On 12 Jul 2006 03:56:16 -0700, "Arthur Brain" > wrote:

>
>dd wrote:
>> The right to life is possible only in a certain, different atmosphere that
>
>There is no such right.
>
>> is not present on the earth at the moment. Animals are killed, birds are
>> killed, sea animals are killed, just for game. You don't have any reverence
>
>So? Whereever there is life, there must also - inevitably - be death.
>
>There is no reason why we shouldn't kill plants or animals if it suits
>us.
>
>> for life. And life is the same whether it is in human beings or in other
>> forms. Unless man becomes aware of his violence towards animals, birds, he
>> cannot be really alert about his own right to life. If you are not caring
>
>There is no such right.
>
>> about others' lives, what right have you got to demand the same right for
>> yourself?
>
>Human rights only apply to animals in Cloud Cuckoo Land.
>
>Do *you* live in Cloud Cuckoo Land?
>
>> But the whole of humanity is non-vegetarian; they are all eating other life
>> forms. There is no reverence for life as such. Unless we create an
>> atmosphere of reverence for life, man cannot realize the goal of getting his
>> fundamental right of life.
>
>So what are you gong to eat, if you can't eat "other life forms"?

· Vegans contribute to the deaths of animals by their use of
wood and paper products, electricity, roads and all types of
buildings, their own diet, etc... just as everyone else does.
What they try to avoid are products which provide life
(and death) for farm animals, but even then they would have
to avoid the following items containing animal by-products
in order to be successful:

Tires, Paper, Upholstery, Floor waxes, Glass, Water
Filters, Rubber, Fertilizer, Antifreeze, Ceramics, Insecticides,
Insulation, Linoleum, Plastic, Textiles, Blood factors, Collagen,
Heparin, Insulin, Solvents, Biodegradable Detergents, Herbicides,
Gelatin Capsules, Adhesive Tape, Laminated Wood Products,
Plywood, Paneling, Wallpaper and Wallpaper Paste, Cellophane
Wrap and Tape, Abrasives, Steel Ball Bearings

The meat industry provides life for the animals that it
slaughters, and the animals live and die as a result of it
as animals do in other habitats. They also depend on it for
their lives as animals do in other habitats. If people consume
animal products from animals they think are raised in decent
ways, they will be promoting life for more such animals in the
future. People who want to contribute to decent lives for
livestock with their lifestyle must do it by being conscientious
consumers of animal products, because they can not do it by
being vegan.
From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat...that's well
over 500 servings of meat. From a grass raised dairy cow people
get thousands of dairy servings. Due to the influence of farm
machinery, and *icides, and in the case of rice the flooding and
draining of fields, one serving of soy or rice based product is
likely to involve more animal deaths than hundreds of servings
derived from grass raised animals. Grass raised animal products
contribute to fewer wildlife deaths, better wildlife habitat, and
better lives for livestock than soy or rice products. ·