Salut/Hi Clyde,

le/on Tue, 28 Oct 2003 17:58:52 -0600, tu disais/you said:-

>> I don't agree with the EU on this btw, but I feel that winemaking techniques shouldn't be
>>trademarked. But only if they did in fact use ALL the significant champagne
>>techniques and their wine was made at the same high pressure.

>I agree with all you've stated Ian, especially this statement above,

Thanks.

>which has me questioning why it's been ruled against here in the
>states.

Probably to avoid making a rod for their own back later.

> Shouldn't they be changing the rule on use of appellation
>terms on the front label, instead of messing with winemaking terms?

I think so, yes. There's another "Cuvée sur Lie" which has become the
private preserve of the Muscadet growers. Whenever I meet one, I tell him
clrealy what I think of it. If you can protect "cuvée sur lie" you would be
able to protect "Bottle fermented", it seems to me. A bad decision, typical
of protectionism.

>
>Few things erk me more than CA wines being called Chablis, especially
>when they are made from Thompson Seedless!

Grin!

>The subject interests me as we are making our first commercial
>sparkling wine this year and have been looking for label terms. It
>seems like Methode Traditionalle is the most descriptive term
>available beyond "fermented in this bottle" which has always been
>awkward at best. What would one think otherwise: it was fermented in
>the bottle next to it?

As Dana said, someone could use very large bottles and then decant and
legally call it "bottle fermented". If you want to use french expressions
(which I'm not very much in favour on a CA bottle of wine for the same sort
of reasons I'm against the use of french wine names) on the label, then the
expression "Methode Traditionnelle" is the one that is used throughout
France.

>Sparkling wine is another awkward term.

Well, all wines with bubbles can be called that. Remember that there are
three ways of introducing CO2 into wine. Pumping it in. Fermenting in vats
(I'm tempted to say that I see little difference between that and using
large bottles), followed by filling the bottles under pressure, and
fermenting in the bottles in which the wine is sold with the concommitant
operations of disgorging and dosing. I think it's reasonable to want to
specify that you're bottle fermenting.

>we want something that the customers will be comfortable with and
>still understand what's in the bottle.

Well, I'd strongly suggest a powerful brand name, "Dom Pérignon" doesn't
really NEED to say anything other than that. I would lean towards the
english language expression "Tradionally bottle fermented" (if it's legal).

>In the case of champagne, or crackling wines, the type designation
>"champagne" or "crackling wine" ("petillant wine", "frizzante wine")
>may appear in lieu of the class designation "sparkling wine".
>
>________
>
>Even our government casually calls it Champagne!

One could argue that this is an unhappy conflation. I _could_ interpret that
to mean that the term champagne may appear in lieu of the class designation
"sparkling wine" in the case of champagne, while the other expressions could
appear in the place of "sparkling wine" in the case of crackling wines.

>I tend to like the term "petillant", but how many of my customers
>would know what that means? It's not even in my dictionary.

Pétillant is a nice word, but in France it is often used to describe wines
slightly LESS fizzy than champagne and others of the same type. France uses
the word "Crémant" as in "Crémant de Bourgogne" "Crémant d'Alsace" and so
on, for wines made by the Methode champenoise.

>And crackling wine sounds dangerous. Where'd that come from?

God knows.... fireworks?


--
All the Best
Ian Hoare

Sometimes oi just sits and thinks
Sometimes oi just sits.