We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?

Thanks in advance.

Nikki

On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 01:09:39 +0100, Nikki Cluley
> wrote:

>We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
>making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Nikki
>
>
>
check back to the July 21st thread blackberry wine question.. for my
recipe if you can't see it I will post again.

You will need 20K for a 20 L batch.

cheers
Marv

On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 01:09:39 +0100, Nikki Cluley
> wrote:

>We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
>making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Nikki
>
>
>
check back to the July 21st thread blackberry wine question.. for my
recipe if you can't see it I will post again.

You will need 20K for a 20 L batch.

cheers
Marv

On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 01:09:39 +0100, Nikki Cluley
> wrote:

>We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
>making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Nikki
>
>
>
check back to the July 21st thread blackberry wine question.. for my
recipe if you can't see it I will post again.

You will need 20K for a 20 L batch.

cheers
Marv

I am having a go at 100% (okay, 90%) blackberry wine. I bought 24 lbs of
frozen marionberries from Trader Joe's, and when thawed and fermented at SG
1.110 (Yikes!), they yielded 8.25 liters of beautiful wine. I diluted it
with water by 10% to bring the alcohol down to about 13.5% and the acid with
it. I am oaking half to make a dry, "big" red - and sweetening the other
half to make a fruity dessert wine. It is lovely stuff. I'm drinking a
coffee-filtered glass from the carboy bottom right now after having just
racked it. (Winemaker's privilege!)

I thawed the berries along with added sugar, sulfite, and pectic enzyme over
the course of 3 days - essentially a 3 day cold maceration prior to
fermentation. Following that, I pressed the must with my basket press and
proceeded with fermentation in a 3 gallon carboy. I realized that I had
overshot the SG and would end up with a 15% PA doozy of a wine... so I
planned my first racking accordingly. I filled two gallon jugs each with
375mL water, which is 10% of the jug volume, then racked to both jugs. The
resulting wine is reduced by 10% in PA (15 to 13.5%) and in acid. I also
had 2 x 750mL bottles in overage for topping, which I left undiluted.

I don't work with recipes per se, so I can't give you one. The tannin in
blackberries seems to be adequate though, so I wouldn't (and didn't) add
any. The acid is substantial if you are not doing ML. If you do, word is
that it will carry the wine over the edge into flat territory - as
blackberries are mostly malic acid. So I chose to see how the acid would
end up, and finish to balance by sweetening if necessary. As luck would
have it, the unintentional over-sugaring was a blessing in disguise because
I could dilute the acid without killing the alcohol. I used Lalvin
Bourgovin yeast on this batch.

Sorry for the ramble... good luck with your wine.

Roger
Quinta do Placer

"islander" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 01:09:39 +0100, Nikki Cluley
> > wrote:
>
> >We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> >making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >
> >Thanks in advance.
> >
> >Nikki
> >
> >
> >
> check back to the July 21st thread blackberry wine question.. for my
> recipe if you can't see it I will post again.
>
> You will need 20K for a 20 L batch.
>
> cheers
> Marv

I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09. Ferment
with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
sweeten if necessary at bottling.

Any recommendations for a yeast?

I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like the
results, but am always looking for improvements.




"Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
...
> We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Nikki
>
>
>
>

for most fruit wines, I enjoy using the Cotes Des Blanc,

Rick

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09.
Ferment
> with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> sweeten if necessary at bottling.
>
> Any recommendations for a yeast?
>
> I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like
the
> results, but am always looking for improvements.
>
>
>
>
> "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> ...
> > We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> > making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Nikki
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

for most fruit wines, I enjoy using the Cotes Des Blanc,

Rick

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09.
Ferment
> with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> sweeten if necessary at bottling.
>
> Any recommendations for a yeast?
>
> I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like
the
> results, but am always looking for improvements.
>
>
>
>
> "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> ...
> > We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> > making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Nikki
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

in article , islander at
wrote on 6/8/04 2:39 am:

> On Fri, 06 Aug 2004 01:09:39 +0100, Nikki Cluley
> > wrote:
>
>> We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
>> making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>>
>> Nikki
>>
>>
>>
> check back to the July 21st thread blackberry wine question.. for my
> recipe if you can't see it I will post again.
>
> You will need 20K for a 20 L batch.
>
> cheers
> Marv


Thanks. Will have a look at it. Shouldn't be too hard to get a good
amount. Where we take the dog for a walk there are loads of them.In the
past three days we picked 9, 12, and the 22lbs and thats without even
trying. Made bramble jelly with the few first lots, but there will be
another lot ready by now.

Nikki

in article , Mike at wrote
on 6/8/04 4:54 am:

> I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09. Ferment
> with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> sweeten if necessary at bottling.
>
> Any recommendations for a yeast?
>
> I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like the
> results, but am always looking for improvements.
>
>
>
>
> "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> ...
>> We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
>> making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>>
>> Nikki
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England just
growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them. Its
such a shame to see so many wasted each year. I'll have to get the other
frezzer plugged in somewhere so I can freeze some.
--
Nikki

in article , Mike at wrote
on 6/8/04 4:54 am:

> I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09. Ferment
> with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> sweeten if necessary at bottling.
>
> Any recommendations for a yeast?
>
> I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like the
> results, but am always looking for improvements.
>
>
>
>
> "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> ...
>> We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
>> making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
>>
>> Thanks in advance.
>>
>> Nikki
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England just
growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them. Its
such a shame to see so many wasted each year. I'll have to get the other
frezzer plugged in somewhere so I can freeze some.
--
Nikki

>Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England just
>growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
>space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them. Its
>such a shame to see so many wasted each year.

The blackberries are hardly wasted if they are left to supply the (ever
decreasing) wildlife with a healthy supply of food.
After all, they need it more than you or I.
On a more positive note, has anybody ever tried making a pure blackberry
wine? I made five gallons of the stuff last year, only adding sugar to
raise the alcohol to 11-12% and after only a year of ageing in the
barrel it tastes seriously good, if still a little harsh. I really
recommend it. I know, I know, I am contradicting myself big style but
there was a HUGE crop last year so I hardly damaged the numbers of
blackberries at all.
Please do try it!
--
Dan

$6 for 2.5 lbs sounds like a good deal but just a heads up. I have made
dewberry (a close relative to blackberry) wine several times and with
several recipes. I have found that anything less than 5 lbs in a gallon and
it comes out weak with low boddy. 6 lbs is what I have standardized one.
You might visit Jack's site for a number of recipes and note what he
suggests.

Ray

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09.
Ferment
> with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> sweeten if necessary at bottling.
>
> Any recommendations for a yeast?
>
> I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like
the
> results, but am always looking for improvements.
>
>
>
>
> "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> ...
> > We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> > making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Nikki
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

$6 for 2.5 lbs sounds like a good deal but just a heads up. I have made
dewberry (a close relative to blackberry) wine several times and with
several recipes. I have found that anything less than 5 lbs in a gallon and
it comes out weak with low boddy. 6 lbs is what I have standardized one.
You might visit Jack's site for a number of recipes and note what he
suggests.

Ray

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09.
Ferment
> with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> sweeten if necessary at bottling.
>
> Any recommendations for a yeast?
>
> I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like
the
> results, but am always looking for improvements.
>
>
>
>
> "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> ...
> > We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> > making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Nikki
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

You are right, I looked back at my past wines. I need to use 4 lbs minimum
per gallon.

Anyone have a opinion on just fermenting the juice without any pulp?




> $6 for 2.5 lbs sounds like a good deal but just a heads up. I have made
> dewberry (a close relative to blackberry) wine several times and with
> several recipes. I have found that anything less than 5 lbs in a gallon
and
> it comes out weak with low boddy. 6 lbs is what I have standardized one.
> You might visit Jack's site for a number of recipes and note what he
> suggests.
>
> Ray
>
> > I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> > real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> > think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each
2.5lbs
> > of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09.
> Ferment
> > with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> > sweeten if necessary at bottling.
> >
> > Any recommendations for a yeast?
> >
> > I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like
> the
> > results, but am always looking for improvements.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go
at
> > > making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance.
> > >
> > > Nikki
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

You are right, I looked back at my past wines. I need to use 4 lbs minimum
per gallon.

Anyone have a opinion on just fermenting the juice without any pulp?




> $6 for 2.5 lbs sounds like a good deal but just a heads up. I have made
> dewberry (a close relative to blackberry) wine several times and with
> several recipes. I have found that anything less than 5 lbs in a gallon
and
> it comes out weak with low boddy. 6 lbs is what I have standardized one.
> You might visit Jack's site for a number of recipes and note what he
> suggests.
>
> Ray
>
> > I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> > real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> > think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each
2.5lbs
> > of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09.
> Ferment
> > with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> > sweeten if necessary at bottling.
> >
> > Any recommendations for a yeast?
> >
> > I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like
> the
> > results, but am always looking for improvements.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go
at
> > > making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance.
> > >
> > > Nikki
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> You are right, I looked back at my past wines. I need to use 4 lbs
minimum
> per gallon.
>
> Anyone have a opinion on just fermenting the juice without any pulp?
>
>
If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of berries
for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried it.
If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest this
but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do. You
might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too much
fruit. See the address below

http://www.homebrew.com/wine_cellar/wineblog.shtml

I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
have a wine that is drinkable sooner.

> If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of berries
> for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried
it.
> If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest this
> but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do. You
> might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too much
> fruit. See the address below
>
> http://www.homebrew.com/wine_cellar/wineblog.shtml
>
>

I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
have a wine that is drinkable sooner.

> If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of berries
> for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried
it.
> If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest this
> but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do. You
> might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too much
> fruit. See the address below
>
> http://www.homebrew.com/wine_cellar/wineblog.shtml
>
>

Even as we speak, I have a batch bottled & aging, and another batch aging in
a carboy. We don't have them around here, so I have to settle for a sale on
frozen blackberries at my local grocery store.
Darlene

"danthemen" > wrote in message
...
> >Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England
just
> >growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
> >space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them.
Its
> >such a shame to see so many wasted each year.
>
> The blackberries are hardly wasted if they are left to supply the (ever
> decreasing) wildlife with a healthy supply of food.
> After all, they need it more than you or I.
> On a more positive note, has anybody ever tried making a pure blackberry
> wine? I made five gallons of the stuff last year, only adding sugar to
> raise the alcohol to 11-12% and after only a year of ageing in the
> barrel it tastes seriously good, if still a little harsh. I really
> recommend it. I know, I know, I am contradicting myself big style but
> there was a HUGE crop last year so I hardly damaged the numbers of
> blackberries at all.
> Please do try it!
> --
> Dan

Even as we speak, I have a batch bottled & aging, and another batch aging in
a carboy. We don't have them around here, so I have to settle for a sale on
frozen blackberries at my local grocery store.
Darlene

"danthemen" > wrote in message
...
> >Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England
just
> >growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
> >space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them.
Its
> >such a shame to see so many wasted each year.
>
> The blackberries are hardly wasted if they are left to supply the (ever
> decreasing) wildlife with a healthy supply of food.
> After all, they need it more than you or I.
> On a more positive note, has anybody ever tried making a pure blackberry
> wine? I made five gallons of the stuff last year, only adding sugar to
> raise the alcohol to 11-12% and after only a year of ageing in the
> barrel it tastes seriously good, if still a little harsh. I really
> recommend it. I know, I know, I am contradicting myself big style but
> there was a HUGE crop last year so I hardly damaged the numbers of
> blackberries at all.
> Please do try it!
> --
> Dan

Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.


> I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
> could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
> have a wine that is drinkable sooner.
>
> > If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of
berries
> > for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried
> it.
> > If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest
this
> > but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do.
You
> > might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too
much
> > fruit. See the address below

Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.


> I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
> could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
> have a wine that is drinkable sooner.
>
> > If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of
berries
> > for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried
> it.
> > If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest
this
> > but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do.
You
> > might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too
much
> > fruit. See the address below

> Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.
>
> > I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
> > could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
> > have a wine that is drinkable sooner.

Many times. See http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/blackbr2.asp and
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/blackbr2.asp

What is the question?

Jack Keller, The Winemaking Home Page
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/

> Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.
>
> > I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
> > could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
> > have a wine that is drinkable sooner.

Many times. See http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/blackbr2.asp and
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/blackbr2.asp

What is the question?

Jack Keller, The Winemaking Home Page
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/

"Mike" > wrote:
> Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.
>
> > I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
> > could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
> > have a wine that is drinkable sooner.

If you mean using juice only (juice fermenting) as opposed to pulp
fermenting, that does tend to reduce extract (including, for e.g.,
harsh seed phenols) so that will result in less "bite".

If you mean using pure (100%) juice without diluting it (as Ray
mentioned), there are a number of winemakers who have done this and
found the results favourable (including with blackberry). In reference
to Jack's recent wine blog entry, the balance and flavour
concentration issue is one at the heart of the entire debate. I
continue to disagree with his stance on this issue, I believe a truely
balanced wine (flavour to body to acidity to alcohol to etc) will not
be overpowering in terms of flavour (assuming the taster actually
enjoys strong flavours). (Actually, Jack even reported in rcw some
time ago finding favourable results with a 100% blackberry wine he
made.)

Ben

http://members.tripod.com/~BRotter/100juice.htm

I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine. That
would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What will
this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
but to what extent?


> If you mean using juice only (juice fermenting) as opposed to pulp
> fermenting, that does tend to reduce extract (including, for e.g.,
> harsh seed phenols) so that will result in less "bite".
>
> If you mean using pure (100%) juice without diluting it (as Ray
> mentioned), there are a number of winemakers who have done this and
> found the results favourable (including with blackberry). In reference
> to Jack's recent wine blog entry, the balance and flavour
> concentration issue is one at the heart of the entire debate. I
> continue to disagree with his stance on this issue, I believe a truely
> balanced wine (flavour to body to acidity to alcohol to etc) will not
> be overpowering in terms of flavour (assuming the taster actually
> enjoys strong flavours). (Actually, Jack even reported in rcw some
> time ago finding favourable results with a 100% blackberry wine he
> made.)
>
> Ben
>
> http://members.tripod.com/~BRotter/100juice.htm

I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine. That
would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What will
this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
but to what extent?


> If you mean using juice only (juice fermenting) as opposed to pulp
> fermenting, that does tend to reduce extract (including, for e.g.,
> harsh seed phenols) so that will result in less "bite".
>
> If you mean using pure (100%) juice without diluting it (as Ray
> mentioned), there are a number of winemakers who have done this and
> found the results favourable (including with blackberry). In reference
> to Jack's recent wine blog entry, the balance and flavour
> concentration issue is one at the heart of the entire debate. I
> continue to disagree with his stance on this issue, I believe a truely
> balanced wine (flavour to body to acidity to alcohol to etc) will not
> be overpowering in terms of flavour (assuming the taster actually
> enjoys strong flavours). (Actually, Jack even reported in rcw some
> time ago finding favourable results with a 100% blackberry wine he
> made.)
>
> Ben
>
> http://members.tripod.com/~BRotter/100juice.htm

"Mike" > wrote:
> I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine. That
> would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
> thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What will
> this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
> but to what extent?

Whether you will significanly loose flavours when juice fermenting (as
opposed to pulp fermenting) is a debatable issue, and of course it
depends on the pressing method anyway. Really, the amount of suspended
solids in the must can play a more important role in terms of flavour.
In any case, juice fermenting *tends* to result in wines with less
phenolic extract (lower tannin, less seed character, etc) and
potentially slightly lower acidity.

But you've identified the key issue: to what extent? Whether the
difference is significant will depend very much on your juice
extraction method. For example, if you simply press and use free run
juice you'll get a much lighter, less extracted wine than if you use a
food processor to mash the fruit and subsequently strain the juice
from that pulp. For your purposes of reducing "bite" (by which I
assume you mean high tannin/acidity) I would suggest being gentle on
the fruit (i.e., no harsh crushing/pressing techniques). If you are
concerned about loss of flavour, a cold maceration might be a good
idea.

Ben

"Mike" > wrote:
> I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine. That
> would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
> thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What will
> this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
> but to what extent?

Whether you will significanly loose flavours when juice fermenting (as
opposed to pulp fermenting) is a debatable issue, and of course it
depends on the pressing method anyway. Really, the amount of suspended
solids in the must can play a more important role in terms of flavour.
In any case, juice fermenting *tends* to result in wines with less
phenolic extract (lower tannin, less seed character, etc) and
potentially slightly lower acidity.

But you've identified the key issue: to what extent? Whether the
difference is significant will depend very much on your juice
extraction method. For example, if you simply press and use free run
juice you'll get a much lighter, less extracted wine than if you use a
food processor to mash the fruit and subsequently strain the juice
from that pulp. For your purposes of reducing "bite" (by which I
assume you mean high tannin/acidity) I would suggest being gentle on
the fruit (i.e., no harsh crushing/pressing techniques). If you are
concerned about loss of flavour, a cold maceration might be a good
idea.

Ben

"Mike" > wrote:
> I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine. That
> would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
> thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What will
> this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
> but to what extent?

Whether you will significanly loose flavours when juice fermenting (as
opposed to pulp fermenting) is a debatable issue, and of course it
depends on the pressing method anyway. Really, the amount of suspended
solids in the must can play a more important role in terms of flavour.
In any case, juice fermenting *tends* to result in wines with less
phenolic extract (lower tannin, less seed character, etc) and
potentially slightly lower acidity.

But you've identified the key issue: to what extent? Whether the
difference is significant will depend very much on your juice
extraction method. For example, if you simply press and use free run
juice you'll get a much lighter, less extracted wine than if you use a
food processor to mash the fruit and subsequently strain the juice
from that pulp. For your purposes of reducing "bite" (by which I
assume you mean high tannin/acidity) I would suggest being gentle on
the fruit (i.e., no harsh crushing/pressing techniques). If you are
concerned about loss of flavour, a cold maceration might be a good
idea.

Ben

4-5 lbs of berries will make a wine that is slightly on the light bodied
side. If you only use the juice it will probably be even lighter. Maybe
that is what you wnat. Nothing wrong with light bodied wine in the right
situation.

Ray

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine.
That
> would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
> thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What
will
> this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
> but to what extent?
>
>
> > If you mean using juice only (juice fermenting) as opposed to pulp
> > fermenting, that does tend to reduce extract (including, for e.g.,
> > harsh seed phenols) so that will result in less "bite".
> >
> > If you mean using pure (100%) juice without diluting it (as Ray
> > mentioned), there are a number of winemakers who have done this and
> > found the results favourable (including with blackberry). In reference
> > to Jack's recent wine blog entry, the balance and flavour
> > concentration issue is one at the heart of the entire debate. I
> > continue to disagree with his stance on this issue, I believe a truely
> > balanced wine (flavour to body to acidity to alcohol to etc) will not
> > be overpowering in terms of flavour (assuming the taster actually
> > enjoys strong flavours). (Actually, Jack even reported in rcw some
> > time ago finding favourable results with a 100% blackberry wine he
> > made.)
> >
> > Ben
> >
> > http://members.tripod.com/~BRotter/100juice.htm
>
>

4-5 lbs of berries will make a wine that is slightly on the light bodied
side. If you only use the juice it will probably be even lighter. Maybe
that is what you wnat. Nothing wrong with light bodied wine in the right
situation.

Ray

"Mike" > wrote in message
...
> I was thinking about using 4-5 LBs of berries to each gallon of wine.
That
> would mean I would add water to the juice to get the desired amount. I am
> thinking about not fermenting with the pulp to reduce the "bite". What
will
> this do to the final product? I am sure the wine will loose some flavors,
> but to what extent?
>
>
> > If you mean using juice only (juice fermenting) as opposed to pulp
> > fermenting, that does tend to reduce extract (including, for e.g.,
> > harsh seed phenols) so that will result in less "bite".
> >
> > If you mean using pure (100%) juice without diluting it (as Ray
> > mentioned), there are a number of winemakers who have done this and
> > found the results favourable (including with blackberry). In reference
> > to Jack's recent wine blog entry, the balance and flavour
> > concentration issue is one at the heart of the entire debate. I
> > continue to disagree with his stance on this issue, I believe a truely
> > balanced wine (flavour to body to acidity to alcohol to etc) will not
> > be overpowering in terms of flavour (assuming the taster actually
> > enjoys strong flavours). (Actually, Jack even reported in rcw some
> > time ago finding favourable results with a 100% blackberry wine he
> > made.)
> >
> > Ben
> >
> > http://members.tripod.com/~BRotter/100juice.htm
>
>

> (Actually, Jack even reported in rcw some time ago finding favourable results
> with a 100% blackberry wine he made.)

I still have two bottles left and am saving them for a special
occasion. I wish I had another case.

On the other hand, I made several batches of blackberry in 2002 --
still experimenting to identify the boundaries. The second batch I
made that year used 8 pounds of berries per gallon, 2-day cold
maceration, pressing, and fermentation. TA, pH and tannins were fine.
This wine simply had WAY too much flavor dry, but smoothed out at
1.012 RS. Still, I corked 5 bottles dry and 20 bottles sweet just to
have both on hand.

I think I had some very ripe (possibly OVER-ripe) berries. Everyone
who has tasted it dry has commented on the flavor -- it is that strong
(stronger even than the pure juice batch). Obviously, it was a
balance problem and I corrected it, but I'm not sure every novice out
there would have recognized that or known what to do to make it right.
They would have tasted it, made a face, and cut back the next time.
Either way (correcting the problem or cutting back and making a "safe"
wine) would have been right.

The nice thing (for me) about blackberries is that I have SO MUCH of
them that I can afford to tinker. Even a bad batch is worth
keeping....

Jack Keller, The Winemaking Home Page
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/

Well, I am going to soon. I just got 8 lbs of berries (with a promise of
another 25-30lbs to come) of blackberries that have been run through a
reamer thing, so you are left with juice and some pulp, the seads are 99%
out. See what happens when I get enought to do a 5 gallon batch.

~Brian

in rec.crafts.winemaking,
"Mike" > wrote:
>Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.
>
>
>> I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
>> could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
>> have a wine that is drinkable sooner.
>>
>> > If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of
>berries
>> > for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried
>> it.
>> > If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest
>this
>> > but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do.
>You
>> > might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too
>much
>> > fruit. See the address below
>
>

Well, I am going to soon. I just got 8 lbs of berries (with a promise of
another 25-30lbs to come) of blackberries that have been run through a
reamer thing, so you are left with juice and some pulp, the seads are 99%
out. See what happens when I get enought to do a 5 gallon batch.

~Brian

in rec.crafts.winemaking,
"Mike" > wrote:
>Has anyone tried this? I would love to here the results.
>
>
>> I am thinking of 4-5 lbs of berries to a gallon. My thoughts are that I
>> could eliminate some of the "bite" that the skins and seeds add and maybe
>> have a wine that is drinkable sooner.
>>
>> > If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of
>berries
>> > for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried
>> it.
>> > If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest
>this
>> > but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do.
>You
>> > might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too
>much
>> > fruit. See the address below
>
>

Nikki Cluley > wrote:

> in article , Mike at wrote
> on 6/8/04 4:54 am:
>
> > I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> > real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> > think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> > of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09. Ferment
> > with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> > sweeten if necessary at bottling.
> >
> > Any recommendations for a yeast?
> >
> > I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like the
> > results, but am always looking for improvements.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> >> making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >>
> >> Thanks in advance.
> >>
> >> Nikki
> Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England just
> growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
> space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them. Its
> such a shame to see so many wasted each year. I'll have to get the other
> frezzer plugged in somewhere so I can freeze some.

Here in East Devon we seem to have a few ripe berries, many green ones
and some still in flower. I saw someone picking to day. I dont think
they would get many. The spring and early summer were very wet. I may
not bother unless they ripen very soon.

Last year the crop was very good and early too.

--
Regards, Shane
"A closed mouth gathers no feet!"
Website: http://www.wonk.demon.co.uk/

Nikki Cluley > wrote:

> in article , Mike at wrote
> on 6/8/04 4:54 am:
>
> > I just scored 2.5lb packs of frozen organic blackberries from Costco for
> > real cheap(just over $6 each). I figured each would make a gallon. I
> > think I will thaw them, add enough water to make one gallon to each 2.5lbs
> > of berries. balance acid to .6 TA and sugar to a SG of 1.08~1.09. Ferment
> > with pulp for a few days then strain and finish fermentation. Slightly
> > sweeten if necessary at bottling.
> >
> > Any recommendations for a yeast?
> >
> > I would like comments on my strategy. I have done this before and like the
> > results, but am always looking for improvements.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Nikki Cluley" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> We picked 22lbs of blackberries yesterday and thought we'd have a go at
> >> making some wine. Anyone got any blackberry wine recipes?
> >>
> >> Thanks in advance.
> >>
> >> Nikki
> Never had to buy blackberries. There are loads of them here in England just
> growing everywhere they can. Where we take the dog is a bit of an open
> space/nature reserve and the paths have bramble bushes along side them. Its
> such a shame to see so many wasted each year. I'll have to get the other
> frezzer plugged in somewhere so I can freeze some.

Here in East Devon we seem to have a few ripe berries, many green ones
and some still in flower. I saw someone picking to day. I dont think
they would get many. The spring and early summer were very wet. I may
not bother unless they ripen very soon.

Last year the crop was very good and early too.

--
Regards, Shane
"A closed mouth gathers no feet!"
Website: http://www.wonk.demon.co.uk/

I'm a rank noobie and have to ask if the blackberry at 5 or 6 lbs. per
gallon is fresh picked or store bought. Is there a difference?

Steve Vegos


>"Ray" > wrote:

>If you mean pressing the fruit and using the juice form 5-6 lbs of berries
>for each gallon, I have not seen recipies for that and I have not tried it.
>If you mean using pure juice like grapes, there are those who suggest this
>but again I have not tried it. Be careful of your acidity if you do. You
>might also want to read Jack's recent wine blog concerning using too much
>fruit. See the address below
>
>http://www.homebrew.com/wine_cellar/wineblog.shtml

In response to:

>>"Mike" > wrote...
>> You are right, I looked back at my past wines. I need to use 4 lbs
>>minimum per gallon. Anyone have a opinion on just fermenting
>>the juice without any pulp?

"spud" > wrote in message
...
> I'm a rank noobie and have to ask if the blackberry at 5 or 6 lbs. per
> gallon is fresh picked or store bought. Is there a difference?
>
> Steve Vegos
>
5-6 lbs is basic for blackberry but as to whether store bought are different
from fresh picked. That is a hard question. Store bought are probably
domestic. Then which domestic? Fresh picked may be domestic or may be
wild. Is there a difference? Probably, but I could not say what. If you
are going with store bought, you might actually get better berries with
frozen than fresh. Frozen berries may be picked at their peak an frozen
immediately while fresh are picked early to allow for shipping. We seldom
have much control over any of this and just use what we get. If you really
get into all this you will probably want to check TA and pH on any of these
and learn to adjust them for ballance. This may improve your chances of a
superior wine. Or you can just do it by recipe and make a probably make a
decent or better wine. If you are just starting, just go by recipe and
don't worry.

Ray