On Sun, 10 Jan 2010 17:16:03 -0800, "Dutch" > wrote:

>On Sun, 10 Jan 2010 14:18:23 -0500, dh@. wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 8 Jan 2010 11:45:15 -0800 (PST), Rupert
> wrote:
>>
>>>Ball seems to make this statement often enough. I claim that the vast
>>>majority of people living in developed nations who make a transition
>>>to an omnivorous diet to a vegan diet achieve a signfiicant reduction
>>>in the amount of suffering, premature death, and injection of carbons
>>>in the atmosphere caused by the production of their food, and also in
>>>most cases they'd probably struggle a fair bit to achieve a comparable
>>>reduction by any means short of avoiding animal products almost
>>>completely.
>>
>> · Vegans contribute to the deaths of animals by their use of
>>wood and paper products, electricity, roads and all types of
>>buildings, their own diet, etc... just as everyone else does.
>>What they try to avoid are products which provide life
>>(and death) for farm animals, but even then they would have
>>to avoid the following items containing animal by-products
>>in order to be successful:
>>
>>tires, paper, upholstery, floor waxes, glass, water
>>filters, rubber, fertilizer, antifreeze, ceramics, insecticides,
>>insulation, linoleum, plastic, textiles, blood factors, collagen,
>>heparin, insulin, solvents, biodegradable detergents, herbicides,
>>gelatin capsules, adhesive tape, laminated wood products,
>>plywood, paneling, wallpaper and wallpaper paste, cellophane
>>wrap and tape, abrasives, steel ball bearings
>>
>> The meat industry provides life for the animals that it
>>slaughters, and the animals live and die as a result of it
>>as animals do in other habitats. They also depend on it for
>>their lives as animals do in other habitats. If people consume
>>animal products from animals they think are raised in decent
>>ways, they will be promoting life for more such animals in the
>>future. People who want to contribute to decent lives for
>>livestock with their lifestyle must do it by being conscientious
>>consumers of animal products, because they can not do it by
>>being vegan.
>> From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
>>steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
>>get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat...that's well
>>over 500 servings of meat. From a grass raised dairy cow people
>>get thousands of dairy servings. Due to the influence of farm
>>machinery, and *icides, and in the case of rice the flooding and
>>draining of fields, one serving of soy or rice based product is
>>likely to involve more animal deaths than hundreds of servings
>>derived from grass raised animals. Grass raised animal products
>>contribute to fewer wildlife deaths, better wildlife habitat, and
>>better lives for livestock than soy or rice products. ·
>
>Jam the boilerplate bullshit up your ass.

It was all true when I wrote it years ago, it's still just as
true as it was then, and it will continue to be true in the
future.