I have been making beer at home on and off for approx. 10 years. I make
some beers that I am quite happy with. Recently an older gentleman that
has been making wine for about three years got involved with beer making
and has been doing a fair amount of brewing with me. He has two cherry,
an apple and an apricot trees and a line on Merlot and Gertzwiojgoihag
(sp) grapes each fall. (we live in Yakima, Wa and wine making is quickly
becoming the cash crop instead of apples and hops)

We made a cherry wine about a month ago when the bings were ripe. The
Cots are now ripe and we are going to pick and make some out of those
tonight.

I plan on doing a Merlot with him this fall, and we will probably do a
cider with the home brew club this fall too.

Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby
what you know now what would you do different?

As an example if I knew then what I now about home brewing I would just
start right away with all grain.

TIA,

Ryan

> Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby
> what you know now what would you do different?

Don't buy a hand corker, get a good bench or floor corker. I use the
Portuguese and it's hard to beat. You can do synthetic corks with it
in addition to natural.

Joe

Ryan Case wrote:
> Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby
> what you know now what would you do different?

I would have started years earlier.

My mistake was making two kits, and then waiting until they were ready
to drink, just to realize I was going to run out because I hadn't
considered what I call "Drink-able planning". I now plan out when
bottles will be ready to start opening, and ensure I have no long dry
spells.

--
DAve

Ryan Case wrote:
> I have been making beer at home on and off for approx. 10 years. I make
> some beers that I am quite happy with. Recently an older gentleman that
> has been making wine for about three years got involved with beer making
> and has been doing a fair amount of brewing with me. He has two cherry,
> an apple and an apricot trees and a line on Merlot and Gertzwiojgoihag
> (sp) grapes each fall. (we live in Yakima, Wa and wine making is quickly
> becoming the cash crop instead of apples and hops)
>
> We made a cherry wine about a month ago when the bings were ripe. The
> Cots are now ripe and we are going to pick and make some out of those
> tonight.
>
> I plan on doing a Merlot with him this fall, and we will probably do a
> cider with the home brew club this fall too.
>
> Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby
> what you know now what would you do different?
>
> As an example if I knew then what I now about home brewing I would just
> start right away with all grain.
>
> TIA,
>
> Ryan

Good quest!

My mistake was making two kits, then waiting until they were drinkable
only realize I would run out before I could make and mature the next
wines. I now have a "drinkable dates" plan to map out when each kind of
wine will be ready to drink, so I don't have anymore dry spells. :*)

--
DAve
p.s. And I agree about the floor corker, my experience with the hand
corker was just horrible. Love my floor corker.



Ryan Case wrote:
> I have been making beer at home on and off for approx. 10 years. I make
> some beers that I am quite happy with. Recently an older gentleman that
> has been making wine for about three years got involved with beer making
> and has been doing a fair amount of brewing with me. He has two cherry,
> an apple and an apricot trees and a line on Merlot and Gertzwiojgoihag
> (sp) grapes each fall. (we live in Yakima, Wa and wine making is quickly
> becoming the cash crop instead of apples and hops)
>
> We made a cherry wine about a month ago when the bings were ripe. The
> Cots are now ripe and we are going to pick and make some out of those
> tonight.
>
> I plan on doing a Merlot with him this fall, and we will probably do a
> cider with the home brew club this fall too.
>
> Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby
> what you know now what would you do different?
>
> As an example if I knew then what I now about home brewing I would just
> start right away with all grain.
>
> TIA,
>
> Ryan

Larger volumes earlier.

My first wines were 5 gallon batches. Too small - better quality control at
higher volumes.



>I have been making beer at home on and off for approx. 10 years. I make
>some beers that I am quite happy with. Recently an older gentleman that has
>been making wine for about three years got involved with beer making and
>has been doing a fair amount of brewing with me. He has two cherry, an
>apple and an apricot trees and a line on Merlot and Gertzwiojgoihag (sp)
>grapes each fall. (we live in Yakima, Wa and wine making is quickly
>becoming the cash crop instead of apples and hops)
>
> We made a cherry wine about a month ago when the bings were ripe. The Cots
> are now ripe and we are going to pick and make some out of those tonight.
>
> I plan on doing a Merlot with him this fall, and we will probably do a
> cider with the home brew club this fall too.
>
> Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby what
> you know now what would you do different?
>
> As an example if I knew then what I now about home brewing I would just
> start right away with all grain.
>
> TIA,
>
> Ryan

I also would have kept the batches going, one right after another. And
I wouldn't have been so obsessive about sanitation either. It
certainly is important, maybe not as critical with wine as with beer
however.

Paul

I would only change one thing... do 2-3 five gallon batches each year,
each with different yeast/fermentation protocol variant, whereas I
limited myself to 1 three gallon batch each of the first two years.

Alas, I ended up not having enough 'ready to drink' wine from those
first two years. Live and learn.

Gene


Ryan Case wrote:
> I have been making beer at home on and off for approx. 10 years. I make
> some beers that I am quite happy with. Recently an older gentleman that
> has been making wine for about three years got involved with beer making
> and has been doing a fair amount of brewing with me. He has two cherry,
> an apple and an apricot trees and a line on Merlot and Gertzwiojgoihag
> (sp) grapes each fall. (we live in Yakima, Wa and wine making is quickly
> becoming the cash crop instead of apples and hops)
>
> We made a cherry wine about a month ago when the bings were ripe. The
> Cots are now ripe and we are going to pick and make some out of those
> tonight.
>
> I plan on doing a Merlot with him this fall, and we will probably do a
> cider with the home brew club this fall too.
>
> Back to the subject line, though. If you knew at your beginning hobby
> what you know now what would you do different?
>
> As an example if I knew then what I now about home brewing I would just
> start right away with all grain.
>
> TIA,
>
> Ryan

Find a girlfriend who doesn't like my wine so there's more for me. I'm
glad she doesn't read this

Oh, that's bad!! ROFL! I'm still looking for a mate that will clean my
empty bottles. hahaha.

--
DAve

alien wrote:
> Find a girlfriend who doesn't like my wine so there's more for me. I'm
> glad she doesn't read this

Thanks so much for all the replies.

So far this year I have started 5 gallons of cherry
5 gallons of Apricot
and am planning on 5 gallons of Merlot
5 gallons of Riesling
and 5 gallons of cider

I already have the grapes spoken for at a local growers.

If all goes well I might consider bumping some of them up to 10 gallons
next year. Only thing is, that home brewing beer is really my first
love, so I don't know that I really need to bump wine up to 10 gallon
batches with the beer around too. Will see.

Once again, thanks for the replies.

Ryan

I've learned three things quickly

1) Get the best starting fruit you can find - it really shows up later

2) Overoaking is really easy and rarely a good thing

3) Letting time do the work results in a great lazy hobby. I nearly
threw out my first, very good wine because I was too impatient.

Rob

One thing that comes to mind is to never bottle too soon. Wait until
wine (esp. white) is completely clear and free of sediment and also
don't bottle before the wine tastes like it should (don't hope that age
will correct a problem). When I first started, I had to rebottle and
recork a batch of Riesling because of sediment that was thrown after
bottling (sediment doesn't really bother me too much, but we give a lot
of wine as gifts). Another time I over-oaked a Merlot and bottled it
anyway hoping it would even out over time. It did improve some with age
but I should have taken other actions before bottling to correct this.

Also, I second the floor corker suggestion. We now have the same type
that Joe has and love it.

I make beer too and that sounds like a plan. One thing to consider is
'give away' wine (just like beer). I know I don't drink 20 gallons in
a year but am sure I give that much away. In other words, think that
through now and include it in your plan, at least for the Merlot. It
needs a little time to come around and giving wine away is a slippery
slope. You could end up on the short end...

Joe


> If all goes well I might consider bumping some of them up to 10 gallons
> next year. Only thing is, that home brewing beer is really my first
> love, so I don't know that I really need to bump wine up to 10 gallon
> batches with the beer around too. Will see.
>
> Once again, thanks for the replies.
>
> Ryan

Joe Sallustio wrote:
> I make beer too and that sounds like a plan. One thing to consider is
> 'give away' wine (just like beer). I know I don't drink 20 gallons in
> a year but am sure I give that much away. In other words, think that
> through now and include it in your plan, at least for the Merlot. It
> needs a little time to come around and giving wine away is a slippery
> slope. You could end up on the short end...
>
> Joe

I hear you. In fact my little brother-in-law got hitched last weekend
and I am now out of all but my coffee stout and a few bottles of weizen.
I didn't plan on taking beer to the party the night before, so I didn't
brew to have extra on hand when we ran through it.

I always make 10 gallon batches when it comes to beer. It just isn't
enough extra work to justify only making 5. I have a friend that
normally splits the batches with me. Unless of course it is one of my
recipes that people like real well and then I keep it all so as to not
burn through it with company too quickly.

I do think that one of the things that will help me in the vein of
running out by giving away, is that my dad and brother are slated to
give it a go with me on the grape wines this fall. We will each do a 5
gallon batch. So there will be 15 gallons of each variety in the family.

If the cherry and apricot turn out well, I could definately see doing 10
gallon batches of those next year. The fruit is free, so why not?

On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.


Ryan

> On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
> going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
> produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
> will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.
>
>
> Ryan

It takes 3-4 years to properly grow vines to get grapes from them. See
Jeff Cox's "Vines to Wines" for a good, basic background on this.

I've got 54 first-year Riesling vines growing in our front yard this
year. I've approximated that I'll end up getting 150-180 bottles/year
from that in average years.

Good luck!

Rob

Rob wrote:
>> On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
>> going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
>> produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
>> will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.
>>
>>
>> Ryan
>
> It takes 3-4 years to properly grow vines to get grapes from them. See
> Jeff Cox's "Vines to Wines" for a good, basic background on this.

Thanks! I will find a copy.

>
> I've got 54 first-year Riesling vines growing in our front yard this
> year. I've approximated that I'll end up getting 150-180 bottles/year
> from that in average years.
>
> Good luck!
>
> Rob
>

I've heard and read that it takes 600-800 grapes per bottle! So a mature
vine needs to produce a lot of grapes to make a gallon.

--
DAve

Ryan Case wrote:
> Joe Sallustio wrote:
>> I make beer too and that sounds like a plan. One thing to consider is
>> 'give away' wine (just like beer). I know I don't drink 20 gallons in
>> a year but am sure I give that much away. In other words, think that
>> through now and include it in your plan, at least for the Merlot. It
>> needs a little time to come around and giving wine away is a slippery
>> slope. You could end up on the short end...
>>
>> Joe
>
> I hear you. In fact my little brother-in-law got hitched last weekend
> and I am now out of all but my coffee stout and a few bottles of weizen.
> I didn't plan on taking beer to the party the night before, so I didn't
> brew to have extra on hand when we ran through it.
>
> I always make 10 gallon batches when it comes to beer. It just isn't
> enough extra work to justify only making 5. I have a friend that
> normally splits the batches with me. Unless of course it is one of my
> recipes that people like real well and then I keep it all so as to not
> burn through it with company too quickly.
>
> I do think that one of the things that will help me in the vein of
> running out by giving away, is that my dad and brother are slated to
> give it a go with me on the grape wines this fall. We will each do a 5
> gallon batch. So there will be 15 gallons of each variety in the family.
>
> If the cherry and apricot turn out well, I could definately see doing 10
> gallon batches of those next year. The fruit is free, so why not?
>
> On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
> going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
> produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
> will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.
>
>
> Ryan

"Dave Allison" > wrote in message
.. .
> I've heard and read that it takes 600-800 grapes per bottle! So a mature
> vine needs to produce a lot of grapes to make a gallon.

A mature vine does indeed produce a lot of grapes. A gallon per vine is not
unreal. This amounts to about 12.5 pounds of grapes per vine. I think a
lot of growers limit their vines to produce a little less in an effort to
improve quality.




>
> --
> DAve
>
> Ryan Case wrote:
>> Joe Sallustio wrote:
>>> I make beer too and that sounds like a plan. One thing to consider is
>>> 'give away' wine (just like beer). I know I don't drink 20 gallons in
>>> a year but am sure I give that much away. In other words, think that
>>> through now and include it in your plan, at least for the Merlot. It
>>> needs a little time to come around and giving wine away is a slippery
>>> slope. You could end up on the short end...
>>>
>>> Joe
>>
>> I hear you. In fact my little brother-in-law got hitched last weekend and
>> I am now out of all but my coffee stout and a few bottles of weizen. I
>> didn't plan on taking beer to the party the night before, so I didn't
>> brew to have extra on hand when we ran through it.
>>
>> I always make 10 gallon batches when it comes to beer. It just isn't
>> enough extra work to justify only making 5. I have a friend that normally
>> splits the batches with me. Unless of course it is one of my recipes that
>> people like real well and then I keep it all so as to not burn through it
>> with company too quickly.
>>
>> I do think that one of the things that will help me in the vein of
>> running out by giving away, is that my dad and brother are slated to give
>> it a go with me on the grape wines this fall. We will each do a 5 gallon
>> batch. So there will be 15 gallons of each variety in the family.
>>
>> If the cherry and apricot turn out well, I could definately see doing 10
>> gallon batches of those next year. The fruit is free, so why not?
>>
>> On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
>> going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
>> produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
>> will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.
>>
>>
>> Ryan

Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
> "Dave Allison" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> I've heard and read that it takes 600-800 grapes per bottle! So a mature
>> vine needs to produce a lot of grapes to make a gallon.
>
> A mature vine does indeed produce a lot of grapes. A gallon per vine is not
> unreal. This amounts to about 12.5 pounds of grapes per vine. I think a
> lot of growers limit their vines to produce a little less in an effort to
> improve quality.

Hmmm, I will definitely have to let you all know once I get there. I am
quite anxious for next spring now, so I can get them in the ground. Of
course there is all that nasty prep work to be done this fall.

Ryan
>
>
>
>
>> --
>> DAve
>>
>> Ryan Case wrote:
>>> Joe Sallustio wrote:
>>>> I make beer too and that sounds like a plan. One thing to consider is
>>>> 'give away' wine (just like beer). I know I don't drink 20 gallons in
>>>> a year but am sure I give that much away. In other words, think that
>>>> through now and include it in your plan, at least for the Merlot. It
>>>> needs a little time to come around and giving wine away is a slippery
>>>> slope. You could end up on the short end...
>>>>
>>>> Joe
>>> I hear you. In fact my little brother-in-law got hitched last weekend and
>>> I am now out of all but my coffee stout and a few bottles of weizen. I
>>> didn't plan on taking beer to the party the night before, so I didn't
>>> brew to have extra on hand when we ran through it.
>>>
>>> I always make 10 gallon batches when it comes to beer. It just isn't
>>> enough extra work to justify only making 5. I have a friend that normally
>>> splits the batches with me. Unless of course it is one of my recipes that
>>> people like real well and then I keep it all so as to not burn through it
>>> with company too quickly.
>>>
>>> I do think that one of the things that will help me in the vein of
>>> running out by giving away, is that my dad and brother are slated to give
>>> it a go with me on the grape wines this fall. We will each do a 5 gallon
>>> batch. So there will be 15 gallons of each variety in the family.
>>>
>>> If the cherry and apricot turn out well, I could definately see doing 10
>>> gallon batches of those next year. The fruit is free, so why not?
>>>
>>> On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
>>> going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
>>> produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
>>> will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.
>>>
>>>
>>> Ryan
>
>

That sounds right to me too, i always went with a gallon per vine. 4
or 5 years to produce good grapes sounds right too. (I still buy all
mine, Pittsburgh has very little sun...)

Joe

> >
> > A mature vine does indeed produce a lot of grapes. A gallon per vine is not
> > unreal. This amounts to about 12.5 pounds of grapes per vine. I think a
> > lot of growers limit their vines to produce a little less in an effort to
> > improve quality.
>
> Hmmm, I will definitely have to let you all know once I get there. I am
> quite anxious for next spring now, so I can get them in the ground. Of
> course there is all that nasty prep work to be done this fall.
>
> Ryan
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> --
> >> DAve
> >>
> >> Ryan Case wrote:
> >>> Joe Sallustio wrote:
> >>>> I make beer too and that sounds like a plan. One thing to consider is
> >>>> 'give away' wine (just like beer). I know I don't drink 20 gallons in
> >>>> a year but am sure I give that much away. In other words, think that
> >>>> through now and include it in your plan, at least for the Merlot. It
> >>>> needs a little time to come around and giving wine away is a slippery
> >>>> slope. You could end up on the short end...
> >>>>
> >>>> Joe
> >>> I hear you. In fact my little brother-in-law got hitched last weekend and
> >>> I am now out of all but my coffee stout and a few bottles of weizen. I
> >>> didn't plan on taking beer to the party the night before, so I didn't
> >>> brew to have extra on hand when we ran through it.
> >>>
> >>> I always make 10 gallon batches when it comes to beer. It just isn't
> >>> enough extra work to justify only making 5. I have a friend that normally
> >>> splits the batches with me. Unless of course it is one of my recipes that
> >>> people like real well and then I keep it all so as to not burn through it
> >>> with company too quickly.
> >>>
> >>> I do think that one of the things that will help me in the vein of
> >>> running out by giving away, is that my dad and brother are slated to give
> >>> it a go with me on the grape wines this fall. We will each do a 5 gallon
> >>> batch. So there will be 15 gallons of each variety in the family.
> >>>
> >>> If the cherry and apricot turn out well, I could definately see doing 10
> >>> gallon batches of those next year. The fruit is free, so why not?
> >>>
> >>> On another related note. A friend has Riesling starter vines that he is
> >>> going to give me in the spring. How long, on average, before a vine will
> >>> produce fruit in a usable quantity? I have been told that a mature vine
> >>> will produce enough fruit for a gallon of wine on average.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Ryan
> >
> >