On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 14:37:21 -0600
(Mable Fable) wrote:

> Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary.


Usenet is not for the faint of heart or thin of skin.

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 14:37:21 -0600
(Mable Fable) wrote:

> Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary.


Usenet is not for the faint of heart or thin of skin.

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 14:37:21 -0600
(Mable Fable) wrote:

> Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary.


Usenet is not for the faint of heart or thin of skin.

"Mable Fable" > wrote in message
...
> Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary. The
> pumpkin cookie/mixes issue was just starting. I love to bake, I do most
> from scratch. Sometime I use mixes for various reasons. What if this was
> this person's 1st time to post in a group? What if she is just starting
> to bake? If it were me I would be scared to post again, anywhere. If I
> were just starting to bake I might give up, thinking I would never be
> good enough. I hope she comes back & reads some of the positive
> comments. I hope she keeps on baking, because it is fun, whether from
> scratch or mixes. Looks like lots of good ideas in here, would like to
> see more. Thanks Mable

Get a grip. Everyone is responsible for their own being. If you choose to
be nervous, scared, euphoric, or depressed it is your own business. You
give too much power to people when you let the words of strangers wreck your
life. Frankly, you seem to be a drama queen from you reaction to the quite
civilized discussion about mixes. If this upset you so much as to cause you
to make multiple posts on the subject I would caution you not to participate
in Usenet. That was a quite civilized and benign discussion. If you don't
believe me, I can direct you to some threads that are quite brutal. I find
your criticism of the comments to be quite hypocritical. How can you come
to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an entirely
off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post messages
without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group all in the
name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.

"Mable Fable" > wrote in message
...
> Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary. The
> pumpkin cookie/mixes issue was just starting. I love to bake, I do most
> from scratch. Sometime I use mixes for various reasons. What if this was
> this person's 1st time to post in a group? What if she is just starting
> to bake? If it were me I would be scared to post again, anywhere. If I
> were just starting to bake I might give up, thinking I would never be
> good enough. I hope she comes back & reads some of the positive
> comments. I hope she keeps on baking, because it is fun, whether from
> scratch or mixes. Looks like lots of good ideas in here, would like to
> see more. Thanks Mable

Get a grip. Everyone is responsible for their own being. If you choose to
be nervous, scared, euphoric, or depressed it is your own business. You
give too much power to people when you let the words of strangers wreck your
life. Frankly, you seem to be a drama queen from you reaction to the quite
civilized discussion about mixes. If this upset you so much as to cause you
to make multiple posts on the subject I would caution you not to participate
in Usenet. That was a quite civilized and benign discussion. If you don't
believe me, I can direct you to some threads that are quite brutal. I find
your criticism of the comments to be quite hypocritical. How can you come
to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an entirely
off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post messages
without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group all in the
name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.

"Mable Fable" > wrote in message
...
> Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary. The
> pumpkin cookie/mixes issue was just starting. I love to bake, I do most
> from scratch. Sometime I use mixes for various reasons. What if this was
> this person's 1st time to post in a group? What if she is just starting
> to bake? If it were me I would be scared to post again, anywhere. If I
> were just starting to bake I might give up, thinking I would never be
> good enough. I hope she comes back & reads some of the positive
> comments. I hope she keeps on baking, because it is fun, whether from
> scratch or mixes. Looks like lots of good ideas in here, would like to
> see more. Thanks Mable

Get a grip. Everyone is responsible for their own being. If you choose to
be nervous, scared, euphoric, or depressed it is your own business. You
give too much power to people when you let the words of strangers wreck your
life. Frankly, you seem to be a drama queen from you reaction to the quite
civilized discussion about mixes. If this upset you so much as to cause you
to make multiple posts on the subject I would caution you not to participate
in Usenet. That was a quite civilized and benign discussion. If you don't
believe me, I can direct you to some threads that are quite brutal. I find
your criticism of the comments to be quite hypocritical. How can you come
to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an entirely
off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post messages
without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group all in the
name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004, Vox Humana wrote:

> How can you come
> to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an entirely
> off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post messages
> without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group all in the
> name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.

I must have missed something! Where were the multiple threads on same
issue and messages without content? I'll stipulate the HTML, although I
didn't see it; I suppose it was in her signature attachment...

Dave

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 15:21:52 -0800
Dave Bell > wrote:

> On Wed, 17 Nov 2004, Vox Humana wrote:
>
> > How can you come
> > to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an
> > entirely off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post
> > messages without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group
> > all in the name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.
>
> I must have missed something! Where were the multiple threads on same
> issue and messages without content? I'll stipulate the HTML, although I
> didn't see it; I suppose it was in her signature attachment...


Half of the message that precipitated this thread also appeared in the
turkey thread.

And we're being more than civil over there, considering that it's
technically about roasting rather than baking.

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 15:21:52 -0800
Dave Bell > wrote:

> On Wed, 17 Nov 2004, Vox Humana wrote:
>
> > How can you come
> > to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an
> > entirely off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post
> > messages without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group
> > all in the name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.
>
> I must have missed something! Where were the multiple threads on same
> issue and messages without content? I'll stipulate the HTML, although I
> didn't see it; I suppose it was in her signature attachment...


Half of the message that precipitated this thread also appeared in the
turkey thread.

And we're being more than civil over there, considering that it's
technically about roasting rather than baking.

"Eric Jorgensen" pointed out:
> Mable Fable wrote:
>
> > Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
> > here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary.
>
>
> Usenet is not for the faint of heart or thin of skin.

True enough. So, first lesson: post in plain text.

< yellow text... blue background... uh uhh >

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
a.net...
> On Wed, 17 Nov 2004, Vox Humana wrote:
>
> > How can you come
> > to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an
entirely
> > off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message, post messages
> > without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group all in the
> > name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.
>
> I must have missed something! Where were the multiple threads on same
> issue and messages without content? I'll stipulate the HTML, although I
> didn't see it; I suppose it was in her signature attachment...
>

Mable posted her fears about the newsgroup in the "turkey recipe" thread.
Then she started an entirely new thread, repeating the same message. This
is the repeat thread. Frankly I don't care, but if you are going to hold
people to a standard, then it may as well be a widely accepted standard like
Netiquette.

In both instances, there was no text quoted. She just posted her opinion.

Both of the above mentioned messages were posted in the default Webtv style
with a graphic background with colored text as indicated in the message
header:
Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary=WebTV-Mail-5594-2282
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit
X-WebTV-Signatu 1
ETAtAhQ+0e+Fj6fdpxwAXNLOk4rIeFb4twIVAIXwYilNyjTnOQ sTceBW6md3iDqB
Content-Disposition: Inline
X-WebTV-Stationery: Standard;
Background="http://www.baylor.edu/textures/blue_marble.gif";
TextColor=orange

"Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
news:20041117163046.28497206@wafer...
> On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 15:21:52 -0800
> Dave Bell > wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 17 Nov 2004, Vox Humana wrote:
> >
> > > How can you come
> > > to a newsgroup and criticize the messages that people post, make an
> > > entirely off-topic post, make multiple thread on the same message,
post
> > > messages without any context, and post HTML to a non-binary news group
> > > all in the name of not being critical? Pot-Kettle-Black.
> >
> > I must have missed something! Where were the multiple threads on same
> > issue and messages without content? I'll stipulate the HTML, although I
> > didn't see it; I suppose it was in her signature attachment...
>
>
> Half of the message that precipitated this thread also appeared in the
> turkey thread.
>
> And we're being more than civil over there, considering that it's
> technically about roasting rather than baking.

Yes, and the OP's question was answered in the first response. Then someone
complained because no one addressed the question!!

OK I'm truly sorry, I'm new, trying to learn, & LOVE TO BAKE. It looks
like your saying I'm supposed to include the pervious post. Sorry about
HTML, it is in my sig, turned it off this time. Multiple posts; I added
this because it had nothing to do with turkey, but the pumpkin cookie
issue was mentioned in the turkey post. What is Usenet? Is it for
computers & not webbers? If so why does this group come up on my list? I
honestly wasn't trying to criticize, just trying to share a different
point of view. What if she was getting started? When she asked for
opinions, wasn't she looking for try it & let me know? Some of the
replies were much like this one. I didn't make any accusations or call
names, Hypocritical, drama queen, I guess if the shoe fits wear it.
Don't worry I won't be coming back. Mable


I wrote previous:
Hi, I'm new to discuss groups, is this a private group? I stopped in
here for the 1st time a few days ago, my 1st impression was scary. The
pumpkin cookie/mixes issue was just starting. I love to bake, I do most
from scratch. Sometime I use mixes for various reasons. What if this was
this person's 1st time to post in a group? What if she is just starting
to bake? If it were me I would be scared to post again, anywhere. If I
were just starting to bake I might give up, thinking I would never be
good enough. I hope she comes back & reads some of the positive
comments. I hope she keeps on baking, because it is fun, whether from
scratch or mixes. Looks like lots of good ideas in here, would like to
see more. Thanks Mable



Vox replied:
Get a grip. Everyone is responsible for their own being. If you choose
to be nervous, scared, euphoric, or depressed it is your own business.
You give too much power to people when you let the words of strangers
wreck your life. Frankly, you seem to be a drama queen from you reaction
to the quite civilized discussion about mixes. If this upset you so much
as to cause you to make multiple posts on the subject I would caution
you not to participate in Usenet. That was a quite civilized and benign
discussion. If you don't believe me, I can direct you to some threads
that are quite brutal. I find your criticism of the comments to be quite
hypocritical. How can you come to a newsgroup and criticize the messages
that people post, make an entirely off-topic post, make multiple thread
on the same message, post messages without any context, and post HTML to
a non-binary news group all in the name of not being critical?
Pot-Kettle-Black.

"Mable Fable" > wrote in message
...
> OK I'm truly sorry, I'm new, trying to learn, & LOVE TO BAKE.

No problem. You don't have to be sorry.


It looks
> like your saying I'm supposed to include the pervious post.

Posting some context helps people understand what you are talking about. It
is good to post the relevant part of the post you are replying to and snip
the rest. Snipping help prevent messages from getting too big.

Sorry about
> HTML, it is in my sig, turned it off this time.

Yes, for some reason Webtv has the default set to ON. While it doesn't
bother me, some people have news readers that crash due to all the bells and
whistles. Eventually some people will just killfile you if you post HTML in
a non-binary newsgroup

Multiple posts; I added
> this because it had nothing to do with turkey, but the pumpkin cookie
> issue was mentioned in the turkey post.

Yes, and again it doesn't bother me. It's just that some people do get
upset over off-topic messages. I was just saying that if you want to
criticize people for things that bother you, then be prepared for others to
do the same.

What is Usenet? Is it for
> computers & not webbers? If so why does this group come up on my list?

"Usenet:
A messaging system that uses a computer network, especially the Internet, to
transfer messages organized in thematic groups."
Usenet is a very old part of the Internet used originally to communicate
news in the academic and scientific world. It is for everyone, including
Webtv users. Unfortunately, many Webtv users before you have established a
certain reputation.

I
> honestly wasn't trying to criticize, just trying to share a different
> point of view.

If you go back and read the thread from the beginning with an open mind, I
think you will see that is exactly my position. Someone posed a recipe and
asked for opinions. I gave mine. I wasn't judgmental or abusive. I simple
stated my opinion about using mixes. It was a different point of view from
that of the OP. Here is a link to the thread: http://tinyurl.com/3lrb8


What if she was getting started? When she asked for
> opinions, wasn't she looking for try it & let me know?

I'm not a mind reader. When someone asks for opinions then they shouldn't
expect everyone to guess exactly what that means. Here is exactly what the
OP posted:
"This recipe is fantastic. What do you think about it?" I didn't
understand that I was suppose to run out and make this recipe so I could
reinforce the OP's point of view. In all fairness, I posted a link to a
site where people who had made the recipe posted their opinions. What did
you do to aid the OP?

Your questions about the OP are unknowable and irrelevant.


Some of the
> replies were much like this one. I didn't make any accusations or call
> names, Hypocritical, drama queen, I guess if the shoe fits wear it.
> Don't worry I won't be coming back. Mable

That's entirely up to you. There are lots of people here with diverse
opinions who get in dust-ups on a regular basis. I learn lots of things
here and disagree with lots of what is posted. But if you are the
controlling type of person who can't tolerate the level of dissent posted in
this and the other related threads, then you won't be happy posting to
unmoderated Usenet newsgroups.

In closing, I would also point out that it is a violation of Netiquette to
top-post. The conventional way to post is to quote the relevant part of the
message and then put your reply below it. When top and bottom posting are
mixed, it is nearly impossible to follow the conversation. Again, I'm not
being the police, I'm just telling you the facts. Of course, if you can do
as you wish.

Happy baking!

[posted and emailed]

"Mable Fable" > wrote in message
...

> OK I'm truly sorry, I'm new, trying to learn, & LOVE
> TO BAKE. It looks like your saying I'm supposed to
> include the pervious post. Sorry about HTML, it is in
> my sig, turned it off this time. Multiple posts; I added
> this because it had nothing to do with turkey, but the
> pumpkin cookie issue was mentioned in the turkey post.
> What is Usenet? Is it for computers & not webbers? If
> so why does this group come up on my list? I honestly
> wasn't trying to criticize, just trying to share a different
> point of view. What if she was getting started? When
> she asked for opinions, wasn't she looking for try it &
> let me know? Some of the replies were much like this
> one. I didn't make any accusations or call names,
> Hypocritical, drama queen, I guess if the shoe fits wear
> it. Don't worry I won't be coming back. Mable

Oh good grief. Of course you're welcome -- Usenet is a great and
wonderful thing, although it requires a thick skin and *lurking* in a
group to get a sense of the personalities in it is a *very* good thing
before you post -- Besides, coming into a group and criticizing right
out of the gate is a sure way to get people riled up (consider how
you'd feel if you invited someone you didn't know very well into your
home and s/he started criticizing your choice of furniture, art,
etc.).

And most of the problem isn't *you*, it's the fact that WebTV turns
its customers out into the greater world of Usenet without educating
them as to the difference between WebTV's own safe and rather insular
groups and Usenet, which is, at times, loosely controlled chaos. Some
groups are better than others -- rec.food.baking, for example, has
little in the way of trollery (or at least from what I see on my
server, news.individual.net); rec.food.cooking, however -- and
unfortunately -- is overrun at the moment with quite a bit of
nastiness (this is where I can with ringing affirmation say that
killfiles are your friend). Other groups have different
personalities.

Since you're admittedly not so 'net-savvy, here are a few links to get
you started (and don't feel you have to read and absorb everything at
once -- it's a *lot* of information):

http://www.ibiblio.org/usenet-i/usenet-help.html -- Usenet
Help --comprehensive
http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html -- How to quote
correctly on Usenet (how and why) -- also comprehensive

Unfortunately, the best link to help WebTV customers transition to the
wider world of Usenet is no longer valid (if anyone actually saved the
text from http://www.watchingyou.com/webtv.html I'd love to have a
copy of it), but the above should get you started.

-jacqui

[posted and emailed]

"Mable Fable" > wrote in message
...

> OK I'm truly sorry, I'm new, trying to learn, & LOVE
> TO BAKE. It looks like your saying I'm supposed to
> include the pervious post. Sorry about HTML, it is in
> my sig, turned it off this time. Multiple posts; I added
> this because it had nothing to do with turkey, but the
> pumpkin cookie issue was mentioned in the turkey post.
> What is Usenet? Is it for computers & not webbers? If
> so why does this group come up on my list? I honestly
> wasn't trying to criticize, just trying to share a different
> point of view. What if she was getting started? When
> she asked for opinions, wasn't she looking for try it &
> let me know? Some of the replies were much like this
> one. I didn't make any accusations or call names,
> Hypocritical, drama queen, I guess if the shoe fits wear
> it. Don't worry I won't be coming back. Mable

Oh good grief. Of course you're welcome -- Usenet is a great and
wonderful thing, although it requires a thick skin and *lurking* in a
group to get a sense of the personalities in it is a *very* good thing
before you post -- Besides, coming into a group and criticizing right
out of the gate is a sure way to get people riled up (consider how
you'd feel if you invited someone you didn't know very well into your
home and s/he started criticizing your choice of furniture, art,
etc.).

And most of the problem isn't *you*, it's the fact that WebTV turns
its customers out into the greater world of Usenet without educating
them as to the difference between WebTV's own safe and rather insular
groups and Usenet, which is, at times, loosely controlled chaos. Some
groups are better than others -- rec.food.baking, for example, has
little in the way of trollery (or at least from what I see on my
server, news.individual.net); rec.food.cooking, however -- and
unfortunately -- is overrun at the moment with quite a bit of
nastiness (this is where I can with ringing affirmation say that
killfiles are your friend). Other groups have different
personalities.

Since you're admittedly not so 'net-savvy, here are a few links to get
you started (and don't feel you have to read and absorb everything at
once -- it's a *lot* of information):

http://www.ibiblio.org/usenet-i/usenet-help.html -- Usenet
Help --comprehensive
http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html -- How to quote
correctly on Usenet (how and why) -- also comprehensive

Unfortunately, the best link to help WebTV customers transition to the
wider world of Usenet is no longer valid (if anyone actually saved the
text from http://www.watchingyou.com/webtv.html I'd love to have a
copy of it), but the above should get you started.

-jacqui

jacqui{JB} wrote:

> Unfortunately, the best link to help WebTV customers transition to the
> wider world of Usenet is no longer valid (if anyone actually saved the
> text from http://www.watchingyou.com/webtv.html I'd love to have a
> copy of it), but the above should get you started.
>
> -jacqui

http://web.archive.org/web/200308022...com/webtv.html

Dave

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
. com...

> > (if anyone actually saved the text from
> > http://www.watchingyou.com/webtv.html
> > I'd love to have a copy of it)

> http://web.archive.org/web/200308022...com/webtv.html

Thank you, thank you, thank you. And *this* time, I've saved it.
-j

"Dave Bell" > wrote in message
. com...

> > (if anyone actually saved the text from
> > http://www.watchingyou.com/webtv.html
> > I'd love to have a copy of it)

> http://web.archive.org/web/200308022...com/webtv.html

Thank you, thank you, thank you. And *this* time, I've saved it.
-j

"jacqui{JB}" > wrote in message
...

rec.food.cooking, however -- and
> unfortunately -- is overrun at the moment with quite a bit of
> nastiness

Ain't that the truth!

"jacqui{JB}" > wrote in message
...

rec.food.cooking, however -- and
> unfortunately -- is overrun at the moment with quite a bit of
> nastiness

Ain't that the truth!