I have three wine kits on the go right now, all of them in the
clearing stage or beyond.

First kit is a peach wine kit that has very little sediment on the
bottom. It has been clearing for the past two weeks.

Second kit is a pinot noir that has already been racked once since
clearing (lost nearly 1 gallon thanks to all the sediment) and has
already accumulated another 1" of sediment on the carboy bottom in the
past two weeks.

Third kit is a riesling that has just started clearing and looks to be
dropping a considerable bit of sediment as well.

All three of these kits I would like to bulk age for at least 6 months
prior to bottling.

Questions:

1.) At what point should I filter, if I choose to filter the wines?
2.) When racking, I assume I discard the sediment, even though it has
lots of wine mixed in there...?
3.) Will filtering reduce the amount of wine loss I'm seeing from
2)?.
4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
month!

This is where the kit instructions really break down, as they seem to
assume that most people go for the kits so they can get to drinking as
quick as possible.

Thanks in advance.

Harry,
With all honesty, I should tell you that I do not do wine kits. However, I
can answer you questions in a general way. Please wait until you hear from
those who make wine kits.
1.) At what point should I filter, if I choose to filter the wines?
I generally don't filter my wines until just before I bottle them.
I wait until the wine drops as much sediment as it can before bottling.
If there is too much junk in the wine, them your filter will clog up
very quickly, so I usually let the wine clear as much as it can on its own
(by racking), before making any attempt to filter.

> 2.) When racking, I assume I discard the sediment, even though it has
> lots of wine mixed in there...?
I like to have a reserve top-up for my wines, so I try very hard to
recover as much wine as I can from the sediment. There are many ways to
do this, others talk about putting it into a soda bottle and
running it through the spin cycle on the washing machine. Jack Keller talks
about some different ways on his wine site. I pour the
sediment into a glass container with as little head space as I can and put
it in the fridge. Within 6-10 hours, you'll notice the heavier sediment
falls to the bottom and the wine settles at the top. When the wine at the
top isn't getting any larger in volume, then I draw the wine off into
another container and keep it until the next time I rack.

> 3.) Will filtering reduce the amount of wine loss I'm seeing from
> 2)?.
I don't believe so. You're always going to lose some wine when you're
racking off of lees. You can either make a bit more so you have a little
wine to top-up with, or you can rack to smaller containers each time to
reduce the amount of exposure to air, or you can add a similar wine to top
up with, or you can drop marbles into the carboy to increase the volume to
keep it topped up.

> 4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
> sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
> month!
My rule of thumb is to rack 2-4 times in a 7 month aging period. It all
depends on the wine. If a wine is dropping a lot of sediment, I will rack
it (but I usually let the wine sit for at least a month). The amount of
sediment a wine drops should lessen with time. Some wines clear up at 3
months and then I won't rack it anymore, some take longer. Hopefully
someone will have some experience with your wine kits, so they can tell you
what works best.

Good-luck,
Darlene
"Harry Colquhoun" > wrote in message
om...
> I have three wine kits on the go right now, all of them in the
> clearing stage or beyond.
>
> First kit is a peach wine kit that has very little sediment on the
> bottom. It has been clearing for the past two weeks.
>
> Second kit is a pinot noir that has already been racked once since
> clearing (lost nearly 1 gallon thanks to all the sediment) and has
> already accumulated another 1" of sediment on the carboy bottom in the
> past two weeks.
>
> Third kit is a riesling that has just started clearing and looks to be
> dropping a considerable bit of sediment as well.
>
> All three of these kits I would like to bulk age for at least 6 months
> prior to bottling.
>
> Questions:
>
> 1.) At what point should I filter, if I choose to filter the wines?
> 2.) When racking, I assume I discard the sediment, even though it has
> lots of wine mixed in there...?
> 3.) Will filtering reduce the amount of wine loss I'm seeing from
> 2)?.
> 4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
> sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
> month!
>
> This is where the kit instructions really break down, as they seem to
> assume that most people go for the kits so they can get to drinking as
> quick as possible.
>
> Thanks in advance.

"Dar V" > wrote in message
...
> Harry,
> With all honesty, I should tell you that I do not do wine kits. However,
I
> can answer you questions in a general way. Please wait until you hear
from
> those who make wine kits.
> 1.) At what point should I filter, if I choose to filter the wines?
> I generally don't filter my wines until just before I bottle them.
> I wait until the wine drops as much sediment as it can before
bottling.
> If there is too much junk in the wine, them your filter will clog up
> very quickly, so I usually let the wine clear as much as it can on its own
> (by racking), before making any attempt to filter.
>
> > 2.) When racking, I assume I discard the sediment, even though it has
> > lots of wine mixed in there...?
> I like to have a reserve top-up for my wines, so I try very hard
to
> recover as much wine as I can from the sediment. There are many ways
to
> do this, others talk about putting it into a soda bottle and
> running it through the spin cycle on the washing machine. Jack Keller
talks
> about some different ways on his wine site. I pour
the
> sediment into a glass container with as little head space as I can and put
> it in the fridge. Within 6-10 hours, you'll notice the heavier sediment
> falls to the bottom and the wine settles at the top. When the wine at the
> top isn't getting any larger in volume, then I draw the wine off into
> another container and keep it until the next time I rack.
>
> > 3.) Will filtering reduce the amount of wine loss I'm seeing from
> > 2)?.
> I don't believe so. You're always going to lose some wine when you're
> racking off of lees. You can either make a bit more so you have a little
> wine to top-up with, or you can rack to smaller containers each time to
> reduce the amount of exposure to air, or you can add a similar wine to top
> up with, or you can drop marbles into the carboy to increase the volume to
> keep it topped up.
>
> > 4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
> > sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
> > month!
> My rule of thumb is to rack 2-4 times in a 7 month aging period. It
all
> depends on the wine. If a wine is dropping a lot of sediment, I will rack
> it (but I usually let the wine sit for at least a month). The amount of
> sediment a wine drops should lessen with time. Some wines clear up at 3
> months and then I won't rack it anymore, some take longer. Hopefully
> someone will have some experience with your wine kits, so they can tell
you
> what works best.
>
> Good-luck,
> Darlene

Thank you for a great post Darlene.

Do not understand how you can lose a gallon from sediment (you are talking a
standard 23 litre kit?). That's 20% of your product gone.

I might lose a little from racking, but nothing like that. The most I have lost
is a litre or so. I usually top up with a bottle from similar wine made before.


>Second kit is a pinot noir that has already been racked once since
>clearing (lost nearly 1 gallon thanks to all the sediment) and has
>already accumulated another 1" of sediment on the carboy bottom in the
>past two weeks.
>

Lum,
Thanks - I have learned a lot from all of you, which has helped me to
respond to others.
Darlene

"Lum" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Dar V" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Harry,
> > With all honesty, I should tell you that I do not do wine kits.
However,
> I
> > can answer you questions in a general way. Please wait until you hear
> from
> > those who make wine kits.
> > 1.) At what point should I filter, if I choose to filter the wines?
> > I generally don't filter my wines until just before I bottle
them.
> > I wait until the wine drops as much sediment as it can before
> bottling.
> > If there is too much junk in the wine, them your filter will clog up
> > very quickly, so I usually let the wine clear as much as it can on its
own
> > (by racking), before making any attempt to filter.
> >
> > > 2.) When racking, I assume I discard the sediment, even though it has
> > > lots of wine mixed in there...?
> > I like to have a reserve top-up for my wines, so I try very hard
> to
> > recover as much wine as I can from the sediment. There are many
ways
> to
> > do this, others talk about putting it into a soda bottle and
> > running it through the spin cycle on the washing machine. Jack Keller
> talks
> > about some different ways on his wine site. I pour
> the
> > sediment into a glass container with as little head space as I can and
put
> > it in the fridge. Within 6-10 hours, you'll notice the heavier sediment
> > falls to the bottom and the wine settles at the top. When the wine at
the
> > top isn't getting any larger in volume, then I draw the wine off into
> > another container and keep it until the next time I rack.
> >
> > > 3.) Will filtering reduce the amount of wine loss I'm seeing from
> > > 2)?.
> > I don't believe so. You're always going to lose some wine when
you're
> > racking off of lees. You can either make a bit more so you have a
little
> > wine to top-up with, or you can rack to smaller containers each time to
> > reduce the amount of exposure to air, or you can add a similar wine to
top
> > up with, or you can drop marbles into the carboy to increase the volume
to
> > keep it topped up.
> >
> > > 4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
> > > sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
> > > month!
> > My rule of thumb is to rack 2-4 times in a 7 month aging period. It
> all
> > depends on the wine. If a wine is dropping a lot of sediment, I will
rack
> > it (but I usually let the wine sit for at least a month). The amount of
> > sediment a wine drops should lessen with time. Some wines clear up at 3
> > months and then I won't rack it anymore, some take longer. Hopefully
> > someone will have some experience with your wine kits, so they can tell
> you
> > what works best.
> >
> > Good-luck,
> > Darlene
>
> Thank you for a great post Darlene.
>
>

Darlene,

I think we all have, at least for "those who have ears to listen!" Lum,
Tom and of course several others are wonderful contributors to our
knowledge of winemaking. Great group.

Thanks Lum and keep on posting,

Glen Duff
----------------

Dar V wrote:

> Lum,
> Thanks - I have learned a lot from all of you, which has helped me to
> respond to others.
> Darlene
>
> "Lum" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>"Dar V" > wrote in message
...
>>
>>>Harry,
>>>With all honesty, I should tell you that I do not do wine kits.
>>>
> However,
>
>>I
>>
>>>can answer you questions in a general way. Please wait until you hear
>>>
>>from
>>
>>>those who make wine kits.
>>>1.) At what point should I filter, if I choose to filter the wines?
>>> I generally don't filter my wines until just before I bottle
>>>
> them.
>
>>>I wait until the wine drops as much sediment as it can before
>>>
>>bottling.
>>
>>>If there is too much junk in the wine, them your filter will clog up
>>>very quickly, so I usually let the wine clear as much as it can on its
>>>
> own
>
>>>(by racking), before making any attempt to filter.
>>>
>>>
>>>>2.) When racking, I assume I discard the sediment, even though it has
>>>>lots of wine mixed in there...?
>>>>
>>> I like to have a reserve top-up for my wines, so I try very hard
>>>
>>to
>>
>>>recover as much wine as I can from the sediment. There are many
>>>
> ways
>
>>to
>>
>>>do this, others talk about putting it into a soda bottle and
>>>running it through the spin cycle on the washing machine. Jack Keller
>>>
>>talks
>>
>>>about some different ways on his wine site. I pour
>>>
>>the
>>
>>>sediment into a glass container with as little head space as I can and
>>>
> put
>
>>>it in the fridge. Within 6-10 hours, you'll notice the heavier sediment
>>>falls to the bottom and the wine settles at the top. When the wine at
>>>
> the
>
>>>top isn't getting any larger in volume, then I draw the wine off into
>>>another container and keep it until the next time I rack.
>>>
>>>
>>>>3.) Will filtering reduce the amount of wine loss I'm seeing from
>>>>2)?.
>>>>
>>> I don't believe so. You're always going to lose some wine when
>>>
> you're
>
>>>racking off of lees. You can either make a bit more so you have a
>>>
> little
>
>>>wine to top-up with, or you can rack to smaller containers each time to
>>>reduce the amount of exposure to air, or you can add a similar wine to
>>>
> top
>
>>>up with, or you can drop marbles into the carboy to increase the volume
>>>
> to
>
>>>keep it topped up.
>>>
>>>
>>>>4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
>>>>sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
>>>>month!
>>>>
>>> My rule of thumb is to rack 2-4 times in a 7 month aging period. It
>>>
>>all
>>
>>>depends on the wine. If a wine is dropping a lot of sediment, I will
>>>
> rack
>
>>>it (but I usually let the wine sit for at least a month). The amount of
>>>sediment a wine drops should lessen with time. Some wines clear up at 3
>>>months and then I won't rack it anymore, some take longer. Hopefully
>>>someone will have some experience with your wine kits, so they can tell
>>>
>>you
>>
>>>what works best.
>>>
>>>Good-luck,
>>>Darlene
>>>
>>Thank you for a great post Darlene.
>>
>>
>>
>
>

4nospam (Insprucegrove) wrote in message >...
> Do not understand how you can lose a gallon from sediment (you are talking a
> standard 23 litre kit?). That's 20% of your product gone.
>
> I might lose a little from racking, but nothing like that. The most I have lost
> is a litre or so. I usually top up with a bottle from similar wine made before.

That's how much sediment precipitated out of the wine. I thought it
was a lot too, but there's not much I could do.

Thanks Darlene, very helpful post!

One followup question...

> > 4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
> > sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
> > month!
> My rule of thumb is to rack 2-4 times in a 7 month aging period. It all
> depends on the wine. If a wine is dropping a lot of sediment, I will rack
> it (but I usually let the wine sit for at least a month). The amount of
> sediment a wine drops should lessen with time. Some wines clear up at 3
> months and then I won't rack it anymore, some take longer. Hopefully
> someone will have some experience with your wine kits, so they can tell you
> what works best.

Do you do anything to reduce oxygen exposure when racking? Racking 4
times must introduce a considerable amount of oxygen.

Thanks again,
Harry

Harry,
I racked 1 gallon of strawberry wine with morning from my primary to my
glass secondary, and it took me a couple of minutes (or less), and then I
put the bung and airlock on right away. Even if you have a big carboy, once
you get the siphon going - this amount of limited exposure shouldn't hurt
it. I'll admit the first time I racked it took me awhile, but I get it done
pretty quick now. You should really only have 1 or 2 rackings where you
have a lot of lees - and the other 1 or 2 times to rack should be used only
if the wine isn't clearing. Since I like a bit sweeter wine, sometimes that
final rack is to sorbate and sweeten; and then waiting a month before
bottling. I've had a couple of problem wines which I ended up racking 5 or
6 times in a 9-10 month period - while I'm not an expert, I did not notice
any oxidation problems, nor did the wines turns brown and such (which is an
indication of oxidation). Hope this helps.
Darlene

"Harry Colquhoun" > wrote in message
om...
> Thanks Darlene, very helpful post!
>
> One followup question...
>
> > > 4.) For bulk aging, how long should I let the wine sit on the
> > > sediment? I'm paranoid about oxidation, and don't want to rack every
> > > month!
> > My rule of thumb is to rack 2-4 times in a 7 month aging period. It
all
> > depends on the wine. If a wine is dropping a lot of sediment, I will
rack
> > it (but I usually let the wine sit for at least a month). The amount of
> > sediment a wine drops should lessen with time. Some wines clear up at 3
> > months and then I won't rack it anymore, some take longer. Hopefully
> > someone will have some experience with your wine kits, so they can tell
you
> > what works best.
>
> Do you do anything to reduce oxygen exposure when racking? Racking 4
> times must introduce a considerable amount of oxygen.
>
> Thanks again,
> Harry

"Harry Colquhoun" > wrote in message
om...
> 4nospam (Insprucegrove) wrote in message
>...
> > Do not understand how you can lose a gallon from sediment (you are
talking a
> > standard 23 litre kit?). That's 20% of your product gone.
> >
> > I might lose a little from racking, but nothing like that. The most I
have lost
> > is a litre or so. I usually top up with a bottle from similar wine made
before.
>
> That's how much sediment precipitated out of the wine. I thought it
> was a lot too, but there's not much I could do.

You could have saved that gunk and allowed it to settle further over the
course of months. Adding some bentonite slurry to it probably would have
helped speed things up a bit.

Tom S