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Old 30-08-2012, 04:51 AM posted to alt.food.wine
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Default Sticker shock

My Burgundy epiphany arrived in the form of the '88 Dujac Clos de la
Roche, which we purchased at the first HDH auction in 2004 as part of a
mixed case of '88 GCs (total cost $550 + vig for the case). Today, I
received the latest HDH auction catalogue in which that same '88 Dujac
Clos de la Roche is now priced at $300-450 a _bottle_! The only
silver lining is a graphic at the beginning of the catalogue showing an
overall decline in auction prices over the past year. Perhaps we can
dub that the "Rudy Kurniawan effect"? ;-)

Mark Lipton

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Old 30-08-2012, 02:22 PM posted to alt.food.wine
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Default Sticker shock

On Aug 29, 11:52*pm, Mark Lipton wrote:
My Burgundy epiphany arrived in the form of the '88 Dujac Clos de la
Roche, which we purchased at the first HDH auction in 2004 as part of a
mixed case of '88 GCs (total cost $550 + vig for the case). *Today, I
received the latest HDH auction catalogue in which that same '88 Dujac
Clos de la Roche is now priced at $300-450 a _bottle_! *The only
silver lining is a graphic at the beginning of the catalogue showing an
overall decline in auction prices over the past year. *Perhaps we can
dub that the "Rudy Kurniawan effect"? ;-)

Mark Lipton


I feel your pain Mark. I bought a ton of Burgundy a few years ago so
I haven't been in the market recently and I was shocked by the prices
I'm seeing on HDH, Acker, etc including the prices on a number of
private sites where cellars are being liquidated privately. Burgundy
has gone insane. I did however just receive an e-mail yesterday
selling nothing but SQN with a number of wines at $150 which is a
downturn from the $300-$400 that these wines have been sold at
recently.
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Old 30-08-2012, 03:10 PM posted to alt.food.wine
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Default Sticker shock

On Wednesday, August 29, 2012 11:52:07 PM UTC-4, Mark Lipton wrote:
My Burgundy epiphany arrived in the form of the '88 Dujac Clos de la

Roche, which we purchased at the first HDH auction in 2004 as part of a

mixed case of '88 GCs (total cost $550 + vig for the case). Today, I

received the latest HDH auction catalogue in which that same '88 Dujac

Clos de la Roche is now priced at $300-450 a _bottle_! The only

silver lining is a graphic at the beginning of the catalogue showing an

overall decline in auction prices over the past year. Perhaps we can

dub that the "Rudy Kurniawan effect"? ;-)



Mark Lipton


Yeah, lots of stuff that I used to be able to afford- no longer!

I will point out a couple of other factors than general rises:

Dujac - already borderline cult-I'd guess the CdlR was the most expensive bottle in that mixed case? - has gotten even more popular since 2004.

1988 really languished in market for a lot of years as they're on austere side, and were shut down hard. Parker rated them mediocre to poor. But as they've begun drinking (much) better - and the comments on wine boards and by critics like Meadows and Gilman who have a better grip on Burgundy are much more positive- prices have creeped up even more than other vintages. As a fan of the vintage this makes me sad!

Those are just observations, I totally agree re Burg prices overall

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Old 31-08-2012, 06:25 PM posted to alt.food.wine
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On 8/30/12 10:10 AM, DaleW wrote:


Yeah, lots of stuff that I used to be able to afford- no longer!

I will point out a couple of other factors than general rises:

Dujac - already borderline cult-I'd guess the CdlR was the most
expensive bottle in that mixed case? - has gotten even more popular
since 2004.

1988 really languished in market for a lot of years as they're on
austere side, and were shut down hard. Parker rated them mediocre to
poor. But as they've begun drinking (much) better - and the comments
on wine boards and by critics like Meadows and Gilman who have a
better grip on Burgundy are much more positive- prices have creeped
up even more than other vintages. As a fan of the vintage this makes
me sad!

Those are just observations, I totally agree re Burg prices overall



Good points, Dale. I have no idea if Dujac was the most expensive in
the case, but probably (the rest IIRC were Faiveley and Roty GCs -
Chambertin Clos de Bez, Mazis-Chambertin, etc, and multiple bottles of
Chevillon Vaucrains). And of course this effect isn't limited to
Burgundy. Bdx, CalCabs and Rhone wines have all undergone similar price
escalation.

Mark Lipton
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alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.cwdjr.net
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Old 02-09-2012, 04:01 AM posted to alt.food.wine
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Default Sticker shock

On Aug 31, 12:25*pm, Mark Lipton wrote:
On 8/30/12 10:10 AM, DaleW wrote:











Yeah, lots of stuff that I used to be able to afford- no longer!


I will point out a couple of other factors than general rises:


Dujac - already borderline cult-I'd guess the CdlR was the most
expensive bottle in that mixed case? - *has gotten even more popular
since 2004.


1988 really languished in market for a lot of years as they're on
austere side, and were shut down hard. Parker rated them mediocre to
poor. *But as they've begun drinking (much) better - and the comments
on wine boards and by critics like Meadows and Gilman who have a
better grip on Burgundy are much more positive- prices have creeped
up even more than other vintages. As a fan of the vintage this makes
me sad!


Those are just observations, I totally agree re Burg prices overall


Good points, Dale. *I have no idea if Dujac was the most expensive in
the case, but probably (the rest IIRC were Faiveley and Roty GCs -
Chambertin Clos de Bez, Mazis-Chambertin, etc, and multiple bottles of
Chevillon Vaucrains). *And of course this effect isn't limited to
Burgundy. *Bdx, CalCabs and Rhone wines have all undergone similar price
escalation.


I just received an offer from FinestWine for a few wines. All prices
are listed in Euros per bottle. Also there are shipping charges for
orders under 600 Euros. In the EU one must also pay about 19% VAT.

Petrus 1990 (a Parker 100/100 wine) - 2990;
Petrus 1971 - 1600;
Petrus 1995 - 1490;
Vega Sicilia Unico 1922 - 1600;
Lafite-Rothschild 1975 - 650;

I bought a case of the 1971 Petrus in the mid 1970s for around US$30
per bottle and still have 9 bottles that have been stored properly. I
guess I will have to get along with that, considering the prices given
above. I have a few bottles of the 1975 Lafite, and it has not
impressed me much. If I were buying it now, I can think of many other
ways I could spend 650 Euros that would bring more pleasure.



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Old 02-09-2012, 09:15 PM posted to alt.food.wine
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Default Sticker shock

cwdjrxyz wrote:

I just received an offer from FinestWine for a few wines. All prices
are listed in Euros per bottle. Also there are shipping charges for
orders under 600 Euros. In the EU one must also pay about 19% VAT.

Petrus 1990 (a Parker 100/100 wine) - 2990;
Petrus 1971 - 1600;
Petrus 1995 - 1490;
Vega Sicilia Unico 1922 - 1600;
Lafite-Rothschild 1975 - 650;

I bought a case of the 1971 Petrus in the mid 1970s for around US$30
per bottle and still have 9 bottles that have been stored properly. I
guess I will have to get along with that, considering the prices given
above. I have a few bottles of the 1975 Lafite, and it has not
impressed me much. If I were buying it now, I can think of many other
ways I could spend 650 Euros that would bring more pleasure.


Depending on your own interests, you could consider selling those wines
on the aftermarket to fund the purchase of other wines that you might
enjoy more. IIRC, Dale has some experience with that '75 Lafite and
came to a similar conclusion as you.

Mark Lipton
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Old 04-09-2012, 06:11 PM posted to alt.food.wine
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On Sunday, September 2, 2012 4:16:34 PM UTC-4, Mark Lipton wrote:
cwdjrxyz wrote:



I just received an offer from FinestWine for a few wines. All prices


are listed in Euros per bottle. Also there are shipping charges for


orders under 600 Euros. In the EU one must also pay about 19% VAT.




Petrus 1990 (a Parker 100/100 wine) - 2990;


Petrus 1971 - 1600;


Petrus 1995 - 1490;


Vega Sicilia Unico 1922 - 1600;


Lafite-Rothschild 1975 - 650;




I bought a case of the 1971 Petrus in the mid 1970s for around US$30


per bottle and still have 9 bottles that have been stored properly. I


guess I will have to get along with that, considering the prices given


above. I have a few bottles of the 1975 Lafite, and it has not


impressed me much. If I were buying it now, I can think of many other


ways I could spend 650 Euros that would bring more pleasure.






Depending on your own interests, you could consider selling those wines

on the aftermarket to fund the purchase of other wines that you might

enjoy more. IIRC, Dale has some experience with that '75 Lafite and

came to a similar conclusion as you.



Mark Lipton


I like the 75 Lafite, but it's certainly not a topflight first. And definitely not worth that kind of coin. Though this isn't apparently a bargain seller- WMJ lists average as $450, and that includes all premiums.
I've only sold wines where a friend really wanted a wine. But if I had 1975 Lafite and thought I could clear $350, I'd be tempted.


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