Glorfindel wrote:

> Scented Nectar wrote:
>
>> Leif Erikson wrote:
>
>
>>>>> pearl wrote:
>
>
>>>> You approve of people "diddling" animals
>
>
>>> No. There's no sexual gratification dimension to
>>> artificial insemination.
>
>
>> There was also no sexual gratification for Glorfindel when she allowed
>> the bird to do its thing. She only said that she thought it was sweet
>> that the bird was getting some enjoyment in its difficult life. Since
>> she did not get sexual gratification, and since the cattle ranchers
>> who, um, 'milk' the sperm from the bulls do not get gratification, they
>> are on the same moral level. Possibly Glorfindel's morals are even
>> better than the ranchers. Her motive was for the bird to be happy, and
>> their motive was to sell the sperm for money and then impregnate the
>> females without regard to letting the animals do it their own way.
>
>
>
> That is why I feel artificial insemination is wrong at both
> (bad pun ) ends of the process. The bull does not choose
> to be forced into this process. He may get some gratification,
> but that is not the purpose of the activity. The purpose
> is to *USE* an animal, make the animal a thing, a slave, a
> tool.

Nothing wrong with that. I'll point out that only
humans have been slaves.


> The person doing it doesn't *care* if the bull enjoys
> it,

Exactly!


> only that the bull produces. That is wrong.

No, it isn't.


> The same is
> true of the cow: she gets no enjoyment from the insemination
> at all.

Not an issue.


> That's why the restraint used is called a "rape rack."

Figure of speech. This term does not appear outside
quotes indicating it is a forced slang expression. As
always, Karen, being a militant dyke "feminist", you
put your buttons right out there to be pushed.


> It is rape for her,

No. There is no concept of consensual sex for animals.


> and she gets no more moral consideration than
> the bull.

Doesn't deserve any on this issue.


> She is an economic tool for the farmer.

Right. Your point is...?


> He gets
> milk (by taking the calf away and turning him into veal
> and her into another milk-machine slave) and eventually sells the
> spent cow for meat. It is a thoroughly evil system

No.


> and both inhumane and harmful to all the animals involved -- bull,
> cow, and calf.

Nonsense.


>
> It is, simply, morally evil and wrong.

False.