Today, Jean and I popped into a local wine retailer to pick up a few
white and sparkling wines for our vacation next week. Just as we
arrived, a major thunderstorm hit, so we waited out the downpour by
looking into their temperature-controlled wine room. Normally, I don't
shop for wines to cellar there, as the manager -- a well-meaning lady --
uses WS scores to guide her purchases and rarely has wines that interest
me. However, as I looked around this room, I found three wines of
interest: 2000 Alain Voge Cornas VV ($57), 2000 Produttori del
Barbaresco Barbaresco ($33) and 1998 Havens Bourriquot ($32). I will
probably pick up all three wines in the near future, but if anyone has
any feedback on them, I'm all ears.

Mark Lipton
--
alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

On Jun 26, 4:10�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> Today, Jean and I popped into a local wine retailer to pick up a few
> white and sparkling wines for our vacation next week. �Just as we
> arrived, a major thunderstorm hit, so we waited out the downpour by
> looking into their temperature-controlled wine room. �Normally, I don't
> shop for wines to cellar there, as the manager -- a well-meaning lady --
> uses WS scores to guide her purchases and rarely has wines that interest
> me. �However, as I looked around this room, I found three wines of
> interest: 2000 Alain Voge Cornas VV ($57), 2000 Produttori del
> Barbaresco Barbaresco ($33) and 1998 Havens Bourriquot ($32). �I will
> probably pick up all three wines in the near future, but if anyone has
> any feedback on them, I'm all ears.
>
> Mark Lipton
> --
> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

I'd definitely go for the Voge.
That's a little steep for the Barbaresco, I paid $22 for my lone
bottle. Early drinking vintage, traditional producer, what to do?
I generally like Bourriquot, but didn't like the '98.
Would love your impressions of any you try.

In article
>,
DaleW > wrote:

> On Jun 26, 4:10?pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> > Today, Jean and I popped into a local wine retailer to pick up a few
> > white and sparkling wines for our vacation next week. ?Just as we
> > arrived, a major thunderstorm hit, so we waited out the downpour by
> > looking into their temperature-controlled wine room. ?Normally, I don't
> > shop for wines to cellar there, as the manager -- a well-meaning lady --
> > uses WS scores to guide her purchases and rarely has wines that interest
> > me. ?However, as I looked around this room, I found three wines of
> > interest: 2000 Alain Voge Cornas VV ($57), 2000 Produttori del
> > Barbaresco Barbaresco ($33) and 1998 Havens Bourriquot ($32). ?I will
> > probably pick up all three wines in the near future, but if anyone has
> > any feedback on them, I'm all ears.
> >
> > Mark Lipton
> > --
> > alt.food.wine FAQ: ?http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com
>
> I'd definitely go for the Voge.
> That's a little steep for the Barbaresco, I paid $22 for my lone
> bottle. Early drinking vintage, traditional producer, what to do?
> I generally like Bourriquot, but didn't like the '98.
> Would love your impressions of any you try.

The Voge is the only good buy in the group. I paid $26 for the
Barbaresco so I think $33 is quite high but I don't know relative values
for Indiana. The Barbaresco was quite nice though.

On Jun 26, 4:10�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> Today, Jean and I popped into a local wine retailer to pick up a few
> white and sparkling wines for our vacation next week. �Just as we
> arrived, a major thunderstorm hit, so we waited out the downpour by
> looking into their temperature-controlled wine room. �Normally, I don't
> shop for wines to cellar there, as the manager -- a well-meaning lady --
> uses WS scores to guide her purchases and rarely has wines that interest
> me. �However, as I looked around this room, I found three wines of
> interest: 2000 Alain Voge Cornas VV ($57), 2000 Produttori del
> Barbaresco Barbaresco ($33) and 1998 Havens Bourriquot ($32). �I will
> probably pick up all three wines in the near future, but if anyone has
> any feedback on them, I'm all ears.
>
> Mark Lipton
> --
> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. 1998 wasn't a
great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. I've
never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.

Bi!! wrote:

> I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. 1998 wasn't a
> great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
> was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
> particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. I've
> never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
> this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.

Interesting point, Bill. '98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. I might give it a flyer just out of
curiosity. Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
be factored in. I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
standout of the bunch.

Mark Lipton


--
alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

On Jun 26, 11:23�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> Bi!! wrote:
> > I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. �1998 wasn't a
> > great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
> > was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
> > particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. �I've
> > never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
> > this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.
>
> Interesting point, Bill. �'98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
> Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
> is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. �I might give it a flyer just out of
> curiosity. �Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
> cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
> be factored in. �I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
> standout of the bunch.
>
> Mark Lipton
>
> --
> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

I hate to paint vintages with a broad brush and I certainly have a
fair amount of '98 Napa cabs in my cellar. They were "bargains"
compared to the '97's and as usual good winemakers make good wine in
any vintage. I've been drinking a fair amount of 1997's and 1998's
recently and in particular I've enjoyed the Phelps Insignia from
1998. I find that the '98's have a bit more acidity and balance than
the fleshy flashy 1997's but I've also found that the 1997's haven't
fallen apart as predicted at the time of release. In any case I've
never been a huge fan of Napa Cab Franc from any vintage although
Pride may have made one of the better bottles of Cab Franc. I usually
get a lot of green bean and herbal notes from pure Cab Franc.

On Jun 27, 3:47Â*am, "Bi!!" > wrote:
> On Jun 26, 11:23�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
>
>
>
> > Bi!! wrote:
> > > I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. �1998 wasn't a
> > > great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
> > > was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
> > > particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. �I've
> > > never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
> > > this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.
>
> > Interesting point, Bill. �'98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
> > Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
> > is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. �I might give it a flyer just out of
> > curiosity. �Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
> > cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
> > be factored in. �I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
> > standout of the bunch.
>
> > Mark Lipton
>
> > --
> > alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com
>
> I hate to paint vintages with a broad brush and I certainly have a
> fair amount of '98 Napa cabs in my cellar. Â*They were "bargains"
> compared to the '97's and as usual good winemakers make good wine in
> any vintage. Â*I've been drinking a fair amount of 1997's and 1998's
> recently and in particular I've enjoyed the Phelps Insignia from
> 1998. Â*I find that the '98's have a bit more acidity and balance than
> the fleshy flashy 1997's but I've also found that the 1997's haven't
> fallen apart as predicted at the time of release. Â*In any case I've
> never been a huge fan of Napa Cab Franc from any vintage although
> Pride may have made one of the better bottles of Cab Franc. Â*I usually
> get a lot of green bean and herbal notes from pure Cab Franc.

I have still not recovered from the Mt. Veeder Winery Cabernet Franc
1977. It did have a bit of green bean and herbal character to it, but
this was just a minor component. This wine ranked right up there in
style with some of the monster CS made in the 70s by the likes of Dr.
David Bruce and Martin Ray, and may have even topped most of them in
extract and tannin content. It was undrinkable, at least for me, for
several years after the vintage. It had nearly as deep a color as
India ink. I still have a bottle, and at least I only bought 2 bottles
of it on release. I will open it within a few years in the hopes that
the tannin and acid have reduced enough to make it drinkable and hope
that some fruit is left or that an interesting bottle bouquet has
developed. This is the largest monster red table wine that I have ever
tasted, and I hope I never find another wine anywhere near as
excessive as this one.

cwdjrxyz wrote:
> On Jun 27, 3:47 am, "Bi!!" > wrote:
>> On Jun 26, 11:23�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> Bi!! wrote:
>>>> I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. �1998 wasn't a
>>>> great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
>>>> was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
>>>> particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. �I've
>>>> never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
>>>> this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.
>>> Interesting point, Bill. �'98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
>>> Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
>>> is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. �I might give it a flyer just out of
>>> curiosity. �Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
>>> cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
>>> be factored in. �I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
>>> standout of the bunch.
>>> Mark Lipton
>>> --
>>> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com
>> I hate to paint vintages with a broad brush and I certainly have a
>> fair amount of '98 Napa cabs in my cellar. They were "bargains"
>> compared to the '97's and as usual good winemakers make good wine in
>> any vintage. I've been drinking a fair amount of 1997's and 1998's
>> recently and in particular I've enjoyed the Phelps Insignia from
>> 1998. I find that the '98's have a bit more acidity and balance than
>> the fleshy flashy 1997's but I've also found that the 1997's haven't
>> fallen apart as predicted at the time of release. In any case I've
>> never been a huge fan of Napa Cab Franc from any vintage although
>> Pride may have made one of the better bottles of Cab Franc. I usually
>> get a lot of green bean and herbal notes from pure Cab Franc.
>
> I have still not recovered from the Mt. Veeder Winery Cabernet Franc
> 1977. [...] This is the largest monster red table wine that I have ever
> tasted, and I hope I never find another wine anywhere near as
> excessive as this one.

LOL!! For my part, some of Ken Burnap's Santa Cruz Mtn Vyd Pinot Noirs
were the biggest, brawniest, toughest wines I've ever tasted. There's
probably a Petite Sirah or two that come close, but I'm sure that I lost
most of my tooth enamel to a few of those SCMV Pinots ;-) (Dr Bruce
produced a few others that vie for the title, too)

Mark Lipton


--
alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

On Jun 27, 10:40Â*am, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> cwdjrxyz wrote:
> > On Jun 27, 3:47 am, "Bi!!" > wrote:
> >> On Jun 26, 11:23�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
>
> >>> Bi!! wrote:
> >>>> I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. �1998 wasn't a
> >>>> great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
> >>>> was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
> >>>> particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. �I've
> >>>> never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
> >>>> this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.
> >>> Interesting point, Bill. �'98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
> >>> Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
> >>> is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. �I might give it a flyer just out of
> >>> curiosity. �Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
> >>> cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
> >>> be factored in. �I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
> >>> standout of the bunch.
> >>> Mark Lipton
> >>> --
> >>> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com
> >> I hate to paint vintages with a broad brush and I certainly have a
> >> fair amount of '98 Napa cabs in my cellar. Â*They were "bargains"
> >> compared to the '97's and as usual good winemakers make good wine in
> >> any vintage. Â*I've been drinking a fair amount of 1997's and 1998's
> >> recently and in particular I've enjoyed the Phelps Insignia from
> >> 1998. Â*I find that the '98's have a bit more acidity and balance than
> >> the fleshy flashy 1997's but I've also found that the 1997's haven't
> >> fallen apart as predicted at the time of release. Â*In any case I've
> >> never been a huge fan of Napa Cab Franc from any vintage although
> >> Pride may have made one of the better bottles of Cab Franc. Â*I usually
> >> get a lot of green bean and herbal notes from pure Cab Franc.
>
> > I have still not recovered from the Mt. Veeder Winery Cabernet Franc
> > 1977. [...] Â*This is the largest monster red table wine that I have ever
> > tasted, and I hope I never find another wine anywhere near as
> > excessive as this one.
>
> LOL!! For my part, some of Ken Burnap's Santa Cruz Mtn Vyd Pinot Noirs
> were the biggest, brawniest, toughest wines I've ever tasted. Â*There's
> probably a Petite Sirah or two that come close, but I'm sure that I lost
> most of my tooth enamel to a few of those SCMV Pinots ;-) Â*(Dr Bruce
> produced a few others that vie for the title, too)
>
> Mark Lipton
>
> --
> alt.food.wine FAQ: Â*http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Hands down for me is Randy Dunn's 1985 Howell Mountain Cab. The wine
is still totally unyielding in it's tannic grip and has become
legendary due to it's outright toughness. I also owned a few bottles
of Turley Petitie Syrah that were monstrously huge and tannic as were
some Martinelli Jack Ass Hill Zins that pushed 18% alcohol and were
not at all charming.

In article
>,
"Bi!!" > wrote:

> On Jun 27, 10:40Â*am, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> > cwdjrxyz wrote:
> > > On Jun 27, 3:47 am, "Bi!!" > wrote:
> > >> On Jun 26, 11:23?pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> >
> > >>> Bi!! wrote:
> > >>>> I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. ?1998 wasn't a
> > >>>> great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
> > >>>> was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
> > >>>> particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. ?I've
> > >>>> never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
> > >>>> this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.
> > >>> Interesting point, Bill. ?'98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
> > >>> Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
> > >>> is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. ?I might give it a flyer just out of
> > >>> curiosity. ?Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
> > >>> cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
> > >>> be factored in. ?I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
> > >>> standout of the bunch.
> > >>> Mark Lipton
> > >>> --
> > >>> alt.food.wine FAQ: ?http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com
> > >> I hate to paint vintages with a broad brush and I certainly have a
> > >> fair amount of '98 Napa cabs in my cellar. Â*They were "bargains"
> > >> compared to the '97's and as usual good winemakers make good wine in
> > >> any vintage. Â*I've been drinking a fair amount of 1997's and 1998's
> > >> recently and in particular I've enjoyed the Phelps Insignia from
> > >> 1998. Â*I find that the '98's have a bit more acidity and balance than
> > >> the fleshy flashy 1997's but I've also found that the 1997's haven't
> > >> fallen apart as predicted at the time of release. Â*In any case I've
> > >> never been a huge fan of Napa Cab Franc from any vintage although
> > >> Pride may have made one of the better bottles of Cab Franc. Â*I usually
> > >> get a lot of green bean and herbal notes from pure Cab Franc.
> >
> > > I have still not recovered from the Mt. Veeder Winery Cabernet Franc
> > > 1977. [...] Â*This is the largest monster red table wine that I have ever
> > > tasted, and I hope I never find another wine anywhere near as
> > > excessive as this one.
> >
> > LOL!! For my part, some of Ken Burnap's Santa Cruz Mtn Vyd Pinot Noirs
> > were the biggest, brawniest, toughest wines I've ever tasted. Â*There's
> > probably a Petite Sirah or two that come close, but I'm sure that I lost
> > most of my tooth enamel to a few of those SCMV Pinots ;-) Â*(Dr Bruce
> > produced a few others that vie for the title, too)
> >
> > Mark Lipton
> >
> > --
> > alt.food.wine FAQ: Â*http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Hands down for me is Randy Dunn's 1985 Howell Mountain Cab. The wine
> is still totally unyielding in it's tannic grip and has become
> legendary due to it's outright toughness. I also owned a few bottles
> of Turley Petitie Syrah that were monstrously huge and tannic as were
> some Martinelli Jack Ass Hill Zins that pushed 18% alcohol and were
> not at all charming.

I opened a 1995 Dunn Howell Mountain Cab last night that was listed as
15 and must have been 15.5 or more. They can't fudge much more than 1/2
% on the alcohol. This wine actually had integrated, a first for me with
Dunn and only 13 years. The alcohol wasn't noticeable and the nose was
magnificent dark fruits and pencil shavings. The mouthfeel was full and
the taste was dark chocolate and raspberries with some coffee as well. I
was tasting it 15 minutes after drinking it. This, as I said is a first
as I quit buying Dunn after 2003 because I didn't think I would live
long enough for them to integrate. Maybe it was just 1995.

On Jun 27, 9:40Â*am, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> cwdjrxyz wrote:
> > On Jun 27, 3:47 am, "Bi!!" > wrote:
> >> On Jun 26, 11:23�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
>
> >>> Bi!! wrote:
> >>>> I would agree with Dale and pass on the Bourriquot. �1998 wasn't a
> >>>> great vintage to begin with and I had the wine a few years ago and it
> >>>> was showing it's age....but I can't vouch for the provenance of that
> >>>> particular bottle so you might find one with better storage. �I've
> >>>> never found Napa Cab Franc ot age particularly well in general and
> >>>> this bottle has a lot of Cab Franc as I recall.
> >>> Interesting point, Bill. �'98 is one of my favorite recent vintages for
> >>> Napa Cabs, but Cab Franc is another kettle of fish, and the Bourriquot
> >>> is 2/3 Cab Franc as a rule. �I might give it a flyer just out of
> >>> curiosity. �Value isn't as much of an issue as some may think, as the
> >>> cost of driving to Sam's in Chicago or mail order from NYC or CA has to
> >>> be factored in. �I agree with all of you, though, that the Voge is the
> >>> standout of the bunch.
> >>> Mark Lipton
> >>> --
> >>> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com
> >> I hate to paint vintages with a broad brush and I certainly have a
> >> fair amount of '98 Napa cabs in my cellar. Â*They were "bargains"
> >> compared to the '97's and as usual good winemakers make good wine in
> >> any vintage. Â*I've been drinking a fair amount of 1997's and 1998's
> >> recently and in particular I've enjoyed the Phelps Insignia from
> >> 1998. Â*I find that the '98's have a bit more acidity and balance than
> >> the fleshy flashy 1997's but I've also found that the 1997's haven't
> >> fallen apart as predicted at the time of release. Â*In any case I've
> >> never been a huge fan of Napa Cab Franc from any vintage although
> >> Pride may have made one of the better bottles of Cab Franc. Â*I usually
> >> get a lot of green bean and herbal notes from pure Cab Franc.
>
> > I have still not recovered from the Mt. Veeder Winery Cabernet Franc
> > 1977. [...] Â*This is the largest monster red table wine that I have ever
> > tasted, and I hope I never find another wine anywhere near as
> > excessive as this one.
>
> LOL!! For my part, some of Ken Burnap's Santa Cruz Mtn Vyd Pinot Noirs
> were the biggest, brawniest, toughest wines I've ever tasted. Â*There's
> probably a Petite Sirah or two that come close, but I'm sure that I lost
> most of my tooth enamel to a few of those SCMV Pinots ;-) Â*(Dr Bruce
> produced a few others that vie for the title, too)

Yes, I can remember several other monster wines, especially from the
late 60s and 70s. Martin Ray's 1968 CS was not at all user friendly
for many years, but it finally became drinkable, but still huge, after
about 30 years. David Bruce's 1974 CS prompted one critic of the 70s
to call it the perfect match for mastodon steak. It too became semi-
drinkable with about 20 years of age, but when young you wondered if
it would shrink your mouth shut from all of the tannin and if the acid
and alcohol was going to scald your throat. Monterey Peninsula Winery
could be depended on to make over-the-top CS and Zinfandel monsters in
the 70s, although their wines often were a little more drinkable with
just a few years age than many monsters of the era.There were many
monster Petite Sirahs. The Callaway 1975 PS was huge and tannic,
completely undrinkable for me when young. Drinking it at a few years
old was akin to masochism. I have a single bottle and will open it
someday, hoping that it does not jump out of the bottle and bite me.

cwdjrxyz wrote:
> Yes, I can remember several other monster wines, especially from the
> late 60s and 70s. Martin Ray's 1968 CS was not at all user friendly
> for many years, but it finally became drinkable, but still huge, after
> about 30 years. David Bruce's 1974 CS prompted one critic of the 70s
> to call it the perfect match for mastodon steak. It too became semi-
> drinkable with about 20 years of age, but when young you wondered if
> it would shrink your mouth shut from all of the tannin and if the acid
> and alcohol was going to scald your throat. Monterey Peninsula Winery
> could be depended on to make over-the-top CS and Zinfandel monsters in
> the 70s, although their wines often were a little more drinkable with
> just a few years age than many monsters of the era.There were many
> monster Petite Sirahs. The Callaway 1975 PS was huge and tannic,
> completely undrinkable for me when young. Drinking it at a few years
> old was akin to masochism. I have a single bottle and will open it
> someday, hoping that it does not jump out of the bottle and bite me.

It's interesting to note how many of the wines we're talking about came
from the Santa Cruz Mountains, as the standard bearer for the region
today would of course be Ridge, who have never followed that
over-the-top, all consequences be damned approach. I recall that
"mastodon steak" quip, too (Dan Berger, was it not?) and those examples
of which I spoke were from the late '70s.

Monterey Peninsula has a special significance for me, as Jean (then my
girlfriend) and I discovered a cache of their '79 Zin in a dingy little
liquor store on Broadway near Columbia University in '87 and proceeded
to drink them all up as our relationship developed. By then, the wine
was quite drinkable and smooth (storage conditions were far from ideal)
and had lovely plummy fruit. Who knows what would have become of our
relationship had we not found those bottles? ;-)

Mark Lipton


--
alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

"Mark Lipton" wrote ............
>
> Monterey Peninsula has a special significance for me, as Jean .... (Who
> knows what would have become of our relationship had we not found those
> bottles? ;-)


Actually, I can categorically state that it was wine which brought Kathryn
and I together, too.

I was managing a small specialist wine outlet for a friend (in Auckland
city), and on this particular Saturday morning, a tall, very attractive
woman walked in, seeking a bottle to take to a girl-friends for dinner.

I suggested something expensive, without being outrageously so! (and was
rebuffed) - but recommended an acceptable Australian red (good QPR) -
explaining it came with Andrew's "money back guarantee" - huh?????

She came back the following week, saying "that wine was very good - so, just
how good is the other wine"

I said - "you buy the wine and I will buy dinner"

A deal was struck - she returned to Australia the following week,
resulting in a transTasman courtship - and - we shall celebrate 16 years
of marriage later this year.

Any other stories out there?

st.helier

st.helier wrote:
> "Mark Lipton" wrote ............
>
>>Monterey Peninsula has a special significance for me, as Jean .... (Who
>>knows what would have become of our relationship had we not found those
>>bottles? ;-)
>
>
>
> Actually, I can categorically state that it was wine which brought Kathryn
> and I together, too.
>
> I was managing a small specialist wine outlet for a friend (in Auckland
> city), and on this particular Saturday morning, a tall, very attractive
> woman walked in, seeking a bottle to take to a girl-friends for dinner.
>
> I suggested something expensive, without being outrageously so! (and was
> rebuffed) - but recommended an acceptable Australian red (good QPR) -
> explaining it came with Andrew's "money back guarantee" - huh?????
>
> She came back the following week, saying "that wine was very good - so, just
> how good is the other wine"
>
> I said - "you buy the wine and I will buy dinner"
>
> A deal was struck - she returned to Australia the following week,
> resulting in a transTasman courtship - and - we shall celebrate 16 years
> of marriage later this year.

Interesting story, milud. I was aware that Kathryn was tall and
good-looking, but I handn't sussed out the fact that she wasn't a native
Kiwi. Good going, and congrats to you both on the longevity of the romance!

Mark Lipton
(who in 2009 will celebrate his 20th anniversary and 50th birthday)


--
alt.food.wine FAQ: http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

On Jun 27, 2:55*pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:

> Monterey Peninsula has a special significance for me, as Jean (then my
> girlfriend) and I discovered a cache of their '79 Zin in a dingy little
> liquor store on Broadway near Columbia University in '87 and proceeded
> to drink them all up as our relationship developed. *By then, the wine
> was quite drinkable and smooth (storage conditions were far from ideal)
> and had lovely plummy fruit. *Who knows what would have become of our
> relationship had we not found those bottles? ;-)

It turns out that I still have a single bottle of 1976 Monterey
Peninsula Winery Amador Zinfandel, Ferrero Ranch, late harvest. It
still has a fill in the low neck and still quite a bit of color from
what you can tell through a green glass bottle using a flashlight.
There is no doubt about the late harvest style, but it as bit
different from most, having only 0.2 % residual sugar and thus being
nearly dry. Alcohol is listed at 15.5 % by volume. There is a very
verbose rear label with much information in small print. There was a
drought in 1976 resulting in the most intense Zinfandel the winery had
made up to 1976. The grapes were very small and almost the size of
currants. The wine was fermented to dryness on skins. The wine was
aged in reused, neutral oak because more tannins from new oak were not
needed - there was already a huge amount of tannin from the skins. It
says the wine is suitable for drinking early only by those who have a
pallate for extremely tannic wines or who have a penchant for
education. It suggests serving with more formidable cuts of meat or
strong character cheeses after the main course. It says the wine will
always benefit from breathing and that it should be decanted and
splashed to facilitate breathing.

Most likely this wine still is in good form as it still was rather
youthful and showed no evidence of decline about 10 years ago.

On Jun 27, 8:51�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
> st.helier wrote:
> > "Mark Lipton" wrote ............
>
> >>Monterey Peninsula has a special significance for me, as Jean .... (Who
> >>knows what would have become of our relationship had we not found those
> >>bottles? ;-)
>
> > Actually, I can categorically state that it was wine which brought Kathryn
> > and I together, too.
>
> > I was managing a small specialist wine outlet for a friend (in Auckland
> > city), and on this particular Saturday morning, a tall, very attractive
> > woman walked in, seeking a bottle to take to a girl-friends for dinner.
>
> > I suggested something expensive, without being outrageously so! (and was
> > rebuffed) - but recommended an acceptable �Australian red (good QPR) -
> > explaining it came with Andrew's "money back guarantee" �- �huh?????
>
> > She came back the following week, saying "that wine was very good - so, just
> > how good is the other wine"
>
> > I said - "you buy the wine and I will buy dinner"
>
> > A deal was struck �- �she returned to Australia the following week,
> > resulting in a transTasman courtship �- �and - we shall celebrate 16 years
> > of marriage later this year.
>
> Interesting story, milud. �I was aware that Kathryn was tall and
> good-looking, but I handn't sussed out the fact that she wasn't a native
> Kiwi. �Good going, and congrats to you both on the longevity of the romance!
>
> Mark Lipton
> (who in 2009 will celebrate his 20th anniversary and 50th birthday)
>
> --
> alt.food.wine FAQ: �http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -


On Monday we will be celebrating our 35th at Blackberry Farms in
Tennessee. I'll probably take a bottle or two from my cellar to
suplement their wine list which is quite large but lacking in Bordeaux
and Loire.

On Jun 28, 5:46Â*pm, "Bi!!" > wrote:
> On Jun 27, 8:51�pm, Mark Lipton > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > st.helier wrote:
> > > "Mark Lipton" wrote ............
>
> > >>Monterey Peninsula has a special significance for me, as Jean .... (Who
> > >>knows what would have become of our relationship had we not found those
> > >>bottles? ;-)
>
> > > Actually, I can categorically state that it was wine which brought Kathryn
> > > and I together, too.
>
> > > I was managing a small specialist wine outlet for a friend (in Auckland
> > > city), and on this particular Saturday morning, a tall, very attractive
> > > woman walked in, seeking a bottle to take to a girl-friends for dinner.