I took Todd's formula and converted to grams. The water is
staightforward. I used an internet site to convert ounces to grams. For
the flour I used Todd's measu 4.66 cups = 699 grams and also a
Dakota Maid flour bag which listed 5 pounds = 2270 grams = 20 cups or
113.5 grams/cup.

This is what I got (I hope the table posts intact)...


Todd in
grams Dakota Maid in grams
> Sponge:
> 1/4 cup starter (week old from refridgerator) 70 grams 70 grams
> 1 cup WW flour 150 grams 114 grams
> 1 cup Bread flour 150 grams 114 grams
> 1.5 cup water 340 grams 340 grams

total 710
grams 638 grams
water 375
grams 375 grams
flour 335
grams 263 grams
sponge hydration % 112 %
143%
inoculation % 10%
11%

The inoculation % is consistant. But the sponge hydration is a real
issue. The sponge in the Dakota Maid colum will mature much faster
(less flour). At 14 hours its pH might be the same as Todd's but the
relative residual acid load will be higher as its buffering capacity is
reduced (less flour). This increased unbuffered lactic acid load causes
LBs to slow down. It will not affect the yeasts which are sensitive to
acetic acid and not at their threshold. So... depending on which sponge
is actually employed, the culture populations are shifting. The future
proof requirements (time) and the flavor are shifting too.

> Let sponge ferment 14 hours
>
> Added to sponge:
> 1 cup water 227 grams 227 grams
> 4.66 cup bread flour (699 g) 700 grams 529 grams
> 20 grams salt 20 grams 20 grams

total dough 1657 grams
1414 grams
water 602
grams 602 grams
flour 1035
grams 792 grams
dough hydration% 58%
76%
sponge percent 43%
45%

Here, we have a big discontinuity, though notice the sponge %'s are
very similar. It is hard to imagine that the dough is actually at 76%
hydration. Todd would have mentioned the wetness factor. His original
post calculated hydration at 60%. But he was thinking that he should
reduce water to promote proofing firmness. Since It is equally hard to
imagine moving down from 58-60%. We might begin to suspect the old and
recurring issue of how much flour is really in those cups. As a
benchmark... bagel dough (quite stiff) is run at 55% hydration. Now...
if the sponge was over fermented at 14 hours, the dough would feel
flabby (acid load)... unless it had a lot of flour to stiffen it. That
additional flour would support a long bulk fermation (which Todd
employs).

> knead for 12 minutes
> Fermented 4 hours at room temp,
> Punched down, fermented in fridge for 22 hours
> Split into two equal balls
> Let sit at room temp for 1 hour
> Shaped, proofed in oiled bowls for 2 hours
> Baked for about 40 minutes at about 400F on gas grill w/ wood chips on
> a pizza stone

Adding a lot of flour would allow the dough to survive the next 4 hours
at room temp and 22 hours in the refrigerator. Its bulk proof would be
fine, and as Todd says, it doubles, but it's culture is now weighted to
yeasts. This is because the sponge LBs were over fermented and don't
carry vigorously into the bulk proof AND the long refrigerator stage
prevents their recovery.

At this point the question to Todd is... "what does the dough smell
like at final shaping? does it smell sour?" This will tell us something
about where the yeasts are.

In reference to another thread, where Dusty and I are squared off on
volume vs weight, I hope Dusty will respond.

I have tried to establish here that the inoculation ratios of starter
to sponge, and, sponge to dough were very similar whether we used cups
or scales. This indicates water, not flour, drives this observation.
This is worth pondering.

It is significant that we do not have a firm grasp of flour levels,
which is what ferments.