I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?

prettymoira wrote:
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?

Yes - don't.

-S-

On 2011-09-23, prettymoira > wrote:
>
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?

You might consider reviewing culinary schools and discussing the pros
and cons of attending one. That's an alternate career field, now.

nb

On Sep 23, 10:33*am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> wrote:
> I wannabeachefand put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love tobakeand cook good food so I'm planning to go back to schooland takeculinaryarts.Any ideasanyone?
>
> --prettymoira

Why not start with an apprenticeship. It won't cost you money. Try
out good hotels etc. where you get a variety of experience; banquets,
coffee shop, fine dining restaurants, etc. Try and find a place that
does mostly from scratch cooking. i.e. Howard Johnson's I don't know
about, although a feather in their cap is that Jaques Pepin used to
work there.

On 9/23/2011 8:33 AM, prettymoira wrote:
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>
>


There are many good culinary schools all over the country. Go to the
library and look at the July issue of "Food and Wine" magazine. They
feature some upcoming chefs and list their education and experience.
That should give you some idea where to begin your research.

gloria p

On 9/23/2011 9:12 AM, Steve Freides wrote:
> prettymoira wrote:
>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>
> Yes - don't.
>
> -S-



That's a valid reply, but you need to tell her some of the reasons WHY.

gloria p

On 2011-09-23, gloria.p > wrote:

> That's a valid reply, but you need to tell her some of the reasons WHY.

Cuz there are currently about a jillion of them and most cost an arm
and a leg cuz they've been bought up by the rip-off private education
industry and even when you graduate you'll start a real job at illegal
immigrant pay till you get some real world experience. In the
meantime, the interest on that monster loan is still growing. Better
to seek out a community college with a culinary program or start at
the bottom and work up, learning in the trenches.

nb

On Sep 23, 7:33*am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> wrote:
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>

Most culinary schools are for-profit and charge steep tuitions. While
most restaurant jobs for newbies pay poorly, leaving you under a
crushing debt burden for years.

Tax-supported schools are more affordable. Check out the community
colleges in your area. Big cities' school systems often operate a
vocational/trade school. In Chicago, the Washburne Trade School turned
out hundreds of cooks and bakers before the program became part of the
City College system.

The cheapest way is just to start working for a restaurant, and learn
as you go.

On 2011-09-23, Mark Thorson > wrote:

> Don't listen to these people! You posted from foodbanter
> so right away we know you have the discerning judgement
> to choose a good culinary school and do well! The California
> Culinary Academy in San Francisco would be just right for you.

You know yer going to Hell, don't you?

nb

"gloria.p" > wrote in message
...
> On 9/23/2011 9:12 AM, Steve Freides wrote:
>> prettymoira wrote:
>>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
>>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
>>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>>
>> Yes - don't.
>>
>> -S-
>
> That's a valid reply, but you need to tell her some of the reasons WHY.
>
> gloria p

I'll give some good reasons. Most people's ideas of being a "chef" have to
do with what they see on television and very little to do with real life.
Loving to cook and cooking to LIVE are two totally different things. You
don't walk out of a cooking school and open a restaurant that will
immediately take off. Most restaurants fail in the first year or two, even
if they have very good food. It's an overwhelming business and takes 24/7
devotion. Don't plan on having a life outside the restaurant.

As if that weren't enough, think about the financial outlay (school aside)
for renting a building or space that is adequate and up to code for housing
a restaurant. Think about equipping a professional kitchen, not to mention
decking out the dining room. (Want to take over a failed restaurant space?
Think about why it failed.) There are licenses, hiring and vetting the
staff, paying wages and insurance and worker's compensation... I could go on
and on but there are MANY reasons

Jill

notbob wrote:
>
> Cuz there are currently about a jillion of them and most cost an arm
> and a leg cuz they've been bought up by the rip-off private education
> industry and even when you graduate you'll start a real job at illegal
> immigrant pay till you get some real world experience. In the
> meantime, the interest on that monster loan is still growing. Better
> to seek out a community college with a culinary program or start at
> the bottom and work up, learning in the trenches.

Don't listen to these people! You posted from foodbanter
so right away we know you have the discerning judgement
to choose a good culinary school and do well! The California
Culinary Academy in San Francisco would be just right for you.

On Sep 23, 12:43*pm, Mark Thorson > wrote:
> notbob wrote:
>
> > Cuz there are currently about a jillion of them and most cost an arm
> > and a leg cuz they've been bought up by the rip-off private education
> > industry and even when you graduate you'll start a real job at illegal
> > immigrant pay till you get some real world experience. *In the
> > meantime, the interest on that monster loan is still growing. *Better
> > to seek out a community college with a culinary program or start at
> > the bottom and work up, learning in the trenches.
>
> Don't listen to these people! *You posted from foodbanter
> so right away we know you have the discerning judgement
> to choose a good culinary school and do well! *The California
> Culinary Academy in San Francisco would be just right for you.

>
>
S/he is from the Philippines.

In article >,
says...
>
> "gloria.p" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On 9/23/2011 9:12 AM, Steve Freides wrote:
> >> prettymoira wrote:
> >>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> >>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> >>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
> >>
> >> Yes - don't.
> >>
> >> -S-
> >
> > That's a valid reply, but you need to tell her some of the reasons WHY.
> >
> > gloria p
>
> I'll give some good reasons. Most people's ideas of being a "chef" have to
> do with what they see on television and very little to do with real life.
> Loving to cook and cooking to LIVE are two totally different things. You
> don't walk out of a cooking school and open a restaurant that will
> immediately take off. Most restaurants fail in the first year or two, even
> if they have very good food. It's an overwhelming business and takes 24/7
> devotion. Don't plan on having a life outside the restaurant.
>
> As if that weren't enough, think about the financial outlay (school aside)
> for renting a building or space that is adequate and up to code for housing
> a restaurant. Think about equipping a professional kitchen, not to mention
> decking out the dining room. (Want to take over a failed restaurant space?
> Think about why it failed.) There are licenses, hiring and vetting the
> staff, paying wages and insurance and worker's compensation... I could go on
> and on but there are MANY reasons

Being your own boss sounds wonderful until you've actually done it and
found out how much _work_ it is.

Besides, if she wants to put up her own restaurant, she'd do better to
go to business school and learn how to manage and market it--that's the
part that most small business owners fall down on.

On Sep 23, 7:33*am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> wrote:
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>
> --
> prettymoira

Culinary arts teach technique. That's all well and good, you need to
learn some of the basic techniques.
If you REALLY want to learn, go to work in a restaurant. Start at
the bottom being a prep cook and work your way
up. That is where you will learn. Find a place where the chef is
also a good teacher. Work at several places with different
cuisines. If you truely want to open your own restaurant you need to
find out just what you are getting yourself into. Working IN a
restaurant and learning all you can learn from those who go before you
is the absolute best way. Apprentice, sous chef, prep cook,
dishwasher,....you need to know it all.

Otherwise, it's a pretty daydream. Far too many people think "oh
wouldn't it be nice to own a restaurant". They go into the business
having no business being IN the business. And they fail....quickly.

prettymoira wrote:
>
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?

Enlist in the navy, you'll get plenty of hands on experience in all
phases of cullinary arts from baking to butchering and they will send
you to the finast cooking schools for free, they'll even pay you and
give you room and board. You'll work your ass off but if you have it
in you you'll learn. But I do not recommend right off the bat opening
a restaurant, restauarnt management and cooking have nothing to do
with each other. Unless you have heaps of money to lose you'll do
better beginning with a position at a big hotel, a cruise line, a
catering company, even a hospital... banks are averse to giving loans
to open a restaurant and most small sole proprietor eateries fall
before the first year.

On Sep 23, 12:05*pm, "J. Clarke" > wrote:
>
> Being your own boss sounds wonderful until you've actually done it and
> found out how much _work_ it is.
>
> Besides, if she wants to put up her own restaurant, she'd do better to
> go to business school and learn how to manage and market it--that's the
> part that most small business owners fall down on.

A good culinary school can probably teach you better about how to
manage a restaurant than a good business school. After all, it's not
a secret that the management is primary for a successful restaurant,
the food being secondary.

Changing the subject slightly, there is another path to successful
restaurant management. Someone I know didn't go to culinary school,
but instead managed to get flunky jobs at many of the best restaurants
in the US. Each time he started at the bottom and managed to work
himself up a little way. He managed to glean enough knowledge and
skills from the chefs that he is now very successful.

www.richardfisher

On 2011-09-23, ImStillMags > wrote:


> wouldn't it be nice to own a restaurant". They go into the business
> having no business being IN the business. And they fail....quickly.

Yep. So many variables.

I had a friend who recently attempted a cafe/chocolate shop. Lost his
life savings. It wasn't cuz of his attention to detail or for lack of
trying. He's anal to a fault, as is his chocolateire wife. I think
it was location, more than anything else, that killed them.

I see a perfect example right here where I live. Two places. One, a
non-chain burger joint on main hwy thru town. Crap food at outrageous
prices, but the place is SWAMPED in the Summer mos. Another
burger/bbq place on Main St, but 3 blcks off main hwy. Killer food,
fair prices, but jes gets by due to appreciation and loyalty. I
frequent the latter and wouldn't stop to **** on the former, yet the
former does so much business in the Summer, it can afford to close for
the Winter. The good place must remain open year round (thankfully!).

nb

On Fri, 23 Sep 2011 09:05:41 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
> wrote:

> Tax-supported schools are more affordable. Check out the community
> colleges in your area. Big cities' school systems often operate a
> vocational/trade school.

Ditto, the community college route is the way to go.

http://www.ccsf.edu/Departments/Hotel_and_Restaurant/
Q&A
<http://www.ccsf.edu/NEW/en/educational-programs/career-and-technical-education/student-resources/hotel_management.html>


--
All you need is love. But a little chocolate now and then doesn't hurt.

On Sep 23, 10:33*am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> wrote:
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>
> --
> prettymoira

Be prepared to spend several thousand dollars if you go. There's a
top ranked culinary school where I live and it costs $50,000 to go
there, and that doesn't include things like books or equipment.

On Sep 23, 1:43*pm, sf > wrote:
> On Fri, 23 Sep 2011 09:05:41 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
>
> > wrote:
> > Tax-supported schools are more affordable. Check out the community
> > colleges in your area. Big cities' school systems often operate a
> > vocational/trade school.
>
> Ditto, the community college route is the way to go.
>
> http://www.ccsf.edu/Departments/Hotel_and_Restaurant/
> Q&A
> <http://www.ccsf.edu/NEW/en/educational-programs/career-and-technical-...>
>
> -- *
> All you need is love. But a little chocolate now and then doesn't hurt.

I went to South Seattle Community College- they have an excellent
culinary arts program, both cooking and baking.

On Sep 23, 4:00*pm, merryb > wrote:
> On Sep 23, 1:43*pm, sf > wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 23 Sep 2011 09:05:41 -0700 (PDT), spamtrap1888
>
> > > wrote:
> > > Tax-supported schools are more affordable. Check out the community
> > > colleges in your area. Big cities' school systems often operate a
> > > vocational/trade school.
>
> > Ditto, the community college route is the way to go.
>
> >http://www.ccsf.edu/Departments/Hotel_and_Restaurant/
> > Q&A
> > <http://www.ccsf.edu/NEW/en/educational-programs/career-and-technical-....>
>
> > -- *
> > All you need is love. But a little chocolate now and then doesn't hurt.
>
> I went to South Seattle Community College- they have an excellent
> culinary arts program, both cooking and baking.

Santa Clara County's Metropolitan Education District has a vocational
program for both high school and adult students. Unfortunately their
culinary arts program and baking program is targeted to hs students --
adults can enroll only on a space-available basis.

http://www.metroed.net/~sevans/Couns...20Catering.pdf

On Sep 23, 10:33*am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> wrote:
> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>
> --
> prettymoira

I know a guy who's a Johnson and Wales grad. Tried his own resto and
almost got suicidal. He's happily running the food end of an assisted
living place and loves it. Flat salary and he can sleep nights, he
says.

I know another guy who ran the kitchen of a medium size college for
years. Worked in a hospital before that. So, don't set your sights
on just having your own business. It is a difficult way to make a
living.

"J. Clarke" > wrote in message
in.local...
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "gloria.p" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > On 9/23/2011 9:12 AM, Steve Freides wrote:
>> >> prettymoira wrote:
>> >>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
>> >>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
>> >>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>> >>
>> >> Yes - don't.
>> >>
>> >> -S-
>> >
>> > That's a valid reply, but you need to tell her some of the reasons WHY.
>> >
>> > gloria p
>>
>> I'll give some good reasons. Most people's ideas of being a "chef" have
>> to
>> do with what they see on television and very little to do with real life.
>> Loving to cook and cooking to LIVE are two totally different things. You
>> don't walk out of a cooking school and open a restaurant that will
>> immediately take off. Most restaurants fail in the first year or two,
>> even
>> if they have very good food. It's an overwhelming business and takes
>> 24/7
>> devotion. Don't plan on having a life outside the restaurant.
>>
>> As if that weren't enough, think about the financial outlay (school
>> aside)
>> for renting a building or space that is adequate and up to code for
>> housing
>> a restaurant. Think about equipping a professional kitchen, not to
>> mention
>> decking out the dining room. (Want to take over a failed restaurant
>> space?
>> Think about why it failed.) There are licenses, hiring and vetting the
>> staff, paying wages and insurance and worker's compensation... I could go
>> on
>> and on but there are MANY reasons
>
> Being your own boss sounds wonderful until you've actually done it and
> found out how much _work_ it is.
>
> Besides, if she wants to put up her own restaurant, she'd do better to
> go to business school and learn how to manage and market it--that's the
> part that most small business owners fall down on.

I agree completely! Even if she wants to also run the kitchen, she'd better
be able to figure out the accounting and keep track of the books. Or hire a
good accountant. It's not enough to say "I wanna be a chef", open a
restaurant and live happily ever after. It's a lot of hard work and a major
investment. I sure wouldn't want to do it. And I do love to cook: )

Jill

On 2011-09-23, spamtrap1888 > wrote:

> Santa Clara County's Metropolitan Education District has a vocational
> program for both high school and adult students. Unfortunately their
> culinary arts program and baking program is targeted to hs students --
> adults can enroll only on a space-available basis.

Last I heard, San Francisco City College has one of the oldest and
best:

http://www.ccsf.edu/Departments/Hote...ant/index.html

nb

On 2011-09-23, Kalmia > wrote:

> I know a guy who's a Johnson and Wales grad. Tried his own resto and
> almost got suicidal.

Yep. We had a high-end resto in town that was owned by a J&W grad.
He even made onto Iron Chef America. It's now closed and vanished
without a trace. I have no idea why.

nb

On Sep 23, 4:57*pm, notbob > wrote:
> On 2011-09-23, spamtrap1888 > wrote:
>
> > Santa Clara County's Metropolitan Education District has a vocational
> > program for both high school and adult students. Unfortunately their
> > culinary arts program and baking program is targeted to hs students --
> > adults can enroll only on a space-available basis.
>
> Last I heard, San Francisco City College has one of the oldest and
> best:
>
> http://www.ccsf.edu/Departments/Hote...ant/index.html
>

Not everyone's cut out for community college. Vocational classes at
the high school level can reach more people.

In article
>,
spamtrap1888 > wrote:

> On Sep 23, 4:57*pm, notbob > wrote:
> > On 2011-09-23, spamtrap1888 > wrote:
> >
> > > Santa Clara County's Metropolitan Education District has a vocational
> > > program for both high school and adult students. Unfortunately their
> > > culinary arts program and baking program is targeted to hs students --
> > > adults can enroll only on a space-available basis.
> >
> > Last I heard, San Francisco City College has one of the oldest and
> > best:
> >
> > http://www.ccsf.edu/Departments/Hote...ant/index.html
> >
>
> Not everyone's cut out for community college. Vocational classes at
> the high school level can reach more people.

Nope, not in the United States. NCLB (No Child Left Behind) doesn't
test for vocational classes. You can have the finest vocational
programs in the country, but your school will fail the standardized
state tests, and you will be punished.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

> On Sep 23, 10:33 am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> > wrote:
>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?

Yes, get a job in a restaurant and see if you still like it. I have a nephew
that wanted to do just what you are saying. He got a job doing prep and
otherwise working in the kitchen. The owner offered to pay most of his
tuition to culinary school.

He soon learned that he liked to cook for his friends, but strongly disliked
the real restaurant world. Long hours, you are working while your friends
are doing fun things, like going out for dinner.

On 9/24/2011 3:18 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
>
>> On Sep 23, 10:33 am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
>> > wrote:
Any ideas anyone?
>
> Yes, get a job in a restaurant and see if you still like it. I have a
> nephew that wanted to do just what you are saying. He got a job doing
> prep and otherwise working in the kitchen. The owner offered to pay most
> of his tuition to culinary school.
>
> He soon learned that he liked to cook for his friends, but strongly
> disliked the real restaurant world. Long hours, you are working while
> your friends are doing fun things, like going out for dinner.


And you work weekends and holidays when the rest of the
world is partying.

gloria p

spamtrap1888 wrote:
> notbob > wrote:
>
>> Last I heard, San Francisco City College has one of the oldest and
>> best:

The community college program has been fabulously successful at
preparing people for highly skilled jobs. Not just in cooking.

> Not everyone's cut out for community college. Vocational classes at
> the high school level can reach more people.

At each level of education there's someone not cut out for that level,
agreed. The question becomes - Where's the line between professional
and not? If "chef" is a profession then "cook" is the less skilled
level. Like engineer/technician CPA/bookkeeper or any other of the
professions.

Fully accredited degrees beat the lower level of accreditation of
vocational schools when it comes to comparing candidates side by side
and the effort to get the degrees match.

Life at Central Baptist Village offers a continuum of care and accommodations complete with many amenities, services, activities, conveniences and a lifestyle of warmth, faith, friendship and family.

> wrote in message
...
> On Sep 23, 10:33 am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
> > wrote:
>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>>
>> --
>> prettymoira
>
> Be prepared to spend several thousand dollars if you go. There's a
> top ranked culinary school where I live and it costs $50,000 to go
> there, and that doesn't include things like books or equipment.
**********
Not to mention it doesn't prepare you for the real world. Taking classes,
no matter how good the school, and running a successful restaurant are two
completely different things.

Jill

On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 11:35:26 -0400, "jmcquown" >
wrote:

>
> wrote in message
...
>> On Sep 23, 10:33 am, prettymoira <prettymoira.
>> > wrote:
>>> I wanna be a chef and put up my own fine dining restaurant. I love to
>>> bake and cook good food so I'm planning to go back to school and take
>>> culinary arts. Any ideas anyone?
>>>
>>> --
>>> prettymoira
>>
>> Be prepared to spend several thousand dollars if you go. There's a
>> top ranked culinary school where I live and it costs $50,000 to go
>> there, and that doesn't include things like books or equipment.
>**********
>Not to mention it doesn't prepare you for the real world. Taking classes,
>no matter how good the school, and running a successful restaurant are two
>completely different things.

Not to mention cooking schools will take your money and heap praise
and encouragement while never mentioning that you haven't the
ability... while after a week working in a restaurant, even if all you
do is prep veggies, you'll know all on your own whether cooking as a
career is your bag. Fixing ones own brekkie is no indication that one
can cook for pay.

On 2011-09-26, Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote:

> ability... while after a week working in a restaurant, even if all you
> do is prep veggies, you'll know all on your own whether cooking as a
> career is your bag.

Yep. Tony Bourdain talks about it in one of his books. Not only will
you know, but the others in the kitchen will let you know if you will
truly fit in.

The last time I worked in a resto, I didn't. The kitchen was all sub-30
and I'm past 60. They also were not happy with a dishwasher/prep
geezer who didn't share their enthusiasm for drugs and came with a
lifetime acquired 'tude. Not quite subordinate enough for a fitting
dishwasher. I fit kinda ok, cuz I pulled my weight, but was the first
pink out the door at the end of the season.

nb

On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 06:50:06 +0000, chrisdenwoy wrote:

> Life at Central Baptist Village offers a continuum of care and
> accommodations complete with many amenities, services, activities,
> conveniences and a lifestyle of warmth, faith, friendship and family.

what about pussy?

blake

In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> On Mon, 26 Sep 2011 06:50:06 +0000, chrisdenwoy wrote:
>
> > Life at Central Baptist Village offers a continuum of care and
> > accommodations complete with many amenities, services, activities,
> > conveniences and a lifestyle of warmth, faith, friendship and family.
>
> what about pussy?

They have two cats.

:-)

Seriously, my father (age 95) just moved into a skilled nursing
facility. They have two cats and a dog (for 100 beds). He's pretty
happy with that.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

"jmcquown" > wrote
..
> **********
> Not to mention it doesn't prepare you for the real world. Taking classes,
> no matter how good the school, and running a successful restaurant are two
> completely different things.
>
> Jill

At the CIA you spend some months in the classroom before touching a knife
and they teach menu planning and finance. It would help, but not be like a
real life business. You have to get your hands dirty.

On 2011-09-26, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

> At the CIA you spend some months in the classroom before touching a knife
> and they teach menu planning and finance. It would help, but not be like a
> real life business. You have to get your hands dirty.

And not necessary. When A. Bourdain went to CIA, it was a piddling
$10-15K, total. Now it's more like $80K+. The kicker is, the guy who
replaced him at Les Halles as executive chef worked up from food
flunky jes working at the restaurant for 8 yrs. Didn't cost a cent.
In fact, he made money the whole time.

nb

On 2011-09-26, Dan Abel > wrote:

> Seriously, my father (age 95) just moved into a skilled nursing
> facility.

What's a "skilled nursing facility", Dan?

nb

Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> At the CIA you spend some months in the classroom before touching a knife
> and they teach menu planning and finance. It would help, but not be like a
> real life business. You have to get your hands dirty.

If you want to save the whales, collect the whole set, you can then go
to Cornell School of Hotel Management and get all of the business part.
It's like a specialized MBA program.