Cheval Blanc 2003
 

"Jean Balthazar" > wrote:

> A question from a newbie: I was able to buy some bottles of
> Cheval Blanc 2003. It doesn't say Grand Cru on the label.

Because it is not Chateau Cheval Blanc, the famous Premier Grand
Cru Classé in St-Émilion:

<http://olfac.univ-lyon1.fr/~vigour/e...rdeaux/st_emil
ion-chateau_cheval_blanc.jpg>

or

<http://snipurl.com/bsfs>

The 2003 is still in cask, of course.

> Does anyone know about this wine ? I can't find any info on the
> internet. How much is it supposed to cost more or less ?

The real thing comes in the solid three-digit range (USD/EUR).

It would be nice to know what type of wine you have. Tr to copy
everything that's on the label.

M.

Hi Michael,

Here's the entire label:

Saint-Emilion
appellation saint-émilion controlée
2003
sociéte civile du cheval blanc
propriétaire à saint-émilion - france
mis en bouteille à la propriété.

How long can this wine be kept in cellar ?

Thanks !


"Michael Pronay" > wrote in message
...
> "Jean Balthazar" > wrote:
>
> > A question from a newbie: I was able to buy some bottles of
> > Cheval Blanc 2003. It doesn't say Grand Cru on the label.
>
> Because it is not Chateau Cheval Blanc, the famous Premier Grand
> Cru Classé in St-Émilion:
>
> <http://olfac.univ-lyon1.fr/~vigour/e...rdeaux/st_emil
> ion-chateau_cheval_blanc.jpg>
>
> or
>
> <http://snipurl.com/bsfs>
>
> The 2003 is still in cask, of course.
>
> > Does anyone know about this wine ? I can't find any info on the
> > internet. How much is it supposed to cost more or less ?
>
> The real thing comes in the solid three-digit range (USD/EUR).
>
> It would be nice to know what type of wine you have. Tr to copy
> everything that's on the label.
>
> M.

one more thing, on the top it says: 33 - recoltant - 490

Don't know if that means a lot...

"Jean Balthazar" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Michael,
>
> Here's the entire label:
>
> Saint-Emilion
> appellation saint-émilion controlée
> 2003
> sociéte civile du cheval blanc
> propriétaire à saint-émilion - france
> mis en bouteille à la propriété.
>
> How long can this wine be kept in cellar ?
>
> Thanks !
>
>
> "Michael Pronay" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "Jean Balthazar" > wrote:
> >
> > > A question from a newbie: I was able to buy some bottles of
> > > Cheval Blanc 2003. It doesn't say Grand Cru on the label.
> >
> > Because it is not Chateau Cheval Blanc, the famous Premier Grand
> > Cru Classé in St-Émilion:
> >
> > <http://olfac.univ-lyon1.fr/~vigour/e...rdeaux/st_emil
> > ion-chateau_cheval_blanc.jpg>
> >
> > or
> >
> > <http://snipurl.com/bsfs>
> >
> > The 2003 is still in cask, of course.
> >
> > > Does anyone know about this wine ? I can't find any info on the
> > > internet. How much is it supposed to cost more or less ?
> >
> > The real thing comes in the solid three-digit range (USD/EUR).
> >
> > It would be nice to know what type of wine you have. Tr to copy
> > everything that's on the label.
> >
> > M.
>
>

"Jean Balthazar" > wrote:

> Here's the entire label:
>
> Saint-Emilion
> appellation saint-émilion controlée
> 2003
> sociéte civile du cheval blanc
> propriétaire à saint-émilion - france
> mis en bouteille à la propriété.
>
> How long can this wine be kept in cellar ?

Very strange. Does the label carry any resemblance to the original I
sent the URL? How much did you pay for it?

The only wine I know cheval blanc bottles beside the Grand Vin is "Le
Petit Cheval", the second wine.

Anyhow,

<www.wine-searcher.com>

is always quite a useful toool when searching for a wine price.

M.

It does not resemble that label at all.. It is very simple white background
and simple font.
I was told it was a special lot of 2500 liters, and wanted to know more
about it.

I paid 20 Euro a bottle.

"Michael Pronay" > wrote in message
...
> "Jean Balthazar" > wrote:
>
> > Here's the entire label:
> >
> > Saint-Emilion
> > appellation saint-émilion controlée
> > 2003
> > sociéte civile du cheval blanc
> > propriétaire à saint-émilion - france
> > mis en bouteille à la propriété.
> >
> > How long can this wine be kept in cellar ?
>
> Very strange. Does the label carry any resemblance to the original I
> sent the URL? How much did you pay for it?
>
> The only wine I know cheval blanc bottles beside the Grand Vin is "Le
> Petit Cheval", the second wine.
>
> Anyhow,
>
> <www.wine-searcher.com>
>
> is always quite a useful toool when searching for a wine price.
>
> M.

"Jean Balthazar" > wrote:

> It does not resemble that label at all.. It is very simple white
> background and simple font. I was told it was a special lot of
> 2500 liters, and wanted to know more about it.
>
> I paid 20 Euro a bottle.

Sorry, but this seems to be very strange. Maybe you might contact
the chateau at <cheval point blanc at-sign chateau-chevalblanc
point com>?

M.

On 5 Jan 2005 16:09:42 GMT, Michael Pronay > said:

] "Jean Balthazar" > wrote:
]
] > It does not resemble that label at all.. It is very simple white
] > background and simple font. I was told it was a special lot of
] > 2500 liters, and wanted to know more about it.
] >
] > I paid 20 Euro a bottle.
]
] Sorry, but this seems to be very strange. Maybe you might contact
] the chateau at <cheval point blanc at-sign chateau-chevalblanc
] point com>?
]
] M.

Jean and Michael,

SC du Cheval Blanc is the company that makes "Cheval Blanc,"
the St Emilion 1ere grand cru of great repute. There is only one
"SC du Cheval Blanc" (forcibly) in France, so if the label says they
made the wine it is either so, or fraudulent.

None the less it is bizarre that they would do a bottling like this...
Knock off frauds don't usually carry that high a price tag, either.

There is not much '03 Bordeaux on the market yet, even on the low end,
that I've seen anyway.

-E
--
Emery Davis
You can reply to
by removing the well known companies

"Jean Balthazar" > skrev i melding
...
> Hi Michael,
>
> Here's the entire label:
>
> Saint-Emilion
> appellation saint-émilion controlée
> 2003
> sociéte civile du cheval blanc
> propriétaire à saint-émilion - france
> mis en bouteille à la propriété.
>
> How long can this wine be kept in cellar ?
>
Not strange at all
You have a St. Emilion, pure and simple. Could be a batch from very young
vines or the like that was not good enough for the chateau stuff.
Anders

"Anders Tørneskog" > wrote:

> Not strange at all
> You have a St. Emilion, pure and simple. Could be a batch from
> very young vines or the like that was not good enough for the
> chateau stuff.

Very strange, in fact. If the label would read "St-Émilion de
Cheval Blanc" (like "Pauillac Sté. civile du Chteau Latour" where
"PAUILLAC" is by far the most prominent word on the label), that
would make sense. But "Cheval Blanc"?! Not since "Mouton-Cadet
Baron de Rothschild" has there been such an offense to common
sense!

M.

"Michael Pronay" > skrev i melding
...
> "Anders Tørneskog" > wrote:
>
>> Not strange at all
>> You have a St. Emilion, pure and simple. Could be a batch from
>> very young vines or the like that was not good enough for the
>> chateau stuff.
>
> Very strange, in fact. If the label would read "St-Émilion de
> Cheval Blanc" (like "Pauillac Sté. civile du Chteau Latour" where
> "PAUILLAC" is by far the most prominent word on the label), that
> would make sense. But "Cheval Blanc"?! Not since "Mouton-Cadet
> Baron de Rothschild" has there been such an offense to common
> sense!
>
Unusual, may be, but the OP quoted this:
Saint-Emilion
appellation saint-émilion controlée
2003
sociéte civile du cheval blanc
propriétaire à saint-émilion - france
mis en bouteille à la propriété.

It does not say CHEVAL BLANC, like the PAUILLAC you mention does not say
LATOUR (and I did once have such a bottle where the only mention of Latour
was the logo on the cork! 1980?)
So, if the label above actually was SAINT EMILION, then it makes sense to
me.
But, I agree, it is probably very unusual, especially if you say so,
Michael!
:-) Anders

"Anders Tørneskog" > wrote:

> It does not say CHEVAL BLANC,

Take a look at the subject and reread the OP please:

| I was able to buy some bottles of Cheval Blanc 2003.

But maybe the Jean could help us in telling us whether Cheval
Blanc figures prominently on the label (what I condluded from
his first posting) or not (what you concluded from his second
posting).

M.

"Anders Tørneskog" > wrote:

> It does not say CHEVAL BLANC,

Take a look at the subject and reread the OP please:

| I was able to buy some bottles of Cheval Blanc 2003.

But maybe the Jean could help us in telling us whether Cheval
Blanc figures prominently on the label (what I condluded from
his first posting) or not (what you concluded from his second
posting).

M.

Société Civile du Cheval Blanc is in small print.
The only thing that figures prominently on the lable is 'Saint Emilion'.
Everything else is in small print. Is it allowed to post a small image in
this newsgroup ? If so I can take a small picture of the bottle.

"Michael Pronay" > wrote in message
...
> "Anders Tørneskog" > wrote:
>
> > It does not say CHEVAL BLANC,
>
> Take a look at the subject and reread the OP please:
>
> | I was able to buy some bottles of Cheval Blanc 2003.
>
> But maybe the Jean could help us in telling us whether Cheval
> Blanc figures prominently on the label (what I condluded from
> his first posting) or not (what you concluded from his second
> posting).
>
> M.

"Jean Balthazar" > wrote:

> Société Civile du Cheval Blanc is in small print.
> The only thing that figures prominently on the lable is 'Saint
> Emilion'. Everything else is in small print.

So we have the equivalent of Latour's third wine, Pauillac.

For 2003, Cheval Blanc is around EUR 225; Le Petit Cheval around
EUR 50. So the price of 20 EUR fits nicely - but if it's good
value for the money, one can only say after having tasted it.

Thus said, I'd rather have La Tour Carnet 2003 for the same price
(as a future, of course, since it's not yet released).

M.

How long do you think it can be kept ? And what would be best age before
opening ?

Michael Pronay wrote:
> "Jean Balthazar" > wrote:
>
>
>>Société Civile du Cheval Blanc is in small print.
>>The only thing that figures prominently on the lable is 'Saint
>>Emilion'. Everything else is in small print.
>
>
> So we have the equivalent of Latour's third wine, Pauillac.
>
> For 2003, Cheval Blanc is around EUR 225; Le Petit Cheval around
> EUR 50. So the price of 20 EUR fits nicely - but if it's good
> value for the money, one can only say after having tasted it.
>
> Thus said, I'd rather have La Tour Carnet 2003 for the same price
> (as a future, of course, since it's not yet released).
>
> M.

Michael Pronay wrote:

> Thus said, I'd rather have La Tour Carnet 2003 for the same price
> (as a future, of course, since it's not yet released).
>
> M.

Hi Michael,

Have you tasted the 2003 La Tour Carnet?

I have some bottles of the 2001 that was quite highly recommended here
in AFW and I like the wine (even though it will need quite a few years
yet). Do you know whether the 2003 is comparable?

Cheers,

-Topi Kuusinen, Finland

This is clearly a very interesting question. I'm bound to say that I would
be a little surprised if Cheval Blanc put a wine on the market which could
be traced to them but was not even of Grand Cru quality. If they had
produced a third wine - surprising in itself, especially in a low yielding
and generally dificult year like 2003 - I would have thought they would have
either submitted it for Grand Cru status or sold it in bulk as generic St.
Emilion rather than bottling it at the chateau and under their company's own
name so risking the sort of confusion which has arisen here with the OP presumably
thinking he'd got a bargain.

GC status can, of course, be obtained in any year by any wine from anywhere
in the Jurisdiction provided it is of of sufficient quality. In poor years
some of the best and proudest growers just do not apply but sell their wine
in bulk. Certain other chateaux sell young wines in bulk for generic
Saint-Emilion. Some of the Grand Crus have a second wine which is AOC
Saint-Emilion and not AOC Grand Cru Saint-Emilion - Ch de Ferrand and Ch
Bernateau for example make Ch St-Poly and Ch. Tour Peyronneau for example.
In the latter's case a Tertre de Lisse and Ch. Cotes Bernateau is made as
well but they are very different operations from Cheval Blanc. The simple
way to find out if this wine could be genuine is surely by a phone call by
the OP to Cheval Blanc - 0033 5 57 55 55 55 - which should answer all the
questions and then perhaps he would be kind enough to enlighten us all.


Tim Hartley

Topi Kuusinen > wrote:

>> Thus said, I'd rather have La Tour Carnet 2003 for the same
>> price (as a future, of course, since it's not yet released).

> Have you tasted the 2003 La Tour Carnet?

Yes, I quite liked it, although it was not as stunning (for me) as
the 2001.

> I have some bottles of the 2001 that was quite highly
> recommended here in AFW and I like the wine (even though it will
> need quite a few years yet).

Very probable that I sung the praises of LTC '01. Just found my
invoice: EUR 16.30/btl.

> Do you know whether the 2003 is comparable?

Well I guess I was slightly overexcited with the 2001 (94/100),
while a littles underwhelmed by 2003 (88/100). The truth, I guess,
is somewhere in the middle.

Anyhow: Given who is after La Tour Carnet since five years
(Magrez, Rolland), I'd put a bank on any recent vintage.

M.

Michael Pronay wrote:

>
>>>Thus said, I'd rather have La Tour Carnet 2003 for the same
>>>price (as a future, of course, since it's not yet released).
>
> Well I guess I was slightly overexcited with the 2001 (94/100),
> while a littles underwhelmed by 2003 (88/100). The truth, I guess,
> is somewhere in the middle.
>
> Anyhow: Given who is after La Tour Carnet since five years
> (Magrez, Rolland), I'd put a bank on any recent vintage.

Michael,

Thanks for your reply.

Now, I will consider getting some on futures; actually, even the 2002
seems to be available as a future yet. Might be interesting to stock
some vintages of La Tour Carnet and compare them later on.

The prices are not all that bad, either, with EUR 13,70 / btl for the
2002 and EUR 15 / btl for the 2003.

Cheers,

-Topi Kuusinen, Finland

Timothy Hartley wrote:
> In message >
> Jean Balthazar > wrote:
>
>
>>I have sent them an e-mail with the details of the label, asking them if >
>>they produced the wine, and if not, if they know where it comes from.
>
>
> You may find e-mails are not dealt with or dealt with very quickly. Written
> answers from French growers can be difficult to get. That's why I suggested
> a phone call. Good luck anyway.
>
> Tim Hartley
>

I finally received an answer about these bottles of Cheval Blanc 2003.
They are bottles of lower quality grapes, not suited for the Grand Cru
or the Petit Cheval. They are not commercialised, but distributed amonst
their shareholders.

Thanks for all your help,
Jean

In message >
Jean Balthazar > wrote:

> Timothy Hartley wrote:
> > In message >
> > Jean Balthazar > wrote:
> >
> >
> >>I have sent them an e-mail with the details of the label, asking them if >
> >>they produced the wine, and if not, if they know where it comes from.
> >
> >
> > You may find e-mails are not dealt with or dealt with very quickly. Written
> > answers from French growers can be difficult to get. That's why I suggested
> > a phone call. Good luck anyway.
> >
> > Tim Hartley
> >
>
> I finally received an answer about these bottles of Cheval Blanc 2003.
> They are bottles of lower quality grapes, not suited for the Grand Cru
> or the Petit Cheval. They are not commercialised, but distributed amonst
> their shareholders.
>
> Thanks for all your help,
> Jean

Thanks for letting us know. I wonder who has put them on the market? I should
not think the Chateau will be too amused. I would have been very surprised to see
a generic ”Cheval Blanc• released by the Chateau or to discover a third wine which is
not listed anywhere or known to St.Emilion fanatics!

Tim Hartley