Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Wine (alt.food.wine) Devoted to the discussion of wine and wine-related topics. A place to read and comment about wines, wine and food matching, storage systems, wine paraphernalia, etc. In general, any topic related to wine is valid fodder for the group. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic
variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more sweet. JB |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
On Jul 24, 9:18*am, Ronin > wrote:
> Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > variations in bottles of the same case? *For instance I have been > drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. *Last night Bam! *I was hit > with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! *What's up with that? > *It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > the case. *No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > sweet. > > * * * * JB There are many possible contributors to this phenomenon. You say that there was no taint, but TCA (2,4,6-Trichloroanisole) can be present in such small quantities that the amount of taint can vary. It is also possible that the bottle was not properly gassed at bottling. Introducing oxygen, as you know, can really affect a wine. |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
It could be that they packed a late harvest Zinfandel by mistake. I say that
because you said it tasted like Port. "Agent Red" > wrote in message ... On Jul 24, 9:18 am, Ronin > wrote: > Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been > drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit > with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? > It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > sweet. > > JB There are many possible contributors to this phenomenon. You say that there was no taint, but TCA (2,4,6-Trichloroanisole) can be present in such small quantities that the amount of taint can vary. It is also possible that the bottle was not properly gassed at bottling. Introducing oxygen, as you know, can really affect a wine. |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
"Ronin" > wrote in message ... > Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been > drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit > with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? > It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > sweet. > > JB > I have no idea why there would be a bottle variation within the case. Sounds like a nice surprise! But I am curious about Klick Zinfandel. Googled and Wine Searchered, but nothing. Can you tell me a bit more about Klick? I was intrigued by your description "elegant style like some Bordeaux". |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
On 2008-07-24 14:16:53 -0700, "Evan Keel" > said:
> > "Ronin" > wrote in message > ... >> Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic >> variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been >> drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a >> light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit >> with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? >> It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in >> the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more >> sweet. >> >> JB >> > > I have no idea why there would be a bottle variation within the case. Sounds > like a nice surprise! But I am curious about Klick Zinfandel. Googled and > Wine Searchered, but nothing. Can you tell me a bit more about Klick? I was > intrigued by your description "elegant style like some Bordeaux". Well, I like the flavour of zin, but I get tired of the "huge-er than thou" style, and I was introduced to Klick by the restaurant "Zin" in Healdsburg. What I'm drinking now is the 2005 Hamilton vinyard, Dry Creek Valley. The label says Nice, CA, (on the North shore of Clearlake, just NW of Healdsburg. Bottle Barn in Santa Rosa got it for me. |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
"Ronin" > wrote in message ... > On 2008-07-24 14:16:53 -0700, "Evan Keel" > said: > > > > > "Ronin" > wrote in message > > ... > >> Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > >> variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been > >> drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > >> light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit > >> with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? > >> It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > >> the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > >> sweet. > >> > >> JB > >> > > > > I have no idea why there would be a bottle variation within the case. Sounds > > like a nice surprise! But I am curious about Klick Zinfandel. Googled and > > Wine Searchered, but nothing. Can you tell me a bit more about Klick? I was > > intrigued by your description "elegant style like some Bordeaux". > > Well, I like the flavour of zin, but I get tired of the "huge-er than > thou" style, and I was introduced to Klick by the restaurant "Zin" in > Healdsburg. What I'm drinking now is the 2005 Hamilton vinyard, Dry > Creek Valley. The label says Nice, CA, (on the North shore of > Clearlake, just NW of Healdsburg. Bottle Barn in Santa Rosa got it > for me. > So Klick is the winemaker and Hamilton is the producer? The link to the restaurant (Zin) times out. Thanks for the reference to the Bottle Barn. On a mission for a case. I used to like the 14%+ Zins, but looking for something with a little less body but still that brambly fruit. Thanks.... Evan |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
On 2008-07-24 15:16:39 -0700, "Evan Keel" > said:
> > "Ronin" > wrote in message > ... >> On 2008-07-24 14:16:53 -0700, "Evan Keel" > said: >> >>> >>> "Ronin" > wrote in message >>> ... >>>> Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic >>>> variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been >>>> drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a >>>> light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit >>>> with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? >>>> It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in >>>> the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more >>>> sweet. >>>> >>>> JB >>>> >>> >>> I have no idea why there would be a bottle variation within the case. > Sounds >>> like a nice surprise! But I am curious about Klick Zinfandel. Googled > and >>> Wine Searchered, but nothing. Can you tell me a bit more about Klick? I > was >>> intrigued by your description "elegant style like some Bordeaux". >> >> Well, I like the flavour of zin, but I get tired of the "huge-er than >> thou" style, and I was introduced to Klick by the restaurant "Zin" in >> Healdsburg. What I'm drinking now is the 2005 Hamilton vinyard, Dry >> Creek Valley. The label says Nice, CA, (on the North shore of >> Clearlake, just NW of Healdsburg. Bottle Barn in Santa Rosa got it >> for me. >> > So Klick is the winemaker and Hamilton is the producer? The link to the > restaurant (Zin) times out. Thanks for the reference to the Bottle Barn. On > a mission for a case. I used to like the 14%+ Zins, but looking for > something with a little less body but still that brambly fruit. > > Thanks.... > > Evan Klick is the winemaker, and he got his grapes from the Hamilton vinyard in Dry Creek Valley, which is around Lake Sonoma, just West of Geyeserville, CA (Just North of Healdsburg, CA) You are quite welcome. JB |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
On Jul 24, 1:18�pm, Ronin > wrote:
> Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > variations in bottles of the same case? �For instance I have been > drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. �Last night Bam! �I was hit > with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! �What's up with that? > �It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > the case. �No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > sweet. > > � � � � JB Very interesting post/thread, thanks for starting. I am not among the cognoscenti - I'm cognizant of my limitations - but have opinions about a lot of things vinuous. I read your first sentence and began preparing thoughts. But when I read your full post, most of my possibilities (brett, TCA, other faulty cork issues such as oxidative notes, heat, etc) were not real options. Several bottles lighter and elegant, one richer and fuller is puzzling (other way around might be slightly less so). My only thought then was batch or barrel variation- it's possible that if they bottled barrel by barrel or from different batches one could end up with a case with an outlier from another barrel/batch. But your subsequent response that this seems to be a small producer with a single vineyard bottling makes that a lot less likely. The only remaining possibility I see is some kind of food matching or enviromental reason. You didn't have artichokes last night did you? I look forward to others' ideas. |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
On Jul 24, 8:03 pm, DaleW > wrote:
> On Jul 24, 1:18�pm, Ronin > wrote: > > > Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > > variations in bottles of the same case? �For instance I have been > > drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > > light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. �Last night Bam! �I was hit > > with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! �What's up with that? > > �It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > > the case. �No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > > sweet. > > > � � � � JB > > Very interesting post/thread, thanks for starting. I am not among the > cognoscenti - I'm cognizant of my limitations - but have opinions > about a lot of things vinuous. I read your first sentence and began > preparing thoughts. But when I read your full post, most of my > possibilities (brett, TCA, other faulty cork issues such as oxidative > notes, heat, etc) were not real options. > > Several bottles lighter and elegant, one richer and fuller is puzzling > (other way around might be slightly less so). My only thought then was > batch or barrel variation- it's possible that if they bottled barrel > by barrel or from different batches one could end up with a case with > an outlier from another barrel/batch. But your subsequent response > that this seems to be a small producer with a single vineyard bottling > makes that a lot less likely. > > The only remaining possibility I see is some kind of food matching or > enviromental reason. You didn't have artichokes last night did > you? > > I look forward to others' ideas. Dale, I had to same thoughts about the bottling. The only other variable I can think of is some kind of volatile acidity. VA occurs in varying degrees like TCA. The most extreme example actually fizzes when poured. Mark |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
Apart from all the factors mentioned by other posters, transport conditions
can also play a role: If a truck filled with cardboard boxes of wines stays parked in the summer sun for a couple of hours, part of the load can be exposed to uncomfortable temperatures. Decades ago, when we still had cold winters in Europe, there have also been rumors about wines "on the edges" of a lorry that had been spoiled by temperatures below freezing... Yves "Ronin" > wrote in message ... > Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been drinking > out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a light "elegant" > style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit with a bottle as > SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? It was delicious, > but certainly not like any of the other bottles in the case. No "taint" > of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more sweet. > > JB > |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
In article
>, Mark Slater > wrote: > On Jul 24, 8:03 pm, DaleW > wrote: > > On Jul 24, 1:18?pm, Ronin > wrote: > > > > > Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > > > variations in bottles of the same case? ?For instance I have been > > > drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > > > light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. ?Last night Bam! ?I was hit > > > with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! ?What's up with that? > > > ?It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > > > the case. ?No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > > > sweet. > > > > > ? ? ? ? JB > > > > Very interesting post/thread, thanks for starting. I am not among the > > cognoscenti - I'm cognizant of my limitations - but have opinions > > about a lot of things vinuous. I read your first sentence and began > > preparing thoughts. But when I read your full post, most of my > > possibilities (brett, TCA, other faulty cork issues such as oxidative > > notes, heat, etc) were not real options. > > > > Several bottles lighter and elegant, one richer and fuller is puzzling > > (other way around might be slightly less so). My only thought then was > > batch or barrel variation- it's possible that if they bottled barrel > > by barrel or from different batches one could end up with a case with > > an outlier from another barrel/batch. But your subsequent response > > that this seems to be a small producer with a single vineyard bottling > > makes that a lot less likely. > > > > The only remaining possibility I see is some kind of food matching or > > enviromental reason. You didn't have artichokes last night did > > you? > > > > I look forward to others' ideas. > > Dale, > I had to same thoughts about the bottling. The only other variable I > can think of is some kind of volatile acidity. VA occurs in varying > degrees like TCA. The most extreme example actually fizzes when > poured. > > Mark Good post Mark. VA is the more likely culprit than TCA IMHO. I am very TCA sensitive so even coming near an open bottle makes me slightly nauseous but VA can be subtle. |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 09:18:38 -0700, Ronin >
wrote: >Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic >variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been >drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a >light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit >with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? > It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in >the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more >sweet. I've read the various suggestions and the only one I find even vaguely possible is a rogue bottle. VA can't make a normally dry subtle wine taste like port, no way, José. Neither can TCA. As for any reasonably likely barrel variation, surely, any winemaker worth his salt will transfer all his barrels of a particular wine into a blending vat to eliminate individual barrel variations. Certainly that's standard practice in the great majority of wineries, where they often use different oaks and barrel makers and toasts to give a more complex final blend. I think you got a rogue bottle, though goodness knows how. -- All the best Fatty from Forges |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
In article >,
IanH > wrote: > On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 09:18:38 -0700, Ronin > > wrote: > > >Do any of you cognescenti out there know why there may be drastic > >variations in bottles of the same case? For instance I have been > >drinking out of a case of Klick Zinfandel which has been made in a > >light "elegant" style like some Bordeaux. Last night Bam! I was hit > >with a bottle as SWIMBO said, tasted like a Port! What's up with that? > > It was delicious, but certainly not like any of the other bottles in > >the case. No "taint" of any sort, just more ripe and definitely more > >sweet. > > I've read the various suggestions and the only one I find even vaguely > possible is a rogue bottle. VA can't make a normally dry subtle wine > taste like port, no way, José. Neither can TCA. > > As for any reasonably likely barrel variation, surely, any winemaker > worth his salt will transfer all his barrels of a particular wine > into a blending vat to eliminate individual barrel variations. > Certainly that's standard practice in the great majority of wineries, > where they often use different oaks and barrel makers and toasts to > give a more complex final blend. > > I think you got a rogue bottle, though goodness knows how. > -- > All the best > Fatty from Forges Ian, I totally agree with you. I guess I was just trying to play nice. Usually, when there is that much bottle variation from one wine maker and one vintage, there is something wrong in their bottling process. What I have been seeing more and more are the mobile trucks that go from winery to winery and this has actually cut down bottle variation. When I see much of it, they are probably bottling it themselves and aren't as fastidious as the mobile bottlers. |
Posted to alt.food.wine
|
|||
|
|||
bottle variation
>
> I've read the various suggestions and the only one I find even vaguely > possible is a rogue bottle. VA can't make a normally dry subtle wine > taste like port, no way, José. Neither can TCA. > > As for any reasonably likely barrel variation, surely, any winemaker > worth his salt will transfer all his barrels of a particular wine > into a blending vat to eliminate individual barrel variations. > Certainly that's standard practice in the great majority of wineries, > where they often use different oaks and barrel makers and toasts to > give a more complex final blend. > > I think you got a rogue bottle, though goodness knows how. Well, that's what I thought. The first examples that I found wer in cases of "Montepiano" (sic) "Tuscan style red wine" from Rabbit Ridge. This was while they were closing their Healdsburg tasting room, and I put it down to bottling the "bin ends" ($20/case of reasonable everyday wine, who's to complain?) but I'd get 2-3 bottles that were not like the others. But when I found an outlier in the Klick zin, I thought I'd ask if anyone has had a similar experience, or knew of some reason why... Thanks, by the by, for the responses. |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Empty Champagne or wine bottle as oil bottle and vented pourer | General Cooking | |||
TN: '04 Barolo and a PN with bottle variation | Wine | |||
Comparing bottle A vs bottle B over a couple of weeks | Wine | |||
TN: Bourgogne, Bdx, and bottle variation at Jaboulet | Wine | |||
great bottle cleaning tip for stuff that hardened inside the bottle | Winemaking |