Do we taste with:
1) our nose or
2) our tongue or
3) both?
- Apple juice is naturally sweet.
- Apple-scented mineral water is not sweet.
We certainly can say the apple juice tastes fruity.
Can we say the apple-scented mineral water tastes fruity too?
Or it just smells fruity but not tastes fruity.
Ray

You seem to be implying that the taste of fruit comes from sugar alone.
I would strongly disagree, as there are many more components to flavor
that just sweetness.

- Chris

Raymond wrote:
> Do we taste with:
> 1) our nose or
> 2) our tongue or
> 3) both?

3) Your tongue can taste sweet, salty, sour and bitter (and maybe
"umame" ;-)). All the rest comes from your sense of smell in what is
known as "retronasal olfaction." If you lose your sense of smell, your
sense of taste is also greatly diminished.

Mark Lipton

"Raymond" > wrote in message
...
> Do we taste with:
> 1) our nose or
> 2) our tongue or
> 3) both?
> - Apple juice is naturally sweet.
> - Apple-scented mineral water is not sweet.
> We certainly can say the apple juice tastes fruity.
> Can we say the apple-scented mineral water tastes fruity too?
> Or it just smells fruity but not tastes fruity.
> Ray
>
We taste with different parts of the tongue for different types
of taste, too.
In the end, it is some part of our brain that is interpreting it for us.
Suggestion can make something taste bad, even when it is not.
Surroundings, even temperature of the body and the outside,
can suggest to our brains something different.
Swilling round the tongue gives us one sensation, and even the back
of the mouth is there for a peppery after taste.
A youthful taste can be very much different than an adult one, which
goes on altering with age.

--
Interested

Thanks for the reply guys. I've no intention to argue but to find out the
facts of TASTE.
Mark Lipton says: "If you lose your sense of smell, your sense of taste is
also greatly diminished". Thanks Mark, you've answered my question. Greatly
yes but not totally. Oxford Dictionary for TASTE: "The sensation
characteristic of a soluble substance caused in the mouth and throat by
contact with that substance" Notice that SMELL is not mentioned. So, there
are two different senses though they are somewhat related: "SMELL" and
"TASTE". If I've completely lost my sense of SMELL, my tongue that is
reponsible for TASTE can still easily tell the difference between bitter and
sweet for example honey and hop juice.
My points: 1) apple scented mineral water does not TASTE the same as pure
apple juice.
2) bone-dry white wine without a trace of natural
sweetness of fruits does not TASTE fruity, it only SMELLS fruity.
Recently, I bought a shampoo that has honey, wheat and fruits (a Body Shop
product). Do you guys think the shampoo TASTES fruity?
No. It has a sweet odour but it does not TASTE sweet.

"Mark Lipton" > wrote in message
...
> Raymond wrote:
> > Do we taste with:
> > 1) our nose or
> > 2) our tongue or
> > 3) both?
>
> 3) Your tongue can taste sweet, salty, sour and bitter (and maybe
> "umame" ;-)). All the rest comes from your sense of smell in what is
> known as "retronasal olfaction." If you lose your sense of smell, your
> sense of taste is also greatly diminished.
>
> Mark Lipton

Mark Lipton wrote...

>> Your tongue can taste sweet, salty, sour and bitter
>> (and maybe "umame")
>> "If you lose your sense of smell, your sense of taste is
>> also greatly diminished".

And "Raymond" wrote ......
> Thanks Mark, you've answered my question. Greatly
> yes but not totally. Oxford Dictionary for TASTE: "The sensation
> characteristic of a soluble substance caused in the mouth and throat by
> contact with that substance"


Raymond, please understand, you can ONLY taste sweet, salty, sour, bitter
and "umame = savoury ie MSG" - nothing else!

Everything else is olfactory = smell.

And you can only taste what you put in your mouth - so if you want to put
shampoo in your mouth - well, silly you.

However, when it comes to the finer nuances of wine; your sensory perception
is not one or the other - it is a combination -(including sight and [mouth]
feel.)

> 2) bone-dry white wine without a trace of natural
> sweetness of fruits does not TASTE fruity,
> it only SMELLS fruity.

Again, repeating what others have said, there is no such thing as fruity
taste, and the expression "dry" means absence of sweetness, natural or
otherwise

--

st.helier

Raymond wrote:

> My points: 1) apple scented mineral water does not TASTE the same as pure
> apple juice.

Of course not. How do you create apple-scented water? How many of the
thousands of flavor components found in apples make it into that water?
People in the flavors and fragrances industry would tell you that at
best you try to simulate a flavor or smell because the real thing is
just too damn complex.

> 2) bone-dry white wine without a trace of natural
> sweetness of fruits does not TASTE fruity, it only SMELLS fruity.

But since smell is a natural component of what we think of as taste, it
tastes fruity, too, except in the most nit-picky of senses (pardon the pun).

> Recently, I bought a shampoo that has honey, wheat and fruits (a Body Shop
> product). Do you guys think the shampoo TASTES fruity?
> No. It has a sweet odour but it does not TASTE sweet.

Have you tasted your shampoo? Have you properly aerated it by swirling
it in your mouth and sucking air through it? Perhaps you need to do it
several times to get a good statistical sample ;-)

Really, this is just a matter of semantics. To the average person,
"taste" is what you sense when you put something into your mouth. If in
fact the majority of that impression is formed by retronasal olfaction,
does it really matter to anyone but us pedants?

Mark Lipton

In ,
Raymond > typed:

> Thanks for the reply guys. I've no intention to argue but to
> find out
> the facts of TASTE.
> Mark Lipton says: "If you lose your sense of smell, your sense
> of
> taste is also greatly diminished". Thanks Mark, you've answered
> my
> question. Greatly yes but not totally.


You are of course literally correct, but in practice, most of
what we perceive as taste (and *call* "taste") is actually smell.
We can only taste sweet, sour, salt, and bitter (and umami, if
you believe in it), but most of the differences we "taste"
between foods are actually odors. If you take the word "taste"
literally, there's probably little if any difference between the
taste of a peach and a plum. But we can all clearly "taste" the
difference, and regardless of the dictionary definition, we call
the difference one of taste, even though it's our noses that do
the distinguishing. Lose your sense of smell and a peach and a
plum (and most other fruits) will be well-nigh indistinguishable
except by texture; turn them into juice so the textural element
is gone and they will almost all be identical to someone who
can't smell.

--
Ken Blake
Please reply to the newsgroup




> Oxford Dictionary for TASTE:
> "The sensation characteristic of a soluble substance caused in
> the
> mouth and throat by contact with that substance" Notice that
> SMELL is
> not mentioned. So, there are two different senses though they
> are
> somewhat related: "SMELL" and "TASTE". If I've completely lost
> my
> sense of SMELL, my tongue that is reponsible for TASTE can
> still
> easily tell the difference between bitter and sweet for example
> honey
> and hop juice.
> My points: 1) apple scented mineral water does not TASTE the
> same as
> pure apple juice.
> 2) bone-dry white wine without a trace of
> natural
> sweetness of fruits does not TASTE fruity, it only SMELLS
> fruity.
> Recently, I bought a shampoo that has honey, wheat and fruits
> (a Body
> Shop product). Do you guys think the shampoo TASTES fruity?
> No. It has a sweet odour but it does not TASTE sweet.
>
> "Mark Lipton" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Raymond wrote:
>>> Do we taste with:
>>> 1) our nose or
>>> 2) our tongue or
>>> 3) both?
>>
>> 3) Your tongue can taste sweet, salty, sour and bitter (and
>> maybe
>> "umame" ;-)). All the rest comes from your sense of smell in
>> what is
>> known as "retronasal olfaction." If you lose your sense of
>> smell,
>> your sense of taste is also greatly diminished.
>>
>> Mark Lipton

Salut/Hi Mark Lipton,

le/on Fri, 08 Jul 2005 10:29:43 -0500, tu disais/you said:-

>Raymond wrote:
>> Do we taste with:
>> 1) our nose or
>> 2) our tongue or
>> 3) both?
>
>3) Your tongue can taste sweet, salty, sour and bitter (and maybe
>"umame" ;-)).

What about "hot"? I know that TomS can't taste it but most of us can!!

I'd argue that this is a valid 6th sense.

> the rest comes from your sense of smell in what is
>known as "retronasal olfaction." If you lose your sense of smell, your
>sense of taste is also greatly diminished.

Absolutely right. And I'd also point out that it's somewhat naive to assume
that the Oxford Dictionary is the bible when it comes to subtle and complex
sensory matters. Just as I've seen several mistakes in the Larousse
Gastronomique what it comes to defining obscure cooking techniques etc.
Horses for courses.

--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

"Ian Hoare" > wrote in message
...
> What about "hot"? I know that TomS can't taste it but most of us can!!

Hey, wait a minute Ian! I certainly _can_ taste hot; I just happen to
*like* the effect. Gets those endorphins _flowin'_, know'msayin'? :^D

> I'd argue that this is a valid 6th sense.

I'm not so sure that the perception of heat is a "taste" in the classical
sense.

I made a large batch (several gallons) of hot sauce a week or so ago,
working barehanded. After I was finished, my fingers had the same sort of
tingly numbness that I get in my lips when I eat really fiery food. Does
that mean that I was experiencing taste with my fingertips? FWIW, it wasn't
unpleasant. Still, I knew well enough that it would have been unwise to
have handled my contact lenses for awhile thereafter. =>8^O

Perhaps I'll have to reflect upon this topic over a (small) glass of my
Habanero wine...

Tom S

Tom S wrote:
> "Ian Hoare" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>What about "hot"? I know that TomS can't taste it but most of us can!!
>
>
> Hey, wait a minute Ian! I certainly _can_ taste hot; I just happen to
> *like* the effect. Gets those endorphins _flowin'_, know'msayin'? :^D
>
>
>>I'd argue that this is a valid 6th sense.
>
>
> I'm not so sure that the perception of heat is a "taste" in the classical
> sense.
>
> I made a large batch (several gallons) of hot sauce a week or so ago,
> working barehanded. After I was finished, my fingers had the same sort of
> tingly numbness that I get in my lips when I eat really fiery food. Does
> that mean that I was experiencing taste with my fingertips? FWIW, it wasn't
> unpleasant. Still, I knew well enough that it would have been unwise to
> have handled my contact lenses for awhile thereafter. =>8^O

Tom,
To reduce the risk attendent upon blowing your nose, fiddling with
your contacts or urinating after hanndling chilis, you can briefly wash
your hands in a 1/10 dilution of Clorox in water which effectively
removes the capsaicin on your skin. I find this a necessity when making
our renowned jerk sauce in bulk (using 15-20 habañeros).

>
> Perhaps I'll have to reflect upon this topic over a (small) glass of my
> Habanero wine...

I do hope you're joking. One time a friend made some habañero beer --
not an attractive combination IMO. I have got hints of jalapeños
occasionally when drinking Sauvignon Blanc, but in minor quantity and
with no heat, I hasten to add.

Mark Lipton

> Tom S
>
>

"Mark Lipton" > wrote in message
news:I81Be.148313$x96.74516@attbi_s72...
> Tom,
> To reduce the risk attendent upon blowing your nose, fiddling with
> your contacts or urinating after hanndling chilis, you can briefly wash
> your hands in a 1/10 dilution of Clorox in water which effectively
> removes the capsaicin on your skin. I find this a necessity when making
> our renowned jerk sauce in bulk (using 15-20 habaneros).

"Renowned" jerk sauce? Care to trade for some "renowned" hot sauce? :^)

FWIW, I'd rather put up with the slight tingling from the capsaicin than the
smell of bleach on my hands. Besides, a thorough washing with Dawn or the
like seems to do an adequate job of removing most of the residue.

Usually I don't get that tingly effect at all, but this time I had to destem
about 1½ Kilos of roasted Habaneros. That was rather tedious; must've been
hundreds of them.

>> Perhaps I'll have to reflect upon this topic over a (small) glass of my
>> Habanero wine...
>
> I do hope you're joking.

Nope. I just _had_ to try it. It was very difficult to get it to ferment,
and it's probably etching the glass as we "speak". Pretty hot stuff for
just drinking, but useful in a marinade.

I gave a small bottle (unlabeled) to a friend, explaining what it was. She
put it in her refrigerator and promptly forgot about it until one day when
her Mom was looking for some white wine to sip while she cooked. Wow, did
_she_ ever get a surprise! =>8^O

Funny thing is, she put the bottle back in the 'fridge, and a couple of
years later repeated the experience! True story.

Tom S

interested wrote:

> We taste with different parts of the tongue for different types
> of taste, too.

Do we? I think you'll find its a rather moot point.


--
Chris S

In article <I81Be.148313$x96.74516@attbi_s72>, says...
>
>Tom S wrote:
>> "Ian Hoare" > wrote in message
>> ...

[SNIP some hot topics]
>
>>
>> Perhaps I'll have to reflect upon this topic over a (small) glass of my
>> Habanero wine...

In Cave Creek, just north of PHX proper, there is a brewery, which offers an
interesting chili beer. The top the bottles up with a jalapeño. It is quite
interesting and very drinkable in small quantities. I have learned, however,
to sample it young, and bottle-conditioning really cranks up the heat.
>
>I do hope you're joking. One time a friend made some habañero beer --
>not an attractive combination IMO. I have got hints of jalapeños
>occasionally when drinking Sauvignon Blanc, but in minor quantity and
>with no heat, I hasten to add.

About the '96-97 vintage, Sanford did an SB (either Sanford & Benedict, or
maybe Bien Nacido)had pronounced jalapeños tastes. I stocked up on this one,
but later vintages did not exhibit this characteristic.

>Mark Lipton

Hunt
>
>> Tom S

"Chris S" > wrote in message
...
> interested wrote:
>
>> We taste with different parts of the tongue for different types
>> of taste, too.
>
> Do we? I think you'll find its a rather moot point.
>
>
> --
> Chris S

http://www.cf.ac.uk/biosi/staff/jaco...aste.html#Salt
Durned new fangled science Phsaw!!
Everywhere I turn, some scientist has found the "old" knowledge is
now wrong.
:-)

--
Interested