Winemaking (rec.crafts.winemaking) Discussion of the process, recipes, tips, techniques and general exchange of lore on the process, methods and history of wine making. Includes traditional grape wines, sparkling wines & champagnes.

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Tom
 
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I've got a little problem here that I thought someone could weight in on. I
purchased two boxes of Merlot grapes on Sat., they pressed them for me and I
took them home. I poured it out and got about two buckets of 5.5 gallons of
juice. The SG was 1.100 and the pH was 3.64. I did not measure acids. I
added two campden tablets (.75) to each bucket and started two packets of
yeast in two dishes. Sunday, I mixed the two yeast starters (and nutrients)
into the two buckets. Unfortunately after Sunday, I was not able to stir
the buckets until Tues. and again on Thurs. My problem is, I never got any
bubbles or foam on top of the must. I tried another yeast starter (and more
yeast nutrients) and again nothing. I tried a third time and said " hey
whoa, what's going on here". I took a reading with my hydrometer and it was
around 1.010. Could this must fermented already? Can juice ferment without
foam and bubbles? Anybody got any ideas about what happened? Thanks in
advance for any help.


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pp
 
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Seems like the sg he numbers are telling you all you need to know -
yes, it's fermenting, and fast at that. You can always taste the must
to make sure - at this point you've got about 10% alcohol so that
should be pretty obvious that it's not just juice anymore.

I haven't seen ferments without bubbles a/o foam but apparently it's
possible.

What are you making anw? I'm puzzled that you've only got juice from
the Merlot and not crushed grapes. If it's just juice, then you don't
need to stir it at all during ferment.

In any case, if your numbers are correct, you should start thinking
about racking into a carboy soon.

Pp

Tom wrote:
> I've got a little problem here that I thought someone could weight in on. I
> purchased two boxes of Merlot grapes on Sat., they pressed them for me and I
> took them home. I poured it out and got about two buckets of 5.5 gallons of
> juice. The SG was 1.100 and the pH was 3.64. I did not measure acids. I
> added two campden tablets (.75) to each bucket and started two packets of
> yeast in two dishes. Sunday, I mixed the two yeast starters (and nutrients)
> into the two buckets. Unfortunately after Sunday, I was not able to stir
> the buckets until Tues. and again on Thurs. My problem is, I never got any
> bubbles or foam on top of the must. I tried another yeast starter (and more
> yeast nutrients) and again nothing. I tried a third time and said " hey
> whoa, what's going on here". I took a reading with my hydrometer and it was
> around 1.010. Could this must fermented already? Can juice ferment without
> foam and bubbles? Anybody got any ideas about what happened? Thanks in
> advance for any help.


  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tom
 
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The place where I purchased the merlot grapes, crushed and squeezed the
grapes giving me just juice. They mix in rice hulls during the squeeze. If
you wanted, you could get some of the pulp to add to the juice for
fermentation. I choose to get just the juice with sediment still in the
juice. Since my hydrometer says the sugar levels are low, I racked the
must/wine into carboys, leaving most of the sediment, and added a little bit
more SO2. There is very little bubbling in the air locks. In the 30 years
that I have been making wine, I just have never seen a fermentation as quick
or one lacking so little foam or bubbles. I thought maybe it was because I
couldn't get to stir the must during the week. Anyway, I can smell the
alcohol so I guess I proceed from here.


"pp" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Seems like the sg he numbers are telling you all you need to know -
> yes, it's fermenting, and fast at that. You can always taste the must
> to make sure - at this point you've got about 10% alcohol so that
> should be pretty obvious that it's not just juice anymore.
>
> I haven't seen ferments without bubbles a/o foam but apparently it's
> possible.
>
> What are you making anw? I'm puzzled that you've only got juice from
> the Merlot and not crushed grapes. If it's just juice, then you don't
> need to stir it at all during ferment.
>
> In any case, if your numbers are correct, you should start thinking
> about racking into a carboy soon.
>
> Pp
>
> Tom wrote:
>> I've got a little problem here that I thought someone could weight in on.
>> I
>> purchased two boxes of Merlot grapes on Sat., they pressed them for me
>> and I
>> took them home. I poured it out and got about two buckets of 5.5 gallons
>> of
>> juice. The SG was 1.100 and the pH was 3.64. I did not measure acids. I
>> added two campden tablets (.75) to each bucket and started two packets of
>> yeast in two dishes. Sunday, I mixed the two yeast starters (and
>> nutrients)
>> into the two buckets. Unfortunately after Sunday, I was not able to stir
>> the buckets until Tues. and again on Thurs. My problem is, I never got
>> any
>> bubbles or foam on top of the must. I tried another yeast starter (and
>> more
>> yeast nutrients) and again nothing. I tried a third time and said " hey
>> whoa, what's going on here". I took a reading with my hydrometer and it
>> was
>> around 1.010. Could this must fermented already? Can juice ferment
>> without
>> foam and bubbles? Anybody got any ideas about what happened? Thanks in
>> advance for any help.

>



  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
pp
 
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Ok, sounds like it's on the right track. For next time, though, there
is no need to add SO2 at this stage, it just gets metabolized by the
yeast, so there is no benefit. It's actually detrimental if you're
planning on doing an ML on this wine.

I've done red juice as well as grapes, and for my taste, I wouldn't go
back to just juice. There is a lot of goodness in the skins that you're
missing in juice only ferments. If you don't have big equipment, you
can do a "press" for small amounts like 100 lbs using a straining bag
or nylon hose or similar; it only takes an hour or so.

Good luck,

Pp

Tom wrote:
> The place where I purchased the merlot grapes, crushed and squeezed the
> grapes giving me just juice. They mix in rice hulls during the squeeze. If
> you wanted, you could get some of the pulp to add to the juice for
> fermentation. I choose to get just the juice with sediment still in the
> juice. Since my hydrometer says the sugar levels are low, I racked the
> must/wine into carboys, leaving most of the sediment, and added a little bit
> more SO2. There is very little bubbling in the air locks. In the 30 years
> that I have been making wine, I just have never seen a fermentation as quick
> or one lacking so little foam or bubbles. I thought maybe it was because I
> couldn't get to stir the must during the week. Anyway, I can smell the
> alcohol so I guess I proceed from here.
>


  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tom
 
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I added the SO2 at this stage in case there were any strange yeasts or
bacteria doing something funky causing the wine yeast not to work properly.
I was not planning on a ML. I've done both juice and grapes and I appreciate
your response, but I think I will continue with just juice as this works out
better for me. My question/problem was simply had anyone ever seen a
fermentation with no foam or bubbles, apparently, you haven't.


"pp" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Ok, sounds like it's on the right track. For next time, though, there
> is no need to add SO2 at this stage, it just gets metabolized by the
> yeast, so there is no benefit. It's actually detrimental if you're
> planning on doing an ML on this wine.
>
> I've done red juice as well as grapes, and for my taste, I wouldn't go
> back to just juice. There is a lot of goodness in the skins that you're
> missing in juice only ferments. If you don't have big equipment, you
> can do a "press" for small amounts like 100 lbs using a straining bag
> or nylon hose or similar; it only takes an hour or so.
>
> Good luck,
>
> Pp
>
> Tom wrote:
>> The place where I purchased the merlot grapes, crushed and squeezed the
>> grapes giving me just juice. They mix in rice hulls during the squeeze.
>> If
>> you wanted, you could get some of the pulp to add to the juice for
>> fermentation. I choose to get just the juice with sediment still in the
>> juice. Since my hydrometer says the sugar levels are low, I racked the
>> must/wine into carboys, leaving most of the sediment, and added a little
>> bit
>> more SO2. There is very little bubbling in the air locks. In the 30
>> years
>> that I have been making wine, I just have never seen a fermentation as
>> quick
>> or one lacking so little foam or bubbles. I thought maybe it was because
>> I
>> couldn't get to stir the must during the week. Anyway, I can smell the
>> alcohol so I guess I proceed from here.
>>

>
>





  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Joe Sallustio
 
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No, it's not possible. The byproducts of fermentation are CO2 and
alcohol in roughly equal parts. I had a Seyval stored in a hot car
fement almost dry on a 4 hour trip once, it never foamed over either.

I make a Grenache like your Merlot and it goes pretty quickly, it is
well liked.

Joe

  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tom
 
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Thank you Joe, that answers it.

"Joe Sallustio" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> No, it's not possible. The byproducts of fermentation are CO2 and
> alcohol in roughly equal parts. I had a Seyval stored in a hot car
> fement almost dry on a 4 hour trip once, it never foamed over either.
>
> I make a Grenache like your Merlot and it goes pretty quickly, it is
> well liked.
>
> Joe
>



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