On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 01:42:05 -0400, "larrylook" > wrote:

>The anti's here assume the following:
>1. The CD argument is valid (veggies involve more CD's)

· From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat...that's well
over 500 servings of meat. From a grass raised dairy cow people
get thousands of dairy servings. Due to the influence of farm
machinery, and *icides, and in the case of rice the flooding and
draining of fields, one serving of soy or rice based product is
likely to involve more animal deaths than hundreds of servings
derived from grass raised animals. Grass raised animal products
contribute to fewer wildlife deaths, better wildlife habitat, and
better lives for livestock than soy or rice products. ·

>2. Vegetarians are aware of

I continue to wonder if they really are too stupid to understand,
or if they're just lying when they pretend it's not true.

>and agree with the 1.

From my experience they always lie about it, proving that they
never care about human influence on animals. Remember that
I've pointed it out before?

>3. Therefore vegetarians are hypocrites.

Maybe. All that I've encountered have been liars though, whether
they're hypocrites too or not I don't know. Can they be liars and
hypocrites both?

>But these anti's are are misguided terribly about all three above.
>First of all, that there is the least harm created by eating meat is clearly
>refuted by the following:
>http://courses.ats.rochester.edu/nob.../leastharm.htm

I didn't see any refutation there, but if you want to post some
example(s) of it that might be good.

>Derek has eloquently refuted the myth of the no CD GFC (grass fed cow), too.

2goo is referring to grain fed beef, not grass fed. So are you. You can
lie and say you're not. So can farmers. But you and Goochild both are,
and that is a fact. 2goo is a deliberate and contemptible liar btw, as are
all other "ARAs" that I've encountered except for one...and that one is
not you. So far I'm not sure that you're a liar, but I am positive that 2goo is.

>Vegetarians don't acknowledge 2,

Right. They lie about it, as I pointed out before. They lie, because
they don't care about the animals, as I pointed out before. Actually
I've been pointing it out for years. So has Rick. I've already mentioned
that. If you want to justify the lying I'd like to see it, but don't expect
such honesty from any vegans/"ARAs". Not ever.

>even though Rick and Dutch want to cram it
>down our mouths along with those GFC's. I think the anti's owe us a huge
>apology. This GFC myth, even if it were true, is no way to get millions of
>hungry people fed.

My impression at this time is that rotational grazing is a very efficient
method, and you'll have to do more than just shake your head before I'll
believe otherwise.

> My impression at this time is that rotational grazing is a very
> efficient
> method, and you'll have to do more than just shake your head before I'll
> believe otherwise.

Oh great! So next time I eat at the cafeteria or go to a restaurant I'm
forced to ask, "Maam, I'll take the stew with the grass fed cows that
participated in rotational grazing". What planet do you guys life on?
People are busy taking care of the essentials of life. I'm trying to raise
teenagers (pity me) and make a living. You need to make some practical
suggestions on how to eat ethically.

Please don't say anything that might make some vegetarians regret their
choice not to eat factory farmed meat, or you'd be steering them greatly
away from their goals. That would be irresponsible.

"larrylook" > wrote in message
...
>> My impression at this time is that rotational grazing is a
>> very efficient
>> method, and you'll have to do more than just shake your head
>> before I'll
>> believe otherwise.
>
> Oh great! So next time I eat at the cafeteria or go to a
> restaurant I'm forced to ask, "Maam, I'll take the stew with
> the grass fed cows that participated in rotational grazing".
=============
Another nice little strawman, larry-boy. While you're at it, why
not ask them where all their veggies came from. You also have no
idea what kind of farm, and from how far away all that came from,
hypocrite. Most restaurants I worked at back in school days
bought their meats locally. Their veggies almost never were.
Again, if unnecessary death and suffering to animals REALLY means
anything to you, why are you eating at restaurants, hypocrite?


What planet do you guys life on?
> People are busy taking care of the essentials of life.
============================
Obviously not the whacked out planet you seem to be from, killer.


I'm trying to raise
> teenagers (pity me) and make a living. You need to make some
> practical suggestions on how to eat ethically.
=================================
I have. You on the other hand have made NONE. You pretend and
delude yourself that eating veggies automatically means ethical.
Yet by your own admission you have done zero research into your
diet. Which of your so-called 'erhical' veggies kill fewer
animals? Which kills less? Your problem is that you don't know,
and worse, you don't CARE, which continues to prove that this is
NOT about saving any animals, it's about your hatred of others.


>
> Please don't say anything that might make some vegetarians
> regret their choice not to eat factory farmed meat, or you'd be
> steering them greatly away from their goals. That would be
> irresponsible.
=========================
No, it is you that is being irresponsible by making claims that
being vegan automatically means fewer animals die for your food.
It's a ly, it's trresponsible, and it's hypocritical. Plus, it
kills far more animals than necessary. But again, your continued
inane posts to usenet prove that unnecessary death and suffering
to animals means nothing to you, hypocrite.


>
>

"larrylook" > wrote
>> My impression at this time is that rotational grazing is a very
>> efficient
>> method, and you'll have to do more than just shake your head before I'll
>> believe otherwise.
>
> Oh great! So next time I eat at the cafeteria or go to a restaurant I'm
> forced to ask, "Maam, I'll take the stew with the grass fed cows that
> participated in rotational grazing". What planet do you guys life on?
> People are busy taking care of the essentials of life. I'm trying to
> raise teenagers (pity me) and make a living. You need to make some
> practical suggestions on how to eat ethically.

Why? Can't you figure it out for yourself?

> Please don't say anything that might make some vegetarians regret their
> choice not to eat factory farmed meat, or you'd be steering them greatly
> away from their goals. That would be irresponsible.

Vegans consider it immoral to eat ANY meat, not just "factory farmed".

Vegans consider it perfectly moral to eat ANY vegetables, even "factory
farmed".

Can't you see what is wrong with this picture yet?

On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 22:43:15 -0400, "larrylook" > wrote:

>> My impression at this time is that rotational grazing is a very
>> efficient
>> method, and you'll have to do more than just shake your head before I'll
>> believe otherwise.
>
>Oh great! So next time I eat at the cafeteria or go to a restaurant I'm
>forced to ask, "Maam, I'll take the stew with the grass fed cows that
>participated in rotational grazing".

You wouldn't support it regardless.

>What planet do you guys life on?
>People are busy taking care of the essentials of life. I'm trying to raise
>teenagers (pity me)

More like pitty them I'm sure.

>and make a living. You need to make some practical
>suggestions on how to eat ethically.
>
>Please don't say anything that might make some vegetarians regret their
>choice not to eat factory farmed meat, or you'd be steering them greatly
>away from their goals. That would be irresponsible.

Grass raised animal products contribute to fewer deaths than many
types of vegetable products. You don't and can't care. You lie about
it. That's how it is. Other people are trying to get you to care, and to
stop lying. You refuse. Pitty the kids, not you. You are a horrible example
for them, and I'm quite sure they have suffered as a result.