Hey, you native or fluent French speakers. I was struggling with this
while writing up notes. If one doesn't say "Chateau", do you drop the
D? Grammatically that seems correct, yet I've never heard anyone refer
to Issan.

"DaleW" > wrote in news:1105974750.908326.294700
@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

> Hey, you native or fluent French speakers. I was struggling with this
> while writing up notes. If one doesn't say "Chateau", do you drop the
> D? Grammatically that seems correct, yet I've never heard anyone refer
> to Issan.
>

Unless yo' is dissin' you "should" say Issan. (but they don't actually
rhyme) of course try to tell that to the hundreds of thousands who flock to
the Museum lovingly called "The d'Orsay"

"DaleW" > wrote in news:1105974750.908326.294700
@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

> Hey, you native or fluent French speakers. I was struggling with this
> while writing up notes. If one doesn't say "Chateau", do you drop the
> D? Grammatically that seems correct, yet I've never heard anyone refer
> to Issan.
>

Unless yo' is dissin' you "should" say Issan. (but they don't actually
rhyme) of course try to tell that to the hundreds of thousands who flock to
the Museum lovingly called "The d'Orsay"

On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 09:21:24 -0600, jcoulter =
t> said:

] "DaleW" > wrote in news:1105974750.908326.294700
] @z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:
]=20
] > Hey, you native or fluent French speakers. I was struggling with this
] > while writing up notes. If one doesn't say "Chateau", do you drop the
] > D? Grammatically that seems correct, yet I've never heard anyone refer
] > to Issan.
] >=20
]=20
] Unless yo' is dissin' you "should" say Issan. (but they don't actually=20
] rhyme) of course try to tell that to the hundreds of thousands who flock =
to=20
] the Museum lovingly called "The d'Orsay"



I think we're into idiom here. It's "la mus=E9e d'Orsay" because it was
formerly la gare d'Orsay, Orsay being a town outside of Paris. Of
course in French no one says "the d'Orsay," being more likely to
opt for "l'Orsay" in a pinch.

I agree with Mike that is should simple be "Issan" as the "de" really
means "of" or "from." There may actually be another name for the
house. Or maybe Issan was the founder of the Chateau, or a=20
lieu-dit?

It gets cloudier, because Valerie Giscard d'Estang is of course=20
referred to simply as "Giscard," so perhaps by this light we
should shorten Chateau d'Issan to "Chateau."

-E
--=20
Emery Davis
You can reply to
by removing the well known companies

On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 09:21:24 -0600, jcoulter =
t> said:

] "DaleW" > wrote in news:1105974750.908326.294700
] @z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:
]=20
] > Hey, you native or fluent French speakers. I was struggling with this
] > while writing up notes. If one doesn't say "Chateau", do you drop the
] > D? Grammatically that seems correct, yet I've never heard anyone refer
] > to Issan.
] >=20
]=20
] Unless yo' is dissin' you "should" say Issan. (but they don't actually=20
] rhyme) of course try to tell that to the hundreds of thousands who flock =
to=20
] the Museum lovingly called "The d'Orsay"



I think we're into idiom here. It's "la mus=E9e d'Orsay" because it was
formerly la gare d'Orsay, Orsay being a town outside of Paris. Of
course in French no one says "the d'Orsay," being more likely to
opt for "l'Orsay" in a pinch.

I agree with Mike that is should simple be "Issan" as the "de" really
means "of" or "from." There may actually be another name for the
house. Or maybe Issan was the founder of the Chateau, or a=20
lieu-dit?

It gets cloudier, because Valerie Giscard d'Estang is of course=20
referred to simply as "Giscard," so perhaps by this light we
should shorten Chateau d'Issan to "Chateau."

-E
--=20
Emery Davis
You can reply to
by removing the well known companies

Emery Davis > wrote in
:

> On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 09:21:24 -0600, jcoulter
> > said:
>
>] "DaleW" > wrote in news:1105974750.908326.294700
>] @z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:
>]
>] > Hey, you native or fluent French speakers. I was struggling with
>] > this while writing up notes. If one doesn't say "Chateau", do you
>] > drop the D? Grammatically that seems correct, yet I've never heard
>] > anyone refer to Issan.
>] >
>]
>] Unless yo' is dissin' you "should" say Issan. (but they don't
>] actually rhyme) of course try to tell that to the hundreds of
>] thousands who flock
> to
>] the Museum lovingly called "The d'Orsay"
>
>
>
> I think we're into idiom here. It's "la musée d'Orsay" because it was
> formerly la gare d'Orsay, Orsay being a town outside of Paris. Of
> course in French no one says "the d'Orsay," being more likely to
> opt for "l'Orsay" in a pinch.
>
I was speaking tongue in cheeky tourist vernacular. americans among
other tourist groups do refer to the museum as the d'Orsay which is
painful to even my ear. But this gets us all ready for . . .
>
> It gets cloudier, because Valerie Giscard d'Estang is of course
> referred to simply as "Giscard," so perhaps by this light we
> should shorten Chateau d'Issan to "Chateau."
>

the other former leader of France Charles de Gaulle, perhaps we could
say he had a lot of gall but none I think would so name him. Names it
seems take the article de Berry etc. but then names do not take the
indefinite article le/la so . . .

we all agree it "should" be Issan which I would rather be drinking than
discussin.