effervescence after 8 months?
 

vic wrote:
> I transferred a mix of Cab/Merlot/Sangiovese from the barrel today
after
> pressing last Sept. The wine tasted sweet, and sort of carbonated -
like a
> champagne.
> I put into demi-jons with air-locks and I am getting a small rate of
> bubbles - not insignificant.
> Is it possible that the wine still has fermentation to go? Even
after 8
> months? Should I add yeast to help it along, or just let nature take

> course? I've never had anything like this happen before.
> Any ideas and comments from this group are appreciated, and thanks in

> advance.
> Vic

Hello Vic,

I am new to the group, but not new to winemaking. Maybe I can help.
What was the initial gravity of the juice and what is the gravity now?
Also, what strain of yeast did you use? Some of them leave more
residual sugar, and others ferment more completely and leave you with a
wine that is much drier.

vic wrote:

> I transferred a mix of Cab/Merlot/Sangiovese from the barrel today after
> pressing last Sept. The wine tasted sweet, and sort of carbonated - like
> a champagne.
> I put into demi-jons with air-locks and I am getting a small rate of
> bubbles - not insignificant.
> Is it possible that the wine still has fermentation to go? Even after 8
> months? Should I add yeast to help it along, or just let nature take
> course? I've never had anything like this happen before.
> Any ideas and comments from this group are appreciated, and thanks in
> advance.
> Vic

Probably a natural malo lactic fermentation going on. Suggest you get a
paper chromatography kit and check when you think it is complet before
bottling. Also check your free SO2 and pH and prior to bottling.

wrote:
> Hello Vic,
>
> I am new to the group, but not new to winemaking. Maybe I can help.
> What was the initial gravity of the juice and what is the gravity now?
> Also, what strain of yeast did you use? Some of them leave more
> residual sugar, and others ferment more completely and leave you with a
> wine that is much drier.

Thanks for your reply.
I added no yeast, nor any other ingredient. I do not add any chemicals
to the wine at any time. Closest I get is sterilizng equiptment and
bottles with sulfites.
The SG started at 1.11, PA 15, and PS 27 at crush.
10 days later at press time, SG 1.014, PA 2, and PS 3.5.
I have not measured current gravity but can only guess its greater than
1.
Its now been a week since transfer and the bubbling continues with
visible effervescence up the demi jon walls, which are air locked. I
will let continue until still with not real concern for anything
negative. Perhaps just the opposite? Your view?

Vic wrote "I added no yeast, nor any other ingredient. I do not add any
chemicals
> to the wine at any time. Closest I get is sterilizng equiptment and
> bottles with sulfites.
> The SG started at 1.11, PA 15, and PS 27 at crush.
> 10 days later at press time, SG 1.014, PA 2, and PS 3.5.
> I have not measured current gravity but can only guess its greater than
> 1.
> Its now been a week since transfer and the bubbling continues with
> visible effervescence up the demi jon walls, which are air locked. "

Vic - Like Paul said it's probably a malo-latic fermentation. Especially
since you don't add any yeast or malo-lactic culture to your wines. Let it
run to completion which may take several weeks depending on temperature.
BTW, what is PS.

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas USA

Bill,
He said it still tastes sweet, he used natural yeasts and had a high
starting gravity. It could be MLF but it sure sounds like the yeast
'gave up the ghost' to me.

With a PA of 1.11 natural yeast may not complete the alcoholic
fermentation; I wouldn't have tried that if the goal was dry. I would
have used K1V on it and kept it warm.

I have Sangiovese that is too sweet and am going to use a heating pad
on it to finish it, it's too sluggish and making me nervous.

Joe

Good points Joe. I missed the part about the wine still tasting sweet. I
think you're right about natural yeast not being able to complete a wine
starting at 1011. Plenty of discussion here about how to restart a stuck
fermentation and that's probably in order. I always add ML culture so the
fermentation completes before cold cellar temperatures set in so I thought
Vic's wine might just be starting the ML after cellar conditions warm up in
spring.

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas UsA

"Joe Sallustio" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Bill,
> He said it still tastes sweet, he used natural yeasts and had a high
> starting gravity. It could be MLF but it sure sounds like the yeast
> 'gave up the ghost' to me.
>
> With a PA of 1.11 natural yeast may not complete the alcoholic
> fermentation; I wouldn't have tried that if the goal was dry. I would
> have used K1V on it and kept it warm.
>
> I have Sangiovese that is too sweet and am going to use a heating pad
> on it to finish it, it's too sluggish and making me nervous.
>
> Joe
>

Is there a veiled suggestion to try and re-start the process by adding
yeast, now? If so, can I get some specifics please?
Incidently, I am still getting a very slow rate of tiny bubbles and the
airlock shows positive pressure.
Thanks,
Vic
"William Frazier" > wrote in message
...
> Good points Joe. I missed the part about the wine still tasting sweet. I
> think you're right about natural yeast not being able to complete a wine
> starting at 1011. Plenty of discussion here about how to restart a stuck
> fermentation and that's probably in order. I always add ML culture so the
> fermentation completes before cold cellar temperatures set in so I thought
> Vic's wine might just be starting the ML after cellar conditions warm up
> in spring.
>
> Bill Frazier
> Olathe, Kansas UsA
>
> "Joe Sallustio" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> Bill,
>> He said it still tastes sweet, he used natural yeasts and had a high
>> starting gravity. It could be MLF but it sure sounds like the yeast
>> 'gave up the ghost' to me.
>>
>> With a PA of 1.11 natural yeast may not complete the alcoholic
>> fermentation; I wouldn't have tried that if the goal was dry. I would
>> have used K1V on it and kept it warm.
>>
>> I have Sangiovese that is too sweet and am going to use a heating pad
>> on it to finish it, it's too sluggish and making me nervous.
>>
>> Joe
>>
>
>

Hi Vic - The slow, tiny bubbles sound like a malo-lactic fermentation to me.
Joe reminded me that you said the wine still tasted sweet. So, the bubbles
could be from a regular yeast fermentation, a ML fermentation or maybe both.
Since you don't add yeast or ML culture any of the above is possible. To be
sure of what's going on you could do a chromatograpy test and see if lactic
acid is present. Or, just let the wine go and wait for it to finish
whatever type fermentation is underway.

Knock on wood, I've never had a stuck fermentation. But those that have
give a general method to restart using fresh yeast. Hydrate yeast, add a
small amount of grape juice and get a strong fermentation going. Then add
some of your stuck wine. When this mixture is fermenting strongly add more
stuck wine...and so on.

But, since you like to ferment naturally I would just let the wine finish
out as is. Tincture of time cures lots of problems.

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas USA


"vic" > wrote in message
...
> Is there a veiled suggestion to try and re-start the process by adding
> yeast, now? If so, can I get some specifics please?
> Incidently, I am still getting a very slow rate of tiny bubbles and the
> airlock shows positive pressure.
> Thanks,
> Vic

I agree - time heals all (usually) - thanks for the suggestion. Will keep
posted.
Vic
"William Frazier" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Vic - The slow, tiny bubbles sound like a malo-lactic fermentation to
> me. Joe reminded me that you said the wine still tasted sweet. So, the
> bubbles could be from a regular yeast fermentation, a ML fermentation or
> maybe both. Since you don't add yeast or ML culture any of the above is
> possible. To be sure of what's going on you could do a chromatograpy test
> and see if lactic acid is present. Or, just let the wine go and wait for
> it to finish whatever type fermentation is underway.
>
> Knock on wood, I've never had a stuck fermentation. But those that have
> give a general method to restart using fresh yeast. Hydrate yeast, add a
> small amount of grape juice and get a strong fermentation going. Then add
> some of your stuck wine. When this mixture is fermenting strongly add
> more stuck wine...and so on.
>
> But, since you like to ferment naturally I would just let the wine finish
> out as is. Tincture of time cures lots of problems.
>
> Bill Frazier
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
>
> "vic" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Is there a veiled suggestion to try and re-start the process by adding
>> yeast, now? If so, can I get some specifics please?
>> Incidently, I am still getting a very slow rate of tiny bubbles and the
>> airlock shows positive pressure.
>> Thanks,
>> Vic
>
>

I guess I'm late to this discussion, but I have another thought.

This past fall, Ihad a batch of syrah which was doing the same things
as your Cab mix. Ultimately, I innoculated for MLF, and then
re-innoculated after several months. Still, I was getting persistent
minor bubbling. Finally, after fooling with this wine for about 7-8
months, I just tried degassing it with a stirring wand on a drill.
After LOTS of agitation, the bubbling stopped, and hasn't
re-startedafter another 2-3 months. It tastes "sweet", but the R.S. is
virtually zero.

So, I wonder if the sweetness is just the flavor of your grapes, and
the bubbles are retained CO2.

Lee

Glycerin is a by product of fermentation. Some yeast produce more of it
than others and some conditions favor it's production and I think some
grapes tend toward it. I don't know exactly what they are but it happens.
The army, in wars past, has used fermentation to manufacture glycerin.
Anyway, glycerin is sweet and adds legs to your wine. Some people add
glycerin for the legs. When a wine comes out tasting sweet but has a low
RS, it may be that you have a high glycerin content. You might check it to
see if it has strong legs.

Ray

"Lee" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I guess I'm late to this discussion, but I have another thought.
>
> This past fall, Ihad a batch of syrah which was doing the same things
> as your Cab mix. Ultimately, I innoculated for MLF, and then
> re-innoculated after several months. Still, I was getting persistent
> minor bubbling. Finally, after fooling with this wine for about 7-8
> months, I just tried degassing it with a stirring wand on a drill.
> After LOTS of agitation, the bubbling stopped, and hasn't
> re-startedafter another 2-3 months. It tastes "sweet", but the R.S. is
> virtually zero.
>
> So, I wonder if the sweetness is just the flavor of your grapes, and
> the bubbles are retained CO2.
>
> Lee
>

Your situation sounds very similar. I'll try the innoculation and stirring
to see if that quiets it down. BTW, still bubbling - even to point it's
raised into the airlock - seems like the little drum banging bunny on TV,
keeps going and going...
'Appreciate the suggestion.
Vic
"Lee" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I guess I'm late to this discussion, but I have another thought.
>
> This past fall, Ihad a batch of syrah which was doing the same things
> as your Cab mix. Ultimately, I innoculated for MLF, and then
> re-innoculated after several months. Still, I was getting persistent
> minor bubbling. Finally, after fooling with this wine for about 7-8
> months, I just tried degassing it with a stirring wand on a drill.
> After LOTS of agitation, the bubbling stopped, and hasn't
> re-startedafter another 2-3 months. It tastes "sweet", but the R.S. is
> virtually zero.
>
> So, I wonder if the sweetness is just the flavor of your grapes, and
> the bubbles are retained CO2.
>
> Lee
>