On 3/8/2012 1:22 PM, dh@. wrote:
> On Wed, 7 Mar 2012 13:57:21 -0800, > wrote:
>
>> <dh@.> wrote in message ...
>>> On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 12:55:32 +0000, > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 06/03/2012 08:57, Rupert wrote:
>>>
>>>>> On Mar 6, 5:08 am, Goo wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> Woopert, "glen" here is a "vegan" who claims his diet doesn't kill
>>>>>> *any*
>>>>>> animals. What do you have to say to him, Woopert?
>>>>>
>>>>> He is incorrect.
>>>>
>>>> I have never denied that animals die during crop production. What I
>>>> deny is ... [Goo's] baseless claim that all the food I eat is
>>>> /contaminated/
>>>> with it.
>>>
>>> · Vegans contribute to the deaths of animals [...]
>>
>> See ...Prof. Geo. Plimpton arguing against veganism.
>
> "People who don't want them to exist should be "vegans".
> "Vegans" aren't interested in contributing to lives of any
> quality for farm animals: they don't want there to be farm
> animals." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

A true statement.


>
> "Life "justifying" death is the stupidest goddamned thing
> you ever wrote." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.


>
> "NO livestock benefit from being farmed." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> "No farm animals benefit from farming." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> "There is nothing to "appreciate" about the livestock "getting
> to experience life" - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
>> See how he ALWAYS does.
>
> ""vegans" are interested in their influence on animals,
> ****wit. They want everyone to be "vegan", which would
> mean no animals raised for food and other products. That's
> an influence, whether you like it or not." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> ""Veg*nism" certainly doesn't harm any living farm animals.
> And if everyone adopted "veg*nism", no farm animals would
> live in bad conditions." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> ""Getting to experience life" has no significance." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> "the "getting to experience life" deserves NO moral
> consideration, and is given none; the deliberate killing
> of animals for use by humans DOES deserve moral
> consideration, and gets it." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> ""giving them life" does NOT mitigate the wrongness, if any,
> of their deaths" - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

>
> "Causing animals to be born and "get to experience life"
> (in ****wit's wretched prose) is no mitigation at all for
> killing them." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

Another true statement.

They are all true statements.


>
> "When considering your food choices ethically, assign
> ZERO weight to the morally empty fact that choosing to
> eat meat causes animals to be bred into existence." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
>> See how you continue to insist that he a<sic> "eliminationist".
>
> ""giving them life" does NOT mitigate the wrongness of
> their deaths" - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
> "the nutritionally unnecessary choice deliberately to kill an animal
> ALWAYS causes a moral harm greater in magnitude than . . . the
> moral "benefit" realized by the animal in existing at all" - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
> "the moral harm, if any, caused by killing them is greater in magnitude
> than ANY benefit they might derive from "decent lives" - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
> "The meaningless fact-lette that farm animals "get to
> experience life" deserves no consideration when asking
> whether or not it is moral to kill them. Zero." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
> "no matter how "decent" the conditions are, the deliberate killing
> of the animals erases all of it." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
>> See how that shows what a fool you are.
>
> "you MUST believe that it makes moral sense not to raise the
> animals as the only way to prevent the harm that results from
> killing them." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
> "Humans could change it. They could change it by ending it." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton
>
> "There is no "selfishness" involved in wanting farm animals not to
> exist as a step towards creating a more just world." - Prof. Geo. Plimpton

All true.