"Mr-Natural-Health" wrote.

> No!
>
> But, I know quite a few food processors who try to convince consumers
> that their food science garbage is actually healthier for them. Do not
> believe their nonsense.
> --
> john gohde
> http://naturalhealthperspective.com/blog/
>

I hate to say that John is correct but he is.

Bran is not the main component removed from wheat
to make white flour but wheat germ is. The reason for
the removal is that the germ contains oils which can
go rancid in flour. If you use whole wheat flours
you should use them while still fresh. Refrigeration
may help a bit. Bran can get stale too. Buy in small
amounts keep tightly closed and replace if the odor
changes. Same goes for wheat germ. And I doubt very
much the proportion mention of a cup to a cup is anywhere
near the bran in whole wheat flours.

Food faddists need to learn more about the topic.

later
bliss -- C O C O A Powered... (at california dot com)

--
bobbie sellers - a retired nurse in San Francisco

It is by the beans of cocoa that the thoughts acquire speed,
the thighs acquire girth, the girth become a warning.
It is by theobromine alone I set my mind in motion."
--from Someone else's Dune spoof ripped to my taste.

i wonder.

suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
flour. is it same as wholewheat?

or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

No!

But, I know quite a few food processors who try to convince consumers
that their food science garbage is actually healthier for them. Do not
believe their nonsense.
--
john gohde
http://naturalhealthperspective.com/blog/

No!

But, I know quite a few food processors who try to convince consumers
that their food science garbage is actually healthier for them. Do not
believe their nonsense.
--
john gohde
http://naturalhealthperspective.com/blog/

The white flour will still be NOT whole grain. The bran will still be
whole grain.

On 12 Jan 2005 16:26:42 -0800, "salgud"
> wrote:

>The bran will still be
>whole grain.

Well, no... It will still be bran.

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

On 12 Jan 2005 16:26:42 -0800, "salgud"
> wrote:

>The bran will still be
>whole grain.

Well, no... It will still be bran.

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

"big macbeth" > wrote in
oups.com:

> i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

There's a mechanical difference which interacts with digestive physiology:
the whole wheat takes longer to digest. That means that the starch
component, which gets digested into glucose, is released more slowly, which
means that the glucose is absorbed into the bloodstream at a lower rate for
a longer period. This can be important if you have glucose-regulation
problems, since the regulatory system does a better job of coping with a
slow, steady influx of glucose than with a big load of it coming into the
bloodstream all at once.

"big macbeth" > wrote in
oups.com:

> i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

There's a mechanical difference which interacts with digestive physiology:
the whole wheat takes longer to digest. That means that the starch
component, which gets digested into glucose, is released more slowly, which
means that the glucose is absorbed into the bloodstream at a lower rate for
a longer period. This can be important if you have glucose-regulation
problems, since the regulatory system does a better job of coping with a
slow, steady influx of glucose than with a big load of it coming into the
bloodstream all at once.

big macbeth wrote:
> i wonder.

> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?

> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

This is part of paper I wrote. Hopefully this will explain it.

Bread. "The staff of life." A staple that's been around since
the beginning of civilization suddenly has a reputation worse than Mike
Tyson's. How in the world could this be? How can a food that has
been sustaining mankind for thousands of years now suddenly be bad?
Well, what happened is what the food companies have done to bread.
Decades ago, all bread used to be made of pure "whole wheat/grain"
flour. Now, although things have gotten better in the last decade or
so, most bread and baked goods are still made out of "enriched"
wheat flour. Want to know why the food companies "enrich" it?
It's because they stole all the goodness from the natural
wheat/grain. Here's what they do. There are three parts to a piece
of grain. The food companies, when making wheat/white flour, remove
the two nutritious parts, the bran and germ, and leave you with the
un-nutritious part the endosperm. In removing the bran and germ parts
of the grain, they also remove significant amounts of twenty-two
different natural vitamins, minerals and all of the fiber. The food
companies feel really bad about this, so they "enrich" the
remaining endosperm with four to six, cheapy synthetic vitamins in an
attempt to compensate you after they ripped you off. Aren't these
guys nice?

Patrick

big macbeth wrote:
> i wonder.

> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?

> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

This is part of paper I wrote. Hopefully this will explain it.

Bread. "The staff of life." A staple that's been around since
the beginning of civilization suddenly has a reputation worse than Mike
Tyson's. How in the world could this be? How can a food that has
been sustaining mankind for thousands of years now suddenly be bad?
Well, what happened is what the food companies have done to bread.
Decades ago, all bread used to be made of pure "whole wheat/grain"
flour. Now, although things have gotten better in the last decade or
so, most bread and baked goods are still made out of "enriched"
wheat flour. Want to know why the food companies "enrich" it?
It's because they stole all the goodness from the natural
wheat/grain. Here's what they do. There are three parts to a piece
of grain. The food companies, when making wheat/white flour, remove
the two nutritious parts, the bran and germ, and leave you with the
un-nutritious part the endosperm. In removing the bran and germ parts
of the grain, they also remove significant amounts of twenty-two
different natural vitamins, minerals and all of the fiber. The food
companies feel really bad about this, so they "enrich" the
remaining endosperm with four to six, cheapy synthetic vitamins in an
attempt to compensate you after they ripped you off. Aren't these
guys nice?

Patrick

wrote.

> so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
> grain flour?
>
Most likely not but why not simply use white wholegrain flour to start
with? It does exist you know and it gets rancid if not promptly used. You
don't give a clue as to how the flour will be used. Let me say that you
should be careful about the amount of bran sued per day, so don't od.

later
bliss -- C O C O A Powered... (at california dot com)

--
bobbie sellers - a retired nurse in San Francisco

It is by the beans of cocoa that the thoughts acquire speed,
the thighs acquire girth, the girth become a warning.
It is by theobromine alone I set my mind in motion."
--from Someone else's Dune spoof ripped to my taste.

wrote.

> so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
> grain flour?
>
Most likely not but why not simply use white wholegrain flour to start
with? It does exist you know and it gets rancid if not promptly used. You
don't give a clue as to how the flour will be used. Let me say that you
should be careful about the amount of bran sued per day, so don't od.

later
bliss -- C O C O A Powered... (at california dot com)

--
bobbie sellers - a retired nurse in San Francisco

It is by the beans of cocoa that the thoughts acquire speed,
the thighs acquire girth, the girth become a warning.
It is by theobromine alone I set my mind in motion."
--from Someone else's Dune spoof ripped to my taste.

wrote.

> so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
> grain flour?
>
Most likely not but why not simply use white wholegrain flour to start
with? It does exist you know and it gets rancid if not promptly used. You
don't give a clue as to how the flour will be used. Let me say that you
should be careful about the amount of bran sued per day, so don't od.

later
bliss -- C O C O A Powered... (at california dot com)

--
bobbie sellers - a retired nurse in San Francisco

It is by the beans of cocoa that the thoughts acquire speed,
the thighs acquire girth, the girth become a warning.
It is by theobromine alone I set my mind in motion."
--from Someone else's Dune spoof ripped to my taste.

I wonder if you are a "half-wit" is it the same as being a dim wit? Sounds
like it. If you take a cup of shit and mix it with sugar, is it the same as
sugar or does it still have some shit in it?

"big macbeth" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.
>

I wonder if you are a "half-wit" is it the same as being a dim wit? Sounds
like it. If you take a cup of shit and mix it with sugar, is it the same as
sugar or does it still have some shit in it?

"big macbeth" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.
>

so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
grain flour?

so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
grain flour?

"big macbeth" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.
>

Is the white flour you are planning to bleached?
Does your white flour have added iron?

As others have already pointed out, you'll need to
added germ also.

If you add "too much" bran and you try to sell
your bread here in the states the US FDA may
come after you in a hostile way. In the 70's
Oroweat was selling a bread with added
wheat bran, the US FDA told them to
stop. Granted some of the new low
carb breads have added fiber, so the
pinheads over at the FDA may have
changed the regs. And some years ago,
there was a white bread with added celluose
to provide a lower calorie product.

If you are make it locally or for yourself
don't sweat it. Added bran will likely not
cause any problem. Indeed, it help
keep the bowels moving. Hopefully all
your flour, bran, and germ will be freshly
ground. And hopefully you aren't the
1 to about 150 that has some level
gluten intolerance ailment known a
celiac disease. In that case, a wise person
avoids all gluten like the plague. Know
also it is hard to diagnosis this problem
in a timely fashion.

May I suggest brown rice or perhaps millet:-)

In article .com>,
> wrote:
>so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
>grain flour?

Not really. It will be more or less the same as commercial or
supermarket "whole wheat" flour, which is white flour with bran added
back. It won't be the same as real whole grain flour, which is whole
grain ground to flour without anything removed or added.

If you want the real thing, go to a bulk food store and buy
"stone-ground" whole wheat flour. While flour is seldom actually
ground between stones any more, "stone-ground" means that it's ground
by a technology that doesn't let it get as hot as does flour in large
scale commercial milling. This retains more nutrients and flavor than
the commercial flour, and it hasn't been bleached or had aging agents
added. It also hasn't had nutrients added, as commercial white flour
often does.

If you taste supermarket whole wheat flour and stone ground whole wheat
flour, you'll find they taste quite different. Stone ground flour
makes a somewhat heavier but much more flavorful bread. Remember that
hard wheat flour is for yeast-raised breads, and soft wheat flour is
for other baking. Durum flour is for pasta and noodles, or a small
amount will add extra gluten to a bread recipe.

Try stone ground soft whole wheat flour for a chocolate cake sometime.
The whole wheat gives it a very rich flavour. You can get a delicious
cake with much less fat and sugar.

As for other whole grains, refer to this list:

Whole Refined
Pot barley Pearl barley
Large flake oats Minute, quick or instant oats
Brown rice White rice
Cracked wheat, bulgur Semolina, cream of wheat
Dark rye flour Light rye flour

Most millet and buckwheat is unrefined. Almost all cornmeal is
refined. You can sometimes find whole corn meal, but the seed hulls
will really give your guts a good scrubbing on the way through.

While whole grains are an excellent source of dietary fibre, often
lacking in modern diets, it's worth switching to them just for the
flavour alone, aside from the health benefits. You'll find that
refined grains seem rather bland, mushy and dead-tasting once you're
used to the real thing. Whole grains are interesting, flavourful foods
in their own right, not just starchy fillers in a meal.

There are hundreds of cookbooks about using whole grains, beans,
lentils, etc, for both ethnic cuisines and variations on more familiar
dishes. You can eat more healthily, more interestingly and much more
cheaply than most North Americans do by using these foods. Have a look
in your local public library.

big macbeth wrote:
> i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

Re-constituted "whole grains" are not even close to being the same as
the real thing.

TC

big macbeth wrote:
> i wonder.
>
> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

Re-constituted "whole grains" are not even close to being the same as
the real thing.

TC

ROFLMAO!

ROFLMAO!

what is a 'bulk food store"? is it a health store? how do i look it
up?

wrote:
> In article .com>,
> > wrote:
>> so if you add bran AND wheat germ to white flour, is it same as whole
>> grain flour?
>
> Not really. It will be more or less the same as commercial or
> supermarket "whole wheat" flour, which is white flour with bran added
> back. It won't be the same as real whole grain flour, which is whole
> grain ground to flour without anything removed or added.
>

That would depend on your supermarket or grocery store. Mine carries King
Arthur flour, which is:

a.. Milled from hard red spring wheat from the Northern Great Plains.
a.. Traditional stone ground whole wheat flavor.
a.. Very finely ground.
a.. Includes 100% of the bran and germ of the wheat berry.
a.. Cool stone grinding preserves nutrients.

So at least according to its label and website, this flour will meet your
needs, even if you buy it in your supermarket.


A lot of the so-called experts will tell you in their books about all the
things that you cannot find in a conventional supermarket. Perhaps it's
true where they live, but I found that items such as whole grain spaghetti
are readily available on my supermarket shelf. There are more whole grain
breads than I can count, but still some are better than others, and some
have more sugar than others. There's still far more junk on the shelves than
anything else, but if you ask your supermarket manager for an item, it may
make it onto store shelves. That's especially true if your friends and
neighbors do the same thing.

Eric Bohlman wrote:
> "big macbeth" > wrote in
> oups.com:
>
>> i wonder.
>>
>> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
>> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>>
>> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
>> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.
>
> There's a mechanical difference which interacts with digestive
> physiology: the whole wheat takes longer to digest. That means that
> the starch component, which gets digested into glucose, is released
> more slowly, which means that the glucose is absorbed into the
> bloodstream at a lower rate for a longer period. This can be
> important if you have glucose-regulation problems, since the
> regulatory system does a better job of coping with a slow, steady
> influx of glucose than with a big load of it coming into the
> bloodstream all at once.

Even if you don't have glucose regulation problems, the body will react to
the pure white flour's quick digestion with a sudden large release of
insulin. When the glucose has been absorbed and the insulin level is still
high, you can "crash" and get strong cravings for more sugar. It's best to
avoid those swings in blood sugar whether you have a "problem" or not. If
you don't have a problem in the medical sense, you might still have a
problem with respect to the way you feel, and how it affects your body in
general.

Eric Bohlman wrote:
> "big macbeth" > wrote in
> oups.com:
>
>> i wonder.
>>
>> suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
>> flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>>
>> or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
>> you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.
>
> There's a mechanical difference which interacts with digestive
> physiology: the whole wheat takes longer to digest. That means that
> the starch component, which gets digested into glucose, is released
> more slowly, which means that the glucose is absorbed into the
> bloodstream at a lower rate for a longer period. This can be
> important if you have glucose-regulation problems, since the
> regulatory system does a better job of coping with a slow, steady
> influx of glucose than with a big load of it coming into the
> bloodstream all at once.

Even if you don't have glucose regulation problems, the body will react to
the pure white flour's quick digestion with a sudden large release of
insulin. When the glucose has been absorbed and the insulin level is still
high, you can "crash" and get strong cravings for more sugar. It's best to
avoid those swings in blood sugar whether you have a "problem" or not. If
you don't have a problem in the medical sense, you might still have a
problem with respect to the way you feel, and how it affects your body in
general.

wrote:
In removing the bran and germ parts
> of the grain, they also remove significant amounts of twenty-two
> different natural vitamins, minerals and all of the fiber. The food
> companies feel really bad about this, so they "enrich" the
> remaining endosperm with four to six, cheapy synthetic vitamins in an
> attempt to compensate you after they ripped you off. Aren't these
> guys nice?

In the US, they also put it prominently on the label along with a picture of
the food pyramid. They make you think that the vitamins in it can be
measured by what's on the labels, and there's no difference between how the
body absorbs the naturally occuring vitamins and the synthetic ones of the
same quantity. Could they possibly be wrong, given the state of health and
weight of the average American?

In > John Que wrote:

<snip>

> If you are make it locally or for yourself
> don't sweat it. Added bran will likely not
> cause any problem. Indeed, it help
> keep the bowels moving. Hopefully all
> your flour, bran, and germ will be freshly
> ground. And hopefully you aren't the
> 1 to about 150 that has some level
> gluten intolerance ailment known a
> celiac disease. In that case, a wise person
> avoids all gluten like the plague. Know
> also it is hard to diagnosis this problem
> in a timely fashion.
>
> May I suggest brown rice or perhaps millet:-)

You know, I've just started eating white rice (used to totally avoid the
stuff) and actually like it. Is brown rice different and how, well,
other than the obvious colour.


--
Cheers

Dennis

Remove 'Elle-Kabong' to reply

On 12 Jan 2005 15:46:58 -0800, "big macbeth"
> scribbled some thoughts:


>i wonder.
>
>suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
>flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
>or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
>you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

True whole wheat would be the ground wheat kernel sans
bleaching and used whole with nothing removed.

--

Sincerely, | NOTE: Best viewed in a fixed pitch font
| (©) (©)
Andrew H. Carter | ------ooo--(_)--ooo------
d(-_-)b | /// \\\

On 12 Jan 2005 15:46:58 -0800, "big macbeth"
> scribbled some thoughts:


>i wonder.
>
>suppose you take one cup of bran and mix it with one cup of white
>flour. is it same as wholewheat?
>
>or does flour chemically change when it's defiberized so that even if
>you mix it later with bran flakes, it's still bad for you.

True whole wheat would be the ground wheat kernel sans
bleaching and used whole with nothing removed.

--

Sincerely, | NOTE: Best viewed in a fixed pitch font
| (©) (©)
Andrew H. Carter | ------ooo--(_)--ooo------
d(-_-)b | /// \\\

> You know, I've just started eating white rice (used to totally avoid the
> stuff) and actually like it. Is brown rice different and how, well,
> other than the obvious colour.
> --
> Cheers
>
> Dennis

White rice is mainly starch. Brown rice has much more fiber and
more B vitamins. I much prefer the taste of brown rice or rather
the various types of brown. My favorite is either brown Texmati which
a type of Basmati.

Good health food store is a also a bulk food store with
flours, legumes, grains, raw nuts, dried fruits, bulk herbs,
and spices. In bigger communities, they can have organic
produce, organic dairy and organic eggs.
A good health food store is more than a supplement store.

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> what is a 'bulk food store"? is it a health store? how do i look it
> up?
>

"Hagrinas Mivali" > wrote in
:

> Even if you don't have glucose regulation problems, the body will
> react to the pure white flour's quick digestion with a sudden large
> release of insulin. When the glucose has been absorbed and the
> insulin level is still high, you can "crash" and get strong cravings
> for more sugar. It's best to avoid those swings in blood sugar whether
> you have a "problem" or not. If you don't have a problem in the
> medical sense, you might still have a problem with respect to the way
> you feel, and how it affects your body in general.

Actually, if you do experience such a swing you almost certainly *do* have
glucose-regulation problems, although they may be at a subclinical level.
alt.support.diabetes is replete with stories of diabetics who measured
their non-diabetic spouses' blood glucose both before and after a carb-
heavy meal and got readings of 85 mg/dl (4.7 mmol/L) both times. There are
potential issues (the area is still quite debated) involving the effects of
the temporarily increased insulin levels themselves in people with normal
glucose regulation, though.

"Hagrinas Mivali" > wrote in
:

> Even if you don't have glucose regulation problems, the body will
> react to the pure white flour's quick digestion with a sudden large
> release of insulin. When the glucose has been absorbed and the
> insulin level is still high, you can "crash" and get strong cravings
> for more sugar. It's best to avoid those swings in blood sugar whether
> you have a "problem" or not. If you don't have a problem in the
> medical sense, you might still have a problem with respect to the way
> you feel, and how it affects your body in general.

Actually, if you do experience such a swing you almost certainly *do* have
glucose-regulation problems, although they may be at a subclinical level.
alt.support.diabetes is replete with stories of diabetics who measured
their non-diabetic spouses' blood glucose both before and after a carb-
heavy meal and got readings of 85 mg/dl (4.7 mmol/L) both times. There are
potential issues (the area is still quite debated) involving the effects of
the temporarily increased insulin levels themselves in people with normal
glucose regulation, though.