I have a batch that has been in the primary over a week. Its per Jack
Keller, and his recipe gives a number of days after which to move to
secondary. The ferment is noticeably slower (in terms of PA dropped)
than usual for me in one week, because of the cold conditions, despite
heating belts.

My question is, should you move from the primary to the secondary based
purely on days since begun, or should you move based on PA/SG?

My must is very dark purple and daily stirrings are not giving huge
clues as to how much lees is accumulating.

Thanks

Sean

snpm wrote:
[snip]
> My question is, should you move from the primary to the secondary based
> purely on days since begun, or should you move based on PA/SG?
[snip]

Sean,

I would move it based on the SG, since the ferment time can vary quite a
bit, due to the cool temps.

Other guidelines could be the sinking of the cap, if present, and the
rate of bubbles through a fermentaion lock, but these are probably just
substitutes for going by the SG.

--
Mike MTM, Cokesbury, NJ, USA

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In the absence of data, what would be a fair general SG to achieve before transferring to secondary? The Vineco kits I
have done have said transfer at < 1.020 but the recipes I have followed have largely been based on 'a few days at 18-24
degrees' or similar.

snpm > wrote:
> I have a batch that has been in the primary over a week. Its per Jack
> Keller, and his recipe gives a number of days after which to move to
> secondary. The ferment is noticeably slower (in terms of PA dropped)
> than usual for me in one week, because of the cold conditions, despite
> heating belts.
>
> My question is, should you move from the primary to the secondary based
> purely on days since begun, or should you move based on PA/SG?
>
> My must is very dark purple and daily stirrings are not giving huge
> clues as to how much lees is accumulating.

Specific gravity of the must determines my primary to secondary moves.

Dick

jim wrote:
> In the absence of data, what would be a fair general SG to achieve before transferring to secondary? The Vineco kits I
> have done have said transfer at < 1.020 but the recipes I have followed have largely been based on 'a few days at 18-24
> degrees' or similar.
>
>
Jim,

1.020 is a good number, although I've heard of some who let it go own to
1.010. Down in that range you start to run the risk of a stuck
fermentation though.

In all honesty, I generally go by a sinking cap or slowed bubbling or
visible sediment buildup. There's a lot of leeway here.


--
Mike MTM, Cokesbury, NJ, USA

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On Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:25:42 -0000, "jim" >
wrote:

>In the absence of data, what would be a fair general SG to achieve before transferring to secondary? The Vineco kits I
>have done have said transfer at < 1.020 but the recipes I have followed have largely been based on 'a few days at 18-24
>degrees' or similar.
>

Jim:

Both my memory of Vineco's wine instructions & the 4-week instructions
that I just checked online say less than 1.010. Personally I prefer
less than 1.005.

The goal is to do the transfer once the main, vigourous fermentation
is done. I believe that this applies for any fermentation. If you
transfer too early, you will probably get wine entering the airlock
and spritzing out of it. There will probably be no harm done to the
wine. None sure about the area around the carboy though.

Steve

Mike/Jim - I don't make a lot of kits but when making wine from grape must I
let the fermentation go in the primary container until the specific gravity
is down around 1.000 to 1.005. I wouldn't rack out of the primary fermenter
when the sg was still at 1.020 for fear of taking the fermenting juice away
from the great mass of yeast that settles to the bottom of the fermenter.
Of course there is ample yeast in suspension to finish a fermentation but
when you rack out of the primary fermenter you disrupt the process. I've
used this technique to help make the decision to rack...hold a lit match
inside the primary fermenter. If it goes out quickly there is a lot of CO2
evolving off the surface of must. If it stays lit near the surface it's
time to rack to a closed secondary fermenter such as a carboy.

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas USA


Mike McGeough wrote "1.020 is a good number, although I've heard of some who
let it go own to
> 1.010. Down in that range you start to run the risk of a stuck
> fermentation though. In all honesty,
I generally go by a sinking cap or slowed bubbling or visible sediment
buildup. There's a lot of leeway here."


Jim asked "In the absence of data, what would be a fair general SG to
achieve before transferring to secondary? The Vineco kits I
>> have done have said transfer at < 1.020 but the recipes I have followed
>> have largely been based on 'a few days at 18-24 degrees' or similar.

I had a rhubarb wine recipe which I followed to the last, once in secondary the thing went mad, producing a mass of
heavy spongy lees and pumping some of the wine out through the airlock.

I agree its best to transfer once the fermentation rate has declined reasonably (better than generic recipe timing
unless an SG based one or kit )

Funny the difference in Vineco instruction but of course they know what they are doing

Jim

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve" >
Newsgroups: rec.crafts.winemaking
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 1:52 AM
Subject: Target SG before transferring to secondary?


> On Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:25:42 -0000, "jim" >
> wrote:
>
>>In the absence of data, what would be a fair general SG to achieve before transferring to secondary? The Vineco kits
>>I
>>have done have said transfer at < 1.020 but the recipes I have followed have largely been based on 'a few days at
>>18-24
>>degrees' or similar.
>>
>
> Jim:
>
> Both my memory of Vineco's wine instructions & the 4-week instructions
> that I just checked online say less than 1.010. Personally I prefer
> less than 1.005.
>
> The goal is to do the transfer once the main, vigourous fermentation
> is done. I believe that this applies for any fermentation. If you
> transfer too early, you will probably get wine entering the airlock
> and spritzing out of it. There will probably be no harm done to the
> wine. None sure about the area around the carboy though.
>
> Steve
"Steve" > wrote in message ...
> On Sun, 14 Jan 2007 21:25:42 -0000, "jim" >
> wrote:
>
>>In the absence of data, what would be a fair general SG to achieve before transferring to secondary? The Vineco kits
>>I
>>have done have said transfer at < 1.020 but the recipes I have followed have largely been based on 'a few days at
>>18-24
>>degrees' or similar.
>>
>
> Jim:
>
> Both my memory of Vineco's wine instructions & the 4-week instructions
> that I just checked online say less than 1.010. Personally I prefer
> less than 1.005.
>
> The goal is to do the transfer once the main, vigourous fermentation
> is done. I believe that this applies for any fermentation. If you
> transfer too early, you will probably get wine entering the airlock
> and spritzing out of it. There will probably be no harm done to the
> wine. None sure about the area around the carboy though.
>
> Steve

According to Cox, a good place to transfer to a carboy with airlock is
when 2/3 of the sugar has been "eaten". If your starting SG is 1.09,
then that point would be at about 1.03.



snpm wrote:
> I have a batch that has been in the primary over a week. Its per Jack
> Keller, and his recipe gives a number of days after which to move to
> secondary. The ferment is noticeably slower (in terms of PA dropped)
> than usual for me in one week, because of the cold conditions, despite
> heating belts.
>
> My question is, should you move from the primary to the secondary based
> purely on days since begun, or should you move based on PA/SG?
>
> My must is very dark purple and daily stirrings are not giving huge
> clues as to how much lees is accumulating.
>
> Thanks
>
> Sean

Franco > wrote:
> snpm wrote:

>> I have a batch that has been in the primary over a week. Its per Jack
>> Keller, and his recipe gives a number of days after which to move to
>> secondary. The ferment is noticeably slower (in terms of PA dropped)
>> than usual for me in one week, because of the cold conditions, despite
>> heating belts.
>>
>> My question is, should you move from the primary to the secondary based
>> purely on days since begun, or should you move based on PA/SG?
>>
>> My must is very dark purple and daily stirrings are not giving huge
>> clues as to how much lees is accumulating.

> According to Cox, a good place to transfer to a carboy with airlock is
> when 2/3 of the sugar has been "eaten". If your starting SG is 1.09,
> then that point would be at about 1.03.

While 1.03 may be sweeter than I would prefer, the point well-taken
is that racking should be based on a target SG reading. Unlike
mothers-in-law, hydrometers are there to help you.

Dick

If you mean Jeff Cox, does he have any qualification other than
journalist? His book on vines to wines doesnt mention it if he
does.....


Franco wrote:
> According to Cox, a good place to transfer to a carboy with airlock is
> when 2/3 of the sugar has been "eaten". If your starting SG is 1.09,
> then that point would be at about 1.03.
>
>
>
> snpm wrote:
> > I have a batch that has been in the primary over a week. Its per Jack
> > Keller, and his recipe gives a number of days after which to move to
> > secondary. The ferment is noticeably slower (in terms of PA dropped)
> > than usual for me in one week, because of the cold conditions, despite
> > heating belts.
> >
> > My question is, should you move from the primary to the secondary based
> > purely on days since begun, or should you move based on PA/SG?
> >
> > My must is very dark purple and daily stirrings are not giving huge
> > clues as to how much lees is accumulating.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Sean