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Nils Gustaf Lindgren 05-10-2003 04:03 PM

On cheese and wine
 
Hello;
Self and Xina went to Copenhagen and had lunch at Amalie, our favorite -
very special kind of resto, or, very typical for Copenhagen -
frokostrestaurant, which means lunch restaurant, and should be half a
staircase down and at least a 100 years old, with gigantic open sandwiches
(of the kind where you might find a piece of bread buried deep deep down
under the liver pte, ribs, frieds plaice, or a gadzillion varieties of
herring). Amalie is good. Anyway. It is not strictly a wine palce (not even
the ones called Hviidīs Vinstue or Husmannīs Vinstue have very much relation
to wines), but I ordered a glass of the house red with my emmenthaler. The
cheese makes the wine sing, they say. The hosue red proved to be a very
worthy Cabrnet Franc from Bourgeuil (sp?), very strict and dry, grass and
green peppery as they come. Did the cheese make it sing? Well, not exactly.
One reason was that the cheese was (and this is the rule in Denmark, as well
as the earlier parts of Sweden) accompanied by sweet grapes, raw sweet
pepper. and radishes. Another is that, perhaps, a very dry red is not the
best thing to drown a piece of cheese in.
Last week-end, the worty cvouple celebrated their 22nd anniversary with,
amongst other good things, three pieces of cheese watered by a Gewurz VT.
The cheeses were a mature chevre, Puligny St Pierre, a medium ripe Epoisse,
and a Rouquefort. The Gwz went spendidly with the EPoisse, was a good runner
up to the chevre, and was, ultimately, killed stone dead by the Roquefort,
it being very salty. As far as I know, the best with the latter would be a
Port, while the classic with the chevre should be a ... Sancerre? We
discussed it with the wine waiter who readily admitted that, really, each
piece of cheese might be served with its own individual wine.
Some accompaniments are apparently classic - Reggiano Parmigiano and
Amarone, for isntance.
I would like to hear about your favorites. What do you drink with a
manchego? An emmenthaler? One of those weird goatīs cheeses from Provence
packed in chest nut leaves? Etc.

Cheers

Nils Gustaf


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Mike Tommasi 05-10-2003 04:27 PM

On cheese and wine
 
On Sun, 05 Oct 2003 15:03:39 GMT, "Nils Gustaf Lindgren"
wrote:

Last week-end, the worty cvouple celebrated their 22nd anniversary with,
amongst other good things, three pieces of cheese watered by a Gewurz VT.


VG, we celebrated our 25th... congratulations!

The cheeses were a mature chevre, Puligny St Pierre, a medium ripe Epoisse,
and a Rouquefort. The Gwz went spendidly with the EPoisse, was a good runner
up to the chevre, and was, ultimately, killed stone dead by the Roquefort,
it being very salty. As far as I know, the best with the latter would be a
Port, while the classic with the chevre should be a ... Sancerre?


Sancerre white, of course... ;-)) I think that would be a good choice,
sauvignon works well with goat's cheese. Roquefort and port go wel,
but do try a top Loire sticky, one of those with balls like Poirel's
Chateau de Suronde.

We
discussed it with the wine waiter who readily admitted that, really, each
piece of cheese might be served with its own individual wine.


You knew that already ;-))

Some accompaniments are apparently classic - Reggiano Parmigiano and
Amarone, for isntance.
I would like to hear about your favorites. What do you drink with a
manchego? An emmenthaler? One of those weird goatīs cheeses from Provence
packed in chest nut leaves? Etc.


I will not comment on Emmenthaler, but recent tests with some "hors
d'age" comte' with Chateauneuf were impressive, and last year the same
cheese with a really good Vin Jaune from the Jura were stunning.

Banon (weird goat packed in leaves) is a special case, it all depends
on the quality and on the aging of the thing. Since july this cheese
is protected with an AOC, hence all banon made from cow or sheep milk
is banned, as well as any not made in the defined terroir. Assuming
you have the right one, then aging is critical. This cheese, over a 2
week period, goes from a mild creamy gentle taste to an intense spicy
peppery powerful nutty tannic liquid delicious mess.

Young banon goes well with some of the aromatic southern whites like
corsican vermentino or some of the rare interesting Provence whites,
Chateau de Roquefort was magnificent with a 10-day banon. As you turn
the power up, you need to resort to whites with a lot of character. A
"dry" white from Macon, domaine de Bongran, had enough structure and
mellowness to stand up to a 20-day banon. Beyond that we resorted to
some definitely oxidative whites from Roussillon, and the 2-motnh old
monster was adequately subdued by a Rivesaltes Ambre' 93 by Cazes.

Mike

Dale Williams 05-10-2003 08:07 PM

On cheese and wine
 
Congratulations on the anniversary. Glad the Loire Cab Franc was good.

As to cheese matches:
I prefer Sauternes or maybe Tokaji with Roquefort. I think Port does better
with Stilton (something about the firmer drier texture).
Sauvignon Blanc is my first instinct with goat cheese. With more mature ones I
go for a bigger SB, or a lighter red if I'm feeling like taking a chance.
Manchego is a cheese I find goes well with big reds, or with Port. Aged Gouda
and cheddar also do well with bigger reds.
Munster goes well with late-harvest Alsaces, esp. Pinot Gris or Gewürztraminer.
I find Epoisses and red Burgundy a good match, others here find it repugnant.
Most Emmenthal around here is low quality, I've had a couple of good ones, but
not enough to say a match.

Best,
Dale

Dale Williams
Drop "damnspam" to reply

Mark Lipton 05-10-2003 09:40 PM

On cheese and wine
 


Nils Gustaf Lindgren wrote:

I would like to hear about your favorites. What do you drink with a
manchego? An emmenthaler? One of those weird goatīs cheeses from Provence
packed in chest nut leaves? Etc.


Congrats again, Nils! As for your question: Manchego is to me one of the
great red wine cheeses, provided that it's not too young. I've had it with
aged Bordeaux and it was lovely. It's one of my standard accompaniments now
for red wine tastings. I haven't much access to good Emmenthaler, but Gruyčre
is another fine foil to large red wines. I'll defer to Mike's expertise on the
subject of Banon...

Mark Lipton


Nils Gustaf Lindgren 06-10-2003 09:37 PM

On cheese and wine
 
Last week-end, the worty cvouple celebrated their 22nd anniversary with,
amongst other good things, three pieces of cheese watered by a Gewurz VT.


VG, we celebrated our 25th... congratulations!


Congratulations to all four of us!

Roquefort and port go wel,
but do try a top Loire sticky, one of those with balls like Poirel's
Chateau de Suronde.


Have to admit - I donīt really dig Roquefort all that much - too salty, too
.... I donīt know, sometimes I feel I get blsiters on my tongue .... I much
prefer Epoisse (which, of course, has very little in common with the
Roquefort).

We
discussed it with the wine waiter who readily admitted that, really, each
piece of cheese might be served with its own individual wine.


You knew that already ;-))


Yea, I knew dat ...


I will not comment on Emmenthaler, but recent tests with some "hors
d'age" comte' with Chateauneuf were impressive, and last year the same
cheese with a really good Vin Jaune from the Jura were stunning.


Notes are being busily taken ...

Banon (weird goat packed in leaves) is a special case, it all depends
on the quality and on the aging of the thing ... aging is critical. This

cheese, over a 2
week period, goes from a mild creamy gentle taste to an intense spicy
peppery powerful nutty tannic liquid delicious mess.


Young banon goes well with some of the aromatic southern whites like
corsican vermentino or some of the rare interesting Provence whites,
Chateau de Roquefort was magnificent with a 10-day banon. As you turn
the power up, you need to resort to whites with a lot of character. A
"dry" white from Macon, domaine de Bongran, had enough structure and
mellowness to stand up to a 20-day banon. Beyond that we resorted to
some definitely oxidative whites from Roussillon, and the 2-motnh old
monster was adequately subdued by a Rivesaltes Ambre' 93 by Cazes.



Pure rocket science, then. I feel that, in order to do something
constructive with this, extended testing is required. Unfortunately very
little Banon available in these dreary and desert lands ...
I wonders if that farm outside Helsingborg that does ecologic goatīs cheese
snd which we are going to taste Nov 25th has anything that could be ... or
else Iīll set up a laboratory enxt time in the deep South (late April).

Cheers

Nils Gustaf
--
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