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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
MikeD
 
Posts: n/a
Default Burlwood Cellars


ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.

I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
has ever tried these before?

Thanks,

Mike

--

http://www.webwinerack.com - Wine, Wine Reviews, and Wine Information
  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Hehr
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:

>
>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>
>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>has ever tried these before?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mike



I first had a glass of the Burlwood Merlot several years ago at a
local German restaurant, and liked it quite a bit. When Aldi's opened
nearby last year, I bought some and was less impressed (I'm not saying
the wine wasn't necessarily as good, maybe my preference just changed
in the interim). For an inexpensive Merlot, I currently really like
the ForestVille, which was recommended by someone else in this
newsgroup.

--
Steve Hehr

To send me email, replace the "OUT" in my address with its opposite.
  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Hehr
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:

>
>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>
>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>has ever tried these before?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mike



I first had a glass of the Burlwood Merlot several years ago at a
local German restaurant, and liked it quite a bit. When Aldi's opened
nearby last year, I bought some and was less impressed (I'm not saying
the wine wasn't necessarily as good, maybe my preference just changed
in the interim). For an inexpensive Merlot, I currently really like
the ForestVille, which was recommended by someone else in this
newsgroup.

--
Steve Hehr

To send me email, replace the "OUT" in my address with its opposite.
  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:

>
>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>
>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>has ever tried these before?
>
>Thanks,
>
>Mike



I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.

I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
expensive catering option.
  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Richard Neidich
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Nice Markup...guess you had a captive audience. :-(


"sisyphus" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:
>
>>
>>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>>
>>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>>has ever tried these before?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Mike

>
>
> I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
> as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
> such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
> Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
> gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.
>
> I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
> expensive catering option.



  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Richard Neidich
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Nice Markup...guess you had a captive audience. :-(


"sisyphus" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:
>
>>
>>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>>
>>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>>has ever tried these before?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Mike

>
>
> I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
> as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
> such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
> Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
> gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.
>
> I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
> expensive catering option.



  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 19:40:43 GMT, "Richard Neidich"
> wrote:

>Nice Markup...guess you had a captive audience. :-(
>
>
>"sisyphus" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>>>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>>>
>>>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>>>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>>>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>>>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>>>has ever tried these before?
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>Mike

>>
>>
>> I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
>> as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
>> such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
>> Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
>> gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.
>>
>> I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
>> expensive catering option.

>



There were other options. As I said it was the least expensive option.
The other offerings were, shall we say, better bargains. Like
everything in life, the least expensive choice is usually not the
best.
  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 19:40:43 GMT, "Richard Neidich"
> wrote:

>Nice Markup...guess you had a captive audience. :-(
>
>
>"sisyphus" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>>>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>>>
>>>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>>>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>>>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>>>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>>>has ever tried these before?
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>
>>>Mike

>>
>>
>> I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
>> as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
>> such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
>> Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
>> gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.
>>
>> I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
>> expensive catering option.

>



There were other options. As I said it was the least expensive option.
The other offerings were, shall we say, better bargains. Like
everything in life, the least expensive choice is usually not the
best.


  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 13:38:57 -0600, jcoulter
> wrote:

>sisyphus
><viwineaux1nospam@hotmail
>.com> wrote in
>news:io9j411qidi25dub953q
:
>
>
>
>>
>>
>> I never cared for

>Burlwood. When I lived in
>the Caribbean, we sold it
>> as a catering wine

>option.
>
>Sisyphus is being kind.
>Burlwood was the house
>wine a friend's club, It
>was in a word Burlywood
>with little grape.



....and that wood does not resemble oak. As I recall it was very
vegetal.
  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 13:38:57 -0600, jcoulter
> wrote:

>sisyphus
><viwineaux1nospam@hotmail
>.com> wrote in
>news:io9j411qidi25dub953q
:
>
>
>
>>
>>
>> I never cared for

>Burlwood. When I lived in
>the Caribbean, we sold it
>> as a catering wine

>option.
>
>Sisyphus is being kind.
>Burlwood was the house
>wine a friend's club, It
>was in a word Burlywood
>with little grape.



....and that wood does not resemble oak. As I recall it was very
vegetal.
  #13 (permalink)   Report Post  
MikeD
 
Posts: n/a
Default

sisyphus wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:
>
>
>>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>>
>>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>>has ever tried these before?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Mike

>
>
>
> I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
> as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
> such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
> Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
> gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.
>
> I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
> expensive catering option.


You hit the nail on the head. One of the primary reasons for starting
my wine reviews "at the bottom" is because MANY of these wines are out
there with no reviews or information for the consumer. Google for
Burlwood Cellars and you'll find a list of restaurants selling these
wines for $20+/bottle to customers who most likely have no idea. I paid
$5.99 a bottle. Yes, I know restaurants take a high markup on wine, but
400%? If consumers knew better that wouldn't be the case IMHO.







--

http://www.webwinerack.com - Wine, Wine Reviews, and Wine Information
  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
MikeD
 
Posts: n/a
Default

sisyphus wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 16:29:36 GMT, MikeD > wrote:
>
>
>>ALDI Stores USA is now stocking Burlwood Cellars wines. These are
>>produced buy E&J Gallo for the Hotel and Restaurant industry.
>>
>>I've not tried them yet, but ALDI has five varietals: Cabernet
>>Sauvignon, Merlot, White Zinfandel, Sauvignon Blanc, and Chardonnay, all
>>at $5.99 per bottle. I picked up a bottle of 2003 Merlot and 2003
>>Sauvignon Blanc to review for the web site, and was curious if anyone
>>has ever tried these before?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Mike

>
>
>
> I never cared for Burlwood. When I lived in the Caribbean, we sold it
> as a catering wine option. I believe it was created to be sold as
> such( also house wine). Because it was produced specifically for the
> Hotel and Restaurant Industry there was no way for the consumer to
> gauge a price for the wine, as it was not available retail.
>
> I believe we purchased for $3.99 and sold for $25 as our least
> expensive catering option.


You hit the nail on the head. One of the primary reasons for starting
my wine reviews "at the bottom" is because MANY of these wines are out
there with no reviews or information for the consumer. Google for
Burlwood Cellars and you'll find a list of restaurants selling these
wines for $20+/bottle to customers who most likely have no idea. I paid
$5.99 a bottle. Yes, I know restaurants take a high markup on wine, but
400%? If consumers knew better that wouldn't be the case IMHO.







--

http://www.webwinerack.com - Wine, Wine Reviews, and Wine Information
  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
potatoman
 
Posts: n/a
Default

MikeD wrote:
>
> Yes, I know restaurants take a high markup on wine, but
> 400%? If consumers knew better that wouldn't be the case IMHO.
>


I noticed a local restaurant where I frequent selling Yellowtail Shiraz
for something like $6 a glass/$15 a bottle. Earlier that very day I had
just happened to notice the same exact wine at a local store for $3.30 a
bottle. They probably paid less than $3 a bottle and are charging twice
that for a glass. I had never really thought about the markup until I
saw that. It wasn't really a 'wine' type restaurant, but still...markup
is insane.


  #16 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 15:41:53 -0500, potatoman
> wrote:

>MikeD wrote:
>>
>> Yes, I know restaurants take a high markup on wine, but
>> 400%? If consumers knew better that wouldn't be the case IMHO.
>>

>
>I noticed a local restaurant where I frequent selling Yellowtail Shiraz
>for something like $6 a glass/$15 a bottle. Earlier that very day I had
>just happened to notice the same exact wine at a local store for $3.30 a
>bottle. They probably paid less than $3 a bottle and are charging twice
>that for a glass. I had never really thought about the markup until I
>saw that. It wasn't really a 'wine' type restaurant, but still...markup
>is insane.



You may think of it as insane, but it is similar to the markup on the
food that you eat at that same restaurant. Remember, food, wine,
liquor...by purchasing those at the restaurant, you are paying for
labor, lease, electricity, taxes, cleaning supplies, water, glasses,
plates, flatware, the furniture, linens, possibly landscaping, payroll
services, insurance, etc, etc. There is a lot of overhead involved.

You are paying for someone to cook for you and clean up after you.
You frequent that restaurant beacuse you enjoy the job they do for
you. The owners are probably not getting rich, but make a decent
living. The servers, however, always need your help. Please tip
generously!

P.S. $3.30 is a very good price for that particular wine. I belive it
retails for $6-8 in most states.
  #17 (permalink)   Report Post  
potatoman
 
Posts: n/a
Default

sisyphus wrote:
>
> You may think of it as insane, but it is similar to the markup on the
> food that you eat at that same restaurant. Remember, food, wine,
> liquor...by purchasing those at the restaurant, you are paying for
> labor, lease, electricity, taxes, cleaning supplies, water, glasses,
> plates, flatware, the furniture, linens, possibly landscaping, payroll
> services, insurance, etc, etc. There is a lot of overhead involved.
>
> You are paying for someone to cook for you and clean up after you.
> You frequent that restaurant beacuse you enjoy the job they do for
> you. The owners are probably not getting rich, but make a decent
> living. The servers, however, always need your help. Please tip
> generously!


Oh, I understand the business side of a restaurant and markup. I wasn't
saying it wasn't neccessary, just that it is remarkable when you
actually stop and consider how much it can sometimes be. Although, I do
think that 5 times the ammount of a bottle (which isn't the same as the
markup on the cost of components of a meal which has to be prepared) is
just a tad excessive. IMO, 100% markup is more than fair.

And, as a former server, I understand gratuity all too well. It's almost
a curse - Sometimes when I think the server has done a dreadful job, I
still leave more than what most would consider a decent tip, when I
really shouldn't.

>
> P.S. $3.30 is a very good price for that particular wine. I belive it
> retails for $6-8 in most states.


yeah, I know. That's what made me take note. It was just a coincidence
that I saw it at the restaurant that night.
  #18 (permalink)   Report Post  
potatoman
 
Posts: n/a
Default

sisyphus wrote:
>
> You may think of it as insane, but it is similar to the markup on the
> food that you eat at that same restaurant. Remember, food, wine,
> liquor...by purchasing those at the restaurant, you are paying for
> labor, lease, electricity, taxes, cleaning supplies, water, glasses,
> plates, flatware, the furniture, linens, possibly landscaping, payroll
> services, insurance, etc, etc. There is a lot of overhead involved.
>
> You are paying for someone to cook for you and clean up after you.
> You frequent that restaurant beacuse you enjoy the job they do for
> you. The owners are probably not getting rich, but make a decent
> living. The servers, however, always need your help. Please tip
> generously!


Oh, I understand the business side of a restaurant and markup. I wasn't
saying it wasn't neccessary, just that it is remarkable when you
actually stop and consider how much it can sometimes be. Although, I do
think that 5 times the ammount of a bottle (which isn't the same as the
markup on the cost of components of a meal which has to be prepared) is
just a tad excessive. IMO, 100% markup is more than fair.

And, as a former server, I understand gratuity all too well. It's almost
a curse - Sometimes when I think the server has done a dreadful job, I
still leave more than what most would consider a decent tip, when I
really shouldn't.

>
> P.S. $3.30 is a very good price for that particular wine. I belive it
> retails for $6-8 in most states.


yeah, I know. That's what made me take note. It was just a coincidence
that I saw it at the restaurant that night.
  #19 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:49:49 -0500, potatoman
> wrote:


>
>Oh, I understand the business side of a restaurant and markup. I wasn't
>saying it wasn't neccessary, just that it is remarkable when you
>actually stop and consider how much it can sometimes be. Although, I do
>think that 5 times the ammount of a bottle (which isn't the same as the
>markup on the cost of components of a meal which has to be prepared) is
>just a tad excessive. IMO, 100% markup is more than fair.
>
>And, as a former server, I understand gratuity all too well. It's almost
>a curse - Sometimes when I think the server has done a dreadful job, I
>still leave more than what most would consider a decent tip, when I
>really shouldn't.
>


I agree with your assessment, but few restauranteurs would (though
there are some). Shameful that it is tough to find the bargains on the
less expensive end of the wine list, generally speaking.

I am a fomer sever as well, and do the same...15% for bad service.
  #20 (permalink)   Report Post  
sisyphus
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:49:49 -0500, potatoman
> wrote:


>
>Oh, I understand the business side of a restaurant and markup. I wasn't
>saying it wasn't neccessary, just that it is remarkable when you
>actually stop and consider how much it can sometimes be. Although, I do
>think that 5 times the ammount of a bottle (which isn't the same as the
>markup on the cost of components of a meal which has to be prepared) is
>just a tad excessive. IMO, 100% markup is more than fair.
>
>And, as a former server, I understand gratuity all too well. It's almost
>a curse - Sometimes when I think the server has done a dreadful job, I
>still leave more than what most would consider a decent tip, when I
>really shouldn't.
>


I agree with your assessment, but few restauranteurs would (though
there are some). Shameful that it is tough to find the bargains on the
less expensive end of the wine list, generally speaking.

I am a fomer sever as well, and do the same...15% for bad service.


  #22 (permalink)   Report Post  
Richard Neidich
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The only way a server gets less than 15% from me is if they are RUDE. If
RUDE---5%. Otherwise its 15-22% at a nice restaurant...for cheap eats it
can be much more. Like Chinese Lunch Special of 6.95.....drink included...I
still leave $2.00.

ie--Only had rude service 1x in 25 years.


"sisyphus" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:49:49 -0500, potatoman
> > wrote:
>
>
>>
>>Oh, I understand the business side of a restaurant and markup. I wasn't
>>saying it wasn't neccessary, just that it is remarkable when you
>>actually stop and consider how much it can sometimes be. Although, I do
>>think that 5 times the ammount of a bottle (which isn't the same as the
>>markup on the cost of components of a meal which has to be prepared) is
>>just a tad excessive. IMO, 100% markup is more than fair.
>>
>>And, as a former server, I understand gratuity all too well. It's almost
>>a curse - Sometimes when I think the server has done a dreadful job, I
>>still leave more than what most would consider a decent tip, when I
>>really shouldn't.
>>

>
> I agree with your assessment, but few restauranteurs would (though
> there are some). Shameful that it is tough to find the bargains on the
> less expensive end of the wine list, generally speaking.
>
> I am a fomer sever as well, and do the same...15% for bad service.



  #23 (permalink)   Report Post  
Richard Neidich
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The only way a server gets less than 15% from me is if they are RUDE. If
RUDE---5%. Otherwise its 15-22% at a nice restaurant...for cheap eats it
can be much more. Like Chinese Lunch Special of 6.95.....drink included...I
still leave $2.00.

ie--Only had rude service 1x in 25 years.


"sisyphus" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:49:49 -0500, potatoman
> > wrote:
>
>
>>
>>Oh, I understand the business side of a restaurant and markup. I wasn't
>>saying it wasn't neccessary, just that it is remarkable when you
>>actually stop and consider how much it can sometimes be. Although, I do
>>think that 5 times the ammount of a bottle (which isn't the same as the
>>markup on the cost of components of a meal which has to be prepared) is
>>just a tad excessive. IMO, 100% markup is more than fair.
>>
>>And, as a former server, I understand gratuity all too well. It's almost
>>a curse - Sometimes when I think the server has done a dreadful job, I
>>still leave more than what most would consider a decent tip, when I
>>really shouldn't.
>>

>
> I agree with your assessment, but few restauranteurs would (though
> there are some). Shameful that it is tough to find the bargains on the
> less expensive end of the wine list, generally speaking.
>
> I am a fomer sever as well, and do the same...15% for bad service.



  #24 (permalink)   Report Post  
Anders Tørneskog
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Richard Neidich" > skrev i melding
k.net...
> The only way a server gets less than 15% from me is if they are RUDE. If
> RUDE---5%. Otherwise its 15-22% at a nice restaurant...for cheap eats it
> can be much more. Like Chinese Lunch Special of 6.95.....drink
> included...I still leave $2.00.
>

Again, things are different in other places :-) Rude service in Scandinavia
is 0% - zero. Standard would be about 5, very good 10%. People with expense
accounts use to go higher, however, if they want to show off... :-)
Anything above 15 would be very excessive.
Anders


  #25 (permalink)   Report Post  
Anders Tørneskog
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Richard Neidich" > skrev i melding
k.net...
> The only way a server gets less than 15% from me is if they are RUDE. If
> RUDE---5%. Otherwise its 15-22% at a nice restaurant...for cheap eats it
> can be much more. Like Chinese Lunch Special of 6.95.....drink
> included...I still leave $2.00.
>

Again, things are different in other places :-) Rude service in Scandinavia
is 0% - zero. Standard would be about 5, very good 10%. People with expense
accounts use to go higher, however, if they want to show off... :-)
Anything above 15 would be very excessive.
Anders




  #26 (permalink)   Report Post  
potatoman
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Anders Tørneskog wrote:
>
> Again, things are different in other places :-) Rude service in Scandinavia
> is 0% - zero. Standard would be about 5, very good 10%. People with expense
> accounts use to go higher, however, if they want to show off... :-)
> Anything above 15 would be very excessive.
> Anders
>
>


I have always wondered how the standard pay for servers in other
counties is worked out. In the US, minimum wage for a server (last I
checked) is $2.13, which is under half of standard minimum wage.

The strange thing is that usually in lower end restaurants, servers are
paid MORE because the tips are lower. Usually, even in nice restaurants,
servers are paid standard server minimum because they make so much more
in tips.

Anders,
Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in Scandinavia?
brian
  #27 (permalink)   Report Post  
potatoman
 
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Anders Tørneskog wrote:
>
> Again, things are different in other places :-) Rude service in Scandinavia
> is 0% - zero. Standard would be about 5, very good 10%. People with expense
> accounts use to go higher, however, if they want to show off... :-)
> Anything above 15 would be very excessive.
> Anders
>
>


I have always wondered how the standard pay for servers in other
counties is worked out. In the US, minimum wage for a server (last I
checked) is $2.13, which is under half of standard minimum wage.

The strange thing is that usually in lower end restaurants, servers are
paid MORE because the tips are lower. Usually, even in nice restaurants,
servers are paid standard server minimum because they make so much more
in tips.

Anders,
Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in Scandinavia?
brian
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Anders Tørneskog
 
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"potatoman" > skrev i melding
...
>
> Anders,
> Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in Scandinavia?
> brian

Sure, found easily official figures from 1 October 2004 saying average
monthly salary for waiters, bartenders including the maître d' - is
20.000-22.000 NOK, which would be 3300-3600USD.
Direct comparison with US salaries is a futile exercise, however - levels of
taxation and prices are very different.
It makes more sense comparing to industrial wages which in Norway would be
about 28.000 NOK a month, i.e. 4600USD.
Salaries in Sweden are about 20-30% lower, but so are the prices.
Anders


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potatoman
 
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Anders Tørneskog wrote:
> "potatoman" > skrev i melding
> ...
>
>>Anders,
>>Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in Scandinavia?
>>brian

>
> Sure, found easily official figures from 1 October 2004 saying average
> monthly salary for waiters, bartenders including the maître d' - is
> 20.000-22.000 NOK, which would be 3300-3600USD.
> Direct comparison with US salaries is a futile exercise, however - levels of
> taxation and prices are very different.
> It makes more sense comparing to industrial wages which in Norway would be
> about 28.000 NOK a month, i.e. 4600USD.
> Salaries in Sweden are about 20-30% lower, but so are the prices.
> Anders
>
>


Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).
  #30 (permalink)   Report Post  
joseph b. rosenberg
 
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I thought they were tipped in lutefisk or is that just a Minnesota-Norwegian
thing???

--
Joseph B. Rosenberg
"Anders Tørneskog" > wrote in message
...
>
> "potatoman" > skrev i melding
> ...
> >
> > Anders,
> > Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in Scandinavia?
> > brian

> Sure, found easily official figures from 1 October 2004 saying average
> monthly salary for waiters, bartenders including the maître d' - is
> 20.000-22.000 NOK, which would be 3300-3600USD.
> Direct comparison with US salaries is a futile exercise, however - levels

of
> taxation and prices are very different.
> It makes more sense comparing to industrial wages which in Norway would be
> about 28.000 NOK a month, i.e. 4600USD.
> Salaries in Sweden are about 20-30% lower, but so are the prices.
> Anders
>
>





  #31 (permalink)   Report Post  
joseph b. rosenberg
 
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I thought they were tipped in lutefisk or is that just a Minnesota-Norwegian
thing???

--
Joseph B. Rosenberg
"Anders Tørneskog" > wrote in message
...
>
> "potatoman" > skrev i melding
> ...
> >
> > Anders,
> > Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in Scandinavia?
> > brian

> Sure, found easily official figures from 1 October 2004 saying average
> monthly salary for waiters, bartenders including the maître d' - is
> 20.000-22.000 NOK, which would be 3300-3600USD.
> Direct comparison with US salaries is a futile exercise, however - levels

of
> taxation and prices are very different.
> It makes more sense comparing to industrial wages which in Norway would be
> about 28.000 NOK a month, i.e. 4600USD.
> Salaries in Sweden are about 20-30% lower, but so are the prices.
> Anders
>
>



  #32 (permalink)   Report Post  
pavane
 
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Salted lutefish in Minnesota; for outstanding service perhaps
a nice matjes herring on the side, with a hazelnut.

pavane

"joseph b. rosenberg" > wrote in message
...
> I thought they were tipped in lutefisk or is that just a

Minnesota-Norwegian
> thing???
>
> --
> Joseph B. Rosenberg
> "Anders Tørneskog" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "potatoman" > skrev i melding
> > ...
> > >
> > > Anders,
> > > Do you know how servers are usually paid, pre-gratuity, in

Scandinavia?
> > > brian

> > Sure, found easily official figures from 1 October 2004 saying average
> > monthly salary for waiters, bartenders including the maître d' - is
> > 20.000-22.000 NOK, which would be 3300-3600USD.
> > Direct comparison with US salaries is a futile exercise, however -

levels
> of
> > taxation and prices are very different.
> > It makes more sense comparing to industrial wages which in Norway would

be
> > about 28.000 NOK a month, i.e. 4600USD.
> > Salaries in Sweden are about 20-30% lower, but so are the prices.
> > Anders
> >
> >

>
>



  #33 (permalink)   Report Post  
 
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On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:34:39 -0500, potatoman
> wrote:

>Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
>tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
>Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
>somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
>apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
>being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).


Math challenged?

160 hours into $340 is $2.13 an hour!

I think you meant 340USD/week, huh? Not that that's exactly a
screaming wage, but at least it's the federally mandated minimum wage.

As for higher wages in Scandinavia: the taxes in Denmark come in at
around 55%, and if they're being taken out of the wages (which I'm
sure they are), suddenly that big salary doesn't look that much
better.

On the other hand, there's Denmark's cradle-to-grave health care.

JJ
  #34 (permalink)   Report Post  
 
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On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:34:39 -0500, potatoman
> wrote:

>Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
>tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
>Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
>somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
>apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
>being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).


Math challenged?

160 hours into $340 is $2.13 an hour!

I think you meant 340USD/week, huh? Not that that's exactly a
screaming wage, but at least it's the federally mandated minimum wage.

As for higher wages in Scandinavia: the taxes in Denmark come in at
around 55%, and if they're being taken out of the wages (which I'm
sure they are), suddenly that big salary doesn't look that much
better.

On the other hand, there's Denmark's cradle-to-grave health care.

JJ
  #35 (permalink)   Report Post  
Anders Tørneskog
 
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> skrev i melding
...
> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:34:39 -0500, potatoman
> > wrote:
>
>>Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
>>tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
>>Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
>>somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
>>apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
>>being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).

>
> Math challenged?
>
> 160 hours into $340 is $2.13 an hour!
>
> I think you meant 340USD/week, huh? Not that that's exactly a
> screaming wage, but at least it's the federally mandated minimum wage.


I think I've heard that hourly wage before... It could be that the poster
indeed was right
>


> As for higher wages in Scandinavia: the taxes in Denmark come in at
> around 55%, and if they're being taken out of the wages (which I'm
> sure they are), suddenly that big salary doesn't look that much
> better.
>
> On the other hand, there's Denmark's cradle-to-grave health care.
>

Top bracket tax.is 59% in Denmark. Total taxation is 49% of GNP compared to
US 30%, but on the other hand things like health care, retirement homes and
higher education are largely free - and most US citizens would have to pay
big insurance premiums, I've understood. The differences may not be that
large after all.
Anders




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Anders Tørneskog
 
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> skrev i melding
...
> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:34:39 -0500, potatoman
> > wrote:
>
>>Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
>>tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
>>Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
>>somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
>>apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
>>being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).

>
> Math challenged?
>
> 160 hours into $340 is $2.13 an hour!
>
> I think you meant 340USD/week, huh? Not that that's exactly a
> screaming wage, but at least it's the federally mandated minimum wage.


I think I've heard that hourly wage before... It could be that the poster
indeed was right
>


> As for higher wages in Scandinavia: the taxes in Denmark come in at
> around 55%, and if they're being taken out of the wages (which I'm
> sure they are), suddenly that big salary doesn't look that much
> better.
>
> On the other hand, there's Denmark's cradle-to-grave health care.
>

Top bracket tax.is 59% in Denmark. Total taxation is 49% of GNP compared to
US 30%, but on the other hand things like health care, retirement homes and
higher education are largely free - and most US citizens would have to pay
big insurance premiums, I've understood. The differences may not be that
large after all.
Anders


  #39 (permalink)   Report Post  
Midlife
 
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Default

in article , Bechi at Bechi wrote
on 4/5/05 6:23 AM:

> On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 19:28:28 GMT,
wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:34:39 -0500, potatoman
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
>>> tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
>>> Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
>>> somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
>>> apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
>>> being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).

>>
>> Math challenged?
>>
>> 160 hours into $340 is $2.13 an hour!
>>
>> I think you meant 340USD/week, huh? Not that that's exactly a
>> screaming wage, but at least it's the federally mandated minimum wage.
>>

> JJ - without actually looking it up, $2.13/hr. sounds about right.
> There is a separate minimum wage covering employees with tip income
> and when payday comes around, their net pay is often $0, as taxes on
> their wages + estimated tips will exceed their gross pay.
>


Exactly right. Most US states have a separate minimum wage law covering
restaurant workers who receive tips. The restaurants are also required to
use a calculation of tips servers report as income in order to pay the
proper amount into the federal social security fund (don't get started on
that) for the server. That's how they can wind up with $0.00 in their
actual wage check. (Many restaurants pay out tips in cash, regardless of
whether credit cards were used).

Here's a site reference for the US Restaurant Association where you can
download a PDF file of a map showing the exact figures by state. Only a
handful of states apply the same minimum wage to ALL jobs in the state. Many
DO have a server minimum of US$2.13 PER HOUR.

http://www.restaurant.org/government...wage/index.cfm

  #40 (permalink)   Report Post  
Midlife
 
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Default

in article , Bechi at Bechi wrote
on 4/5/05 6:23 AM:

> On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 19:28:28 GMT,
wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:34:39 -0500, potatoman
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Interesting. That's before they even get tips? No wonder standard
>>> tipping is much less...these guys already make a pretty good salary.
>>> Before tips, in the US, the average full-time (40hrs/week) server makes
>>> somewhere around 340USD/month. Considering a medium sized 1 bedroom
>>> apartment in my area costs about 600USD/month, that's not even close to
>>> being considered liveable (hence, the high tipping standard).

>>
>> Math challenged?
>>
>> 160 hours into $340 is $2.13 an hour!
>>
>> I think you meant 340USD/week, huh? Not that that's exactly a
>> screaming wage, but at least it's the federally mandated minimum wage.
>>

> JJ - without actually looking it up, $2.13/hr. sounds about right.
> There is a separate minimum wage covering employees with tip income
> and when payday comes around, their net pay is often $0, as taxes on
> their wages + estimated tips will exceed their gross pay.
>


Exactly right. Most US states have a separate minimum wage law covering
restaurant workers who receive tips. The restaurants are also required to
use a calculation of tips servers report as income in order to pay the
proper amount into the federal social security fund (don't get started on
that) for the server. That's how they can wind up with $0.00 in their
actual wage check. (Many restaurants pay out tips in cash, regardless of
whether credit cards were used).

Here's a site reference for the US Restaurant Association where you can
download a PDF file of a map showing the exact figures by state. Only a
handful of states apply the same minimum wage to ALL jobs in the state. Many
DO have a server minimum of US$2.13 PER HOUR.

http://www.restaurant.org/government...wage/index.cfm

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