My 4 year old GE has self-destructed. The GE repairman identified that an
internal part melts under normal use and the melted residue blocks the
drainage holes and pipes: Although I had with considerable difficulty
removed most of what I could get at, he said that the repair on what was
left would now be to disconnect, dissemble, take the underside of the unit
off to check the pipes and to get at the screen behind the impeller
mechanism to clear it. It would cost a relatively uneconomical $198. He
also said that the melted and perished rubber would also have got into the
pump which would need replacing. He specifically said that this would
render the unit in effect unrepairable.

He said he would call their technical people to see if anyone knew about
this and that they would respond within 48 hours: He then reported back 5
minutes later that technical support had told him that it was a known fact
that the rubber matting (which GE may have now replaced with either plastic
or metal in newer units?) needs replacing every three to four years;
otherwise they knew that the unit would self-destruct in the way mine has.

It was a top of the line Profile. I now need to replace it and cannot
identify which units are available in the New York area with trays which
have been in any way re-designed to improve cleaning and increase storage in
the last 30 years. All normal American manufacturers have improved the
spray pattern/pipes but (with the possible exception of GE!) seem to be
using the same upward facing spikes they have used for decades. I have
often found that one cannot easily put lots of unusual sized pieces in them:
SO if you are just putting in normal dishes and glasses, you can put tons
in. But if you are putting in anything vaguely unusual such as a gravy dish
or metal pan of any type, it takes up the space of everything else. Some
have designed their units so that you can put wine glasses in but if you do
that on my Profile, you can't then put any small plates in the central area!
And there is a second rack on the top left for tea-cups which if you use it,
doesn't actually clean the cups.

There seems to be a really cool looking and, - from the reviews, -
catastrophic unit called a Fisher & Paykel with two drawers but it doesn't
seem to achieve anything in improved storage and it doesn't seem to have any
support or repairers or even a stock of parts which regularly need replacing
in the US. Although users seem to report multiple repair sessions and units
out of operation for up to three months at a time, the company doesn't seem
set up to repair anything once they have sold it?

Does anyone know if there are any Bosch, Miele, Asko, or any other
manufacturer's dishwashers which have had this aspect redesigned in recent
memory?

Also does anyone have any long term experience with Bosch please? I have
used Bosch units in various apartments in Europe for thirty years and have
found that they HAD pumps which stopped working after about 4-5 years and
cannot economically be repaired. Is this still the case and would I do
better avoiding Bosch?

On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 10:59:19 -0400, "news.rcn.com" <news.rnc.com> wrote:

>It was a top of the line Profile. I now need to replace it and cannot
>identify which units are available in the New York area with trays which

If I were to get a new dishwasher a criteria for me is quietness. So a
Bosch would be attractive.

Here are a couple of NYC places that have high-end equipment:
http://gringerandsons.com/
http://www.drimmers.com/home.asp

And this is where I order my ordinary appliances (like GE) from:
http://www.glazerbros.com/home.html

Don <www.donwiss.com> (e-mail link at home page bottom).

AFAIC, GE dishwashers suck. We had GE dishwashers supplied in several new
homes. Each failed within 1-2 years, the cheapest repair for which was $165.

The dishwasher we have liked the best was a top model Kenmore.

I don't like the European models for lack of a soft food disposer and the
need to clean the filter screens.

--
Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________

The right to revolt has sources deep in our
history. --William O. Douglas

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
> AFAIC, GE dishwashers suck. We had GE dishwashers supplied in several new
> homes. Each failed within 1-2 years, the cheapest repair for which was
> $165.

THIS dishwasher was one which was provided as a replacement for one which
had failed!!

>
> The dishwasher we have liked the best was a top model Kenmore.
>
> I don't like the European models for lack of a soft food disposer and the
> need to clean the filter screens.

My problem is that the filter screens are a positive advantage: If i had
them, all I would need to replace would be those screens!! Not the whole
interior mechanical, impeller screen and piping parts. You may be right but
I Have always considered that impeller mechanism a bit suspect and have
found olive pits which mysterioulsy found their way into the dishwasher to
prove it.

>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright
> __________________________________________________
>
> The right to revolt has sources deep in our
> history. --William O. Douglas
>

news.rcn.com wrote:
> My 4 year old GE has self-destructed. The GE repairman identified that an
> internal part melts under normal use and the melted residue blocks the
> drainage holes and pipes: Although I had with considerable difficulty
> removed most of what I could get at, he said that the repair on what was
> left would now be to disconnect, dissemble, take the underside of the unit
> off to check the pipes and to get at the screen behind the impeller
> mechanism to clear it. It would cost a relatively uneconomical $198. He
> also said that the melted and perished rubber would also have got into the
> pump which would need replacing. He specifically said that this would
> render the unit in effect unrepairable.
>
> He said he would call their technical people to see if anyone knew about
> this and that they would respond within 48 hours: He then reported back 5
> minutes later that technical support had told him that it was a known fact
> that the rubber matting (which GE may have now replaced with either plastic
> or metal in newer units?) needs replacing every three to four years;
> otherwise they knew that the unit would self-destruct in the way mine has.
>
> It was a top of the line Profile. I now need to replace it and cannot
> identify which units are available in the New York area with trays which
> have been in any way re-designed to improve cleaning and increase storage in
> the last 30 years. All normal American manufacturers have improved the
> spray pattern/pipes but (with the possible exception of GE!) seem to be
> using the same upward facing spikes they have used for decades. I have
> often found that one cannot easily put lots of unusual sized pieces in them:
> SO if you are just putting in normal dishes and glasses, you can put tons
> in. But if you are putting in anything vaguely unusual such as a gravy dish
> or metal pan of any type, it takes up the space of everything else. Some
> have designed their units so that you can put wine glasses in but if you do
> that on my Profile, you can't then put any small plates in the central area!
> And there is a second rack on the top left for tea-cups which if you use it,
> doesn't actually clean the cups.
>
> There seems to be a really cool looking and, - from the reviews, -
> catastrophic unit called a Fisher & Paykel with two drawers but it doesn't
> seem to achieve anything in improved storage and it doesn't seem to have any
> support or repairers or even a stock of parts which regularly need replacing
> in the US. Although users seem to report multiple repair sessions and units
> out of operation for up to three months at a time, the company doesn't seem
> set up to repair anything once they have sold it?
>
> Does anyone know if there are any Bosch, Miele, Asko, or any other
> manufacturer's dishwashers which have had this aspect redesigned in recent
> memory?
>
> Also does anyone have any long term experience with Bosch please? I have
> used Bosch units in various apartments in Europe for thirty years and have
> found that they HAD pumps which stopped working after about 4-5 years and
> cannot economically be repaired. Is this still the case and would I do
> better avoiding Bosch?
>
>
How about putting a few of your favorite oddball items in a bag and
going for a tour of the dealers. Try putting the items in the rack of
the units you are considering to see how they fit.



--
Del Cecchi
"This post is my own and doesn’t necessarily represent IBM’s positions,
strategies or opinions.”

Oh pshaw, on Fri 22 Sep 2006 08:36:41a, news.rcn.com meant to say...

>
> "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> 28.19...
>> AFAIC, GE dishwashers suck. We had GE dishwashers supplied in several
>> new homes. Each failed within 1-2 years, the cheapest repair for which
>> was $165.
>
> THIS dishwasher was one which was provided as a replacement for one
> which had failed!!
>
>>
>> The dishwasher we have liked the best was a top model Kenmore.
>>
>> I don't like the European models for lack of a soft food disposer and
>> the need to clean the filter screens.
>
> My problem is that the filter screens are a positive advantage: If i had
> them, all I would need to replace would be those screens!! Not the whole
> interior mechanical, impeller screen and piping parts. You may be right
> but I Have always considered that impeller mechanism a bit suspect and
> have found olive pits which mysterioulsy found their way into the
> dishwasher to prove it.

I've never had such a problem, but in your case you might prefer one of the
European models that does have a screen. Apart from my personal dislike of
that "feature", I think they are very good machines.

--
Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________

Useless Invention: Double-sided playing cards.

"Del Cecchi" > wrote in message
...
> How about putting a few of your favorite oddball items in a bag and going
> for a tour of the dealers. Try putting the items in the rack of the units
> you are considering to see how they fit.

Clearly you are right but what I would need to do would be to put lots of
standard items in, lots of different unusual shaped items in and then see
how many configurations would fit: Schlepping all these around various
different shops, hopefully all in the same area, would take an age

It seems to me that all the units however elderly in interior design, would
probably work if tried in the way you suggest. (I think someone actually
made this suggestion on a review of a curious double drawer Fisher & Paykal
unit) Hasn't anyone got any experience of which units ARE more compatible
with varying shapes and sizes in the interior? I notice that some of them
DO seem to be significantly more modern than others, such as the ones which
seem to have been designed to take wine glasses (is it Miele?) as opposed to
the GE which as I mention, will take them but if you put them in, NOTHING
else will fit into the upper space

What I need is someone to tell me "Yes, I had an Admiral and it could
usually fit normal items but when I bought an Asko, I suddenly found that
someone had bothered to design the interior as opposed to just putting in
lots of spikes and hoping everything would fit around them and now I can fit
all sorts of different shaped items in all the time"

>
>
>
> --
> Del Cecchi
> "This post is my own and doesn’t necessarily represent IBM’s positions,
> strategies or opinions.”

On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 10:59:19 -0400, "news.rcn.com" <news.rnc.com>
wrote:

>My 4 year old GE has self-destructed. The GE repairman identified that an
>internal part melts under normal use and the melted residue blocks the
>drainage holes and pipes: Although I had with considerable difficulty
>removed most of what I could get at, he said that the repair on what was
>left would now be to disconnect, dissemble, take the underside of the unit
>off to check the pipes and to get at the screen behind the impeller
>mechanism to clear it. It would cost a relatively uneconomical $198. He
>also said that the melted and perished rubber would also have got into the
>pump which would need replacing. He specifically said that this would
>render the unit in effect unrepairable.
>


>
>Does anyone know if there are any Bosch, Miele, Asko, or any other
>manufacturer's dishwashers which have had this aspect redesigned in recent
>memory?
>
>Also does anyone have any long term experience with Bosch please? I have
>used Bosch units in various apartments in Europe for thirty years and have
>found that they HAD pumps which stopped working after about 4-5 years and
>cannot economically be repaired. Is this still the case and would I do
>better avoiding Bosch?
>

I have a Bosch that is very flexible. On the bottom rack 2 sets of
the tines can be folded flat. I can get 4 large pots on the bottom.
And if the things are too tall, I can take out the top rack and just
use the bottom.

The top rack also has tines that fold and the rack can be moved up and
down. You can do a top rack only wash. I love that when I am trying
to get jars ready for canning.

The machine is quiet. My husband has walked into the kitchen and
opened the machine door when it is running.

This is my second Bosch. I had to leave the first one in the house
when we moved.

--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

news.rcn.com wrote:
>
> What I need is someone to tell me "Yes, I had an Admiral and it could
> usually fit normal items but when I bought an Asko, I suddenly found that
> someone had bothered to design the interior as opposed to just putting in
> lots of spikes and hoping everything would fit around them and now I can fit
> all sorts of different shaped items in all the time"
>
I installed a Maytag a few years ago. I selected that particular model,
because of the well-designed, stainless steel interior.
There is a two-piece cutlery basket, which can be used together or
seperately, in a number of locations, depending on what else you're
washing at the time. There are 4 sets of flip-up-and-down prongs in
the bottom tray, allowing large/odd-shaped items to be washed, as well
as a flip-up shelf on the left. The left side of the basket is high
enough to hold cookie sheets, the flip-down shelf helps hold them in
place, and provides a spot for long narrow things, or a series of small
items. There's also a removable rack/basket thing, designed for safe
washing of kitchen knives.
The upper tray has an excellent range of places to put all sorts of
sizes and shapes, including a couple of racks designed to support wine
goblets. The right-hand side has a flip down shelf which lets me
'double-deck' smaller items, like teacups.

Oh pshaw, on Sat 23 Sep 2006 12:36:30p, news.rcn.com meant to say...

>
> "Del Cecchi" > wrote in message
> ...
>> How about putting a few of your favorite oddball items in a bag and
>> going for a tour of the dealers. Try putting the items in the rack of
>> the units you are considering to see how they fit.
>
> Clearly you are right but what I would need to do would be to put lots
> of standard items in, lots of different unusual shaped items in and then
> see how many configurations would fit: Schlepping all these around
> various different shops, hopefully all in the same area, would take an
> age
>
> It seems to me that all the units however elderly in interior design,
> would probably work if tried in the way you suggest. (I think someone
> actually made this suggestion on a review of a curious double drawer
> Fisher & Paykal unit) Hasn't anyone got any experience of which units
> ARE more compatible with varying shapes and sizes in the interior? I
> notice that some of them DO seem to be significantly more modern than
> others, such as the ones which seem to have been designed to take wine
> glasses (is it Miele?) as opposed to the GE which as I mention, will
> take them but if you put them in, NOTHING else will fit into the upper
> space
>
> What I need is someone to tell me "Yes, I had an Admiral and it could
> usually fit normal items but when I bought an Asko, I suddenly found
> that someone had bothered to design the interior as opposed to just
> putting in lots of spikes and hoping everything would fit around them
> and now I can fit all sorts of different shaped items in all the time"

The more you debate this, the more you sound like you expect everyone else
to do your research and shopping for you. The problem with that is, we all
have different needs and expectations, and we all have different dishes,
glassware, and cookware. What I find perfect, you would probably find
foul. It would behoove you to get up off your butt and examine different
brands and models yourself, taking with you anything you deem necessary to
satisfy your concerns. A dishwasher is *not* an armchair shopping item.

--
Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________

Recent polls reveal that some people have never
been polled. Until recently. --George Carlin

Thanks everyone, it does sound as if the Maytag or Bosch are the ways to do
in doing further research in this area
"The Cook" > wrote in message > I have a Bosch that
is very flexible. On the bottom rack 2 sets of
> the tines can be folded flat. I can get 4 large pots on the bottom.
> And if the things are too tall, I can take out the top rack and just
> use the bottom.
>
> The top rack also has tines that fold and the rack can be moved up and
> down. You can do a top rack only wash. I love that when I am trying
> to get jars ready for canning.
>
> The machine is quiet. My husband has walked into the kitchen and
> opened the machine door when it is running.
>
> This is my second Bosch. I had to leave the first one in the house
> when we moved.
>
> --
> Susan N.
>
> "Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
> 48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
> Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

I am now even more grateful to you for your comments on these dishwashers: I
now learn what I didn't see when I went to my local dealer which is that
there is a Maytag which has THREE racks: So the question of not being able
to put pots and pans in without losing all the rest of the space in the
dishwasher doesn't actually arise.

"news.rcn.com" <news.rnc.com> wrote in message
...
> Thanks everyone, it does sound as if the Maytag or Bosch are the ways to
> do in doing further research in this area
> "The Cook" > wrote in message > I have a Bosch that
> is very flexible. On the bottom rack 2 sets of
>> the tines can be folded flat. I can get 4 large pots on the bottom.
>> And if the things are too tall, I can take out the top rack and just
>> use the bottom.
>>
>> The top rack also has tines that fold and the rack can be moved up and
>> down. You can do a top rack only wash. I love that when I am trying
>> to get jars ready for canning.
>>
>> The machine is quiet. My husband has walked into the kitchen and
>> opened the machine door when it is running.
>>
>> This is my second Bosch. I had to leave the first one in the house
>> when we moved.
>>
>> --
>> Susan N.
>>
>> "Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
>> 48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
>> Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974
>
>