Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly assault.
They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with them.
The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging. In
past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
Ken A.

Just get a "Have-a-Hart" trap, catch them and relocate them into someone
else's vineyard )
You can call your local SPCA and they sometimes will lend you a trap and
pick up the little critter the next day. Doesn't hurt them and sometimes
it's hard to get them to leave the trap.
I once caught a skunk who was very at home in it. I tried to lure him out
with a hotdog and he got out, picked up the wiener and went back in, ate it
and took a nap. He finally left after about 2 hours!
All this was done in my yard because I wasn't about to drive him around in
my car to relocate him.
P-YEW! He wasn't what we were after anyways.
Louise;o)

"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
assault.
> They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with
them.
> The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging.
In
> past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> Ken A.
>
>

> "Ken Anderson" > wrote:
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
> assault. They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered
> with them. The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and
foraging.
> In past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to
deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.

Run an 800-volt wire around (and above) your vines. That will discourage
them for the rest of the season. A 10Kv wire will discourage them forever.
Remember to install an on-off switch in the circuit for yourself.

A good dog will frighten them away as well, although he/she might decide
that grapes are tasty too.

I had to check headers to see if the response below was really Negodki.
Seems slightly out of character.

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
>
> Run an 800-volt wire around (and above) your vines. That will discourage
> them for the rest of the season. A 10Kv wire will discourage them forever.
> Remember to install an on-off switch in the circuit for yourself.
>
> A good dog will frighten them away as well, although he/she might decide
> that grapes are tasty too.
>
>

Why is it out of character, Ken? An electrified fence is a very common
method of keeping wildlife out of the garden, vineyard, orchard, etc. A
trip-wire around the perimeter (and above the vines, in case they can jump
from nearby trees) serves the same purpose. 800-volts will produce enough of
a shock to deter but not injure. And animals have memories, so they usually
only need get "zapped" once, and they will stay away thereafter. 10 Kv will
fry them, if that is one's wish. And an off-switch is a (hopefully obvious)
necessity, especially with the higher voltage wire.

Similarly, just the presence of a dog, who will bark at and chase such
intruders, will serve as a deterrent. Unfortunately, dogs _do_ enjoy grapes,
and they make a mess of the vines whilst satisfying their craving. Also
raccoons will stand up to some dogs, rather than being frightened off.

I have both mechanisms protecting my property.

BTW, it's VERY easy to forge news group headers.

"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> I had to check headers to see if the response below was really Negodki.
> Seems slightly out of character.
>
> "Negodki" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Run an 800-volt wire around (and above) your vines. That will discourage
> > them for the rest of the season. A 10Kv wire will discourage them
forever.
> > Remember to install an on-off switch in the circuit for yourself.
> >
> > A good dog will frighten them away as well, although he/she might decide
> > that grapes are tasty too.

Ken, here are a few other ideas:

http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/hom...ae5a30b72f.htm

http://www.wildlife-museum.org/allab.../raccoons.html

Note that both electricity and dogs are amongst the suggestions (so I'm not
the only cruel and evil person on earth).

But I think that the motion-detector-operated lights and radio seem the
easiest to install quickly, and the most "humane". Racoons are nocturnal,
and the lights will definitely send them scurrying. Loud noises from radio
in addition should give you a sure thing.

You can get a few cheap motion detector light-fixtures from Home Depot or
Walmart for about $10 each. In place of one of the bulbs, screw in a
socket-receptacle, and plug your radio in there. You'll need to get some #14
romex (#12 if the run is greater than 100-feet), a few plastic "wall" boxes,
some twist-on wire connectors, electricians tape, and a male wall-plug. It
should take about an hour to string it all together. Don't worry about being
water-tight. Just make sure you plug into a GFI-protected receptacle. Use
outdoor light bulbs. The indoor variety will work, until the rain hits them
when they are on. The cold water hitting the hot bulb will cause it to
break.

Forgiven?

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
> Why is it out of character, Ken? An electrified fence is a very common
> method of keeping wildlife out of the garden, vineyard, orchard, etc. A
> trip-wire around the perimeter (and above the vines, in case they can jump
> from nearby trees) serves the same purpose. 800-volts will produce enough
of
> a shock to deter but not injure. And animals have memories, so they
usually
> only need get "zapped" once, and they will stay away thereafter. 10 Kv
will
> fry them, if that is one's wish. And an off-switch is a (hopefully
obvious)
> necessity, especially with the higher voltage wire.
>
> Similarly, just the presence of a dog, who will bark at and chase such
> intruders, will serve as a deterrent. Unfortunately, dogs _do_ enjoy
grapes,
> and they make a mess of the vines whilst satisfying their craving. Also
> raccoons will stand up to some dogs, rather than being frightened off.
>
> I have both mechanisms protecting my property.
>
> BTW, it's VERY easy to forge news group headers.
>
Are you talking about commercial electric fences? Do they put out high
voltages, but won't kill you, like a car's coil? I don't know much about
electricity, but I believe the 220 in my garage can kill. And you're talking
800 volts?
Ken A.

Whether or not you're willing to shoot or trap them depends on your
frustration level, Ken.
Trapping is humane, because you can let them go in the wild somewhere
else...
So I hope you don't feel too bad about that option...

But...if your frustration level gets too high, its either the critters or
your grapes, there ain't enough room in the vineyard for the both of
you.....
You might be surprised how your desire of being a good winemaker will also
turn you into a good marksman as well! Good aim, good wine! poor aim, no
wine? Of course you can use tranquilizers too! Would probably be cheaper,
either tranq or .22 calibre, than getting an electric fence setup....

Just some thoughts....from someone who would shoot.

Rick


"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
assault.
> They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with
them.
> The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging.
In
> past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> Ken A.
>
>

"Ken Anderson" > wrote:

> Are you talking about commercial electric fences? Do they put out high
> voltages, but won't kill you, like a car's coil? I don't know much about
> electricity, but I believe the 220 in my garage can kill. And you're
talking
> 800 volts?

Amperage, not voltage kills. That's why you get a shock when you touch a
(firing) spark-plug wire (20-60,000 volts), but don't get hurt (unless you
bump your head on the hood jumping away).

Conversely, the 40-volts from a ringing telephone can kill you, if you
happen to be in the tub and someone drops the ringing phone in.

Standard "electric fence" transformers produce 800 volts a/c, and are
sufficient to deter small animals, deer, and humans. I think cattle and
horse fence transformers are about 1200-1600 volts, perhaps 2000. The 10Kv
fences are designed to kill anything which touches it, and are only used in
very high-security installations. [They are illegal anywhere else, and you
wouldn't be able to purchase the transformers very easily.] It's mention was
solely due to my hatred for raccoons, and a warped sense of humor. I
apologize if it offended your sensibilities.

Normally, one does not "electrify" the fence itself, but rather strings the
hot-wire close to the ground, or just above fence level, using plastic
insulators, and grounds the transformer to the fence and the earth. Then the
fence is not "hot", and doesn't pose a fire hazard if something touches it.
When someone or something touches the hot-wire AND the fence (or wet
ground), they will receive a shock. Since the amperage is very low, and the
current is A/C, the shock is just that --- a shock. It _will_ kill birds,
which is why the hot-wire should be far enough from the fence that the bird
can't touch both, and rats (good riddance), but it will not kill dogs,
raccoons, squirrels, or larger mammals.

If you don't have a metal fence (e.g. chain-link), you need to install a
second "ground" wire, so that the intruder will touch both simultaneously.
For this to work, you need to determine the size of your target.

This would have been my suggestion, since a transformer and 500' roll of
wire can be purchased for about $25, and installed in a few hours (I used
sections of 3/4" pvc pipe as insulators). But I like the motion-detector
light and radio idea much better --- depending how large your vineyard is.

Since you say you are not familiar with electricity, and thus may not be
comfortable doing a bit of wiring, you can purchase (more expensive) motion
detectors which have a standard plug in. Then you can plug that into an
extension cord, and plug the lamps and radio into it. Or, I will be happy to
give you a quick course in wiring, and/or refer you to a website with
pictorial instructions.

I don't know what sort of vineyard you have, but I would envision having at
least one detector in between each row, which can get pretty expensive
compared to the electric "fence". If it is a relatively small vineyard,
perhaps you can install the motion detector and lighting high enough to
cover everything with one or two fixtures.

"Rick Vanderwal" > wrote:

> You might be surprised how your desire of being a good winemaker will also
> turn you into a good marksman as well! Good aim, good wine! poor aim,
no
> wine? Of course you can use tranquilizers too! Would probably be
cheaper,
> either tranq or .22 calibre, than getting an electric fence setup....

Problem is, it's not that easy to hit a raccoon, especially for someone who
isn't a practiced shooter. And tranquilizer darts are more difficult to
obtain (and much more expensive) than bullets. I think you need to be a
licensed vet to obtain them. [The government is afraid you might use them on
a person.]

Furthermore, raccoons are nocturnal animals. Unless one wishes to spend
every night until harvest standing watch in the vineyard, shooting them
isn't a very practical solution.

I wonder if it would help to ask them nicely to stay away?

> Negodki > wrote:

> I wonder if it would help to ask them nicely to stay away?

Is rabies in racoons a problem in your area...?

Yeasty

I've got a few grape vines, but they aren't mature enough to attract
attention from coons -- but there are plenty of those critters around here
(southeast LA). After restocking my goldfish pond several times, and having
it promptly emptied during nocturnal visits by one or more coons, I conceded
defeat and made it a lily pond...

Racoons can do a lot of damage if left uncontrolled, and not just to grapes,
goldfish or gardens. I work for a mid-size chemical manufacturer in Baton
Rouge area, and our $150-million plant was totally shut down on two seperate
occassions as a result of coons climbing into major electrical
witchgear -- just enough left (mostly fur) to identify the culprit!

We put out traps and caught several -- the local Wildlife & Fisheries guys
picked them up and (supposedly) relocated them to less hazardous areas.

Good luck...

Bart



"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
assault.
> They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with
them.
> The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging.
In
> past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> Ken A.
>
>

"Yeasty Potatoes" > wrote:

> Is rabies in racoons a problem in your area...?

Not any more.

I'll probably use the radio/light motion detector next year. I have 2
yorkies so all the other deterrents (electricity, pepper etc.) are no good
for me since they are in the yard all day. When a raccoon does come into the
yard at night I prefer not to let the dogs out since they're only 4 pounds
each, they think they're pit bulls and can take a raccoon but I think they'd
come out of it bloody.
Louise)

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
> Ken, here are a few other ideas:
>
> http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/hom...ae5a30b72f.htm
>
> http://www.wildlife-museum.org/allab.../raccoons.html
>
> Note that both electricity and dogs are amongst the suggestions (so I'm
not
> the only cruel and evil person on earth).
>
> But I think that the motion-detector-operated lights and radio seem the
> easiest to install quickly, and the most "humane". Racoons are nocturnal,
> and the lights will definitely send them scurrying. Loud noises from radio
> in addition should give you a sure thing.
>
> You can get a few cheap motion detector light-fixtures from Home Depot or
> Walmart for about $10 each. In place of one of the bulbs, screw in a
> socket-receptacle, and plug your radio in there. You'll need to get some
#14
> romex (#12 if the run is greater than 100-feet), a few plastic "wall"
boxes,
> some twist-on wire connectors, electricians tape, and a male wall-plug. It
> should take about an hour to string it all together. Don't worry about
being
> water-tight. Just make sure you plug into a GFI-protected receptacle. Use
> outdoor light bulbs. The indoor variety will work, until the rain hits
them
> when they are on. The cold water hitting the hot bulb will cause it to
> break.
>
> Forgiven?
>
>

"bwesley7" > wrote:

> . . . there are plenty of those critters around here (southeast LA) . . .

> . . . I work for a mid-size chemical manufacturer in Baton Rouge area . .
..

I'm glad you added the last part. I was trying to figure out when raccoons
came to southeast Los Angeles.

"Louise Gagnon" > wrote:

> I'll probably use the radio/light motion detector next year. I have 2
> yorkies so all the other deterrents (electricity, pepper etc.) are no good
> for me since they are in the yard all day. When a raccoon does come into
the
> yard at night I prefer not to let the dogs out since they're only 4 pounds
> each, they think they're pit bulls and can take a raccoon but I think
they'd
> come out of it bloody.

Louise,
If your yard is fenced, you can still use the electricity. Just run the
wire about 4" above the top of the fence. (Cut some 1' lengths of pvc pipe,
notch the top, and tie or nail them to the fence. Then string your wire
through the notches.) Yorkies are not going to jump or climb that high, and
if they do, you probably want to discourage them. But keep them away from
the raccoons. Coons can hurt a much larger animal if cornered.

"bwesley7" > wrote in message
news:W5%fb.38600$sp2.6649@lakeread04...
> I've got a few grape vines, but they aren't mature enough to attract
> attention from coons -- but there are plenty of those critters around here
> (southeast LA). After restocking my goldfish pond several times, and
having
> it promptly emptied during nocturnal visits by one or more coons, I
conceded
> defeat and made it a lily pond...
>
> Racoons can do a lot of damage if left uncontrolled, and not just to
grapes,
> goldfish or gardens. I work for a mid-size chemical manufacturer in Baton
> Rouge area, and our $150-million plant was totally shut down on two
seperate
> occassions as a result of coons climbing into major electrical
> witchgear -- just enough left (mostly fur) to identify the culprit!
>
> We put out traps and caught several -- the local Wildlife & Fisheries guys
> picked them up and (supposedly) relocated them to less hazardous areas.
>
> Good luck...
>
> Bart
>
Yeah, and if that's not bad enough, I just got done running out back to the
grapes to scare off the dozen or so wild turkeys that we have around here.
Two of them flew but the rest just scurried away. They're hardly scared of
people! I've seen those SOBs bouncing like pogo sticks under my grapes,
gulping them down. This co-existence thing is kind of tough. : \
Ken A.

Robins are terrible. I have a flock of 50 or so practically living in the
vinyard. I thought I had 'em beat (shot 3 or 4 a week all summer with a
pellet gun ) but as soon as the sugar started going into the grapes, the
population explosion began. I have to harvest the grapes early to keep from
losing half. Picked pinot noir and pinot gris saturday, PN was 22.5 brix,
3.49 ph and 9 g/l TA. PG was22 brix, 3.35 ph and 6.2 g/l TA. There were some
slightly greenish seeds and I would have liked to let them hang another week
but what can you do? This is in Idaho at 2700 ft elevation. Any suggestions
about bird control measures? Have tried the bright streamers, inflatable
snakes, and I dislike nets (too expensive and this is supposed to be a
hobby! They are a lot of work!).

"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> "bwesley7" > wrote in message
> news:W5%fb.38600$sp2.6649@lakeread04...
> > I've got a few grape vines, but they aren't mature enough to attract
> > attention from coons -- but there are plenty of those critters around
here
> > (southeast LA). After restocking my goldfish pond several times, and
> having
> > it promptly emptied during nocturnal visits by one or more coons, I
> conceded
> > defeat and made it a lily pond...
> >
> > Racoons can do a lot of damage if left uncontrolled, and not just to
> grapes,
> > goldfish or gardens. I work for a mid-size chemical manufacturer in
Baton
> > Rouge area, and our $150-million plant was totally shut down on two
> seperate
> > occassions as a result of coons climbing into major electrical
> > witchgear -- just enough left (mostly fur) to identify the culprit!
> >
> > We put out traps and caught several -- the local Wildlife & Fisheries
guys
> > picked them up and (supposedly) relocated them to less hazardous areas.
> >
> > Good luck...
> >
> > Bart
> >
> Yeah, and if that's not bad enough, I just got done running out back to
the
> grapes to scare off the dozen or so wild turkeys that we have around here.
> Two of them flew but the rest just scurried away. They're hardly scared of
> people! I've seen those SOBs bouncing like pogo sticks under my grapes,
> gulping them down. This co-existence thing is kind of tough. : \
> Ken A.
>
>

Hi,
I have heard if you hang up CD on a string were they will spin in the wind
worries them.
Give us a use for all those damn AOL CD's.
AT least its cheap.
Cheers,
Dave

So far I have trapped 2 coons, 1 possum, and 6 squirrels - in the
city. Plus hundreds of yellow jackets. If you decide you like fuzzy
animals more than fruit, I suggest you buy grapes.
Tim
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly assault.
> They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with them.
> The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging. In
> past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> Ken A.

>Are you talking about commercial electric fences? Do they put out high
>voltages, but won't kill you, like a car's coil? I don't know much about
>electricity, but I believe the 220 in my garage can kill. And you're talking
>800 volts?
>Ken A.


It's not the volts that kill ya. it's the amps. This of this: a
static discharge (think touching a doorknob and getting a shock) is
usually measured in the 10's of KVolts.... asside from a but of
discomfort no problem. however, take even 15 volts, and a few amps
accross your heart, and say good bye.




email: dallyn_spam at yahoo dot com
please respond in this NG so others
can share your wisdom as well!

Be careful. 220V AC can certainly kill as can 800V AC. They both have
enough potential to force a substantial current through your heart, (under
the right circumstance) which is what Negodki correctly points out will kill
you. What makes the electric fences safe but uncomfortable to touch is the
FREQUENCY of the current. Something called the "skin effect" means that
higher frequency currents will tend to travel only on the outer part of a
conductor, i.e. not through the heart. This makes the shock non-lethal but
very unpleasant. The bottom line is don't try to rig up an electric fence
yourself, use a commercially available unit.

Regards,

John

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
> "Ken Anderson" > wrote:
>
> > Are you talking about commercial electric fences? Do they put out high
> > voltages, but won't kill you, like a car's coil? I don't know much about
> > electricity, but I believe the 220 in my garage can kill. And you're
> talking
> > 800 volts?
>
> Amperage, not voltage kills. That's why you get a shock when you touch a
> (firing) spark-plug wire (20-60,000 volts), but don't get hurt (unless you
> bump your head on the hood jumping away).
>
> Conversely, the 40-volts from a ringing telephone can kill you, if you
> happen to be in the tub and someone drops the ringing phone in.
>
> Standard "electric fence" transformers produce 800 volts a/c, and are
> sufficient to deter small animals, deer, and humans. I think cattle and
> horse fence transformers are about 1200-1600 volts, perhaps 2000. The 10Kv
> fences are designed to kill anything which touches it, and are only used
in
> very high-security installations. [They are illegal anywhere else, and you
> wouldn't be able to purchase the transformers very easily.] It's mention
was
> solely due to my hatred for raccoons, and a warped sense of humor. I
> apologize if it offended your sensibilities.
>
> Normally, one does not "electrify" the fence itself, but rather strings
the
> hot-wire close to the ground, or just above fence level, using plastic
> insulators, and grounds the transformer to the fence and the earth. Then
the
> fence is not "hot", and doesn't pose a fire hazard if something touches
it.
> When someone or something touches the hot-wire AND the fence (or wet
> ground), they will receive a shock. Since the amperage is very low, and
the
> current is A/C, the shock is just that --- a shock. It _will_ kill birds,
> which is why the hot-wire should be far enough from the fence that the
bird
> can't touch both, and rats (good riddance), but it will not kill dogs,
> raccoons, squirrels, or larger mammals.
>
> If you don't have a metal fence (e.g. chain-link), you need to install a
> second "ground" wire, so that the intruder will touch both simultaneously.
> For this to work, you need to determine the size of your target.
>
> This would have been my suggestion, since a transformer and 500' roll of
> wire can be purchased for about $25, and installed in a few hours (I used
> sections of 3/4" pvc pipe as insulators). But I like the motion-detector
> light and radio idea much better --- depending how large your vineyard is.
>
> Since you say you are not familiar with electricity, and thus may not be
> comfortable doing a bit of wiring, you can purchase (more expensive)
motion
> detectors which have a standard plug in. Then you can plug that into an
> extension cord, and plug the lamps and radio into it. Or, I will be happy
to
> give you a quick course in wiring, and/or refer you to a website with
> pictorial instructions.
>
> I don't know what sort of vineyard you have, but I would envision having
at
> least one detector in between each row, which can get pretty expensive
> compared to the electric "fence". If it is a relatively small vineyard,
> perhaps you can install the motion detector and lighting high enough to
> cover everything with one or two fixtures.
>
>

Funny that you can't get tranquilizer darts because the government is afraid
you might use them on a person, but there's no problem getting .44 magnum
loads.

John

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
> "Rick Vanderwal" > wrote:
>
> > You might be surprised how your desire of being a good winemaker will
also
> > turn you into a good marksman as well! Good aim, good wine! poor aim,
> no
> > wine? Of course you can use tranquilizers too! Would probably be
> cheaper,
> > either tranq or .22 calibre, than getting an electric fence setup....
>
> Problem is, it's not that easy to hit a raccoon, especially for someone
who
> isn't a practiced shooter. And tranquilizer darts are more difficult to
> obtain (and much more expensive) than bullets. I think you need to be a
> licensed vet to obtain them. [The government is afraid you might use them
on
> a person.]
>
> Furthermore, raccoons are nocturnal animals. Unless one wishes to spend
> every night until harvest standing watch in the vineyard, shooting them
> isn't a very practical solution.
>
> I wonder if it would help to ask them nicely to stay away?
>
>

I use those CD's for Christmas tree ornaments.
Tim
> Hi,
> I have heard if you hang up CD on a string were they will spin in the wind
> worries them.
> Give us a use for all those damn AOL CD's.
> AT least its cheap.
> Cheers,
> Dave

"Lazurus106" > wrote:

> Give us a use for all those damn AOL CD's.

Yeah, but do you hate robins enough to make them use AOL?

What seems to work well (for bird control) in this area is those little
multi-coloured propeller things they sell at "party stores". Mount a few on
posts, or on a string. But you need some wind to turn them, or it doesn't
scare the birds away, so this is only a good solution where there is a
constant breeze.

Most insecticides will also kill birds, but this is not a good solution,
since birds control the insects much better than do insecticides.

"John DeFiore" > wrote:

> Be careful. 220V AC can certainly kill as can 800V AC. They both have
> enough potential to force a substantial current through your heart, (under
> the right circumstance) which is what Negodki correctly points out will
kill
> you. What makes the electric fences safe but uncomfortable to touch is
the
> FREQUENCY of the current. Something called the "skin effect" means that
> higher frequency currents will tend to travel only on the outer part of a
> conductor, i.e. not through the heart. This makes the shock non-lethal
but
> very unpleasant. The bottom line is don't try to rig up an electric fence
> yourself, use a commercially available unit.

Good point. I assumed that my suggestion implied purchasing a commercial
transformer (available at feed stores and some hardware stores), and not
trying to rig one up oneself, or trying to splice into the 880 feed lines on
the electric poles. But if you know how to build an a/c transformer, you
probably know how to build a safe one.

"John DeFiore" > wrote:

> Funny that you can't get tranquilizer darts because the government is
afraid
> you might use them on a person, but there's no problem getting .44 magnum
> loads.

That irony was my reason for parenthetically mentioning it.

"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
assault.
> They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with
them.
> The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging.
In
> past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> Ken A.
>

A foot-high electric fence. Seems the commonest approach around here
(western Oregon) for racoons that get in fish ponds anyway. Doesn't need
much charge to discourage them, and you can just step over it.

Now if you had a deer problem it would be more of a challenge. I know of
one case where a buck liked grapes so much that he would just bull his way
past an electric fence to get in. A hunter friend of mine with a night
scope, and a special "nuisiance animal" permit obtained by the the vinyard
owner, ended this career of crime. It amazed me the the the buck would just
push right by the wire, getting zapped the whole time, to get in.

--arne

Hi: I found that spreading dog fur liberally under the wire, especially
around the trunk helped.

Joe
"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
assault.
> They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with
them.
> The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging.
In
> past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to deter
> these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> Ken A.
>
>

But then you'd have to trap a dog or shoot the bugger to get the fur to
spread around the perimeter! And you're right back to square one!!!!!!

Rick




"Joe Yudelson" > wrote in message
...
> Hi: I found that spreading dog fur liberally under the wire, especially
> around the trunk helped.
>
> Joe
> "Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
> et...
> > Quite simply, if I don't do something about the raccoons that have
> > discovered my grapes, there will be no wine for me. It's a nightly
> assault.
> > They spit the skins away - the ground under the vines is covered with
> them.
> > The canopy is disheveled from their climbing up the trunks and foraging.
> In
> > past posts, I see mention of box traps. Are there any other ways to
deter
> > these critters? Can't bring myself to shoot, or trap them. Thanks.
> > Ken A.
> >
> >
>
>

Arne Thormodsen wrote:

> A foot-high electric fence. Seems the commonest approach around here
> (western Oregon) for racoons that get in fish ponds anyway. Doesn't need
> much charge to discourage them, and you can just step over it.

We found with our garbage trailer (at our camp) we needed to put down
chicken wire on the groud as well and have that hooked up to the fence
because the raccoons would climb up the poles and avoid the wires. Smart
buggers they are.


--
charles

"Once ... in the wilds of Afghanistan, I lost my corkscrew, and we were
forced to live on nothing but food and water for days."
- W.C. Fields

"Rick Vanderwal" > wrote:

> But then you'd have to trap a dog or shoot the bugger to get the fur to
> spread around the perimeter! And you're right back to square one!!!!!!

Most dogs are beginning to shed their summer coats about this time of year,
perhaps for this precise purpose!

A trip to the local animal shelter will probably yield enough "fur" to cover
a large vineyard.

"Charles H" > wrote:

> We found with our garbage trailer (at our camp) we needed to put down
> chicken wire on the groud as well and have that hooked up to the fence
> because the raccoons would climb up the poles and avoid the wires. Smart
> buggers they are.

You could have just put the chicken wire around the poles, no?

"Dave Allyn" > wrote in message
...
> >Are you talking about commercial electric fences? Do they put out high
> >voltages, but won't kill you, like a car's coil? I don't know much about
> >electricity, but I believe the 220 in my garage can kill. And you're
talking
> >800 volts?
> >Ken A.
>
>
> It's not the volts that kill ya. it's the amps. This of this: a
> static discharge (think touching a doorknob and getting a shock) is
> usually measured in the 10's of KVolts.... asside from a but of
> discomfort no problem. however, take even 15 volts, and a few amps
> accross your heart, and say good bye.
>
I took a jolt of 115AC today. I was working on a magnetic stirrer.
Disassembled it without unplugging it. Soon as it hit me, I told myself I
KNEW that was gonna happen! Been a long time since I got a good shock.
Ken A. (doing the Homer thing today)

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
> "John DeFiore" > wrote:
>
> > Be careful. 220V AC can certainly kill as can 800V AC. They both have
> > enough potential to force a substantial current through your heart,
(under
> > the right circumstance) which is what Negodki correctly points out will
> kill
> > you. What makes the electric fences safe but uncomfortable to touch is
> the
> > FREQUENCY of the current. Something called the "skin effect" means that
> > higher frequency currents will tend to travel only on the outer part of
a
> > conductor, i.e. not through the heart. This makes the shock non-lethal
> but
> > very unpleasant. The bottom line is don't try to rig up an electric
fence
> > yourself, use a commercially available unit.
>
> Good point. I assumed that my suggestion implied purchasing a commercial
> transformer (available at feed stores and some hardware stores), and not
> trying to rig one up oneself, or trying to splice into the 880 feed lines
on
> the electric poles. But if you know how to build an a/c transformer, you
> probably know how to build a safe one.
>
I looked at electric fences at Tractor Supply last evening. A little
overwhelming, for a non-farmer. I think to use one for coons you'd have to
run two wires at 6 and 12 inches, roughly. They sell the wire by the mile. I
could have a grand time. Just dawned on me that if you could string it right
to the trunks, you'd save a bunch of time, money, and headaches. Possible?

"Joe Yudelson" > wrote in message
...
> Hi: I found that spreading dog fur liberally under the wire, especially
> around the trunk helped.
>
> Joe
>
Hmmm. That sounds pretty good. I think that's their MO - up the trunk.

"Ken Anderson" > wrote:

> I looked at electric fences at Tractor Supply last evening. A little
> overwhelming, for a non-farmer. I think to use one for coons you'd have to
> run two wires at 6 and 12 inches, roughly. They sell the wire by the mile.
I
> could have a grand time. Just dawned on me that if you could string it
right
> to the trunks, you'd save a bunch of time, money, and headaches. Possible?

Check your local feed store or hardware store. They sell wire in 100' and
500' reels. It's just 18 or 20-gauge bare aluminum wire. Doesn't have to say
"fence wire". Unless you need 5 miles of it to go around your vineyard? If
so, INVITE ME ---- WILL WORK FOR GRAPES!

Yes, if you don't have a metal fence, you will need to run two wires --- a
hot wire and a ground. And you will need to drive stakes in about a foot, so
they stay there. You can use pvc pipe for the stakes, and then you won't
have to purchase insulators. And you will need some sort of visibility, so
people don't trip on the wire. The white PVC pipe will serve the purpose (in
daylight).

Although running it along the vine trunks seems like it would work, it
won't! Every time a branch touches the hot wire, it will burn, which has
got to be bad for the grapes. And use up a lot of electricity. And you would
have to use insulators, so you may as well use pvc stakes.

Unless there are trees the critters can swing from, you need only run the
wire AROUND the vineyard, not around each vine.

Shouldn't take that long. Get the wife and kids to cut, notch, and drive the
stakes. When they're finished, you can string the wire.

"Negodki" > wrote in message
...
> "Ken Anderson" > wrote:
>
> > I looked at electric fences at Tractor Supply last evening. A little
> > overwhelming, for a non-farmer. I think to use one for coons you'd have
to
> > run two wires at 6 and 12 inches, roughly. They sell the wire by the
mile.
> I
> > could have a grand time. Just dawned on me that if you could string it
> right
> > to the trunks, you'd save a bunch of time, money, and headaches.
Possible?
>
> Check your local feed store or hardware store. They sell wire in 100' and
> 500' reels. It's just 18 or 20-gauge bare aluminum wire. Doesn't have to
say
> "fence wire". Unless you need 5 miles of it to go around your vineyard? If
> so, INVITE ME ---- WILL WORK FOR GRAPES!
>
> Yes, if you don't have a metal fence, you will need to run two wires --- a
> hot wire and a ground. And you will need to drive stakes in about a foot,
so
> they stay there. You can use pvc pipe for the stakes, and then you won't
> have to purchase insulators. And you will need some sort of visibility, so
> people don't trip on the wire. The white PVC pipe will serve the purpose
(in
> daylight).
>
> Although running it along the vine trunks seems like it would work, it
> won't! Every time a branch touches the hot wire, it will burn, which has
> got to be bad for the grapes. And use up a lot of electricity. And you
would
> have to use insulators, so you may as well use pvc stakes.
>
> Unless there are trees the critters can swing from, you need only run the
> wire AROUND the vineyard, not around each vine.
>
> Shouldn't take that long. Get the wife and kids to cut, notch, and drive
the
> stakes. When they're finished, you can string the wire.
>
PVC pipe is cheap, for sure. Could use the drill press and run wire straight
through the stuff.

"Ken Anderson" > wrote:

> PVC pipe is cheap, for sure. Could use the drill press and run wire
straight through the stuff.

I would suggest notching it (with the same hacksaw you use to cut it)
instead. Reason being, it's easier to thread and tension the wire. Cut
2'-2'6" pieces. Make a notch about 3/4-1" from the top, and another about
6-8" below (how big are these racoons?). Space them about 6-10' apart. Make
a hole in the ground with a piece of wood (a broomstick would do the job) or
a piece of metal pipe, and stick each post in. Then string the wire. Wrap it
around every 2nd or third post, so, if it breaks somewhere, you can repair
it without having to retension the entire string. Shouldn't take long. About
1 hour per 100' if you work alone. Twice that time if you have a "helper".


Are you sure you don't want to shoot them?

Coons are not cute. At one time, we had one in our yard and after talking
with local officials they warned me to not let my 75 lb dog out there - the
coon would win. Fast forward more than a few years, I've found out that our
dog was a deterrent for many critters. Now that he's gone, it has become a
free-for-all in my garden (bunnies, squirrels, and a family of coons). The
coons considered us to be the invaders. They are sneaky, and a pellet gun
doesn't seem to hurt them. I will have to adjust to protect my garden next
year. As to the electrical fence, be safe - even my husband who knows a lot
about rigging things up with electricity, has been surprised a few times.
His latest project was to create lights around our swimming pool and one
light in the pool. His comment was, "Don't worry I've figured it out so we
won't get a shock." After he finished it, was neat, but reminded me of a
landing zone for UFO's (circular).
;o) Darlene

"Ken Anderson" > wrote in message
et...
> "Joe Yudelson" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Hi: I found that spreading dog fur liberally under the wire, especially
> > around the trunk helped.
> >
> > Joe
> >
> Hmmm. That sounds pretty good. I think that's their MO - up the trunk.
>
>