The bread bowls are not coming out right.

They are flat instead of raised. They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).

I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
at 400 degrees.

I have tried this twice, same results each time. The 2nd time I even
made the dough a little drier to minimize/prevent settling.

How do I get the centers to come up so I have a nice bread bowl for
soups, etc ?

Here is the recipe I am using from allrecipes.com

Italian Bread Bowls

SUBMITTED BY: Kerri Skrudland PHOTO BY: docswife
"These cute little bread bowls are a great way to serve soup in the
wintertime. I usually serve a hearty potato soup when I have the time to
bake them. They freeze for up to 1 month, if desired."
RECIPE RATING:
The reviewer gave this recipe 160 stars. This recipe average a 4.4 star
rating.
Read Reviews (136)
Review/Rate This Recipe
PREP TIME 30 Min
COOK TIME 30 Min
READY IN 2 Hrs 15 Min
yield 8 bowls




INGREDIENTS (Nutrition)

* 2 (.25 ounce) packages active dry yeast
* 2 1/2 cups warm water (110 degrees F/45 degrees C)
* 2 teaspoons salt
* 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
* 7 cups all-purpose flour
*
* 1 tablespoon cornmeal
* 1 egg white
* 1 tablespoon water

DIRECTIONS

1. In a large bowl, dissolve yeast in warm water. Let stand until
creamy, about 10 minutes.
2. Add salt, oil and 4 cups flour to the yeast mixture; beat well.
Stir in the remaining flour, 1/2 cup at a time, beating well with an
electric mixer at medium speed after each addition.
3. When the dough has pulled together, turn it out onto a lightly
floured surface and knead until smooth and elastic, about 6 minutes.
Lightly oil a large bowl, place the dough in the bowl and turn to coat
with oil. Cover with a damp cloth and let rise in a warm place until
doubled in volume, about 40 minutes.
4. Punch dough down, and divide into 8 equal portions. Shape each
portion into a 4 inch round loaf. Place loaves on lightly greased baking
sheets sprinkled with cornmeal. Cover and let rise in a warm place, free
from drafts, until doubled in bulk, about 35 minutes.
5. Preheat oven to 400 degrees F (200 degrees C). In a small bowl,
beat together egg white and 1 tablespoon water; lightly brush the loaves
with half of this egg wash.
6. Bake in preheated oven for 15 minutes. Brush with remaining egg
mixture, and bake 10 to 15 more minutes or until golden. Cool on wire racks.
7. To make bowls: Cut a 1/2 inch thick slice from top of each loaf;
scoop out centers, leaving 3/4-inch-thick shells. Fill bread bowls with
hot soup and serve immediately.

On 2008-12-15, Ted Campanelli > wrote:
>
> The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> They are flat instead of raised. They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> at 400 degrees.

How old is your yeast? Sounds like old yeast. You might try adding a
little sugar to the water to give it something to feed it.

nb

On Dec 15, 1:49*pm, Ted Campanelli > wrote:
> The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> They are flat instead of raised. *They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> at 400 degrees.
>
> I have tried this twice, same results each time. *The 2nd time I even
> made the dough a little drier to minimize/prevent settling.
>
> How do I get the centers to come up so I have a nice bread bowl for
> soups, etc ?
>
> Here is the recipe I am using from allrecipes.com
>
> Italian Bread Bowls
>
> SUBMITTED BY: Kerri Skrudland PHOTO BY: docswife
> "These cute little bread bowls are a great way to serve soup in the
> wintertime. I usually serve a hearty potato soup when I have the time to
> bake them. They freeze for up to 1 month, if desired."
> RECIPE RATING:
> The reviewer gave this recipe 160 stars. This recipe average a 4.4 star
> rating.
> Read Reviews (136)
> Review/Rate This Recipe
> PREP TIME * * * 30 Min
> COOK TIME * * * 30 Min
> READY IN * * * *2 Hrs 15 Min
> * yield 8 bowls
>
> INGREDIENTS (Nutrition)
>
> * * ** 2 (.25 ounce) packages active dry yeast
> * * ** 2 1/2 cups warm water (110 degrees F/45 degrees C)
> * * ** 2 teaspoons salt
> * * ** 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
> * * ** 7 cups all-purpose flour
> * * **
> * * ** 1 tablespoon cornmeal
> * * ** 1 egg white
> * * ** 1 tablespoon water
>
> DIRECTIONS
>
> * * 1. In a large bowl, dissolve yeast in warm water. Let stand until
> creamy, about 10 minutes.
> * * 2. Add salt, oil and 4 cups flour to the yeast mixture; beat well..
> Stir in the remaining flour, 1/2 cup at a time, beating well with an
> electric mixer at medium speed after each addition.
> * * 3. When the dough has pulled together, turn it out onto a lightly
> floured surface and knead until smooth and elastic, about 6 minutes.
> Lightly oil a large bowl, place the dough in the bowl and turn to coat
> with oil. Cover with a damp cloth and let rise in a warm place until
> doubled in volume, about 40 minutes.
> * * 4. Punch dough down, and divide into 8 equal portions. Shape each
> portion into a 4 inch round loaf. Place loaves on lightly greased baking
> sheets sprinkled with cornmeal. Cover and let rise in a warm place, free
> from drafts, until doubled in bulk, about 35 minutes.
> * * 5. Preheat oven to 400 degrees F (200 degrees C). In a small bowl,
> beat together egg white and 1 tablespoon water; lightly brush the loaves
> with half of this egg wash.
> * * 6. Bake in preheated oven for 15 minutes. Brush with remaining egg
> mixture, and bake 10 to 15 more minutes or until golden. Cool on wire racks.
> * * 7. To make bowls: Cut a 1/2 inch thick slice from top of each loaf;
> scoop out centers, leaving 3/4-inch-thick shells. Fill bread bowls with
> hot soup and serve immediately.

I see you are adding salt, etc., directly to the yeast - salt kills
yeast (sugar feeds it). I would add 2 T of sugar to the dissolved
yeast, then add the rest of the ingredients except the salt, and add
the salt in last. That's the way I do yeast breads, and they always
rise nicely.

Another thing: You might have better results if you don't plop the
little rounds "nekkid" on the baking sheet - try using appropriately-
sized oven-proof ramekins, Pyrex custard cups, or the giant-sized
muffin cups. I think if the sides of the loaves are contained, then
they'll have to rise up and won't be allowed to spread out.

But I think adding the salt at the wrong time is the problem here.

I don't see anything else weird about your recipe.

N.

On Dec 15, 2:28*pm, notbob > wrote:
> On 2008-12-15, Ted Campanelli > wrote:
>
>
>
> > The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> > They are flat instead of raised. *They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> > diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> > I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> > at 400 degrees.
>
> How old is your yeast? *Sounds like old yeast. *You might try adding a
> little sugar to the water to give it something to feed it. *
>
> nb

I responded right away, but my post isn't showing up.

I think the problem is that he's adding salt to the yeast. I
suggested that he add a couple T. of sugar, then the other
ingredients, and the salt last. Salt kills yeast.

I also suggested that he confine the round loaves so they have to rise
up instead of spreading out. A 4-5" ramekin, a large Pyrex custard
cup, a large muffin tin - all would do the job.

N.

On 2008-12-15, Nancy2 > wrote:

> I responded right away, but my post isn't showing up.

I see your other post.

It could be several things.

What is he calling "warm" water? Should be tepid-to-lukewarm. Too warm
will kill the yeast. Yeast should become "bubbly", not just creamy. If it
doesn't become bubbly with lukewarm water and some sugar or honey, it's too
old. Agreed, shouldn't put salt in brewing yeast. Do not add salt till
adding flour. Is it warm enough when bread is proofing? Should be at least
70 deg F. Are the bowls super clean?

I'm no baker, but there are many reasons a bread won't rise. Don't forget
old flour. My mom has plenty of ancient flours, bisquicks, cakemixes, etc.
The get so old and stale, they are useless.

nb

On Dec 15, 2:49�pm, Ted Campanelli > wrote:
> The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> They are flat instead of raised. �They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> at 400 degrees.
>
> I have tried this twice, same results each time. �The 2nd time I even
> made the dough a little drier to minimize/prevent settling.
>
> How do I get the centers to come up so I have a nice bread bowl for
> soups, etc ?
>
> Here is the recipe I am using from allrecipes.com
>
> Italian Bread Bowls
>
> SUBMITTED BY: Kerri Skrudland PHOTO BY: docswife
> "These cute little bread bowls are a great way to serve soup in the
> wintertime. I usually serve a hearty potato soup when I have the time to
> bake them. They freeze for up to 1 month, if desired."
> RECIPE RATING:
> The reviewer gave this recipe 160 stars. This recipe average a 4.4 star
> rating.
> Read Reviews (136)
> Review/Rate This Recipe
> PREP TIME � � � 30 Min
> COOK TIME � � � 30 Min
> READY IN � � � �2 Hrs 15 Min
> � yield 8 bowls
>
> INGREDIENTS (Nutrition)
>
> � � �* 2 (.25 ounce) packages active dry yeast
> � � �* 2 1/2 cups warm water (110 degrees F/45 degrees C)
> � � �* 2 teaspoons salt
> � � �* 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
> � � �* 7 cups all-purpose flour
> � � �*
> � � �* 1 tablespoon cornmeal
> � � �* 1 egg white
> � � �* 1 tablespoon water
>
> DIRECTIONS
>
> � � 1. In a large bowl, dissolve yeast in warm water. Let stand until
> creamy, about 10 minutes.
> � � 2. Add salt, oil and 4 cups flour to the yeast mixture; beat well.
> Stir in the remaining flour, 1/2 cup at a time, beating well with an
> electric mixer at medium speed after each addition.
> � � 3. When the dough has pulled together, turn it out onto a lightly
> floured surface and knead until smooth and elastic, about 6 minutes.
> Lightly oil a large bowl, place the dough in the bowl and turn to coat
> with oil. Cover with a damp cloth and let rise in a warm place until
> doubled in volume, about 40 minutes.
> � � 4. Punch dough down, and divide into 8 equal portions.. Shape each
> portion into a 4 inch round loaf. Place loaves on lightly greased baking
> sheets sprinkled with cornmeal. Cover and let rise in a warm place, free
> from drafts, until doubled in bulk, about 35 minutes.
> � � 5. Preheat oven to 400 degrees F (200 degrees C). In a small bowl,
> beat together egg white and 1 tablespoon water; lightly brush the loaves
> with half of this egg wash.
> � � 6. Bake in preheated oven for 15 minutes. Brush with remaining egg
> mixture, and bake 10 to 15 more minutes or until golden. Cool on wire racks.
> � � 7. To make bowls: Cut a 1/2 inch thick slice from top of each loaf;
> scoop out centers, leaving 3/4-inch-thick shells. Fill bread bowls with
> hot soup and serve immediately.

Probably should use bread flour.

Generally I agree with Nancy re salt and ramekins, but I don't think you
need to use that much sugar. Even a teaspoon will help. Dissolve it in the
warm water, and then add the yeast and let it bubble up..

I would also consider adding a heaping tablespoon of wheat gluten--you can
buy "Vital Wheat Gluten" in the supermarket--with the first addition of
flour, and beating well to develop the gluten, then adding the rest of the
flour as directed.

On Dec 15, 4:31*pm, Sheldon > wrote:
> On Dec 15, 2:49 pm, Ted Campanelli > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> > They are flat instead of raised. They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> > diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> > I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> > at 400 degrees.
>
> > I have tried this twice, same results each time. The 2nd time I even
> > made the dough a little drier to minimize/prevent settling.
>
> > How do I get the centers to come up so I have a nice bread bowl for
> > soups, etc ?
>
> > Here is the recipe I am using from allrecipes.com
>
> > Italian Bread Bowls
>
> > SUBMITTED BY: Kerri Skrudland PHOTO BY: docswife
> > "These cute little bread bowls are a great way to serve soup in the
> > wintertime. I usually serve a hearty potato soup when I have the time to
> > bake them. They freeze for up to 1 month, if desired."
> > RECIPE RATING:
> > The reviewer gave this recipe 160 stars. This recipe average a 4.4 star
> > rating.
> > Read Reviews (136)
> > Review/Rate This Recipe
> > PREP TIME 30 Min
> > COOK TIME 30 Min
> > READY IN 2 Hrs 15 Min
> > yield 8 bowls
>
> > INGREDIENTS (Nutrition)
>
> > * 2 (.25 ounce) packages active dry yeast
> > * 2 1/2 cups warm water (110 degrees F/45 degrees C)
> > * 2 teaspoons salt
> > * 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
> > * 7 cups all-purpose flour
> > *
> > * 1 tablespoon cornmeal
> > * 1 egg white
> > * 1 tablespoon water
>
> > DIRECTIONS
>
> > 1. In a large bowl, dissolve yeast in warm water. Let stand until
> > creamy, about 10 minutes.
> > 2. Add salt, oil and 4 cups flour to the yeast mixture; beat well.
> > Stir in the remaining flour, 1/2 cup at a time, beating well with an
> > electric mixer at medium speed after each addition.
> > 3. When the dough has pulled together, turn it out onto a lightly
> > floured surface and knead until smooth and elastic, about 6 minutes.
> > Lightly oil a large bowl, place the dough in the bowl and turn to coat
> > with oil. Cover with a damp cloth and let rise in a warm place until
> > doubled in volume, about 40 minutes.
> > 4. Punch dough down, and divide into 8 equal portions. Shape each
> > portion into a 4 inch round loaf. Place loaves on lightly greased baking
> > sheets sprinkled with cornmeal. Cover and let rise in a warm place, free
> > from drafts, until doubled in bulk, about 35 minutes.
> > 5. Preheat oven to 400 degrees F (200 degrees C). In a small bowl,
> > beat together egg white and 1 tablespoon water; lightly brush the loaves
> > with half of this egg wash.
> > 6. Bake in preheated oven for 15 minutes. Brush with remaining egg
> > mixture, and bake 10 to 15 more minutes or until golden. Cool on wire racks.
> > 7. To make bowls: Cut a 1/2 inch thick slice from top of each loaf;
> > scoop out centers, leaving 3/4-inch-thick shells. Fill bread bowls with
> > hot soup and serve immediately.
>
> Probably should use bread flour.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Sorry for the two posts. I've been having issues with posts not
showing up.

As to the original poster, Ted, please let us know about your next
attempt, what you did, and how it worked out (or not). Inquiring
minds want to know.

N.

On Dec 16, 11:30�am, Nancy2 > wrote:
> On Dec 15, 4:31�pm, Sheldon > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Dec 15, 2:49 pm, Ted Campanelli > wrote:
>
> > > The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> > > They are flat instead of raised. They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> > > diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> > > I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> > > at 400 degrees.
>
> > > I have tried this twice, same results each time. The 2nd time I even
> > > made the dough a little drier to minimize/prevent settling.
>
> > > How do I get the centers to come up so I have a nice bread bowl for
> > > soups, etc ?
>
> > > Here is the recipe I am using from allrecipes.com
>
> > > Italian Bread Bowls
>
> > > SUBMITTED BY: Kerri Skrudland PHOTO BY: docswife
> > > "These cute little bread bowls are a great way to serve soup in the
> > > wintertime. I usually serve a hearty potato soup when I have the time to
> > > bake them. They freeze for up to 1 month, if desired."
> > > RECIPE RATING:
> > > The reviewer gave this recipe 160 stars. This recipe average a 4.4 star
> > > rating.
> > > Read Reviews (136)
> > > Review/Rate This Recipe
> > > PREP TIME 30 Min
> > > COOK TIME 30 Min
> > > READY IN 2 Hrs 15 Min
> > > yield 8 bowls
>
> > > INGREDIENTS (Nutrition)
>
> > > * 2 (.25 ounce) packages active dry yeast
> > > * 2 1/2 cups warm water (110 degrees F/45 degrees C)
> > > * 2 teaspoons salt
> > > * 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
> > > * 7 cups all-purpose flour
> > > *
> > > * 1 tablespoon cornmeal
> > > * 1 egg white
> > > * 1 tablespoon water
>
> > > DIRECTIONS
>
> > > 1. In a large bowl, dissolve yeast in warm water. Let stand until
> > > creamy, about 10 minutes.
> > > 2. Add salt, oil and 4 cups flour to the yeast mixture; beat well.
> > > Stir in the remaining flour, 1/2 cup at a time, beating well with an
> > > electric mixer at medium speed after each addition.
> > > 3. When the dough has pulled together, turn it out onto a lightly
> > > floured surface and knead until smooth and elastic, about 6 minutes.
> > > Lightly oil a large bowl, place the dough in the bowl and turn to coat
> > > with oil. Cover with a damp cloth and let rise in a warm place until
> > > doubled in volume, about 40 minutes.
> > > 4. Punch dough down, and divide into 8 equal portions. Shape each
> > > portion into a 4 inch round loaf. Place loaves on lightly greased baking
> > > sheets sprinkled with cornmeal. Cover and let rise in a warm place, free
> > > from drafts, until doubled in bulk, about 35 minutes.
> > > 5. Preheat oven to 400 degrees F (200 degrees C). In a small bowl,
> > > beat together egg white and 1 tablespoon water; lightly brush the loaves
> > > with half of this egg wash.
> > > 6. Bake in preheated oven for 15 minutes. Brush with remaining egg
> > > mixture, and bake 10 to 15 more minutes or until golden. Cool on wire racks.
> > > 7. To make bowls: Cut a 1/2 inch thick slice from top of each loaf;
> > > scoop out centers, leaving 3/4-inch-thick shells. Fill bread bowls with
> > > hot soup and serve immediately.
>
> > Probably should use bread flour.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Sorry for the two posts. �I've been having issues with posts not
> showing up.
>
> As to the original poster, Ted, please let us know about your next
> attempt, what you did, and how it worked out (or not). �Inquiring
> minds want to know.

I'll bet it's the flour he's using... it's probably old too, and
wasn't properly stored. Good dough performance really requires fresh
flour, and for a strong dough high gluten flour is manditory.

That recipe also contains twice the salt needed... excessive salt
retards gluten formation, which results in a poorly structured
dough... one tsp salt is plenty for that quantity. If more salty is
desired salt the exterior, like a salted pretzel... for soup I'd leave
the salt out altogether, the bread will pick up saltiness from the
soup. I would also halve the yeast (1 packet is plenty) and leave
more time for development, a fast rise means a weak dough. For soup
bowls (trenchers) I'd use a retarded rise, overnight in the fridge...
then work quickly; punch down, devide, and form tightly, do not permit
to fully proof, for trenchers you want a good oven spring.

Ted shuffled out of his cave and grunted these great (and sometimes not
so great) words of knowledge:
> The bread bowls are not coming out right.
>
> They are flat instead of raised. They expand out to around 8" - 9" in
> diameter, but only get about 3" high (if that).
>
> I have followed the directions exactly, made sure the oven is actually
> at 400 degrees.
>
> I have tried this twice, same results each time. The 2nd time I even
> made the dough a little drier to minimize/prevent settling.
>
> How do I get the centers to come up so I have a nice bread bowl for
> soups, etc ?
>
> Here is the recipe I am using from allrecipes.com
>
> Italian Bread Bowls
>
> SUBMITTED BY: Kerri Skrudland PHOTO BY: docswife
> "These cute little bread bowls are a great way to serve soup in the
> wintertime. I usually serve a hearty potato soup when I have the time to
> bake them. They freeze for up to 1 month, if desired."
> RECIPE RATING:
> The reviewer gave this recipe 160 stars. This recipe average a 4.4 star
> rating.
> Read Reviews (136)
> Review/Rate This Recipe
> PREP TIME 30 Min
> COOK TIME 30 Min
> READY IN 2 Hrs 15 Min
> yield 8 bowls
>
>
>
>
> INGREDIENTS (Nutrition)
>
> * 2 (.25 ounce) packages active dry yeast
> * 2 1/2 cups warm water (110 degrees F/45 degrees C)
> * 2 teaspoons salt
> * 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
> * 7 cups all-purpose flour
> *
> * 1 tablespoon cornmeal
> * 1 egg white
> * 1 tablespoon water
>
> DIRECTIONS
>
> 1. In a large bowl, dissolve yeast in warm water. Let stand until
> creamy, about 10 minutes.
> 2. Add salt, oil and 4 cups flour to the yeast mixture; beat well.
> Stir in the remaining flour, 1/2 cup at a time, beating well with an
> electric mixer at medium speed after each addition.
> 3. When the dough has pulled together, turn it out onto a lightly
> floured surface and knead until smooth and elastic, about 6 minutes.
> Lightly oil a large bowl, place the dough in the bowl and turn to coat
> with oil. Cover with a damp cloth and let rise in a warm place until
> doubled in volume, about 40 minutes.
> 4. Punch dough down, and divide into 8 equal portions. Shape each
> portion into a 4 inch round loaf. Place loaves on lightly greased baking
> sheets sprinkled with cornmeal. Cover and let rise in a warm place, free
> from drafts, until doubled in bulk, about 35 minutes.
> 5. Preheat oven to 400 degrees F (200 degrees C). In a small bowl,
> beat together egg white and 1 tablespoon water; lightly brush the loaves
> with half of this egg wash.
> 6. Bake in preheated oven for 15 minutes. Brush with remaining egg
> mixture, and bake 10 to 15 more minutes or until golden. Cool on wire racks.
> 7. To make bowls: Cut a 1/2 inch thick slice from top of each loaf;
> scoop out centers, leaving 3/4-inch-thick shells. Fill bread bowls with
> hot soup and serve immediately.

Found the solution. I put the dough in small pyrex bowls. The end
result is a cylinder about 6" in diameter and about 5" high.

One thing I will need to do is remove them from the bowls after about 15
minutes and let them finish baking on a cookie sheet.

The sides and bottom were very similar in texture to a loaf of bread
baked in a 9x5 pan - not exactly what you want for a soup bread bowl.