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Best bets on CV grapes

I know that this is always being asked so please forgive once more....I
just recieved my price list for CV grapes. Prices are $28-30 for 36lb
"fresh"grapes and $48 for 20 liter of juice.Canadian dollars that is.
Was wondering if anyone might know what the ripening conditions were
like this year. For example would the Grenache have all the flavor
cooked out of it? What might stand up to extreme heat and still give
some flavor? My choices are...ALICANTE,BARBERA,CABERNET FRANC,CABERNET
SAUVIGNON,CARIGNANE,CARNELIAN,GRENACHE,MERLOT,MONT EPULCIANO,PINOT
NOIR,SANGIOVESE,ZINFANDEL.....thanks in advance for any
replys......andy j.

Best bets on CV grapes

Joe...how does Grenache stand up as a Red?

Best bets on CV grapes

Dave
The Central Valley of California. The only good thing that came of
Prohibition was the entrenching of an industry to supply homewinemakers
with decent vinifera grapes and must from California. It's not Napa
but it makes good everyday table wine.

Joe
Dave Allison wrote:
> CV? I'm not connecting what that means. Is this a source of concentrates?

Best bets on CV grapes

>...how does Grenache stand up as a Red?
I'm a little torn on that, it's not going to be a Rhone valley or
Spanish style Grenache, it's a little lighter. Everything from there
is.

When people post that wines made from the Central Valley are not of the
same quality as better areas they are correct, but its truly a matter
of degree to me. It can make very good table wine or the Gallo's
wouldn't be swimming in money.

I like it as a red but think if you blend that with Syrah you get a
nice blend; you get the deeper color of the Syrah and the perfume of
the Grenache and they don't fight, they marry well. I think it makes a
much better rose; but if using grapes and a red is the object maybe
plan on a long maceration.

To be honest varietal characteristics are muted with most of these
grapes. You can tell a Merlot from a Cab and a Pinot Noir but they
have very little 'power' for lack of a better way of saying it.

That said, most of my wine is given away as gifts and it's very well
thought of. A wine connoisseur would not be very impressed but that is
approximately 0.001% of the population, most people would think a $100
bottle of Bordeaux is just awful tasting and most from around here
would actually admit that.

I like the reds I make from the Central Valley.; you can't go wrong
with them if you are looking for everyday table wine.

Joe.

Best bets on CV grapes

Joe : Generally the CV grapes are not the best quality but can be good.
a few guidelines /things I have learned sine 1998 .

1/ Fresh as possible.
2/ The best grape generally come from Lodi Area for most varietials
3/ Red better than whites- Although Muscat can be good.
4/ Mediterrean varieties IE Italian or Rhone better than Bordeaux
(Merlot/Cab Sav). Avoid Pinot Noir -Is not a true PN any way.
5/ Best I've had from CV were Barbara, Syrah and Zinfandel.
-The Zinfandel is the most consistant year in /year out.
The Zin are often over 25 years old. Sangiovese can be good some
years and Petit Sirah is good as well.
6/ Grenache from CV tend to be light so cold soak or
Freeze the Juice/ Pulp separately then thaw. Dump out the last
10-20% of the thawing juice (Containing the most water)and ferment
with the concentrated 80% juice with pulp added back in.
7/ Blending helps a lot. I made a Rioja as 1/3 Grenache, 1/3 Valdepenas
(Temperanillo clone) and 1/3 Cab Sav all from CV. This blend turn
out
better than the pure varietal wine I made from each at ssame
time/way.
8/ Try belending Grenache with Syrah and Malovoise Black (Cinsault) for

a Rhone Blend.
9/ The Premium Hand Picked (Lodi)CV Varietals such as Syrah/Merlot/Cab
Sav are
worth the extra $12 Case if Available - Much more care and
attention by
the grower. IF avaialble.
10/ Because of the light colour of the Grenache ferment for at least 12
hours at
30 degrees C- then cool to 25 degrees C. This helps with colour
extraction.

WashingtonState Grapes often are a better quality/Value especially
whites
and Bordeaux (Merlot Cab Sav/Cab Franc) based on my experiance..

I hope this helps
Jim Ashenden -"Ch Plonkd De Jacques."

Joe Sallustio wrote:
> >...how does Grenache stand up as a Red?
> I'm a little torn on that, it's not going to be a Rhone valley or
> Spanish style Grenache, it's a little lighter. Everything from there
> is.
>
> When people post that wines made from the Central Valley are not of the
> same quality as better areas they are correct, but its truly a matter
> of degree to me. It can make very good table wine or the Gallo's
> wouldn't be swimming in money.
>
> I like it as a red but think if you blend that with Syrah you get a
> nice blend; you get the deeper color of the Syrah and the perfume of
> the Grenache and they don't fight, they marry well. I think it makes a
> much better rose; but if using grapes and a red is the object maybe
> plan on a long maceration.
>
> To be honest varietal characteristics are muted with most of these
> grapes. You can tell a Merlot from a Cab and a Pinot Noir but they
> have very little 'power' for lack of a better way of saying it.
>
> That said, most of my wine is given away as gifts and it's very well
> thought of. A wine connoisseur would not be very impressed but that is
> approximately 0.001% of the population, most people would think a $100
> bottle of Bordeaux is just awful tasting and most from around here
> would actually admit that.
>
> I like the reds I make from the Central Valley.; you can't go wrong
> with them if you are looking for everyday table wine.
>
> Joe.

Best bets on CV grapes

I agree, especially with the Sangiovese. In my experience the Sangioves is
good to use in a blend in grapes from other areas such as the Mid Atlantic.

"The Chateau Plonk de Jacques" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Joe : Generally the CV grapes are not the best quality but can be good.
> a few guidelines /things I have learned sine 1998 .
>
> 1/ Fresh as possible.
> 2/ The best grape generally come from Lodi Area for most varietials
> 3/ Red better than whites- Although Muscat can be good.
> 4/ Mediterrean varieties IE Italian or Rhone better than Bordeaux
> (Merlot/Cab Sav). Avoid Pinot Noir -Is not a true PN any way.
> 5/ Best I've had from CV were Barbara, Syrah and Zinfandel.
> -The Zinfandel is the most consistant year in /year out.
> The Zin are often over 25 years old. Sangiovese can be good some
> years and Petit Sirah is good as well.
> 6/ Grenache from CV tend to be light so cold soak or
> Freeze the Juice/ Pulp separately then thaw. Dump out the last
> 10-20% of the thawing juice (Containing the most water)and ferment
> with the concentrated 80% juice with pulp added back in.
> 7/ Blending helps a lot. I made a Rioja as 1/3 Grenache, 1/3 Valdepenas
> (Temperanillo clone) and 1/3 Cab Sav all from CV. This blend turn
> out
> better than the pure varietal wine I made from each at ssame
> time/way.
> 8/ Try belending Grenache with Syrah and Malovoise Black (Cinsault) for
>
> a Rhone Blend.
> 9/ The Premium Hand Picked (Lodi)CV Varietals such as Syrah/Merlot/Cab
> Sav are
> worth the extra $12 Case if Available - Much more care and
> attention by
> the grower. IF avaialble.
> 10/ Because of the light colour of the Grenache ferment for at least 12
> hours at
> 30 degrees C- then cool to 25 degrees C. This helps with colour
> extraction.
>
> WashingtonState Grapes often are a better quality/Value especially
> whites
> and Bordeaux (Merlot Cab Sav/Cab Franc) based on my experiance..
>
> I hope this helps
> Jim Ashenden -"Ch Plonkd De Jacques."
>
> Joe Sallustio wrote:
>> >...how does Grenache stand up as a Red?
>> I'm a little torn on that, it's not going to be a Rhone valley or
>> Spanish style Grenache, it's a little lighter. Everything from there
>> is.
>>
>> When people post that wines made from the Central Valley are not of the
>> same quality as better areas they are correct, but its truly a matter
>> of degree to me. It can make very good table wine or the Gallo's
>> wouldn't be swimming in money.
>>
>> I like it as a red but think if you blend that with Syrah you get a
>> nice blend; you get the deeper color of the Syrah and the perfume of
>> the Grenache and they don't fight, they marry well. I think it makes a
>> much better rose; but if using grapes and a red is the object maybe
>> plan on a long maceration.
>>
>> To be honest varietal characteristics are muted with most of these
>> grapes. You can tell a Merlot from a Cab and a Pinot Noir but they
>> have very little 'power' for lack of a better way of saying it.
>>
>> That said, most of my wine is given away as gifts and it's very well
>> thought of. A wine connoisseur would not be very impressed but that is
>> approximately 0.001% of the population, most people would think a $100
>> bottle of Bordeaux is just awful tasting and most from around here
>> would actually admit that.
>>
>> I like the reds I make from the Central Valley.; you can't go wrong
>> with them if you are looking for everyday table wine.
>>
>> Joe.
>

Best bets on CV grapes

Actually Sangiovese interests me in a blend. I'm quite partial to a low
priced wine by Farnese. Might it blend well with Grenache ,Cab. Sauv.
and Zin? Or is that too wacky?...Blending is all new to me. I have a
few days yet to order. I agree that Zin is very good out of the CV.
Last years was very good, although the clusters I recieved were only
partially filled.They looked like "gleanings" to me. The Cab Sauv. I
fermented with it really gave it some nice body.It will be another 6
months to a year before I will really be able to tell for sure. Lots of
tannins. But CV grapes are really a value and a great source of
enjoyment for those of us with no access to premium grapes. I do grow
my own, but being in Eastern Canada gives problems with high acid
levels etc. Who out there makes "second" wine from CV grapes. Now there
is a challenge to get a drinkable product. It's worth the trouble at
$.25 a bottle. If that!....Also.....does anybody use Cv white grape
juice?....andy j.

Best bets on CV grapes

Also....have you tried using Color X enzyme to extract more body/color
out of these CV grapes. I did last year and it made a huge difference.

Best bets on CV grapes

Re Sangiovese Blending: If you blend Merlot and Cab Sav up to
25% each with Sangiovese you have Chainti, which is often
better than Sangiovese alone. The Merlot give more fruit and
a middle palette and the Cab Sav. contributes body and colour.
Last year (2005) did this and please with the results. This is a
Classic blend. -Fruity (Berry-Cherry) with good colour and medium
body.
Fermatntion Plan:This was Cold Souked for 4 days Fermentedd with
Chianti Yeast from Wyeast, at Day 2 French Oak Chips added and
at Day 3 Malolatic added .500 ml of Unfermented juice was added
to a plastic wrap covered must Day 7-14 with a heating pad
keeping
the temp between 25-30 degrees C(Extended Masceration) then
Bladder pressed and keep warm 20 degres c for another 2 weeks to
complete the Malolactic fermentation.

Note Sangiovese is usually mid to late season along wit
Merlot, Cab Sav. Zin seem to be availalble most of the season.
Barbera is a early to mid season .

Other Blending partners Zin seem to work well with many other
varieties-give a berry flavour to compliment the Chery/ Acid of
Sangiovese. Barbera could be a blending partner if you wish
to keep with the Italian theme.

Remember to Oak Early((during Fermentation) Oak Often with French
oak
snf sff Colour X and Peptic Enzeme.

Jim -Ch Plonk de Jacques.

wrote:

> Actually Sangiovese interests me in a blend. I'm quite partial to a low
> priced wine by Farnese. Might it blend well with Grenache ,Cab. Sauv.
> and Zin? Or is that too wacky?...Blending is all new to me. I have a
> few days yet to order. I agree that Zin is very good out of the CV.
> Last years was very good, although the clusters I recieved were only
> partially filled.They looked like "gleanings" to me. The Cab Sauv. I
> fermented with it really gave it some nice body.It will be another 6
> months to a year before I will really be able to tell for sure. Lots of
> tannins. But CV grapes are really a value and a great source of
> enjoyment for those of us with no access to premium grapes. I do grow
> my own, but being in Eastern Canada gives problems with high acid
> levels etc. Who out there makes "second" wine from CV grapes. Now there
> is a challenge to get a drinkable product. It's worth the trouble at
> $.25 a bottle. If that!....Also.....does anybody use Cv white grape
> juice?....andy j.

Best bets on CV grapes

Re...snf sff Colour X and Peptic Enzeme. ....what does "snf sff" mean?
I plead ignorance in the first degree on this one.

Best bets on CV grapes

HI Re Snf snf Typo not in orginal message - Means nothing

Should be add Colour X and Peptic Enzeme.

Jim A

wrote:
> Re...snf sff Colour X and Peptic Enzeme. ....what does "snf sff" mean?
> I plead ignorance in the first degree on this one.