On Sun, 23 Nov 2003 11:49:22 -0700, "Mike Avery"
> wrote:

>> Except the part about starter organisms originating solely from
>> baker's hands.

>The origons of yeast are pretty well understood. They are everywhere.
>In the air. On the grain. On the baker's skin. The concentration is
>highest in the grain, so the chances or probabilities favor the grain
>being the source of the yeast.

Then how come I could not get atmosphere-based starters to activate. I
tried 4 different flours and not one of them got past the stage of
outgassing a little.

But when I used the only thing that worked, namely, a freshly-milled,
organic whole wheat flour that was not exposed to the atmosphere, I
had vigorous activity in a few hours.

I made sourdough bread from that particular starter and it is pretty
good considering that I am an amateur at this business of sourdough
baking. The final rise was substantial and it made nice holes in the
crumb, plus it had a chewy texture and a moderately strong sour taste.
I am letting it do whatever it does when it rests under refrigeration.
I am feeding it once a week by retaining 1/2 cup and adding 1/2 cup
flour and 1/2 cup distilled water, like people advise to do.

>The picture is somewhat less clear with regards to the lactobacillus
>bacteria. It isn't usually found on grain or in the air. It isn't found in
>water. It is found on human skin. And in human dental plaque. Some
>people have started sourdough starters by spitting into the flour and
>water mixture. (Look at google groups and search the
>rec.food.sourdough archives. It's there.)

<BARF>

Remind me to avoid that baker's sourdough.

Why not lace the starter with some buttermilk or yogurt?

I bought some SF SD starter from King Arthur Flour that is made in
France and asked them what the ingredients are. They said yeast,
bacteria and lactose. So why not put lactose in the new culture to
promote lactobacillus formation?

>Sourdough, like aspirin, is an old technology, and as a result not much
>is spent to investigate it in a scientific way. Frank Sugihara, Dr.
>Brummer, and a few others do research... but since it works without
>having to understand it, and since research is unlikely to make much
>money, not as much research has been, or is being, done as we might
>like.

Pity.