Winemaking (rec.crafts.winemaking) Discussion of the process, recipes, tips, techniques and general exchange of lore on the process, methods and history of wine making. Includes traditional grape wines, sparkling wines & champagnes.

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:27 AM
geo
 
Posts: n/a
Default Why are most wine kits made in Canada?

Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American vineyards
to produce wine kits?


  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:17 PM
Joe Sallustio
 
Posts: n/a
Default

No regulations, I doubt that has anything to do with it. The US dollar
has been falling compared to Canada for a few years, I bet it's on the
order of 15% right now. I used to travel a lot to Toronto and the rate
was 1.47 for a long time, now it's around $1.30.

As to California, they are big into home winemaking from Modesto to
Lodi, not to mention Brehm. The Central Valley grows and sells a lot
of wine grapes; they are used throughout California and elsewhere as an
adjunct to local grapes and in jug wines.

They do sell a lot of wine and kits. Most of the stuff that is
available from the Central Valley is sold fresh to home winemakers in
boxes or 6 gallon pails. California Concentrate owns Alexanders Sun
Country and Home Wines, they are a concentrator. If grapes did not
ripen in California it is illegal to use sugar so they would add a
concentrate. (It doesn't happen much, it's not hard to get grapes to
cooperate in California.)

Pailed juice is pretty economical too, we get 6 gallon pails in
Pittsburgh for $30 to $40 here because so much comes our way. That's
really cheap considering pailing costs. It makes good wine too. If
well made it's comparable to most $10 bottles.

Canada is big on the 'brew on premises' process too and it really makes
it easy for someone to get into making wine. You have a built in
expert at your side the whole time. That lends itself to winemaking
year round.

I'm not saying your price increases are justified, just that it makes
some sense to me. When I traveled in Canada the thing that struck me
was that only food was a little more costly, compared to home, a dollar
in Canada got me about the same as a dollar in the US. That made it go
way further at $1.47. It's not like I was buying houses or cars though,
just stuff you buy in a week or so.


Joe

Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit

industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the

larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American

vineyards
to produce wine kits?


  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:17 PM
Joe Sallustio
 
Posts: n/a
Default

No regulations, I doubt that has anything to do with it. The US dollar
has been falling compared to Canada for a few years, I bet it's on the
order of 15% right now. I used to travel a lot to Toronto and the rate
was 1.47 for a long time, now it's around $1.30.

As to California, they are big into home winemaking from Modesto to
Lodi, not to mention Brehm. The Central Valley grows and sells a lot
of wine grapes; they are used throughout California and elsewhere as an
adjunct to local grapes and in jug wines.

They do sell a lot of wine and kits. Most of the stuff that is
available from the Central Valley is sold fresh to home winemakers in
boxes or 6 gallon pails. California Concentrate owns Alexanders Sun
Country and Home Wines, they are a concentrator. If grapes did not
ripen in California it is illegal to use sugar so they would add a
concentrate. (It doesn't happen much, it's not hard to get grapes to
cooperate in California.)

Pailed juice is pretty economical too, we get 6 gallon pails in
Pittsburgh for $30 to $40 here because so much comes our way. That's
really cheap considering pailing costs. It makes good wine too. If
well made it's comparable to most $10 bottles.

Canada is big on the 'brew on premises' process too and it really makes
it easy for someone to get into making wine. You have a built in
expert at your side the whole time. That lends itself to winemaking
year round.

I'm not saying your price increases are justified, just that it makes
some sense to me. When I traveled in Canada the thing that struck me
was that only food was a little more costly, compared to home, a dollar
in Canada got me about the same as a dollar in the US. That made it go
way further at $1.47. It's not like I was buying houses or cars though,
just stuff you buy in a week or so.


Joe

Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit

industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the

larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American

vineyards
to produce wine kits?


  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:44 PM
Glen Duff
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I can probably give you a knowledgeable answer to your query.

I believe the "wine kit" industry was literally started in Vancouver, B.C.
by a gentleman by the name of Stanley Anderson in the late 60's through a
company called WineArt. My wife opened his second store (New Westminster,
B.C.), his original store I think was on West 10th Avenue in Vancouver. He
was an interesting and enterprising man who made more than a few Canadian
shekels on the whole operation.

The popularity of making wine from kits boomed, especially across Canada.
It was of course, a simple, recipe approach that simplified the whole
process of winemaking but was really driven by the fact that wine and all
booze was, and still is, extremely expensive due to our high taxes on all
alcoholic beverages (and anything else the bureaucracy here can get there
hands on). Once established the kits in Canada improved from the original
concentrating process as the first ones tasted quite cooked. Also, the
original grapes used were not always the best but soon the process and the
grapes improved through California and european sources as well as greatly
improved vinifera grapes available in the Okanagan valley of B.C. and the
Niagara penninsula in Ontario.

It was very interesting times as the methods used by the large immigrant
population in Canada that brought traditional european winemaking,
especially the Italian community, was somewhat frowned upon as they had the
audacity to begin by crushing grapes, using barrels and other
non-conventional means (at least according to the recipe approach)!!!

I think we've now learned that everything they did was not so stupid.

Cheers,

Glen Duff
=============


"geo" wrote in message
ups.com...
Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American vineyards
to produce wine kits?



  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:44 PM
Glen Duff
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I can probably give you a knowledgeable answer to your query.

I believe the "wine kit" industry was literally started in Vancouver, B.C.
by a gentleman by the name of Stanley Anderson in the late 60's through a
company called WineArt. My wife opened his second store (New Westminster,
B.C.), his original store I think was on West 10th Avenue in Vancouver. He
was an interesting and enterprising man who made more than a few Canadian
shekels on the whole operation.

The popularity of making wine from kits boomed, especially across Canada.
It was of course, a simple, recipe approach that simplified the whole
process of winemaking but was really driven by the fact that wine and all
booze was, and still is, extremely expensive due to our high taxes on all
alcoholic beverages (and anything else the bureaucracy here can get there
hands on). Once established the kits in Canada improved from the original
concentrating process as the first ones tasted quite cooked. Also, the
original grapes used were not always the best but soon the process and the
grapes improved through California and european sources as well as greatly
improved vinifera grapes available in the Okanagan valley of B.C. and the
Niagara penninsula in Ontario.

It was very interesting times as the methods used by the large immigrant
population in Canada that brought traditional european winemaking,
especially the Italian community, was somewhat frowned upon as they had the
audacity to begin by crushing grapes, using barrels and other
non-conventional means (at least according to the recipe approach)!!!

I think we've now learned that everything they did was not so stupid.

Cheers,

Glen Duff
=============


"geo" wrote in message
ups.com...
Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American vineyards
to produce wine kits?





  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:44 PM
Glen Duff
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I can probably give you a knowledgeable answer to your query.

I believe the "wine kit" industry was literally started in Vancouver, B.C.
by a gentleman by the name of Stanley Anderson in the late 60's through a
company called WineArt. My wife opened his second store (New Westminster,
B.C.), his original store I think was on West 10th Avenue in Vancouver. He
was an interesting and enterprising man who made more than a few Canadian
shekels on the whole operation.

The popularity of making wine from kits boomed, especially across Canada.
It was of course, a simple, recipe approach that simplified the whole
process of winemaking but was really driven by the fact that wine and all
booze was, and still is, extremely expensive due to our high taxes on all
alcoholic beverages (and anything else the bureaucracy here can get there
hands on). Once established the kits in Canada improved from the original
concentrating process as the first ones tasted quite cooked. Also, the
original grapes used were not always the best but soon the process and the
grapes improved through California and european sources as well as greatly
improved vinifera grapes available in the Okanagan valley of B.C. and the
Niagara penninsula in Ontario.

It was very interesting times as the methods used by the large immigrant
population in Canada that brought traditional european winemaking,
especially the Italian community, was somewhat frowned upon as they had the
audacity to begin by crushing grapes, using barrels and other
non-conventional means (at least according to the recipe approach)!!!

I think we've now learned that everything they did was not so stupid.

Cheers,

Glen Duff
=============


"geo" wrote in message
ups.com...
Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American vineyards
to produce wine kits?



  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-04-2005, 01:44 PM
Glen Duff
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I can probably give you a knowledgeable answer to your query.

I believe the "wine kit" industry was literally started in Vancouver, B.C.
by a gentleman by the name of Stanley Anderson in the late 60's through a
company called WineArt. My wife opened his second store (New Westminster,
B.C.), his original store I think was on West 10th Avenue in Vancouver. He
was an interesting and enterprising man who made more than a few Canadian
shekels on the whole operation.

The popularity of making wine from kits boomed, especially across Canada.
It was of course, a simple, recipe approach that simplified the whole
process of winemaking but was really driven by the fact that wine and all
booze was, and still is, extremely expensive due to our high taxes on all
alcoholic beverages (and anything else the bureaucracy here can get there
hands on). Once established the kits in Canada improved from the original
concentrating process as the first ones tasted quite cooked. Also, the
original grapes used were not always the best but soon the process and the
grapes improved through California and european sources as well as greatly
improved vinifera grapes available in the Okanagan valley of B.C. and the
Niagara penninsula in Ontario.

It was very interesting times as the methods used by the large immigrant
population in Canada that brought traditional european winemaking,
especially the Italian community, was somewhat frowned upon as they had the
audacity to begin by crushing grapes, using barrels and other
non-conventional means (at least according to the recipe approach)!!!

I think we've now learned that everything they did was not so stupid.

Cheers,

Glen Duff
=============


"geo" wrote in message
ups.com...
Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American vineyards
to produce wine kits?



  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 17-04-2005, 10:24 PM
KD
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Joe Sallustio" wrote in message
oups.com...
No regulations, I doubt that has anything to do with it. The US dollar
has been falling compared to Canada for a few years, I bet it's on the
order of 15% right now. I used to travel a lot to Toronto and the rate
was 1.47 for a long time, now it's around $1.30.

As to California, they are big into home winemaking from Modesto to
Lodi, not to mention Brehm. The Central Valley grows and sells a lot
of wine grapes; they are used throughout California and elsewhere as an
adjunct to local grapes and in jug wines.

They do sell a lot of wine and kits. Most of the stuff that is
available from the Central Valley is sold fresh to home winemakers in
boxes or 6 gallon pails. California Concentrate owns Alexanders Sun
Country and Home Wines, they are a concentrator. If grapes did not
ripen in California it is illegal to use sugar so they would add a
concentrate. (It doesn't happen much, it's not hard to get grapes to
cooperate in California.)

Pailed juice is pretty economical too, we get 6 gallon pails in
Pittsburgh for $30 to $40 here because so much comes our way. That's
really cheap considering pailing costs. It makes good wine too. If
well made it's comparable to most $10 bottles.

Canada is big on the 'brew on premises' process too and it really makes
it easy for someone to get into making wine. You have a built in
expert at your side the whole time. That lends itself to winemaking
year round.

I'm not saying your price increases are justified, just that it makes
some sense to me. When I traveled in Canada the thing that struck me
was that only food was a little more costly, compared to home, a dollar
in Canada got me about the same as a dollar in the US. That made it go
way further at $1.47. It's not like I was buying houses or cars though,
just stuff you buy in a week or so.


Joe

Our friendly neighborhood brewer's supplier has raised its prices,
supposedly because the weak dollar is making it more expensive to buy
wine kits from Canada. That got me wondering why the wine kit

industry
seems to be almost entirely based in Canada. Wine is one of the

larger
industries in California. You'd think that some of the vineyards in
Napa or the central valley would try marketing grapes in the form of
wine kits. (Sounds like a natural for Bronco - How do you follow two
buck chuck?)

Is there some regulation that makes it difficult for American

vineyards
to produce wine kits?



Strangely enough, wine kit prices here in Canada remain the same. And Joe,
while in Canada maybe you didn't see the price of gas compared to the good
old US of A? We pay over $3 a gallon for gas here these days.

KD


  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2005, 08:21 AM
pinky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

It is nearly 4 per gallon over here in UK for unleaded!

A bit OT -- but it is one of the reasons that in 2004 I did 4895 miles on
my bicycle and less than 2000 miles in my car.

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply.
All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton
Anti Virus for your protection too!
Web Site:- www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk (Cycling to Santiago de
Compostela 2004)

"KD" wrote in message
...


Strangely enough, wine kit prices here in Canada remain the same. And Joe,
while in Canada maybe you didn't see the price of gas compared to the good
old US of A? We pay over $3 a gallon for gas here these days.

KD



  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2005, 08:21 AM
pinky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

It is nearly 4 per gallon over here in UK for unleaded!

A bit OT -- but it is one of the reasons that in 2004 I did 4895 miles on
my bicycle and less than 2000 miles in my car.

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply.
All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton
Anti Virus for your protection too!
Web Site:- www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk (Cycling to Santiago de
Compostela 2004)

"KD" wrote in message
...


Strangely enough, wine kit prices here in Canada remain the same. And Joe,
while in Canada maybe you didn't see the price of gas compared to the good
old US of A? We pay over $3 a gallon for gas here these days.

KD





  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2005, 02:36 PM
pinky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Lol!
I reckon on averaging about 80 kms/day on my long touring Holidays. The most
I have done in a day is about 105 kms.

So to collect your packages, on my velo, would take me 2 days with an
overnight stop somewhere-- and that is assuming I could get them on my velo!

I have my (newly arrived in UK) next Crushendo kit (Corvina Classico Di
Veneto) waiting to be picked up and that's a round trip of about 10 miles
( 16 kms) -- but I would struggle with balancing the box on my rear pannier
rack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply.
All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton
Anti Virus for your protection too!
Web Site:- www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk
"Dr Corinne B Leek" wrote in message
...
Well, it's about $1 Cdn here in Nova Scotia per litre now. I'd say
we're very quickly approaching European prices.
And my wine kit shop is approx 90 kms away and I have 2 kits to pick
up. sigh.

Dr Corinne B Leek
Nova Scotia

--
*** Conserve Energy: Laughter is easier than Anger!
***



  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2005, 02:36 PM
pinky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Lol!
I reckon on averaging about 80 kms/day on my long touring Holidays. The most
I have done in a day is about 105 kms.

So to collect your packages, on my velo, would take me 2 days with an
overnight stop somewhere-- and that is assuming I could get them on my velo!

I have my (newly arrived in UK) next Crushendo kit (Corvina Classico Di
Veneto) waiting to be picked up and that's a round trip of about 10 miles
( 16 kms) -- but I would struggle with balancing the box on my rear pannier
rack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply.
All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton
Anti Virus for your protection too!
Web Site:- www.tapan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk
"Dr Corinne B Leek" wrote in message
...
Well, it's about $1 Cdn here in Nova Scotia per litre now. I'd say
we're very quickly approaching European prices.
And my wine kit shop is approx 90 kms away and I have 2 kits to pick
up. sigh.

Dr Corinne B Leek
Nova Scotia

--
*** Conserve Energy: Laughter is easier than Anger!
***



  #13 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2005, 10:46 PM
Doug
 
Posts: n/a
Default

pinky wrote:
....
I have my (newly arrived in UK) next Crushendo kit (Corvina Classico

Di
Veneto) waiting to be picked up and that's a round trip of about 10

miles
( 16 kms) -- but I would struggle with balancing the box on my rear

pannier
rack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

....

Trevor -
Sounds pretty dangerous to me. I think in the interest of safety,
you'd best buy another kit. If you strap one on either side of the
rear wheel, you should have a lower center of gravity and improved
stability.

:-)

Doug

  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 18-04-2005, 10:46 PM
Doug
 
Posts: n/a
Default

pinky wrote:
....
I have my (newly arrived in UK) next Crushendo kit (Corvina Classico

Di
Veneto) waiting to be picked up and that's a round trip of about 10

miles
( 16 kms) -- but I would struggle with balancing the box on my rear

pannier
rack!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

....

Trevor -
Sounds pretty dangerous to me. I think in the interest of safety,
you'd best buy another kit. If you strap one on either side of the
rear wheel, you should have a lower center of gravity and improved
stability.

:-)

Doug

  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 19-04-2005, 01:52 AM
Steve Waller
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sun, 17 Apr 2005 21:24:08 GMT, "KD" wrote:

Well I think you must be lucky. Vineco increased wholesale prices
earlier in the year (Feb 1 ?), and Spagnols just raised them March
28th. Advintage raised their prices Jan 1st.

I have no contact with the other kit manufacturers.

These increases would mostly affect the retail by $1 to $2, although
in my store a couple of kits got hit by $5 because of a price increase
last fall that I hadn't re-ordered those particular varieties.

Steve


Strangely enough, wine kit prices here in Canada remain the same. And Joe,
while in Canada maybe you didn't see the price of gas compared to the good
old US of A? We pay over $3 a gallon for gas here these days.

KD




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