On 22 nov, 20:08, dh@. wrote:
> * · Vegans contribute to the deaths of animals by their use of
> wood and paper products, electricity, roads and all types of
> buildings, their own diet, etc... just as everyone else does.
> What they try to avoid are products which provide life
> (and death) for farm animals, but even then they would have
> to avoid the following items containing animal by-products
> in order to be successful:
>
> tires, paper, upholstery, floor waxes, glass, water
> filters, rubber, fertilizer, antifreeze, ceramics, insecticides,
> insulation, linoleum, plastic, textiles, blood factors, collagen,
> heparin, insulin, solvents, biodegradable detergents, herbicides,
> gelatin capsules, *adhesive tape, laminated wood products,
> plywood, paneling, wallpaper and wallpaper paste, cellophane
> wrap and tape, abrasives, steel ball bearings
>
> * * The meat industry provides life for the animals that it
> slaughters, and the animals live and die as a result of it
> as animals do in other habitats. They also depend on it for
> their lives as animals do in other habitats. If people consume
> animal products from animals they think are raised in decent
> ways, they will be promoting life for more such animals in the
> future. People who want to contribute to decent lives for
> livestock with their lifestyle must do it by being conscientious
> consumers of animal products, because they can not do it by
> being vegan.
> * * From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
> steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
> get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat...that's well
> over 500 servings of meat. From a grass raised dairy cow people
> get thousands of dairy servings. Due to the influence of farm
> machinery, and *icides, and in the case of rice the flooding and
> draining of fields, one serving of soy or rice based product is
> likely to involve more animal deaths than hundreds of servings
> derived from grass raised animals. Grass raised animal products
> contribute to fewer wildlife deaths, better wildlife habitat, and
> better lives for livestock than soy or rice products. ·

Are you joking?
First of all the original message was about the environmental harm
factory farming does. You did not react to that at all. You also
forget to mention how many resources are needed for that 500 pounds of
meat.
To say factory farming is beneficially for animals is just a load of
rubbish.
Being bred for a live of suffering and being killed when you haven't
even reached maturity is NOT a good thing.
It is not about the number of animals but about the quality of their
lives.
If factory farming is a good thing for non-human animals we could
start breeding humans from 3th world countries as well.

Going vegan is the BEST thing you can do. And yes currently a lot of
things still hurt animals (without us knowing it). But if more become
vegan, more options will become available.

Also going vegan sends a message to improve the conditions of non-
human animals. So by going vegan new animal welfare measurements will
be taken.
Fighting for animal welfare is a waste of time. The same changes will
happen by go vegan.

Most if not all animal welfare measurements are taken because they are
economically sound for the industry.
If enough people go vegan, the industry will need to take measurements
that will get them customers (even vegans) so

Going VEGAN is the BEST one can do for the animals, for the planet and
for your health!