Cherry Port
 

Background:
I'm a new wine maker and have successfully completed and been pleased
with a couple of wine kits. I have really enjoyed many of the cherry
products from the region and while in Traverse City, MI I attained
~130 LBS of IQF (individually quick frozen; no pits) tart cherries.
They are still frozen and I have around 90 LBS left after making 5
Gallons of cherry infusion, an excellent cherry ale, and quite a few
pies.

Inspirations:
Chateau Chantal Cerise
A sweet cherry desert wine from the peninsula. From the bottle:
"Beginning w/ whole, tart cherries we distill the fruit to its essence
(156 proof), then blend it with partially fermented cherry wine."
http://chateauchantal.com/

Homemade Cherry Infusions
2 Cups Sugar, a sun tea jar full of tart cherries and about 1 Liter of
either bourbon or vodka. It's been a big hit at my house for years
(we served 2 gallons of it this New Years Eve 2007 and the entire 5
gallons of cherry ale).

Research:
As this is my first "scratch" batch I've taken a lot of time to review
and research this ng, the incredible Home wine makers manual at
http://www.geocities.com/lumeisenman/contents.html, as well as notes
from a class I took here in Cincinnati, Oh taught by Walt Huber.

I spent a lot of time browsing online; http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/
is incredible, and I think that the recipe discussed on this ng he
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.c... 9fdde6a5acfe
is the one I'd like to go with (not the first recipe) the Berry Port
recipe from:
http://www.geocities.com/lumeisenman/chapt21.html

The discussion leads me to believe this is a very promising recipe.

Recipe:
BERRY PORT
(Makes five gallons, US measurements)

6 lbs Blackberries
6 lbs Loganberries
6 lbs Blueberries
6 lbs very ripe bananas
2 lbs dried dates
2 lbs dried figs
4 1/4 gallons of water
10 lbs white granulated sugar
1 level teaspoon yeast energizer
6 level teaspoons acid blend
2 1/2 level teaspoons grape tannin
1 level teaspoon pectic enzyme
5 Campden tablets


Questions:
Should I swap all of the fruit with cherries; 24 LBS?

I'm using tarts instead of sweet cherries; obviously a lot of the
process is to taste. I think I'd like to try and make a sweet viscous
port. I'd like this to be a real crowd pleaser- something you would
almost pour over ice-cream or cake. Changes you'd suggest to the
initial recipe?

Would glycerol help to get me that full body mouth feel? I realize
this is putting the cart before the horse..

I've read that cherries are extremely high in malic acid; would it be
worthwhile to try and balance out w/ citric acid from another fruit;
for example blueberries as 10-20% (20 LBS Tart Cherries / 4 LBS
Blueberries)? If so, source suggestions for blueberries- would frozen
bagged from the grocery be ok?

To calculate the fortifications is it simply solving for X, where .15%
would be my calculated alchohol %,.45 is a 90 proof liquor, and .20 is
my target alcohol %?
.15(5 gallons) + .45(x gallons) = .20(5 gallons +x gallons)
x = 1 gallon
that seems kind of high

I'd like to fortify some of the resulting wine with bourbon instead of
everclear to 20%; that explains the above selection of a 90 proof
liquor. Is this going to be worthwhile? Are any of the bourbon
flavors going to come through? I suppose if it's a actually a gallon
addition per above they sure would. Would it be worth using something
high end like Blantons?

I would also like to do a chocolate cherry port, but have been unable
to find a way to add some chocolate flavoring to the wine. The best
lead I found from this ng was the recipes starting with 16 boxes of
chocolate covered cherries. Any suggestions here? Ideally I'd split
the batch at some point and infuse somehow?

Any other comments or input on the recipe?

Thanks in advance for all of your thoughts and comments on this
recipe. Regardless of what direction I finally choose I'll be sure to
post the process and results to the new group; this place is an
invaluable reference!

Liam

Cherry Port
 

Liam -
So many questions! Here are a few comments, FWIW:

You can use cherries instead of the other berries, but I think I'd
keep the bananas, figs and dates. I think they contribute some
flavors to the port that complement the berries, so I'd keep them and
use 18 lbs (or perhaps more) cherries in place of the other berries.

Worry about whether to add a bit of glycerin after you've finished the
wine and are about ready to bottle.

It may well be true that cherries are high in malic acid, but I'm not
sure why that would be a problem. Presumably you are not going to put
this wine through MLF. You could certainly use some proportion of
other fruit, which might increase the citric acid relative to the
malic, but then it wouldn't be as focused on the cherry. I don't see
why you'd bother, if what you are aiming for is something that is
distinctly cherry-flavored.

I think your calculations are correct. There is a tool called the
Pearson Square that is intended to simplify this type of calculation.
Personally, I find using a bit of high-school algebra works just as
well, and is (to me) less confusing.

Yes, you could use bourbon instead of Everclear. I usually use high-
proof rum (e.g., Bacardi 151) as I can't buy Everclear in Minnesota.
Using higher-proof spirits cuts down substantially on the amount you
need to add (and dilution of the wine flavors). No, in my opinion
there is no sense in using premium bourbon for something like this --
I'd lean toward Heaven Hill or something similar - drinkable but
inexpensive. With all the other flavors in there, plus some sugar,
you'd never be able to taste the difference. At least, I'm sure I
couldn't.

I can't give you any insights on the chocolate cherry stuff. I've
read posts from folks who have done it and seemed very pleased.
Personally, I've always thought that chocolate and fermentation didn't
really go together very well. There are (were) kits available for
making Chocolate Orange Port (RJ Spagnols) and Chocolate Raspberry
Port (WinExpert) that have pretty much received rave reviews -- you
might want to see if you can find one of them, they'd be a lot more
fool-proof.

Happy fermenting --

Doug

Cherry Port
 

Doug-

Thanks so much for your prompt suggestions.

I thought I might like the bananas in there anyway. One of my
favorite bourbons, Van Winkle 12 year reserve has a distinct mushed
banana undertone. Was planning on keeping the figs and dates.

As far as the blending goes, it seemed to be a very popular suggestion
in many of the recipies and guides that I've looked at. Specifically,
pg.31 of kitwines.pdf:
http://www3.nf.sympatico.ca/phumber/Kitwines.pdf

As this is my first batch, I fell like I've got a lot vested in it- I
want it to be as good as it can be.

I suspected as much on the bourbons. I've tried making the infusion
w/ high end Vodka and Bourbon and after 3 months you can hardly tell
the difference between good or "bad" vodka. After a year it's kind of
tough to distinguish between bourbon and vodka period. I may
experiment anyway and post up some results. Perhaps just a bottle or
two. :)

In my research I saw lot's of good references to both of the kits you
mentioned. While I didn't exhaust all possibilities all of the links
I followed and suppliers I checked were sold out of both kits.
Ideally, I'd like to be as close to the "bean" as possible; I suspect
that some of the flavor that's transferred from the Forrest Gump
method (Boxes of chocolate covered cherries) is additive based
flavors- cherry and chocolate alike (ever read Fast Food Nation?). I
believe I've seen a chocolate flavor additive at my local brew shop.
I'd prefer not to go that route, but will consider it if all of my
other options are exhausted. I've had so much luck with my cherry
infusion recipe I may give that a shot, however read many negative
comments about using cacao powder period I'm somewhat hesitant.

Questions, questions. You should see my log books!

Thanks!

Liam

Cherry Port
 

On Jan 7, 4:21*pm, Liam Randall > wrote:
> Doug-
>
> Thanks so much for your prompt suggestions.
>
> I thought I might like the bananas in there anyway. *One of my
> favorite bourbons, Van Winkle 12 year reserve has a distinct mushed
> banana undertone. *Was planning on keeping the figs and dates.
>
> As far as the blending goes, it seemed to be a very popular suggestion
> in many of the recipes and guides that I've looked at. *Specifically,
> pg.31 of kitwines.pdf:http://www3.nf.sympatico.ca/phumber/Kitwines.pdf
>
> As this is my first batch, I fell like I've got a lot vested in it- I
> want it to be as good as it can be.
>
> I suspected as much on the bourbons. *I've tried making the infusion
> w/ high end Vodka and Bourbon and after 3 months you can hardly tell
> the difference between good or "bad" vodka. *After a year it's kind of
> tough to distinguish between bourbon and vodka period. *I may
> experiment anyway and post up some results. *Perhaps just a bottle or
> two. :)
>
> In my research I saw Lot's of good references to both of the kits you
> mentioned. *While I didn't exhaust all possibilities all of the links
> I followed and suppliers I checked were sold out of both kits.
> Ideally, I'd like to be as close to the "bean" as possible; I suspect
> that some of the flavor that's transferred from the Forrest Gump
> method (Boxes of chocolate covered cherries) is additive based
> flavors- cherry and chocolate alike (ever read Fast Food Nation?). *I
> believe I've seen a chocolate flavor additive at my local brew shop.
> I'd prefer not to go that route, but will consider it if all of my
> other options are exhausted. *I've had so much luck with my cherry
> infusion recipe I may give that a shot, however read many negative
> comments about using cacao powder period I'm somewhat hesitant.
>
> Questions, questions. *You should see my log books!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Liam

Liam,
The bananas and raisins will add some body and viscosity so I would
keep them for sure. I would use cheap 100 proof vodka for the
fortifying alcohol. I make Limoncello often and we can't taste enough
difference between Jacquins and Stoli to ever use good vodka again.

Since you want this sweet, higher acid shouldn't be an issue since you
can normally balance high acid with more sugar but I need to think
about whether you need the acid blend at all when i get home and can
look up the relative acidity of the fruits. Do you have any acid
testing equipment?

I have never made anything close to what you are proposing so just
want to let you know that so you can include that in your
considerations.

Joe

Cherry Port
 

Joe-

Thank you for the comments.

We reviewed titrate acid test kit usage in the class I took at
Listermanns Brewery supply here in Cincinnati, OH. The recipe
instructions say to bring the acid up to .65 %. I have some other
notes on acidity levels in wine to review this evening and incorporate
into my plan. I've done a vodka limoncello infusion before and also
use the cheap stuff for that as well.

I can post the whole log when I finally commit. At the very least it
might help to serve as a starting point for others transitioning from
kit wines to scratch-batch.
FWIW, on my shopping list is:

Shopping List, Necessary

Acid test kit- with the "Titrate method" of determining acid content
-1/2 or 1/4 CC Medicene dropper (may come with Acid test kit)
- DO NOT USE ACID TEST DROPPER FOR ANYTHING ELSE
Child's cough syrup syringe
Tartaric acid or acid blend
Red Star Pasteur Champagne Dry Davis#595 59-86° 13-15% Medium-Low
Yeast nutrient (to make a starter batch)
Campden tablets
Pectic enzyme (to be added to must)
- make sure it contains Rohamet P--> juice extraction from pulpy
fruits
Rohamet P (see above)
Potassium sorbate
Large plastic funnel (food grade; large enough for cherries) to fit
Carboy
Nylon bags for straining; or sterilized panyhose

Shopping List, Extended

Wine filter (not necessary)
Fining agents (may need)
Oak
Acid reducing agents:
-potassium carbonate
-glycerine (can be used at bottling time) (see notes below) (make
sure it's not from CHINA--> diethylene glycol)
Fining Agents (on a case by case basis)- Sparkolloid, Gelatine,
Bentonite, Isinglass, Potassium Sorbate,
#9 corks