I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One thing
I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).

I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly different
ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd like
to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using other
sulfites at the end.

Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
their sulfites clean up their shares?

Looking for any suggestions-

Thanks!
Keith

"ker_01" > wrote in message
...
>
> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One
> thing
> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).
>
> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly
> different
> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd like
> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using other
> sulfites at the end.
>
> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>
> Looking for any suggestions-
>
> Thanks!
> Keith

You could try cooling the whole batch down to just above 0/32 to stop the
fermentation and then try a .2 micron filter to get the yeast cells out.

Dirty Harry wrote:
> "ker_01" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One
>> thing
>> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
>> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).
>>
>> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly
>> different
>> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd like
>> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
>> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using other
>> sulfites at the end.
>>
>> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
>> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
>> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
>> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
>> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
>> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>>
>> Looking for any suggestions-
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Keith
>
> You could try cooling the whole batch down to just above 0/32 to stop the
> fermentation and then try a .2 micron filter to get the yeast cells out.
>
>
I'd not recommend using a 0.2um filter on wine. It would be overkill
for filtering the yeast and would take out 'too much' of the good stuff
(flavors) along with the undesirable stuff.

Using a 0.2um filter would not improve the yeast cell capture
efficiency, but it would increase the pressure drop considerably,
especially if the wine has any polysaccharides or more than trace
amounts of protein (would clog the filter very quickly).

A 0.2um filter is primarily used as the final filter in high purity
water systems, as a means of trapping dead bacteria fragments and
colloidal 'particles'.

A filter in the range of 0.45um to 0.8um pore size should be sufficient
for yeast capture (the 0.45um size also trapping viable bacteria, hence
the term 'sterile' filtering). Even then it would be a good idea to
start with a coarser (1um to 2um) depth filter to keep from clogging the
finer filter too quickly.

I speak of depth filter as contrasted with an absolute (surface capture)
filter. Depth filters have much higher loading capacity before clogging
and are rated at 95% efficiency at the stated pore size. Absolute
filters are rated at 99% efficiency at the stated pore size.

Gene

"gene" > wrote in message
...
> Dirty Harry wrote:
>> "ker_01" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One
>>> thing
>>> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
>>> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).
>>>
>>> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly
>>> different
>>> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd
>>> like
>>> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
>>> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using
>>> other
>>> sulfites at the end.
>>>
>>> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix
>>> in
>>> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
>>> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
>>> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could
>>> bottle
>>> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
>>> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>>>
>>> Looking for any suggestions-
>>>
>>> Thanks!
>>> Keith
>>
>> You could try cooling the whole batch down to just above 0/32 to stop the
>> fermentation and then try a .2 micron filter to get the yeast cells out.
>>
>>
> I'd not recommend using a 0.2um filter on wine. It would be overkill for
> filtering the yeast and would take out 'too much' of the good stuff
> (flavors) along with the undesirable stuff.
>
> Using a 0.2um filter would not improve the yeast cell capture efficiency,
> but it would increase the pressure drop considerably, especially if the
> wine has any polysaccharides or more than trace amounts of protein (would
> clog the filter very quickly).
>
> A 0.2um filter is primarily used as the final filter in high purity water
> systems, as a means of trapping dead bacteria fragments and colloidal
> 'particles'.
>
> A filter in the range of 0.45um to 0.8um pore size should be sufficient
> for yeast capture (the 0.45um size also trapping viable bacteria, hence
> the term 'sterile' filtering). Even then it would be a good idea to start
> with a coarser (1um to 2um) depth filter to keep from clogging the finer
> filter too quickly.
>
> I speak of depth filter as contrasted with an absolute (surface capture)
> filter. Depth filters have much higher loading capacity before clogging
> and are rated at 95% efficiency at the stated pore size. Absolute filters
> are rated at 99% efficiency at the stated pore size.
>
> Gene

Ok, you're probably right, the filter I am thinking about is a #3 for a mini
jet I'm not 100% sure on the micron rating. I'd actually only ever consider
a #3 on a white wine, I do use #2s sometimes on red sometimes nothing.

On Aug 25, 9:47*pm, "Dirty Harry" > wrote:
> "gene" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Dirty Harry wrote:
> >> "ker_01" > wrote in message
> ...
> >>> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One
> >>> thing
> >>> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
> >>> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes)..
>
> >>> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly
> >>> different
> >>> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd
> >>> like
> >>> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
> >>> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using
> >>> other
> >>> sulfites at the end.
>
> >>> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix
> >>> in
> >>> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
> >>> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
> >>> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could
> >>> bottle
> >>> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
> >>> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>
> >>> Looking for any suggestions-
>
> >>> Thanks!
> >>> Keith
>
> >> You could try cooling the whole batch down to just above 0/32 to stop the
> >> fermentation and then try a .2 micron filter to get the yeast cells out.

ker_01 wrote:

>
> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One
> thing I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I
> have several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes
> migranes).

Genaral concensus is that migranes are not caused by Sulphites.
If you have asthma sulphite may cause allergic reactions. But
headaches come from different ingredients.
Ask them if they eat raisins or any other dried fruit and
if that causes migrane. Most dried fruit is prepared with
sulphites.......
If they can not eat dried fruit then sulphites is the culprit
otherwise something else is.

> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly
> different ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends.
> They'd like to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem
> to include adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or
> using other sulfites at the end.

Sorry again, but sulphites will not stop the fermentation.
It may stun the yeast for a certain period of time but it will not
stop fermentation alltogether.
Most yeast strains we use are sulphite resistent.
Best way is to ferment dry and then add sorbate and sulphite.
Sorbate helps preventing the yeast to multiply and the sulphite
kills bacteria and helps preventing oxidation of the wine.

>
> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>
If you do not want to use sulphite (which is ok by me) you can
ferment dry. Make sure that the wine has enough alcohol (12% or up),
enough acidity and tannins and then bottle in a medium that does not
allow air to enter.
The alcohol, tannins and acid will work like preservatives and the closure
makes sure that no air (and bacteria) can come in.
Screw caps are an option but so are beer-bottle caps.

In France there is a bunch of winemakers that call themselves
the gang without sulphur. They make top wines without the use
of sulphites. But a very high level of sanitation must be maintained.

Luc

--
http://www.wijnmaker.blogspot.com/

"Luc Volders" > wrote:
> In France there is a bunch of winemakers that call themselves
> the gang without sulphur. They make top wines without the use
> of sulphites. But a very high level of sanitation must be maintained.

I make all my wine without sulfites by fermenting to dry, but I have not yet
seen the evidence that "a very high level of sanitation must be maintained."
When starting a new batch, I sanitize everything with a little bleach in
water, then rinse well. Then I ferment and age in 4-liter glass jugs (or
demijohns if we want to sound fancy :-) and let it stay under airlock for at
least six months, then put a rubber bung in. Sometimes the bungs still blow
out. Sometimes I don't discover this for a week or two. But I have yet to
have a batch go bad on me. When they are sitting very quietly in the wine
cellar, minding their own business, full of alcohol and residual dissolved
carbon dioxide, they seem pretty resistant to the horrors that are supposed
to occur from having a week or two's exposure to the outside air.

Recently I have acquired more airlocks so my pipeline can get 9-10 months
under airlock before being bunged. Since this change, so far I have not had
any more bung blowouts. (You'd think the fermentation would be done, done,
*done* after nine months. And so far this seems to be the case. But I'm
still hesitant to apply that final step of the screw cap. A bung is less
than a buck. It seems worth this extra one-time expense to me to avoid
having a glass bottle full of wine detonate all over my basement. ;-)

To get sweet wine, I just add a bit of sugar to the glass at pour time. You
can have any level of sweetness you want this way without risking blowing
corks in your wine cellar. And as an added bonus, each glass can be made to
a different level of sweetness, all the way from completely dry to cloyingly
syrupy, to suit everyone's tastes, without requiring multiple different
fermentations.

To be really sacrilegious, you could bottle into 2-liter plastic soda
bottles. Those suckers can withstand an awful lot of pressure. Exactly how
much, I do not know, but when they come from the store they sure are
rock-hard. And they obviously must be food-grade. I store the homemade fruit
wines I'm currently drinking in these, since the 4-liter jugs don't fit well
in the fridge, and I cannot detect any plastic flavor being introduced.

Utopia in Decay
http://home.comcast.net/~kevin.cherkauer/site

Kevin Cherkauer

On Aug 24, 11:50*am, "ker_01" > wrote:
> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One thing
> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).
>
> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly different
> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd like
> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using other
> sulfites at the end.
>
> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>
> Looking for any suggestions-
>
> Thanks!
> Keith

Hey All. I also had similar curcumstance with raspberry wine. I cured
it by racking into a sterile 5 gallon pot on the stove and warmed the
wine to 180 deg. I just picked a number lower than boiling but not to
low. Let cool to about 100 degrees and rack back into a sterile 5
gallon demi. Let any dead lees settle then bottles a week later. Also
back sweetened at time of bottling.
Another alternative is force filtering.
And another is UVC water treatment system for drining water. It will
kill all bacteria and viruses.

Dave Whitney

dave whitney wrote:
> On Aug 24, 11:50 am, "ker_01" > wrote:
>> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One thing
>> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
>> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).
>>
>> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly different
>> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd like
>> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
>> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using other
>> sulfites at the end.
>>
>> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
>> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
>> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
>> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
>> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
>> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>>
>> Looking for any suggestions-
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Keith
>
> Hey All. I also had similar curcumstance with raspberry wine. I cured
> it by racking into a sterile 5 gallon pot on the stove and warmed the
> wine to 180 deg. I just picked a number lower than boiling but not to
> low. Let cool to about 100 degrees and rack back into a sterile 5
> gallon demi. Let any dead lees settle then bottles a week later. Also
> back sweetened at time of bottling.
> Another alternative is force filtering.
> And another is UVC water treatment system for drining water. It will
> kill all bacteria and viruses.
>
> Dave Whitney

Would UVC work on wine? I'd think for red wines, the opacity of the
wine would be an issue, and I'd expect some bleaching. For whites, it
might be better, but UV breaks organic chemical bonds, and that could
affect the flavor profile. Interesting concept, though.

Gene

On Aug 25, 10:15*pm, gene > wrote:
> dave whitney wrote:
> > On Aug 24, 11:50 am, "ker_01" > wrote:
> >> I used to make wine years ago, but never anything "professional". One thing
> >> I avoided was the use of sulfites at the end of fermentation, as I have
> >> several friends that are allergic/sensitive to them (causes migranes).
>
> >> I recently started brewing 2 5-gallon batches of cherry (slightly different
> >> ingredients in each batch as an experiment) with two friends. They'd like
> >> to kill the fermentation to avoid cork blowouts. Options seem to include
> >> adding campden tablets to the final rack in a glass carboy, or using other
> >> sulfites at the end.
>
> >> Any suggestions? One possibility for me is to bottle my share, then mix in
> >> a sulfite to clean whatever is still in the carboy, and bottle it
> >> immediately- but I always thought you had to leave it for 24 hours after
> >> adding anything (I guess it gasses out of solution?). Maybe I could bottle
> >> mine and backfill the carboy with CO2 from some suspended dry ice while
> >> their sulfites clean up their shares?
>
> >> Looking for any suggestions-
>
> >> Thanks!
> >> Keith
>
> > Hey All. I also had similar curcumstance with raspberry wine. I cured
> > it by racking into a sterile 5 gallon pot on the stove and warmed the
> > wine to 180 deg. I just picked a number lower than boiling but not to
> > low. Let cool to about 100 degrees and rack back into a sterile 5
> > gallon demi. Let any dead lees settle then bottles a week later. Also
> > back sweetened at time *of bottling.
> > Another alternative is force filtering.
> > And another is UVC water treatment system for drining water. It will
> > kill all bacteria and viruses.
>
> > Dave Whitney
>
> Would UVC work on wine? *I'd think for red wines, the opacity of the
> wine would be an issue, and I'd expect some bleaching. *For whites, it
> might be better, but UV breaks organic chemical bonds, and that could
> affect the flavor profile. Interesting concept, though.
>
> Gene- Hide quoted text -
>
I have emailed the makers of the UVC purification sytems the same
question. I have not received an answer in 3 months. Home Depot use to
sell these. The smallest one did 1 gallon a minute by gravity feed or
more by pump. A friend also said any UV could change the wine. I
honestly do not know. I do know that if one yeast beasty is in the mix
it will take off again.

Dave Whitney