<Sigh>

I have checked my freezer temp. and have made sure there is enough
circulation... yada yada.

This is kind of a dumb question but..
if you would freeze something in water
that is already encircled/encase in a plastic wrap, aluminum foil
or air tight container...
would you get or tast freezer burn??

Example..
a chicken breast wrapped tightly & frozed vs.
chicken breast wrapped and wrapped tightly, water poured over &
frozed.

I know the first wrapping if left too long in MY freezer would
produce the freezer burn and freezer burn taste,

Would the item encased in ice do the same?

I hope you understand my question.

Just curious.

Thanks!

Linda wrote:
> <Sigh>
>
> I have checked my freezer temp. and have made sure there is enough
> circulation... yada yada.

A "frost-free" freezer will cause freezer burn much more quickly than a
conventional freezer.

> This is kind of a dumb question but.. if you would freeze something
> in water that is already encircled/encase in a plastic wrap, aluminum
> foil or air tight container... would you get or tast freezer burn??

"Freezer burn" is the result of moisture migrating out of the food
leaving behind tough cell walls. It typically ends up as ice crystals on
the inside of the packaging. In the air space surrounding the food.

Encasing the food in water and freezing (with or without wrapping first)
will retard freezer burn.

> Example.. a chicken breast wrapped tightly & frozed vs. chicken
> breast wrapped and wrapped tightly, water poured over & frozed.

The one in ice will likely not freezer burn for years. That's not to say
that the fat in the meat will stay good. Fats will become rancid over
time, even when frozen. Beyond that, vacuum packaging with a FoodSaver
or other vacuum sealer will help meats last longer by removing the
airspace and pressing the package firmly against the flesh.

Pastorio

Bob (this one) wrote:

> The one in ice will likely not freezer burn for years. That's not to say
> that the fat in the meat will stay good. Fats will become rancid over
> time, even when frozen. Beyond that, vacuum packaging with a FoodSaver
> or other vacuum sealer will help meats last longer by removing the
> airspace and pressing the package firmly against the flesh.
>
> Pastorio

How is that possible that fats will become rancid even when frozen?

Would it not take years for the fats to become rancid?
Is this animal fat that becomes rancid or all fats?
If there is little air, how can that be?

wrote:
> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>>The one in ice will likely not freezer burn for years. That's not to say
>>that the fat in the meat will stay good. Fats will become rancid over
>>time, even when frozen. Beyond that, vacuum packaging with a FoodSaver
>>or other vacuum sealer will help meats last longer by removing the
>>airspace and pressing the package firmly against the flesh.
>>
>>Pastorio
>
>
> How is that possible that fats will become rancid even when frozen?

Freezing doesn't stop all molecular action. It slows it, but doesn't
eliminate it. Over time, fats change.

> Would it not take years for the fats to become rancid?

Yes and no. Depending on the kind of fat and how it's being stored.

> Is this animal fat that becomes rancid or all fats?

All fats in time.

> If there is little air, how can that be?

Rancidification doesn't depend on being exposed to air. Essentially,
it's decomposition of fats (it's actually more complicated than that,
but that's the net effect) caused by any of several external and several
internal triggers and processes. I just found this heavily linked site:
<http://www.factbites.com/topics/Rancidification>

Pastorio

On 22 Jan 2006 22:03:41 GMT, Linda > wrote:

><Sigh>
>
>I have checked my freezer temp. and have made sure there is enough
>circulation... yada yada.
>
>This is kind of a dumb question but..
>if you would freeze something in water
>that is already encircled/encase in a plastic wrap, aluminum foil
>or air tight container...
>would you get or tast freezer burn??
>
>Example..
>a chicken breast wrapped tightly & frozed vs.
>chicken breast wrapped and wrapped tightly, water poured over &
>frozed.
>
>I know the first wrapping if left too long in MY freezer would
>produce the freezer burn and freezer burn taste,
>
>Would the item encased in ice do the same?
>
>I hope you understand my question.
>
>Just curious.
>
>Thanks!
This is the ONLY way my dad would freeze fresh caught fish when I was
a kid.. to prevent freezer burn..
He'd take 1/2 gallon cardboard milk carton that had been washed out..
The top glued seams carefully pulled apart. Inserted fish that had
been cleaned and scaled, fill with water, top closed back and
stapled..then freeze..
Chuck (in SC)

Bob (this one) wrote:
> Rancidification doesn't depend on being exposed to air. Essentially,
> it's decomposition of fats (it's actually more complicated than that,
> but that's the net effect) caused by any of several external and several
> internal triggers and processes. I just found this heavily linked site:
> <http://www.factbites.com/topics/Rancidification>
>
> Pastorio

Wonderful URL there. Thanks!

So I gather the custom of leaving olive oil out is what?

The monosaturated oils in olive oil do not go bad that quickly?

Keeping it in the 'frig is a hassle since it solidifies at frig temps.

in southern Europe, not many problems with leaving olive oil out or
do they now keep it in the 'frig?

I used to keep olive oil in the 'frig for the Vitamine E content.
But since it's not a biggee in the health world, vastly over-rated,
not concerned about Vitamine E breaking down as much as before.

What do you think?

On Mon, 23 Jan 2006, Chuck wrote:

> On 22 Jan 2006 22:03:41 GMT, Linda > wrote:
>
> ><Sigh>
> >
> >I have checked my freezer temp. and have made sure there is enough
> >circulation... yada yada.
> >
> >This is kind of a dumb question but..
> >if you would freeze something in water
> >that is already encircled/encase in a plastic wrap, aluminum foil
> >or air tight container...
> >would you get or tast freezer burn??
> >
> >Example..
> >a chicken breast wrapped tightly & frozed vs.
> >chicken breast wrapped and wrapped tightly, water poured over &
> >frozed.
> >
> >I know the first wrapping if left too long in MY freezer would
> >produce the freezer burn and freezer burn taste,
> >
> >Would the item encased in ice do the same?
> >
> >I hope you understand my question.
> >
> >Just curious.
> >
> >Thanks!
> This is the ONLY way my dad would freeze fresh caught fish when I was
> a kid.. to prevent freezer burn..
> He'd take 1/2 gallon cardboard milk carton that had been washed out..
> The top glued seams carefully pulled apart. Inserted fish that had
> been cleaned and scaled, fill with water, top closed back and
> stapled..then freeze..
> Chuck (in SC)
>

I remember the the "old folks" doing that.

A number of years ago when Florida had citrus on the trees, a cold front
was moving across this area and a heavy frost and hard freeze was
expected. To save the citrus, the orchard folks sprayed the citrus with
water, encasing the fruit in a thick coating of ice. It "saved" the
citrus (it could only be used for juice because it broke down the pulp or
something, but it "saved" it).

This is one of those concepts that I have trouble with - like a two inch
water pipe will deliver *four* times as much water as a one inch water
pipe, and with the Interstate highway system, if you want to travel North,
go east, and if you want to travel South, go west, and if you are in
Alaska and you want to stay warm, build yourself a house out of ice.
Geez, these things are just not linearly logical.

And so it was with the citrus. Wasn't Mother Nature just going to do the
same thing the farmers were doing? Apparently not. They were saving the
citrus using the same means by which she was going to kill it. go figure.

Elaine, too

Elaine Parrish wrote:
>
> On Mon, 23 Jan 2006, Chuck wrote:
>
> > On 22 Jan 2006 22:03:41 GMT, Linda > wrote:
> >
> > ><Sigh>
> > >
> > >I have checked my freezer temp. and have made sure there is enough
> > >circulation... yada yada.
> > >
> > >This is kind of a dumb question but..
> > >if you would freeze something in water
> > >that is already encircled/encase in a plastic wrap, aluminum foil
> > >or air tight container...
> > >would you get or tast freezer burn??
> > >
> > >Example..
> > >a chicken breast wrapped tightly & frozed vs.
> > >chicken breast wrapped and wrapped tightly, water poured over &
> > >frozed.
> > >
> > >I know the first wrapping if left too long in MY freezer would
> > >produce the freezer burn and freezer burn taste,
> > >
> > >Would the item encased in ice do the same?
> > >
> > >I hope you understand my question.
> > >
> > >Just curious.
> > >
> > >Thanks!
> > This is the ONLY way my dad would freeze fresh caught fish when I was
> > a kid.. to prevent freezer burn..
> > He'd take 1/2 gallon cardboard milk carton that had been washed out..
> > The top glued seams carefully pulled apart. Inserted fish that had
> > been cleaned and scaled, fill with water, top closed back and
> > stapled..then freeze..
> > Chuck (in SC)
> >
>
> I remember the the "old folks" doing that.
>
> A number of years ago when Florida had citrus on the trees, a cold front
> was moving across this area and a heavy frost and hard freeze was
> expected. To save the citrus, the orchard folks sprayed the citrus with
> water, encasing the fruit in a thick coating of ice. It "saved" the
> citrus (it could only be used for juice because it broke down the pulp or
> something, but it "saved" it).
>
> This is one of those concepts that I have trouble with - like a two inch
> water pipe will deliver *four* times as much water as a one inch water
> pipe, and with the Interstate highway system, if you want to travel North,
> go east, and if you want to travel South, go west, and if you are in
> Alaska and you want to stay warm, build yourself a house out of ice.
> Geez, these things are just not linearly logical.
>
> And so it was with the citrus. Wasn't Mother Nature just going to do the
> same thing the farmers were doing? Apparently not. They were saving the
> citrus using the same means by which she was going to kill it. go figure.
>
> Elaine, too

We live in a fishing village that had a processing plant that
processed the daily catch. They would single freeze fish, then run it
through ice water several times, freezing in between each pass, until it
had enough of a glaze on it to keep it from freezer burn.... Sharon

Elaine Parrish wrote:
> This is one of those concepts that I have trouble with - like a two inch
> water pipe will deliver *four* times as much water as a one inch water
> pipe, and with the Interstate highway system, if you want to travel North,
> go east, and if you want to travel South, go west, and if you are in
> Alaska and you want to stay warm, build yourself a house out of ice.
> Geez, these things are just not linearly logical.

I remember making a water filter installation and seeing how doubling
the diameter of the piper quadrupled the area = throughput.

Okay, Area = pi x radius-squared. That means if the diameter is 2
inches, then the radius would be one inch or pi x 1 , the
cross-sectional area. Area = 1 x pi.

Now if the diameter is 4 inches, then the radius would be 2 inches.

Area = pi x radius-squared = pi x 2-squared = 4 x pi, so yes is it four
times the throughput with just a doubling of the width of the pipe.

I guess that does not help if you don't feel comfy with geometry.

It's the same with a placemat. A 1 foot on all its edges would be 1
square foot.
But if you made it two feet on all its edges, then the placemat would
be 4 square feet.
So that's quadrupled too, or should I say two

On 23 Jan 2006, wrote:

>
> Elaine Parrish wrote:
> > This is one of those concepts that I have trouble with - like a two inch
> > water pipe will deliver *four* times as much water as a one inch water
> > pipe, and with the Interstate highway system, if you want to travel North,
> > go east, and if you want to travel South, go west, and if you are in
> > Alaska and you want to stay warm, build yourself a house out of ice.
> > Geez, these things are just not linearly logical.
>
> I remember making a water filter installation and seeing how doubling
> the diameter of the piper quadrupled the area = throughput.
>
> Okay, Area = pi x radius-squared. That means if the diameter is 2
> inches, then the radius would be one inch or pi x 1 , the
> cross-sectional area. Area = 1 x pi.
>
> Now if the diameter is 4 inches, then the radius would be 2 inches.
>
> Area = pi x radius-squared = pi x 2-squared = 4 x pi, so yes is it four
> times the throughput with just a doubling of the width of the pipe.
>
> I guess that does not help if you don't feel comfy with geometry.
>
> It's the same with a placemat. A 1 foot on all its edges would be 1
> square foot.
> But if you made it two feet on all its edges, then the placemat would
> be 4 square feet.
> So that's quadrupled too, or should I say two
>

Tee hee hee. I'm not real comfy with geometry. I got some better at it
while I was playing pool. I improved my English, too! hehe

My dad taught me about about moving the water through pipe while we were
doing a plumbing job. He showed it to me on a piece of paper. He drew two
circles - one small, one larger - this was not to scale. The small circle
represented the 1" pipe and the larger represented the 2" pipe.

In the larger circle, draw a horizontal line through the center. It would
seem that there'd be 1 inch on top and 1" on bottom to = 2 inches. But it
is not. It is just like slicing an orange in half. There is still as much
orange on the surface as there was to begin with. From
the Horizontal line to the top is 2" (one inch high and 2" long 1X2=2" and
from the Horizontal line to the bottom is 2".

Draw a vertical line through the center intersecting like cross hairs.
Now there are four equal sections, each 1" (1" high and 1"long = 1 x 1 =
1"). So, it takes 4 1" pipes to move as much water as 1 2" pipe.

If it hadn't been for my dad, I never would have gotten through high
school or college algebra.<g> My dad used a slide rule. He'd take my math
problems and work them on the slide rule. Then He would explain the
problem to me and I would work it by hand (this was before calculators. We
always worked by hand) until I got the right answer. But instead of using
those big long formulas, I did some simple math and came out with the
correct answer. It used to drive my teachers nuts. <g>

Elaine, too

wrote:
> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>>Rancidification doesn't depend on being exposed to air. Essentially,
>>it's decomposition of fats (it's actually more complicated than that,
>>but that's the net effect) caused by any of several external and several
>>internal triggers and processes. I just found this heavily linked site:
>><http://www.factbites.com/topics/Rancidification>
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> Wonderful URL there. Thanks!
>
> So I gather the custom of leaving olive oil out is what?

A custom.

> The monosaturated oils in olive oil do not go bad that quickly?

Sure they do. But the habitual users consume it before that happens to
the point where it becomes objectionable. Infrequent users should only
buy small quantities.

> Keeping it in the 'frig is a hassle since it solidifies at frig temps.
>
> in southern Europe, not many problems with leaving olive oil out or
> do they now keep it in the 'frig?

No. They use it quickly.

> I used to keep olive oil in the 'frig for the Vitamine E content.
> But since it's not a biggee in the health world, vastly over-rated,
> not concerned about Vitamine E breaking down as much as before.
>
> What do you think?

My oils sit out at room temp.

Pastorio

In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote:

> wrote:
> > Bob (this one) wrote:
> >
> >>Rancidification doesn't depend on being exposed to air. Essentially,
> >>it's decomposition of fats (it's actually more complicated than that,
> >>but that's the net effect) caused by any of several external and several
> >>internal triggers and processes. I just found this heavily linked site:
> >><http://www.factbites.com/topics/Rancidification>
> >>
> >>Pastorio
> >
> > Wonderful URL there. Thanks!
> >
> > So I gather the custom of leaving olive oil out is what?
>
> A custom.
>
> > The monosaturated oils in olive oil do not go bad that quickly?
>
> Sure they do. But the habitual users consume it before that happens to
> the point where it becomes objectionable. Infrequent users should only
> buy small quantities.
>
> > Keeping it in the 'frig is a hassle since it solidifies at frig temps.
> >
> > in southern Europe, not many problems with leaving olive oil out or
> > do they now keep it in the 'frig?
>
> No. They use it quickly.
>
> > I used to keep olive oil in the 'frig for the Vitamine E content.
> > But since it's not a biggee in the health world, vastly over-rated,
> > not concerned about Vitamine E breaking down as much as before.
> >
> > What do you think?
>
> My oils sit out at room temp.
>
> Pastorio

So does mine.
Both the Olive oil and the Grape seed oil as I use both of them
frequently.

The little bottle of sesame oil is in the 'frige as it lasts quite a
long time. ;-)

I use it drop-wise.....
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

Elaine Parrish wrote:
> Tee hee hee. I'm not real comfy with geometry. I got some better at it
> while I was playing pool. I improved my English, too! hehe
>
> My dad taught me about about moving the water through pipe while we were
> doing a plumbing job. He showed it to me on a piece of paper. He drew two
> circles - one small, one larger - this was not to scale. The small circle
> represented the 1" pipe and the larger represented the 2" pipe.
>
> In the larger circle, draw a horizontal line through the center. It would
> seem that there'd be 1 inch on top and 1" on bottom to = 2 inches. But it
> is not. It is just like slicing an orange in half. There is still as much
> orange on the surface as there was to begin with. From
> the Horizontal line to the top is 2" (one inch high and 2" long 1X2=2" and
> from the Horizontal line to the bottom is 2".
>
> Draw a vertical line through the center intersecting like cross hairs.
> Now there are four equal sections, each 1" (1" high and 1"long = 1 x 1 =
> 1"). So, it takes 4 1" pipes to move as much water as 1 2" pipe.
>
> If it hadn't been for my dad, I never would have gotten through high
> school or college algebra.<g> My dad used a slide rule. He'd take my math
> problems and work them on the slide rule. Then He would explain the
> problem to me and I would work it by hand (this was before calculators. We
> always worked by hand) until I got the right answer. But instead of using
> those big long formulas, I did some simple math and came out with the
> correct answer. It used to drive my teachers nuts. <g>
>
> Elaine, too

That's a good explanation. I can see even though it's well done by you
I still had to stop for a moment to see what you were getting at. Not
as simple reading as a good anecdote. So when I tried a formula, that
probably is slowing things down. But okay, you fit 4 x 1" in a
cross-section of a 2" pipe. That has a good feel to the explanation.

Slide rule? I am trying to recall the last time I even saw one. I used
to have a real one, K&E? They were kind of neat. I could do simple
stuff on it.

About driving your teachers nuts. I recall in high school, I used to
stare out the window. But every time I got called on in trigonometry
class, I came up with the answer. I don't even know how I could do that
since sine, cosine and tangents were tedious. But if you can simplify
problems, that's good - a lot of difficult problems are really simple,
like e = mc(squared) tee hee. Reminds me of that physicist who had
humorous yet serious books, 'Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!'
(Adventures of a Curious Character): Richard P. Feynman. He always was
simplifying problems so he could get the answers in his head.

"Bob (this one)" wrote:
>
> wrote:
> > Bob (this one) wrote:
> >
> >>Rancidification doesn't depend on being exposed to air. Essentially,
> >>it's decomposition of fats (it's actually more complicated than that,
> >>but that's the net effect) caused by any of several external and several
> >>internal triggers and processes. I just found this heavily linked site:
> >><http://www.factbites.com/topics/Rancidification>
> >>
> >>Pastorio
> >
> > Wonderful URL there. Thanks!
> >
> > So I gather the custom of leaving olive oil out is what?
>
> A custom.
>
> > The monosaturated oils in olive oil do not go bad that quickly?
>
> Sure they do. But the habitual users consume it before that happens to
> the point where it becomes objectionable. Infrequent users should only
> buy small quantities.
>
> > Keeping it in the 'frig is a hassle since it solidifies at frig temps.
> >
> > in southern Europe, not many problems with leaving olive oil out or
> > do they now keep it in the 'frig?
>
> No. They use it quickly.
>
> > I used to keep olive oil in the 'frig for the Vitamine E content.
> > But since it's not a biggee in the health world, vastly over-rated,
> > not concerned about Vitamine E breaking down as much as before.
> >
> > What do you think?
>
> My oils sit out at room temp.
>
> Pastorio

Would you refridgerate if there were cloves of garlic in it? ...Sharon

biig wrote:
>
> "Bob (this one)" wrote:

>>My oils sit out at room temp.
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> Would you refridgerate if there were cloves of garlic in it? ...Sharon

I wouldn't have cloves of garlic in my oils beyond a very short time to
extract flavor from them. That possibility of botulism is remote, but it
only needs to happen once for your life to change terribly.

Here's what I do: smash a couple dozen cloves of garlic and put them
into a saucepan. Seriously smash them or run them through a garlic
press. You want them to be almost a paste. Pour about 3 cups of olive
oil into the pot, and it doesn't need to be great quality, because
you're about to change the whole flavor profile. Turn the heat on low
and pop in a candy/deepfry thermometer. Gradually, slowly warm the oil
to 250°F or 120°C and hold it there for 15 minutes. You don't want to be
frying the garlic and having it spit and sputter all over the place.
Doing it slowly lets the moisture out of the garlic gently.

Turn the heat off and let the oil come back down to room temp. Strain
the solids out and bottle the oil. Room temp storage for about 3 months.
Heating it will accelerate the rancidification, so if you plan to hold
it for longer than that, put it into a wide-mouth canning jar and put it
in the fridge. It will solidify, but with the wide mouth, you can spoon
out however much you want to use rather than waiting for it to reliquefy
by taking it out of the fridge and letting it warm up again.

Pastorio

On 24 Jan 2006, wrote:

> That's a good explanation. I can see even though it's well done by you
> I still had to stop for a moment to see what you were getting at. Not
> as simple reading as a good anecdote. So when I tried a formula, that
> probably is slowing things down. But okay, you fit 4 x 1" in a
> cross-section of a 2" pipe. That has a good feel to the explanation.

tee hee hee. I guess it is a good thing that I am not a Math teacher!
Since you already knew "the answer", I knew that you would be able to look
at (or envision) the circle and see the 4 sections so I wasn't as detailed
as I should have been.

I have to think "outside the box" when it comes to math. You see, it seems
logical to me that if you have a 1" pipe and you want twice as much water,
then you just go to a 2" pipe (like if you have 1 apple and you want 2
apples, you just get another apple because 1 + 1 = 2). So, if you have a
2" pipe and you cut it in half - lenghtwise - then you have 2 1" pipes.
Of course that is wrong - but that is beside the point (hahaha). That
"seems" logical and fits with other math principles (like the apple). So,
I, and people like I am, have to be able to forget or unlearn what we are
sure we know in order to allow another (contradicting) idea to take its
place. That's easier said than done. I always do better if I can "see" it.

When my dad drew the circle and drew the horizontal line through it, my
brain said, "ok, you divided 2" in half, so now we have 2 sections of one
inch each. done."

Wrong.

When I said, "why?" (which I say a lot!), he
pointed out that yes, from the center line to the top of the circle was,
indeed one inch (we had cut it in half), but the horizontal line was still
2 inches long (because we had not cut it in half), making
the area 1" high times 2" long for 2" of space. Then he drew the line down
the center and we had four equal pieces and each was 1" high and 1" wide.
Geez, go figure.

And how many one inch pipes does it take to move as much water as one 4"
pipe? (Dad never could quit while I was ahead! ha).

Why, 16, of course. geez. Draw a bigger circle (you'll need it to see all
the lines. sheesh) Then cut the circle in 4 equal pieces horizontally and
in 4 equal pieces vertically. (Kinda like cutting brownies! OB food <g>).

Then the time came when I had to figure out how many city blocks
were in a square mile. (256, BTW). Who knew that math class was easier
than life would be? sheesh!

I admire (and, ok, I'll say it, envy) people like you who are
"math-brained". The whole world works on math. I have been able to learn a
lot, but every step is a struggle. I don't have any propensity for it.

OB food: (kinda <g>) That's why I'm not a good baker. Cooking is an art.
Baking is a math-based science.

It all has to do with that Right Brain/Left Brain thing. I just struggle
not to be "No Brained".



>
> Slide rule? I am trying to recall the last time I even saw one. I used
> to have a real one, K&E? They were kind of neat. I could do simple
> stuff on it.

I never did learn to use the slide rules. I wish I had. They were very
common before calculators. My dad started using one in the 1950s. He had
the bar ones but he loved the circles. He had one the size of a dinner
plate and one the size of a cup's saucer. He was an industrial bearing and
power transmission specialist and he could figure drives, gear ratios,
lift, thrust, and torque, etc. like it was child's play. I have to have a
calculator to figure the tip for lunch! haha.

When I look back on the days before calculators - much less computers -
and see all the math that was done by hand, I'm amazed.
I remember working those formulas that took a half page of notebook paper
just to write down before we started any calculations. sheesh.



>
> About driving your teachers nuts. I recall in high school, I used to
> stare out the window. But every time I got called on in trigonometry
> class, I came up with the answer. I don't even know how I could do that
> since sine, cosine and tangents were tedious.

But see, you just had a propensity for that. Something in the brain just
connects with some things and they come easy. I was like that in English.
My Composition 1 teacher would ask a question. I would answer correctly
and then she would say, "Why is that correct?"

"I don't know." (Geez, Lady, isn't being right enough???? Do I have to
know "why", too????) This is where math beats English six ways to Sunday.
2 + 2 = 4 and you don't have to know "why".

One day, after weeks of this, that poor lady got so frustrated that she
balled her hands into little fists and stomped her foot on the floor as
she hissed at me, "You can't possible get these answers right every time
and not know why they are right!"

Geez, I had an A+ in her class and I was a criminal.

Come to find out, there are pages and pages of "rules" that teach you
English grammar. sheesh, go figure. I didn't know. The only rule I had
ever heard about identifying the parts of speech was, "if it ends in -ly,
it's probably an adverb". I didn't know that there were dozens and dozens
of such rules. But, I did learn a lot. Now I know "why" - for all the
good that does me! <g>


I never took trig. I was required to take algebra. After that, I ran as
hard I could from all things math.

I use math every day, but I have never needed algebra "out in the real
world".

Schools really do need to get their acts together and give kids things
that they actually can use in life.

The one thing about Academe, is that they want to take 50 steps getting
somewhere when 10 will do.


>But if you can simplify
> problems, that's good - a lot of difficult problems are really simple,
> like e = mc(squared) tee hee. Reminds me of that physicist who had
> humorous yet serious books, 'Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!'
> (Adventures of a Curious Character): Richard P. Feynman. He always was
> simplifying problems so he could get the answers in his head.
>
>


I'm not familiar wth Mr. Feynman, but he sounds like my kind of guy.

I've always simplified whenever I could. It is just easier for me.

When I took Economics, we were back to those half-page formulas. sheesh.
I was headed into a test in a couple of days and I knew that I could never
finish using those long, complicated formulas. I was stressed.

While I was doing homework and studying for the test, I
noticed that, interestingly, when you got your answer to the long formula,
there was a formula (something akin to A + B = C [a little more
elaborate]) to use to check your answer.

So I deduced that if I could plug my answer into A + B = C to determine if
it was right, I could use the same formula - with a tad of adjustment - to
get the answer in the first place. Since, A + B = C, then C - A = B and so
forth. I took the answer checker formula, turned it around and solved for
the answer to the problem. It saved me on that test - and all the others.

Elaine, too

In article . com>,
" > wrote:

> Slide rule? I am trying to recall the last time I even saw one. I used
> to have a real one, K&E? They were kind of neat. I could do simple
> stuff on it.

I think Rob had his bronzed.
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-15-2006, RIP Connie Drew

Melba's Jammin' wrote:
> In article . com>,
> " > wrote:
>
>
>>Slide rule? I am trying to recall the last time I even saw one. I used
>>to have a real one, K&E? They were kind of neat. I could do simple
>>stuff on it.
>
>
> I think Rob had his bronzed.


Neil's is at the bottom of a desk drawer, buried under his diploma.

gloria p

Melba's Jammin' wrote:
> In article . com>,
> " > wrote:
>
> > Slide rule? I am trying to recall the last time I even saw one. I used
> > to have a real one, K&E? They were kind of neat. I could do simple
> > stuff on it.
>
> I think Rob had his bronzed.
> --
> http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-15-2006, RIP Connie Drew

did it hurt? they don't work so well when they're bronzed, i think