Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Rob

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous and next
to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it again.
Cam
"Rob M" > wrote in message
om...
> I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
> plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
> have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
> Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>
> Rob

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

In general I agree -- plastic is not a good option. However, practically
speaking, 3 months is hardly aging and you might get away with it.

Ray

"Cam" > wrote in message
news:wq7qc.7722$9P6.2710@clgrps12...
> I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous and
next
> to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it
again.
> Cam
> "Rob M" > wrote in message
> om...
> > I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
> > plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
> > have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
> > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> >
> > Rob
>
>

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

On 5/17/04 4:41 PM, in article
, "Ray"
> wrote:

> In general I agree -- plastic is not a good option. However, practically
> speaking, 3 months is hardly aging and you might get away with it.
>
> Ray
>

I agree - it should be fine if you keep your SO2 levels up.

--
Greg Cook
http://homepage.mac.com/gregcook/Wine
http://homepage.mac.com/gregcook/aws

(remove spamblocker from my email)

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

What about the plastic containers the spring water comes in for those water
coolers?
Steve
"Cam" > wrote in message
news:wq7qc.7722$9P6.2710@clgrps12...
> I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous and
next
> to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it
again.
> Cam
> "Rob M" > wrote in message
> om...
> > I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
> > plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
> > have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
> > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> >
> > Rob
>
>

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

Now no quoting me but if I remember correctly a lost of plastics are quite
permeable to O2 which makes storing wine in poly bottles for the long term
a no-no. Although it would be probably fine for a few months. I'm planing
on trying this with a Riesling that I have aging right now in my basement.

Just thought of something. When I racked my wine for the second time last
night I used some wine (from the same batch) that I placed in plastic
bottle (Poweraid bottle I believe). I did not need all of it to top up the
Carboloy so I drank it, as well as sampling some from the Carboloy and the
wine in the Poweraid bottle seemed more aged. This could be due to several
different reasons, mainly environmental, but if you do try to (bulk) age in
plastic bottles you might want to try it after 1/4 or 1/3 of the time you
were expecting to age the wine for.

just my two cents worth (OK about 1.5 US cents)

Rob



Stephen wrote:

> What about the plastic containers the spring water comes in for those
> water coolers?
> Steve
> "Cam" > wrote in message
> news:wq7qc.7722$9P6.2710@clgrps12...
>> I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous and
> next
>> to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it
> again.
>> Cam
>> "Rob M" > wrote in message
>> om...
>> > I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
>> > plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
>> > have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
>> > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
>> >
>> > Rob
>>
>>

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

I am not saying you cannot but I will throw out some thoughts:

1) Plastic is made from petroleum products. The plastic used for water
bottles is food safe so, at least for water, nothing is going to leach out
of the plastic that would be harmful or detrimental to the product, water.
But lots of things are soluble in alcohol that are not soluble in water.
You put an 11-14% alcohol solution (wine) in that bottle and leave it for a
year or more and I would not guarantee that you would not get some nasties
out of the plastic even if it is food safe. Most foods do not contain 12%
alcohol.
2) As other have pointed out, those jugs are not made of very thick
plastic. Most plastic is permeable to air. That is no problem for water so
there is no reason to make them thicker. Wine is another mater. They are
not made for wine.

Ray

"Stephen" > wrote in message
news:vjMqc.24690$gr.2146875@attbi_s52...
> What about the plastic containers the spring water comes in for those
water
> coolers?
> Steve
> "Cam" > wrote in message
> news:wq7qc.7722$9P6.2710@clgrps12...
> > I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous and
> next
> > to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it
> again.
> > Cam
> > "Rob M" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > > I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
> > > plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
> > > have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
> > > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> > >
> > > Rob
> >
> >
>
>

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

Vodka and Rum are now sold in PET gallon (or some silly millimeter
equivalent) jugs. Most vodka and rum are considerably higher in abv
than wine.

FWIW, bb

"Ray" > wrote in message m>...
> I am not saying you cannot but I will throw out some thoughts:
>
> 1) Plastic is made from petroleum products. The plastic used for water
> bottles is food safe so, at least for water, nothing is going to leach out
> of the plastic that would be harmful or detrimental to the product, water.
> But lots of things are soluble in alcohol that are not soluble in water.
> You put an 11-14% alcohol solution (wine) in that bottle and leave it for a
> year or more and I would not guarantee that you would not get some nasties
> out of the plastic even if it is food safe. Most foods do not contain 12%
> alcohol.
> 2) As other have pointed out, those jugs are not made of very thick
> plastic. Most plastic is permeable to air. That is no problem for water so
> there is no reason to make them thicker. Wine is another mater. They are
> not made for wine.
>
> Ray
>
> "Stephen" > wrote in message
> news:vjMqc.24690$gr.2146875@attbi_s52...
> > What about the plastic containers the spring water comes in for those
> water
> > coolers?
> > Steve
> > "Cam" > wrote in message
> > news:wq7qc.7722$9P6.2710@clgrps12...
> > > I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous and
> next
> > > to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it
> again.
> > > Cam
> > > "Rob M" > wrote in message
> > > om...
> > > > I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
> > > > plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you can
> > > > have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with wine?
> > > > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> > > >
> > > > Rob
> > >
> > >
> >
> >

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

William, You are correct and I would not question the use of these bottles.
Plastic can be made for many different purposes, as I understand it there
are even different formulations of PET. If it is designed for alcohol, as
these are, then they are safe. But if they state on them that they are safe
for water, that does not mean they are safe for alcohol. If they are safe,
then all you have to worry about is oxidation through the plastic.

Wouldn't it be great if they could make plastic jugs that were alcohol safe
AND would allow the same micro-oxidation through the plastic as a wood keg!
If they could tell us the rate of oxidation so we could adjust the time in
bulk storage in plastic to match the time commercial wines are stored in
kegs, that would be fantastic! Just add oak beans and really get the effect
of an expensive keg. Tell me I can do that William, please!

Ray

"William" > wrote in message
om...
> Vodka and Rum are now sold in PET gallon (or some silly millimeter
> equivalent) jugs. Most vodka and rum are considerably higher in abv
> than wine.
>
> FWIW, bb
>
> "Ray" > wrote in message
m>...
> > I am not saying you cannot but I will throw out some thoughts:
> >
> > 1) Plastic is made from petroleum products. The plastic used for water
> > bottles is food safe so, at least for water, nothing is going to leach
out
> > of the plastic that would be harmful or detrimental to the product,
water.
> > But lots of things are soluble in alcohol that are not soluble in water.
> > You put an 11-14% alcohol solution (wine) in that bottle and leave it
for a
> > year or more and I would not guarantee that you would not get some
nasties
> > out of the plastic even if it is food safe. Most foods do not contain
12%
> > alcohol.
> > 2) As other have pointed out, those jugs are not made of very thick
> > plastic. Most plastic is permeable to air. That is no problem for
water so
> > there is no reason to make them thicker. Wine is another mater. They
are
> > not made for wine.
> >
> > Ray
> >
> > "Stephen" > wrote in message
> > news:vjMqc.24690$gr.2146875@attbi_s52...
> > > What about the plastic containers the spring water comes in for those
> > water
> > > coolers?
> > > Steve
> > > "Cam" > wrote in message
> > > news:wq7qc.7722$9P6.2710@clgrps12...
> > > > I would not recommend aging in juice bottles. The plastic is porous
and
> > next
> > > > to impossible to properly sterilize. I tried it once, will not do it
> > again.
> > > > Cam
> > > > "Rob M" > wrote in message
> > > > om...
> > > > > I want to age some wine for about 3 months. I have a bunch of 4L
> > > > > plastic juice bottles that I wanted to use. I know with beer you
can
> > > > > have oxygenation problems with that. How long can you go with
wine?
> > > > > Any suggestions would be appreciated.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rob
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

"Ray" > wrote in message
...
> William, You are correct and I would not question the use of these
bottles.
> Plastic can be made for many different purposes, as I understand it there
> are even different formulations of PET. If it is designed for alcohol, as
> these are, then they are safe. But if they state on them that they are
safe
> for water, that does not mean they are safe for alcohol. If they are
safe,
> then all you have to worry about is oxidation through the plastic.

I recently opened a 2 liter plastic Coke bottle that I'd filled with some
leftover topping wine - 2000 Pinot Noir IIRC. It had been sitting
undisturbed and completely full for about 2½ years.

I poured a glass and it looked and tasted like dry sherry! Not bad,
actually, but far removed from what went _into_ the bottle. Just for
reference, the 2000 Pinot Noir that was bottled in glass under cork still
needs time, and is showing no trace of oxidation.

Tom S

Bulk Aging in Plastic
 

Thanks Tom, that is an excellent observation.

Ray

"Tom S" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Ray" > wrote in message
> ...
> > William, You are correct and I would not question the use of these
> bottles.
> > Plastic can be made for many different purposes, as I understand it
there
> > are even different formulations of PET. If it is designed for alcohol,
as
> > these are, then they are safe. But if they state on them that they are
> safe
> > for water, that does not mean they are safe for alcohol. If they are
> safe,
> > then all you have to worry about is oxidation through the plastic.
>
> I recently opened a 2 liter plastic Coke bottle that I'd filled with some
> leftover topping wine - 2000 Pinot Noir IIRC. It had been sitting
> undisturbed and completely full for about 2½ years.
>
> I poured a glass and it looked and tasted like dry sherry! Not bad,
> actually, but far removed from what went _into_ the bottle. Just for
> reference, the 2000 Pinot Noir that was bottled in glass under cork still
> needs time, and is showing no trace of oxidation.
>
> Tom S
>
>
>