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pricy sommeliers
In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, restaurateur,
writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer the highest price wine." In Australia I reckon this hold pretty much true 37 years on. And if it's not actually the highest priced wine, they do have a certain knack of upselling... Never has any sommelier ever suggested to me the inexpensive wines on their list. Other parts of the world? Cheers! Martin |
pricy sommeliers
On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 09:13:40 +1000, "Martin Field"
> wrote: >In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, restaurateur, >writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer the >highest price wine." > >In Australia I reckon this hold pretty much true 37 years on. And if it's >not actually the highest priced wine, they do have a certain knack of >upselling... Never has any sommelier ever suggested to me the inexpensive >wines on their list. > >Other parts of the world? > >Cheers! > >Martin > It is their job afterall. I don't mind the upsell as much as the dismisal of a good lower cost alternative. The good Sommelier will acknowledge your tastes. Joseph Coulter Joseph Coulter Cruises and Vacations www.josephcoulter.com |
pricy sommeliers
"Joseph Coulter" > wrote in message
... > On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 09:13:40 +1000, "Martin Field" > > wrote: > >>In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, >>restaurateur, >>writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer >>the >>highest price wine." >> >>In Australia I reckon this hold pretty much true 37 years on. And if it's >>not actually the highest priced wine, they do have a certain knack of >>upselling... Never has any sommelier ever suggested to me the inexpensive >>wines on their list. >> >>Other parts of the world? >> >>Cheers! >> >>Martin >> > It is their job afterall. I don't mind the upsell as much as the > dismisal of a good lower cost alternative. The good Sommelier will > acknowledge your tastes. > Joseph Coulter > Joseph Coulter Cruises and Vacations > www.josephcoulter.com Surely the crucial core of their job is to knowledgeably advise diners about wine selections and suitable wine and food matches - not to market expensive wines... Cheers! Martin |
pricy sommeliers
Martin Field wrote:
> Surely the crucial core of their job is to knowledgeably advise diners > about wine selections and suitable wine and food matches - not to market > expensive wines... and that is typical of my experience with the sommeliers I've dealt with. Granted, these have been good sommeliers in restaurants that care about wine, and I also have very specific questions from them rather than an open-ended "what should I order?" Nonetheless, I almost always get good advice that doesn't seem at all about trying to pressure me to pay more than I'm interested in paying. Mark Lipton -- alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.cwdjr.net |
pricy sommeliers
"Mark Lipton" > skrev i melding ... > ...Nonetheless, I almost always > get good advice that doesn't seem at all about trying to pressure me to > pay more than I'm interested in paying. > My experience too. I state the framework - type of wine I like, my price level and they pick a recommendation for the food from what is available - that's what sommeliers are for! :-) Anders |
pricy sommeliers
when on the rare occasion, I go to a restaurant with a sommelier, I still
make my own choice. but now as a pensioner, I do most of my dining and fine wine drinking with friends at home. JT |
pricy sommeliers
"JT" > skrev i melding ... > when on the rare occasion, I go to a restaurant with a sommelier, I still > make my own choice. > > but now as a pensioner, I do most of my dining and fine wine drinking with > friends at home. > I'm in the same situation :-) but when there is a sommelier, there is often a couple of suggestions for me to choose from. After all, it is they who should know the restaurant's wines... A |
pricy sommeliers
On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 11:13:33 +1000, "Martin Field"
> wrote: >"Joseph Coulter" > wrote in message .. . >> On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 09:13:40 +1000, "Martin Field" >> > wrote: >> >>>In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, >>>restaurateur, >>>writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer >>>the >>>highest price wine." >>> >>>In Australia I reckon this hold pretty much true 37 years on. And if it's >>>not actually the highest priced wine, they do have a certain knack of >>>upselling... Never has any sommelier ever suggested to me the inexpensive >>>wines on their list. >>> >>>Other parts of the world? >>> >>>Cheers! >>> >>>Martin >>> >> It is their job afterall. I don't mind the upsell as much as the >> dismisal of a good lower cost alternative. The good Sommelier will >> acknowledge your tastes. >> Joseph Coulter >> Joseph Coulter Cruises and Vacations >> www.josephcoulter.com > >Surely the crucial core of their job is to knowledgeably advise diners >about wine selections and suitable wine and food matches - not to market >expensive wines... > >Cheers! > >Martin When they do the job right they will not just steer to the stars. What I was trying to say in my prior post is that a good one will listen to your tastes and make a recommendation to fit, albeit often at the top of your range. Really good ones will offer something down range, but I think that many at least in the US fear that if they acknowledge good wines at low prices it says something bargain about their knowledge. You know it is tlike th ladies on the street, they all sell the same basic thing and don't want to go down market. :-) Joseph Coulter Joseph Coulter Cruises and Vacations www.josephcoulter.com |
pricy sommeliers
On Oct 5, 11:03�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> Martin Field wrote: > > Surely the crucial core of their job is �to knowledgeably advise diners > > about wine selections and suitable wine and food matches - not to market > > expensive wines... > > and that is typical of my experience with the sommeliers I've dealt > with. �Granted, these have been good sommeliers in restaurants that care > about wine, and I also have very specific questions from them rather > than an open-ended "what should I order?" �Nonetheless, I almost always > get good advice that doesn't seem at all about trying to pressure me to > pay more than I'm interested in paying. > > Mark Lipton > -- > alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.cwdjr.net Mine too. I usually already know what I want or I will point to a wine and ask for a suggestion given what we are eating. By pointing to a wine, they know what your price point is and generally they find a wine lower priced than what you point to. |
pricy sommeliers
Most of the time, the most inexpensive wines on a wine list are the
worst values. Steering you away could be a big favor. Martin Field wrote: > In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, > restaurateur, writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they > invariably offer the highest price wine." > > In Australia I reckon this hold pretty much true 37 years on. And if > it's not actually the highest priced wine, they do have a certain knack > of upselling... Never has any sommelier ever suggested to me the > inexpensive wines on their list. > > Other parts of the world? > > Cheers! > > Martin > > |
pricy sommeliers
On Oct 6, 3:36*pm, Jonathon Alsop > wrote:
> Most of the time, the most inexpensive wines on a wine list are the > worst values. *Steering you away could be a big favor. > Not being a wealthy man, with a non-drinking wife, I've settled for the 'by the glass' option, and found that the lowest price was a label you could find at any grocery store. BTW, Jonathon, I read your Vino Veritas page often a few years ago and learned quite a lot about wine enjoyment and experienced several new wines I never would have tried and ended up liking. Expanding my world view, one bottle at a time. Mark E Sievert |
pricy sommeliers
"Martin Field" > wrote in message . au... > In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, > restaurateur, writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they > invariably offer the highest price wine." > > In Australia I reckon this hold pretty much true 37 years on. And if it's > not actually the highest priced wine, they do have a certain knack of > upselling... Never has any sommelier ever suggested to me the inexpensive > wines on their list. > > Other parts of the world? > > Cheers! > > Martin > > Based on meals in France and the Benelux countries, I cannot confirm your experience, Martin, but maybe it depends on how you put the question. As I prefer to venture into unknown territories when I am confronted with a huge wine list, I tend to point at two or three "intriguing" wines on the list to the sommelier, asking innocently for some guidance and for possible alternatives. The point is that the man will know about the price range you are thinking of and he will do his best to find a suitable bottle for you. Yves |
pricy sommeliers
Wotcha Martin,
On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 09:13:40 +1000, "Martin Field" > wrote: >In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, restaurateur, >writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer the >highest price wine." > >Other parts of the world? As several others have said, that's not been my experience. I won't bore you with the story of what happened at the old Tante Claire in London, but suffice it to say that the Sommelier suggested a bin end at 1/3 the price of the (quite similar) wine I had been thinking of. In fact, I've never, to my knowledge, had a sommelier try to talk up the top end wines. Even if I can find my way roumd a wine list reasonably well, I don't pretend to know the food as well as the Sommelier should do, and so will often ask advice. -- All the best Fatty from Forges |
pricy sommeliers
On Fri, 16 Oct 2009 23:09:11 +0200, IanH > wrote:
> Wotcha Martin, > > On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 09:13:40 +1000, "Martin Field" > > wrote: > > >In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, restaurateur, > >writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer the > >highest price wine." > > > >Other parts of the world? > > As several others have said, that's not been my experience. I won't > bore you with the story of what happened at the old Tante Claire in > London, but suffice it to say that the Sommelier suggested a bin end > at 1/3 the price of the (quite similar) wine I had been thinking of. > > In fact, I've never, to my knowledge, had a sommelier try to talk up > the top end wines. Even if I can find my way roumd a wine list > reasonably well, I don't pretend to know the food as well as the > Sommelier should do, and so will often ask advice. My experience is almost the same as yours, Ian, from sommeliers all over the world. I've sometime asked a sommelier to recommend an inexpensive wine (and gotten such a recommendation), but even when I don't, I usually get inexpensive to moderately-priced recommendations. *Never* have I gotten a recommendation of the highest-priced wine on the list, or anything even close to it. -- Ken Blake Please Reply to the Newsgroup |
pricy sommeliers
"IanH" > wrote in message ... > Wotcha Martin, > > On Tue, 6 Oct 2009 09:13:40 +1000, "Martin Field" > > wrote: > >>In his book, Key to Gracious Living, (pub.1972) Peter Robotti, >>restaurateur, >>writes: "My own experience with sommeliers is that they invariably offer >>the >>highest price wine." >> >>Other parts of the world? > > As several others have said, that's not been my experience. I won't > bore you with the story of what happened at the old Tante Claire in > London, but suffice it to say that the Sommelier suggested a bin end > at 1/3 the price of the (quite similar) wine I had been thinking of. > > In fact, I've never, to my knowledge, had a sommelier try to talk up > the top end wines. Even if I can find my way roumd a wine list > reasonably well, I don't pretend to know the food as well as the > Sommelier should do, and so will often ask advice. > -- > All the best > Fatty from Forges Hi Ian - Judging by AFW comments things have changed since Robotti's experiences in New York and the US in the '70s. The trend I mentioned must be must be a modern Australian phenomenon where, admittedly, trained or professional sommeliers have been scarce on the ground. I quote my own words here about local dining: "Noosa is often touted as Australia's premier tourist destination and its best restaurants are highly regarded and reviewed. "The top shelf restaurants do offer food and service (and prices) on a par with leading restaurants in Sydney and Melbourne. However, at some of the also-ran eateries, while prices remain high, the service, especially the wine service, can be abysmal. "We've had champagne corks popped and the expensive contents dribbled over the floor. Older vintage corks destroyed by poor opening technique 'Ever thought of cutting off the capsule first?' I muttered. And bottles handled carelessly and wine poured as if it were beer." etc. Cheers! Martin |
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