Steve Jackson wrote:

> "dgs" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>>Pilsner Urquell
>>
>>Used to be interesting back in the days of the wooden barrels. Now
>>being turned by SABMiller into yet another international label.
>
> Did you actually ever have any of the wood barrel PU? IIRC, wasn't that
> change made long before the Iron Curtain fell (I want to say the late '70s)
> and before PU became widely available in the west?

The change didn't come until a couple of years after the end of the
Iron Curtain era. The open fermenters were retired in 1995. There is
still a teensy tiny proportion aged in some wooden vessels, ostensibly
for "quality control" purposes.

I also had PU on draught before the Iron Curtain fell, as it was sold
in Germany and Austria back then, and available on draught. The stuff
was quite good. Wood character was not overwhelmingly evident by any
means - IIRC, the vessels were pitch-lined to prevent that - but the PU
12-degree lager of yore trod a fine line between rustic old-fashioned
beer and something a little more current and smooth. I think the
old-fashioned rustic character is much more subdued. They claim they
try, and I believe they do, but ... ah, memories.

> If you have and you can attest to a taste difference, that's quite
> interesting.

I have, and it's too bad that those days are gone forever. The problem
is, there's no way now to compare a fresh example of the "old" PU with
the modern, cleaner version. Or at least there's no easy way.

> Otherwise, a part of your anatomy that shouldn't be capable of
> speech is doing a lot of talking.

That would likely be true anyway, of course. And that part of my
anatomy routinely pronounces words like "spat" and "fit" just fine. It
isn't so different from listening to politicians or used-car salesmen.

>>> Lindeman's Kriek
>>
>>Nice for beginners who like something sweet. Give me Hanssens or
>>Girardin or Drie Fonteinen or Cantillon, please.
>
> Depends on what you're looking for. If you look at Lindeman's as a lambic,
> it falls short. If you look at it as a simple fruit beer, it's pretty damn
> good.

This is true. The lambic character underneath that beer is drowned out
by the sweetness to a certain extent, but a glass of Lindemans Framboise
with a nice little assortment of Neuhaus pralines is not a bad thing, as
desserts go. Still, if that's all someone has to hold up as an example
of how great a 115-tap bar is, that's kinda stretching. If, out of a
ridiculous number of taps like that, I find 11 really exceptional beers,
I figure that's about as good as it gets for those kinds of places. But
if I go into my local with maybe 20 taps, and find five great beers, I
take that for granted. The fact that all of the beers aren't ice-cold
and served in frosted mugs or glassware is a good thing, too.

> BTW, speaking of FG lambics, Drie Fonteinen is now in the States. Picked
> some up last night in Costa Mesa. I was quite happy. Now, if Girardin made
> it here, life would be really good.

Be prepared to be even happier, then. A distributor of imported beers
let me have a look in their book about a month and a half ago, and on
the list was Girardin Guezue. Black label, too. *sproing!* Reminds
me to go bug the guys at the best beer shop in town. Maybe in a couple
of weeks.

Drie Fonteinen has been in some U.S. markets for a while, but with
typically sporadic distribution and availability. My local managed
to lay in a stash of the 1999 and 2000 gueuzes. They also cornered a
stash of some Oud Beersel Kriek and Gueuze. (I like my local. A lot.)
Good on you that you can get some reasonably nearby (by LA standards,
anyway).
--
dgs