
>> is much lower in spelt. Unfortunately, it is this ingredient that allows
>> bread to rise and trap the carbon dioxide. High gluten bread flours are
>too
>> strong for cakes etc., and so cake flour has a low gluten content. Spelt
>> has a low gluten content so makes lousy bread, unless mixed with some
>normal
>> wheat flour for support.
>> Graham
>
>Spelt does of course contain gluten, and I'm not so sure there is less of
>it, per se, but I understand it is more fragile, therefore less suitable
>for breads. Another side of the gluten/allergy issue is that there are two
>proteins that form the gluten, when worked in the presence of water. I am
>given to understand that spelt and wheat share one of the two identically,
>but the other protein differs between them. It may be the latter protein
>that I am primarily allergic to...
>
>At any rate, I do want to avoid adding wheat flour, just to increase the
>gluten. What other ways are there to "toughen" a bread dough? Increased
>working/kneading time, perhaps?
>
>Dave
>
I have never used this, but from everything I've read, you'll have bewtter luck
doing quick breads that don't rely on yeast or with enriched sandwich breads.

Farro, an Old Italian Favorite Returns
http://www.farro.com/

http://www.italiancookingandliving.c...ing/farro.html

spelt-bread from fatfree.com: the low fat vegetarian recipe archive

All Recipes | Bread | Very Simple Spelt Bread
http://bread.allrecipes.com/az/VrySimplSpltBrd.asp

http://www.fatfree.com/recipes/breads-quick/spelt-bread

Easy Vegan Spelt Bread

http://vegweb.com/food/bread/3053.shtml

Recipes that use spelt flour:
http://search.allrecipes.com/recipe/...spelt&lnkid=65
~Peggy

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
ea.net...
> A couple of years ago, it was determined that some persistant digestive
> problems I had were due to allergies to wheat and corn. When I eliminated
> them (and that's not easy!), I improved greatly. Good, but not a happy
> situation for a bread lover! I later learned that some people allergic to
> wheat can safely eat spelt, and tentatively tried some products, finding
> that I could handle them much better than wheat.
>
> I wasn't particularly pleased with any commercial spelt baked good, other
> than one decent yeast- and dairy-free white spelt bread, with a sourdough
> style. I bought some flour and started to experiment on my own. I learned
> that I could handle white spelt, but whole grain gave me similar problems
> as wheat, although to a lesser extent.
>
> The problem is, I haven't been able to really bake well with it (not that
> I was much of a cook with wheat, either.) Quick breads and drop biscuits
> come out quite well, as do shortbread style cookies and usually, scones.
> Yeast breads generally fail miserably, way too dense, not rising or
> staying "up" properly. Cookies like oatmeal-raisin and chocolate chip rise
> in the oven, but collapse before they are finished baking and firm up.
> They taste great, but are flat and chewey, even tough, not the style I
> intended! In general, I have found that it takes a little more flour or
> less liquid, and probably more chemical leavening than AP wheat flour, but
> I don't have the bakery experience that some of the folks on here have, to
> analyze the problems and work around them.
>
> I'd appreciate any suggestions from the group!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Dave

On Wed, 7 Jul 2004, Peggy wrote:

> Recipes that use spelt flour:
> http://search.allrecipes.com/recipe/...spelt&lnkid=65
> ~Peggy

Thanks, Peggy! There are some good picks there, that I'll have to try
out.

After reading Charles Baker's suggestions earlier in this thread, I
compared to the Spelt Bread I recipe at Peggy's link.

"1 Stir yeast and sugar, gradually adding warm water. Add about half the
flour and the salt and beat well. Add the remainder of the flour
gradually to acquire a stiff dough. It may require more or less than 7
cups.

2 Knead 5 to 10 minutes until smooth and elastic."

Now, does this seem to be 1) too dry, and 2) too long working the dough?

Dave

Something else that you can try, that would give your dough a little more
lift:
Mix the dough as you noted, but instead of adding the salt to the mix at the
start, let the dough sit for approx 45 mins. to 1 hour before lightly mixing
in the salt. at that point, then knead in the salt. Let the dough sit
again for a few hours to ferment. Then shape, proof, and bake.

Recipes that use spelt flour:
http://search.allrecipes.com/recipe/...spelt&lnkid=65
~Peggy

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
ea.net...
> A couple of years ago, it was determined that some persistant digestive
> problems I had were due to allergies to wheat and corn. When I eliminated
> them (and that's not easy!), I improved greatly. Good, but not a happy
> situation for a bread lover! I later learned that some people allergic to
> wheat can safely eat spelt, and tentatively tried some products, finding
> that I could handle them much better than wheat.
>
> I wasn't particularly pleased with any commercial spelt baked good, other
> than one decent yeast- and dairy-free white spelt bread, with a sourdough
> style. I bought some flour and started to experiment on my own. I learned
> that I could handle white spelt, but whole grain gave me similar problems
> as wheat, although to a lesser extent.
>
> The problem is, I haven't been able to really bake well with it (not that
> I was much of a cook with wheat, either.) Quick breads and drop biscuits
> come out quite well, as do shortbread style cookies and usually, scones.
> Yeast breads generally fail miserably, way too dense, not rising or
> staying "up" properly. Cookies like oatmeal-raisin and chocolate chip rise
> in the oven, but collapse before they are finished baking and firm up.
> They taste great, but are flat and chewey, even tough, not the style I
> intended! In general, I have found that it takes a little more flour or
> less liquid, and probably more chemical leavening than AP wheat flour, but
> I don't have the bakery experience that some of the folks on here have, to
> analyze the problems and work around them.
>
> I'd appreciate any suggestions from the group!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Dave