"Rupert" > wrote

Never in my life have I believed that the typical vegan lifestyle does
not involving buying any products whose production contributes to the
suffering and premature death of sentient nonhumans. I was well aware
that that was not the case in adolescence, before I seriously
contemplated giving up meat, and frequently discussed the point with
my friends. I would certainly be aware of the truth of that matter one
way or the other. I believe you once remarked that I had no reason to
disbelieve Dutch about some testimony that he gave, well, you have no
rational grounds whatsoever for disbelieving this testimony.
---------->

Again, the elephant in the room, the REAL issue, the issue of viewing
animals as commodities. I think the concern is misguided politicking.

Veganism clearly addresses that issue, but vegans frequently confuse,
conflate and equivocate that issue with issues of legitimate concern, like
health, the environment and animal suffering. Don't assume that by avoiding
that sauce or substituting that tofu steak for that salmon steak you
contributed to lessening animal suffering in any meaningful way, even though
you fulfilled your goal to remain pure, to avoid being an "exploiter" using
animals *as end products*.

Personally it does not bother me that animals are viewed as commodities, as
long as their capacity to suffer pain and deprivation is taken into account.