Vegan Outreach has a stellar starter kit.

Please do not let the word "vegan" in it scare you.

The information applies just as much to vegetarians as
vegans. Just add milk and eggs if that is what you are into.

Vegan Outreach will mail you a very nice printed copy for
free. You can also download a pdf version for free or read
it on the web for free.

The kit includes unique and thoughtful essays by
Vegan Outreach founder Matt Ball that will help you
make vegetarianism a rewarding and lasting committment.

It has a better recipe section than most starter kits that
I have seen. Best of all it also has an up to date,
complete, easy to understand, and brief nutrition section by
Jack Norris, a vegan Registered Dietician.

Assuming you have a solid reason for starting veg*nism
the two best things you can do to make your commitment to it
last is to learn good nutrition and to learn to cook a small
set of recipes you really like.

Here is the url:
http://www.veganoutreach.org/starterpack

Vegan Outreach also hosts a web site of health articles
for people on plant based diets:

http://www.veganhealth.org

Be careful of who you take nutrition advice from on the web.

There are a number of web mavens who sound as if they know what
they are talking about and they really don't.

Learn to ask people how they know what they know.

Animal Rights sites, even some of the more well known names are known for
giving out of date or incomplete information on vegetarian nutrition.

If you are interested in more information I have articles and
descriptions of books by well known, well respected, and well
credentialed authorities on my web site at:

http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdo...ealthyVeg.html

HTH


Steve

Be A Healthy Vegan Or Vegetarian
http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdo...ealthyVeg.html

Steve's Home Page
http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdom/

"The great American thought trap: It is not real
unless it can be seen on television or bought in a
shopping mall"

Steve wrote:

> Vegan Outreach has a stellar starter kit.
>
> Please do not let the word "vegan" in it scare you.
>
> The information applies just as much to vegetarians as
> vegans. Just add milk and eggs if that is what you are into.
>
> Vegan Outreach will mail you a very nice printed copy for
> free. You can also download a pdf version for free or read
> it on the web for free.
>
> The kit includes unique and thoughtful essays by
> Vegan Outreach founder Matt Ball that will help you
> make vegetarianism a rewarding and lasting committment.
>
> It has a better recipe section than most starter kits that
> I have seen. Best of all it also has an up to date,
> complete, easy to understand, and brief nutrition section by
> Jack Norris, a vegan Registered Dietician.
>
> Assuming you have a solid reason for starting veg*nism
> the two best things you can do to make your commitment to it
> last is to learn good nutrition and to learn to cook a small
> set of recipes you really like.
>
> Here is the url:
> http://www.veganoutreach.org/starterpack
>
> Vegan Outreach also hosts a web site of health articles
> for people on plant based diets:
>
> http://www.veganhealth.org
>
> Be careful of who you take nutrition advice from on the web.
>
> There are a number of web mavens who sound as if they know what
> they are talking about and they really don't.
>
> Learn to ask people how they know what they know.
>
> Animal Rights sites, even some of the more well known names are known for
> giving out of date or incomplete information on vegetarian nutrition.
>
> If you are interested in more information I have articles and
> descriptions of books by well known, well respected, and well
> credentialed authorities on my web site at:
>
> http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdo...ealthyVeg.html
>
> HTH
>
>
> Steve
>
> Be A Healthy Vegan Or Vegetarian
> http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdo...ealthyVeg.html
>
> Steve's Home Page
> http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdom/
>
> "The great American thought trap: It is not real
> unless it can be seen on television or bought in a
> shopping mall"
>
>

Yes, this place is the dangerous as their are horrible anti vegetarian
bigots that will try and abuse you.

On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 07:32:44 -0400, Steve > wrote:

[...]
>"The great American thought trap: It is not real
>unless it can be seen on television or bought in a
>shopping mall"

· Vegans contribute to the deaths of animals by their use of
wood and paper products, electricity, roads and all types of
buildings, their own diet, etc... just as everyone else does.
What they try to avoid are products which provide life
(and death) for farm animals, but even then they would have
to avoid the following in order to be successful:

Tires, Surgical sutures, Matches, Soaps, Photographic film,
Cosmetics, Shaving cream, Paints, Candles, Crayon/Chalk,
Toothpaste, Deodorants, Mouthwash, Paper, Upholstery,
Floor waxes, Glass, Water Filters, Rubber, Fertilizer,
Antifreeze, Ceramics, Insecticides, Insulation, Linoleum,
Plastic, Textiles, Blood factors, Collagen, Heparin, Insulin,
Pancreatin, Thrombin, Vasopressin, Vitamin B-12, Asphalt,
auto and jet lubricants, outboard engine oil, brake fluid,
contact-lens care products, glues, sunscreens and sunblocks,
dental floss, hairspray, inks, Solvents, Biodegradable
Detergents, Herbicides, Gelatin Capsules, Bandage Strips,
Combs and Toothbrushes, Emery Boards and Cloth, Adhesive Tape,
Laminated Wood Products, Plywood and Paneling, Wallpaper and
Wallpaper Paste, Cellophane Wrap and Tape, Adhesive Tape,
Abrasivesl, Steel Ball Bearings

The meat industry provides life for the animals that it
slaughters, and the animals live and die as a result of it
as animals do in other habitats. They also depend on it for
their lives as animals do in other habitats. If people consume
animal products from animals they think are raised in decent
ways, they will be promoting life for more such animals in the
future.
From the life and death of a thousand pound grass raised
steer and whatever he happens to kill during his life, people
get over 500 pounds of human consumable meat...that's well
over 500 servings of meat. From a grass raised dairy cow people
get thousands of dairy servings. Due to the influence of farm
machinery, and *icides, and in the case of rice the flooding and
draining of fields, one serving of soy or rice based product is
likely to involve more animal deaths than hundreds of servings
derived from grass raised animals. Grass raised animal products
contribute to fewer wildlife deaths, better wildlife habitat, and
better lives for livestock than soy or rice products. ·

On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 17:45:57 -0400, dh@. wrote:

>On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 07:32:44 -0400, Steve > wrote:
>
>[...]
>>"The great American thought trap: It is not real
>>unless it can be seen on television or bought in a
>>shopping mall"
>
> · Vegans

You've no grounds to voice any opinions here, you
animal abusing filth, at least not while you breed
animals to fight in pits for your sadistic pleasure.

There are some fine veg*n groups on yahoo.

Explore them.

On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 01:27:34 GMT, Beach Runner > wrote:

>
>There are some fine veg*n groups on yahoo.
>
>Explore them.

YOU explore them, you whiney, stupid ****, and then use
your good hand to explore your colitis.

Derek wrote:

> On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 01:27:34 GMT, Beach Runner > wrote:
>
>
>>There are some fine veg*n groups on yahoo.
>>
>>Explore them.
>
>
> YOU explore them, you whiney, stupid ****, and then use
> your good hand to explore your colitis.
At 50 I was running 15Ks and lifting weights and body building.
I have two kids, both lifetime vegetarians in their mid 20s.
One an outstanding athlete, the other still a varsity soccer player
and built great.


I was hit by a car, and am in recovery mode. But like I warned you,
the trolls will come.


Good look.

Beach Runner wrote:
> There are some fine veg*n groups on yahoo.

They're moderated by anal retentive pansies.

Beach Runner wrote:
>> YOU explore them, you whiney, stupid ****, and then use your good hand
>> to explore your colitis.
>
> At 50 I was running 15Ks and lifting weights and body building.

So the **** what.

> I have two kids,

They're not yours.

usual suspect > wrote:

> Beach Runner wrote:
> > There are some fine veg*n groups on yahoo.
>
> They're moderated by anal retentive pansies.

You're moderating vegan groups on Yahoo! then?

equinox wrote:
> usual suspect > wrote:
>
>
>>Beach Runner wrote:
>>
>>>There are some fine veg*n groups on yahoo.
>>
>>They're moderated by anal retentive pansies.
>
>
> You're moderating vegan groups on Yahoo! then?


I won't get personal. The point is they stick to the subject and don't
allow personal attacks. Generally they allow reasonable discussions
even if there are differences of opinions.

However, there are moderated groups where the power has gone into an
individuals hands and abuse that power. I've seen no evidence of anal
retentive groups. Does any such evidence exist.