"williamwaller" > wrote in message =
news:mailman.11.1093486323.1141.rec.food.sourdough @mail.otherwhen.com...

> [ ... ]

> Peter Reinhart is an advocate of retained dough starters. In Bread =
Baker's
> Apprentice he has some formulas that use both: meaning old dough and=20
> liquid starter, in the same bread. I have tried this but only notice a =
flavor
> difference when the dough is not overnighted in the refrigerator.

To me it seems that old dough is a starter that has hardly been started. =
It
has got some yeast and probably some other microorganisms. Mixed with
an active starter, its microorganisms must constitute a very minute =
minority,
however.

Anyway, that procedure is categorically a technique of starter-culture
manipulation, and therefore, by me, relatively, if not totally, =
inefficacious,
inasmuch as the sourdough flavors develop later on (towards the end of
the rise).

> If you cannot run a long, cool fermentation cycle, the addition of =
retained=20
> dough makes a better bread. I imagine the lack of refrigeration was =
what=20
> the European bakers were trying to address with this method.

I do not know what part of the procedure the fermentation cycle is, if =
it
is not the whole of it til bake. It continues to be a mystery to me =
that any
one would want to run all of it, or any part of it, cold, if warm were=20
available, since all aspects of it are accelerated by warmth. What is =
it
about European bakers -- do they lack refrigerators? Well, certainly
not the Old ones, maybe some of the new ones. =20

I recommend to forget Peter Reinhart (, Joe Ortiz, Nancy Silverton, et =
al.)
-- he (they) just get(s) people all confused.

It is possible to tell how to make SD bread without saying "chef", =
"biga"
"levain", "old dough", "poolish", etc. You can do it without even =
saying
"fermentation", using the descriptive power of everyday English. =
Writers
avoid that, however, in the interest of making their books long enough =
to
command a price.

--=20
Dick Adams
(Sourdough minimalist)
<firstname> dot <lastname> at bigfoot dot com
___________________
Sourdough FAQ guide at=20
http://www.nyx.net/~dgreenw/sourdoughfaqs.html