Vegan (alt.food.vegan) This newsgroup exists to share ideas and issues of concern among vegans. We are always happy to share our recipes- perhaps especially with omnivores who are simply curious- or even better, accomodating a vegan guest for a meal!

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
hugod
 
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this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new zealand...

i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste for the foods
that are now staple. i went vegetarian on the 25 of may and made a complete
conversion about this time last month. it is really bringing out the chef
in me, and i love spicy foods. i am much like a gumbo chef, where
everything just goes in the pot (I use a rice cooker). this week i have
been into cabbage, broc, cauli, tofu and chickpea masala with brown rice, i
tell ya, it was so hot it brought tears to my nose.

i have alot more energy at times, but still have an inner ear condition i
hope will clear up.

people think it is amazing that i can live this lifestyle, they think its
hard, but its not really. they admit to the benefits but are unwilling to
break away from their love of meat.


  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
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hugod wrote:
> this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new zealand...
>
> i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste for the foods
> that are now staple. i went vegetarian on the 25 of may and made a complete
> conversion about this time last month. it is really bringing out the chef
> in me, and i love spicy foods. i am much like a gumbo chef, where
> everything just goes in the pot (I use a rice cooker). this week i have
> been into cabbage, broc, cauli, tofu and chickpea masala with brown rice, i
> tell ya, it was so hot it brought tears to my nose.
>
> i have alot more energy at times, but still have an inner ear condition i
> hope will clear up.
>
> people think it is amazing that i can live this lifestyle, they think its
> hard, but its not really. they admit to the benefits but are unwilling to
> break away from their love of meat.
>
>

Congratulations. Don't forget to get your B12 levels checked annually,
vegetarian or not.

Avoid empty calories, fried foods, and eat lots of leafy greens and
fruits. Organic produce has less residual pesticides, but clean it
carefully anyway. Avoid sugar, white flower, and junk foods.

There are some nasty people in this group. Try to ignore them.

Other's will engage in reasonable discussion on how to be a healthy
vegetarian. It's also better for the environment.
  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
rick
 
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Default


"Beach Runner" > wrote in message
. ..
>
>
> hugod wrote:
>> this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new
>> zealand...
>>
>> i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste
>> for the foods that are now staple. i went vegetarian on the
>> 25 of may and made a complete conversion about this time last
>> month. it is really bringing out the chef in me, and i love
>> spicy foods. i am much like a gumbo chef, where everything
>> just goes in the pot (I use a rice cooker). this week i have
>> been into cabbage, broc, cauli, tofu and chickpea masala with
>> brown rice, i tell ya, it was so hot it brought tears to my
>> nose.
>>
>> i have alot more energy at times, but still have an inner ear
>> condition i hope will clear up.
>>
>> people think it is amazing that i can live this lifestyle,
>> they think its hard, but its not really. they admit to the
>> benefits but are unwilling to break away from their love of
>> meat.

> Congratulations. Don't forget to get your B12 levels checked
> annually, vegetarian or not.
>
> Avoid empty calories, fried foods, and eat lots of leafy greens
> and fruits. Organic produce has less residual pesticides, but
> clean it carefully anyway. Avoid sugar, white flower, and junk
> foods.
>
> There are some nasty people in this group. Try to ignore them.
>
> Other's will engage in reasonable discussion on how to be a
> healthy vegetarian. It's also better for the environment.

====================
Still continuing that ly, killer? Back it up fool. Show us your
calculations that back up the spew you make about water useage.
Can't even bring yourself to try, can you? Yes, there are nasty
people here. They are vegan propagandists that don't have a clue
as to what they really say, and can't say anything if it hasn't
already been written down for them somewhere else. Like you, and
your continued spew about being vegan automatially means it's
better or the environment. Hardly the case, killer.




  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve
 
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hugod wrote:
> this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new zealand...
>
> i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste for the foods
> that are now staple. i went vegetarian on the 25 of may and made a complete
> conversion about this time last month. it is really bringing out the chef
> in me, and i love spicy foods. i am much like a gumbo chef, where
> everything just goes in the pot (I use a rice cooker). this week i have
> been into cabbage, broc, cauli, tofu and chickpea masala with brown rice, i
> tell ya, it was so hot it brought tears to my nose.
>
> i have alot more energy at times, but still have an inner ear condition i
> hope will clear up.
>
> people think it is amazing that i can live this lifestyle, they think its
> hard, but its not really. they admit to the benefits but are unwilling to
> break away from their love of meat.
>
>


Congratulations!

You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n, but some ( about 1
pages worth ).

I highly reccommend you check out the articles at:
http://www.veganhealth.org

The link in my sig is good too.

Again, congratulations and good luck!


--

Steve

Be A Healthy Vegan Or Vegetarian
http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdo...ealthyVeg.html

Steve's Home Page
http://www.geocities.com/beforewisdom/

"The great American thought trap: It is not real
unless it can be seen on television or bought in a
shopping mall"


  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
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hugod testified:
> this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new zealand...
>
> i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste for the foods
> that are now staple.


Interesting. I hope the nitwit John Coleman is reading this so he can
take you to task for having to develop a taste for your new austere diet
since he believes it's the other way around.

> i went vegetarian on the 25 of may and made a complete
> conversion about this time last month.


Conversion is apropos: veganism is a religion.

> it is really bringing out the chef in me,


Oh, I doubt that.

> and i love spicy foods. i am much like a gumbo chef, where
> everything just goes in the pot (I use a rice cooker). this week i have
> been into cabbage, broc, cauli, tofu and chickpea masala with brown rice, i
> tell ya, it was so hot it brought tears to my nose.
>
> i have alot more energy at times,


You mean like after you've gotten enough rest after engaging in suitable
daily activities (e.g., mental and physical exercise, breathing clean
air, drinking plenty of water, etc.)?

> but still have an inner ear condition i
> hope will clear up.


Tofu and chickpeas aren't known for curative powers. I suggest you seek
a physician for that.

> people think it is amazing that i can live this lifestyle,


Why is it a lifestyle rather than a diet? What else does this ascetic
approach to eating encompass to make it a lifestyle?

> they think its hard,


It can be a form (or part) of asceticism. Most people enjoy meat.
There's no reason why they should shun it completely if they enjoy it.

> but its not really. they admit to the benefits but are unwilling to
> break away from their love of meat.


What benefits? The fact that they "love" meat should give you some idea
that your attempts to proselytize them will be either futile or
difficult. Why do you feel so compelled to get others to live by the
"light" you've chosen for yourself? Take my advice: most people resent
religious zealots. Make sure you aren't one, and don't let yourself
become one.


  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
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Default

Beach Runner wrote:
<...>
> There are some nasty people in this group.


One such example:

You deserve a punch in the face.
Beach Runner, 23 July 2005

You need to take an anger management class, ass wipe.
  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Steve wrote:
<...>
> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n


Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
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usual suspect wrote:

> Beach Runner wrote:
> <...>
>
>> There are some nasty people in this group.

>
>
> One such example:

Taken way out of context, after accusing a family member for being a
sexually confused.

> You deserve a punch in the face.
> Beach Runner, 23 July 2005
>
> You need to take an anger management class, ass wipe.


I write nice things to her. Let her judge.
  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
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Default

Steve gave a sit.
As usual Usual Suspects insulted him without going to the web site.


The basics are eat well rounded foods.

Fruit first, as it digests much faster than grains or veggies.

Avoid highly processed foods.
Don't eat food high in sugar or fat.
Make sure you eat a variety of legumes. Buckwheat has more protein than
beef.
Don't eat fried foods.
Eat organic when possible, Consumer Reports show they have a much lower
incidence of residual pesticides. Wash them well any way.

Some vitamins are fat soluble. A half an avocado a day is a great
strategy and has great lipid profiles.

Check B12 annually.


Follow Steve's recommendation on web sites.

Unusual suspects insults every veg*n. Ignore him or kill file him.

It will completely avoid saturated fats.

I have been a vegetarian over 30 years. My blood tests and health are
generally excellent. Before a car accident I could run 15 K races at 7
minute miles and do 15 pull ups. I'm no lightweight. This is as an
AARP member. My 23 year old son is a lifetime vegetarian and my 26 year
old is also a lifetime vegetarian. Before a car accident he set the
school records in various sport events of speed and strength ( a 6' tall
young man). Usual suspects lies.

You are doing a great thing.



usual suspect wrote:

> Steve wrote:
> <...>
>
>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n

>
>
> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.


Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
rick
 
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Default


"Beach Runner" > wrote in message
...
> Steve gave a sit.
> As usual Usual Suspects insulted him without going to the web
> site.
>
>
> The basics are eat well rounded foods.
>
> Fruit first, as it digests much faster than grains or veggies.
>
> Avoid highly processed foods.
> Don't eat food high in sugar or fat.
> Make sure you eat a variety of legumes. Buckwheat has more
> protein than
> beef.
> Don't eat fried foods.
> Eat organic when possible, Consumer Reports show they have a
> much lower incidence of residual pesticides. Wash them well
> any way.
>
> Some vitamins are fat soluble. A half an avocado a day is a
> great strategy and has great lipid profiles.
>
> Check B12 annually.
>
>
> Follow Steve's recommendation on web sites.
>
> Unusual suspects insults every veg*n. Ignore him or kill file
> him.
>
> It will completely avoid saturated fats.
>
> I have been a vegetarian over 30 years. My blood tests and
> health are generally excellent. Before a car accident I could
> run 15 K races at 7 minute miles and do 15 pull ups. I'm no
> lightweight. This is as an AARP member. My 23 year old son is
> a lifetime vegetarian and my 26 year old is also a lifetime
> vegetarian. Before a car accident he set the school records in
> various sport events of speed and strength ( a 6' tall young
> man). Usual suspects lies.
>
> You are doing a great thing.
>
>
>
> usual suspect wrote:
>
>> Steve wrote:
>> <...>
>>
>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n

>>
>>
>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go
>> anorexic or bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.

>
> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.

====================
Veganism is not a diet, killer. It IS a disorder masked as a
religion. O course, amny religion seem to be disorders
themselves, so you fit right in, hypocrite.


btw, where's your water calculations? Araid to admit you were
wrong, as usual?





  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
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Bumbling Twit wrote:
>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n

>>
>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.

>
> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.


Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one, numb nuts:

www.orthorexia.com

See also:
http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default



usual suspect wrote:
> Bumbling Twit wrote:
>
>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>
>>>
>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.

>>
>>
>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.

>
>
> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one, numb
> nuts:
>
> www.orthorexia.com
>
> See also:
> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
>

Anyone who calls vegan an eating disorder in the vegan group is like
spreading fire in a crowded circus.
  #13 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
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Default



Beach Runner wrote:

>
>
> usual suspect wrote:
>
>> Bumbling Twit wrote:
>>
>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
>>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.

>>
>>
>>
>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one, numb
>> nuts:
>>
>> www.orthorexia.com


He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism
>>
>> See also:
>> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m

"Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
eating disorder," Morand said. This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a vegetarian
lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling with
food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating behaviours.

He does not call it a eating disorder.
There are plenty of healthy vegans.
There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart desease.
In that sense, meat eating is a disease. I'm not saying it is, but you
made that claim.





>
> Anyone who calls vegan an eating disorder in the vegan group is like
> spreading fire in a crowded circus.

  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
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Default



usual suspect wrote:

> hugod testified:
>
>> this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new zealand...
>>
>> i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste for the
>> foods that are now staple.

>
>
> Interesting. I hope the nitwit John Coleman is reading this so he can
> take you to task for having to develop a taste for your new austere diet
> since he believes it's the other way around.
>
>> i went vegetarian on the 25 of may and made a complete conversion
>> about this time last month.

>
>
> Conversion is apropos: veganism is a religion.


Only in that it shows concern for other life forms. That's like calling
environmentalism a disease. It is concern for the planet.


>
>> it is really bringing out the chef in me,

>
>
> Oh, I doubt that.
>
>> and i love spicy foods. i am much like a gumbo chef, where everything
>> just goes in the pot (I use a rice cooker). this week i have been
>> into cabbage, broc, cauli, tofu and chickpea masala with brown rice, i
>> tell ya, it was so hot it brought tears to my nose.
>>
>> i have alot more energy at times,

>
>
> You mean like after you've gotten enough rest after engaging in suitable
> daily activities (e.g., mental and physical exercise, breathing clean
> air, drinking plenty of water, etc.)?
>
>> but still have an inner ear condition i hope will clear up.

>
>
> Tofu and chickpeas aren't known for curative powers. I suggest you seek
> a physician for that.
>
>> people think it is amazing that i can live this lifestyle,

>
>
> Why is it a lifestyle rather than a diet? What else does this ascetic
> approach to eating encompass to make it a lifestyle?
>
>> they think its hard,

>
>
> It can be a form (or part) of asceticism. Most people enjoy meat.
> There's no reason why they should shun it completely if they enjoy it.
>
>> but its not really. they admit to the benefits but are unwilling to
>> break away from their love of meat.

>
>
> What benefits? The fact that they "love" meat should give you some idea
> that your attempts to proselytize them will be either futile or
> difficult. Why do you feel so compelled to get others to live by the
> "light" you've chosen for yourself? Take my advice: most people resent
> religious zealots. Make sure you aren't one, and don't let yourself
> become one.

  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Bumbling Twit wrote:
>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>
>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
>>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>
>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.

>>
>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one, numb
>> nuts:
>>
>> www.orthorexia.com
>>
>> See also:
>> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m

>
> Anyone who calls vegan an eating disorder


It is.

> in the vegan group


It's true in the vegan group, it's true outside the vegan group. That's
the nature of truth, nitwit.

> is like spreading fire in a crowded circus.


Non sequitur.


  #16 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
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Default

Bumbling Twit can't figure out how to read a thread so he replied to
himself:
>>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>>
>>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or


>>>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>>
>>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
>>>
>>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
>>> numb nuts:
>>>
>>> www.orthorexia.com

>
> He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism


It’s great to eat healthy food, and most of us could benefit by
paying a little more attention to what we eat. However, some
people have the opposite problem: they take the concept of
healthy eating to such an extreme that it becomes an obsession.
I call this state of mind orthorexia nervosa: literally,
"fixation on righteous eating."
http://www.orthorexia.com/index.php?page=katef

He continues on that page with a series of questions, nearly all of
which are apropos to veganism:

Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat, and not think
about whether it’s good for you? Has your diet made you
socially isolated? Is it impossible to imagine going through a
whole day without paying attention to your diet, and just living
and loving? Does it sound beyond your ability to eat a meal
prepared with love by your mother – one single meal – and not
try to control what she serves you? Do you have trouble
remembering that love, and joy, and play and creativity are more
important than food?

Consider the question asked in the "party ideas" thread, and one of the
replies to me in it. Ordinary people don't have a dilemma when it comes
to having a party. They provide a variety of foods which should appeal
to most people. Here we have a vegan who insists others adopt her eating
habit (disorder) when visiting her new home or apartment. It's nothing
at all like someone who doesn't like a particular kind of food, it's a
blanket objection to entire groups of food most people in our society
don't find objectionable.

I politely stated that I cater to my guests' tastes rather than my own
in situations like that. There are certain foods which I don't like, but
I know my guests do. *I*'m entertaining *them*. They wouldn't be
entertained by off-putting statements about my likes or dislikes, nor
should they be subjected to disapproval of their own choices of food (or
drink; I provide alcohol at most of my parties and gatherings, but I
don't drink).

The reply from Ron was typical of the vegan eating disorder: "So you go
out and slaughter a steer just to appease the blood hunger of your guests?"

Mentally disturbed people like Ron believe they should subject guests in
their homes to irrational lectures about veganism. Not only do they
forbid themselves of certain foods, they deny it to others and impugn
them incessantly for even wanting it.

They have disorders their pursuit is so extreme that they, and those
around them (e.g., party guests), don't enjoy themselves. They're too
busy trying to avoid micrograms of animal parts that enjoyment is
completely lost.

>>> See also:
>>> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m

>
> "Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
> that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
> eating disorder," Morand said.


Correct.

> This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
> cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a vegetarian
> lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling with
> food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating behaviours.
>
> He does not call it a eating disorder.


Dr Bratman does.

> There are plenty of healthy vegans.


Irrelevant to the issue at hand. Veganism is an eating disorder.

> There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart desease.


Vegans die of cancer and heart disease, too, dummy.

<...>
  #17 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Beach Runner wrote:
>>> this is my story... i am 20 years old and live in new zealand...
>>>
>>> i had been gradually phasing out meat and developing a taste for the
>>> foods that are now staple.

>>
>> Interesting. I hope the nitwit John Coleman is reading this so he can
>> take you to task for having to develop a taste for your new austere
>> diet since he believes it's the other way around.
>>
>>> i went vegetarian on the 25 of may and made a complete conversion
>>> about this time last month.

>>
>> Conversion is apropos: veganism is a religion.

>
> Only in that it shows concern for other life forms.


No, in its blind, rigid adherence to dogma. You have your rules about
what can and can't be eaten, and then your phony claims that you're
saving animals simply by not eating them. That's completely false. You
only don't eat cattle, pigs, chickens, etc. You still contribute to many
animal deaths and injuries from the agricultural practices required to
grow your grains, legumes, and produce.
  #18 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
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Default

"usual suspect" > wrote in message
.. .
> Bumbling Twit can't figure out how to read a thread so he replied to
> himself:
> >>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or

>
> >>>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
> >>>>
> >>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
> >>>
> >>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
> >>> numb nuts:
> >>>
> >>> www.orthorexia.com

> >
> > He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism

>
> It’s great to eat healthy food, and most of us could benefit by
> paying a little more attention to what we eat. However, some
> people have the opposite problem: they take the concept of
> healthy eating to such an extreme that it becomes an obsession.
> I call this state of mind orthorexia nervosa: literally,
> "fixation on righteous eating."
> http://www.orthorexia.com/index.php?page=katef
>
> He continues on that page with a series of questions, nearly all of
> which are apropos to veganism:
>
> Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat, and not think
> about whether it’s good for you? Has your diet made you
> socially isolated? Is it impossible to imagine going through a
> whole day without paying attention to your diet, and just living
> and loving? Does it sound beyond your ability to eat a meal
> prepared with love by your mother – one single meal – and not
> try to control what she serves you? Do you have trouble
> remembering that love, and joy, and play and creativity are more
> important than food?


What the above describes is
simply the situation of someone
who is the only vegan for miles
around. Of course they are
going to feel out of place and
awkward when having to deal
with what others try to insist on
feeding them. That's only part
of the above though. This bull
about love, joy, etc. makes it
sound like automatically a
person is doing something
wrong if they don't give them
priority over their food, as
though all can't exist at the
same level of priority as each
other. It makes it sound like
there is something wrong
with anyone who pays a lot of
attention to their diet.

> Consider the question asked in the "party ideas" thread, and one of the
> replies to me in it. Ordinary people don't have a dilemma when it comes
> to having a party. They provide a variety of foods which should appeal
> to most people. Here we have a vegan who insists others adopt her eating
> habit (disorder) when visiting her new home or apartment. It's nothing
> at all like someone who doesn't like a particular kind of food, it's a
> blanket objection to entire groups of food most people in our society
> don't find objectionable.


If a vegan is holding a party
that you are attending, of course
you should expect to be served
vegan food. Just as when you
go to a meat eater's party, you
should expect that if you're
vegan, you might or might not
find stuff to eat (eat a bit before
going out just in case).

> I politely stated that I cater to my guests' tastes rather than my own
> in situations like that. There are certain foods which I don't like, but
> I know my guests do. *I*'m entertaining *them*. They wouldn't be
> entertained by off-putting statements about my likes or dislikes, nor
> should they be subjected to disapproval of their own choices of food (or
> drink; I provide alcohol at most of my parties and gatherings, but I
> don't drink).


You need meat and booze to
lure people to your parties.
Considering your personality,
I'm not surprised.

> The reply from Ron was typical of the vegan eating disorder: "So you go
> out and slaughter a steer just to appease the blood hunger of your

guests?"
>
> Mentally disturbed people like Ron believe they should subject guests in
> their homes to irrational lectures about veganism. Not only do they
> forbid themselves of certain foods, they deny it to others and impugn
> them incessantly for even wanting it.


Who said anything about lecturing
guests?

> They have disorders their pursuit is so extreme that they, and those
> around them (e.g., party guests), don't enjoy themselves. They're too
> busy trying to avoid micrograms of animal parts that enjoyment is
> completely lost.


And you know this because.....
how many vegan parties have
you attended?

> >>> See also:
> >>>

http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
> >
> > "Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
> > that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
> > eating disorder," Morand said.

>
> Correct.
>
> > This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
> > cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a vegetarian
> > lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling with
> > food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating

behaviours.
> >
> > He does not call it a eating disorder.

>
> Dr Bratman does.
>
> > There are plenty of healthy vegans.

>
> Irrelevant to the issue at hand. Veganism is an eating disorder.


According to the questions you
quoted near the top of this page,
if a vegan is still feeling love and
joy etc. in her/his life, then they
don't have this (non medically
accepted) disease.

> > There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart desease.

>
> Vegans die of cancer and heart disease, too, dummy.


Not as much. You know that too.
The reason you used to eat
vegan was for health and
aesthetics. Even now you only
have a little fish infrequently.
The rest is vegan food you eat.


--
SN
http://www.scentednectar.com/veg/



  #19 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default

You said he called it an eating disorder. He did not. He said that
people with eating disorders can hide behind a vegan diet. A far cry.

And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
term "Kosher"? Are they sick too? They pay special attention to their
food.

What about Italian cooks who delight in their foods? Are they also sick?




Scented Nectar wrote:

> "usual suspect" > wrote in message
> .. .
>
>>Bumbling Twit can't figure out how to read a thread so he replied to
>>himself:
>>
>>>>>>>>You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or

>>
>>>>>>>bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
>>>>>
>>>>>Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
>>>>>numb nuts:
>>>>>
>>>>>www.orthorexia.com
>>>
>>>He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism

>>
>>It’s great to eat healthy food, and most of us could benefit by
>>paying a little more attention to what we eat. However, some
>>people have the opposite problem: they take the concept of
>>healthy eating to such an extreme that it becomes an obsession.
>>I call this state of mind orthorexia nervosa: literally,
>>"fixation on righteous eating."
>>http://www.orthorexia.com/index.php?page=katef
>>
>>He continues on that page with a series of questions, nearly all of
>>which are apropos to veganism:
>>
>>Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat, and not think
>>about whether it’s good for you? Has your diet made you
>>socially isolated? Is it impossible to imagine going through a
>>whole day without paying attention to your diet, and just living
>>and loving? Does it sound beyond your ability to eat a meal
>>prepared with love by your mother – one single meal – and not
>>try to control what she serves you? Do you have trouble
>>remembering that love, and joy, and play and creativity are more
>>important than food?

>
>
> What the above describes is
> simply the situation of someone
> who is the only vegan for miles
> around. Of course they are
> going to feel out of place and
> awkward when having to deal
> with what others try to insist on
> feeding them. That's only part
> of the above though. This bull
> about love, joy, etc. makes it
> sound like automatically a
> person is doing something
> wrong if they don't give them
> priority over their food, as
> though all can't exist at the
> same level of priority as each
> other. It makes it sound like
> there is something wrong
> with anyone who pays a lot of
> attention to their diet.
>
>
>>Consider the question asked in the "party ideas" thread, and one of the
>>replies to me in it. Ordinary people don't have a dilemma when it comes
>>to having a party. They provide a variety of foods which should appeal
>>to most people. Here we have a vegan who insists others adopt her eating
>>habit (disorder) when visiting her new home or apartment. It's nothing
>>at all like someone who doesn't like a particular kind of food, it's a
>>blanket objection to entire groups of food most people in our society
>>don't find objectionable.

>
>
> If a vegan is holding a party
> that you are attending, of course
> you should expect to be served
> vegan food. Just as when you
> go to a meat eater's party, you
> should expect that if you're
> vegan, you might or might not
> find stuff to eat (eat a bit before
> going out just in case).
>
>
>>I politely stated that I cater to my guests' tastes rather than my own
>>in situations like that. There are certain foods which I don't like, but
>>I know my guests do. *I*'m entertaining *them*. They wouldn't be
>>entertained by off-putting statements about my likes or dislikes, nor
>>should they be subjected to disapproval of their own choices of food (or
>>drink; I provide alcohol at most of my parties and gatherings, but I
>>don't drink).

>
>
> You need meat and booze to
> lure people to your parties.
> Considering your personality,
> I'm not surprised.
>
>
>>The reply from Ron was typical of the vegan eating disorder: "So you go
>>out and slaughter a steer just to appease the blood hunger of your

>
> guests?"
>
>>Mentally disturbed people like Ron believe they should subject guests in
>>their homes to irrational lectures about veganism. Not only do they
>>forbid themselves of certain foods, they deny it to others and impugn
>>them incessantly for even wanting it.

>
>
> Who said anything about lecturing
> guests?
>
>
>>They have disorders their pursuit is so extreme that they, and those
>>around them (e.g., party guests), don't enjoy themselves. They're too
>>busy trying to avoid micrograms of animal parts that enjoyment is
>>completely lost.

>
>
> And you know this because.....
> how many vegan parties have
> you attended?
>
>
>>>>>See also:
>>>>>

>
> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
>
>>>"Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
>>>that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
>>>eating disorder," Morand said.

>>
>>Correct.
>>
>>
>>>This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
>>>cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a vegetarian
>>>lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling with
>>>food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating

>
> behaviours.
>
>>>He does not call it a eating disorder.

>>
>>Dr Bratman does.
>>
>>
>>>There are plenty of healthy vegans.

>>
>>Irrelevant to the issue at hand. Veganism is an eating disorder.

>
>
> According to the questions you
> quoted near the top of this page,
> if a vegan is still feeling love and
> joy etc. in her/his life, then they
> don't have this (non medically
> accepted) disease.
>
>
>>>There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart desease.

>>
>>Vegans die of cancer and heart disease, too, dummy.

>
>
> Not as much. You know that too.
> The reason you used to eat
> vegan was for health and
> aesthetics. Even now you only
> have a little fish infrequently.
> The rest is vegan food you eat.
>
>

  #20 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default



usual suspect wrote:

> Bumbling Twit wrote:
>
>>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
>>>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
>>>
>>>
>>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
>>> numb nuts:
>>>
>>> www.orthorexia.com
>>>
>>> See also:
>>> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m

>>
>>
>>
>> Anyone who calls vegan an eating disorder

>
>
> It is.
>
>> in the vegan group

>
>
> It's true in the vegan group, it's true outside the vegan group. That's
> the nature of truth, nitwit.
>
>> is like spreading fire in a crowded circus.

>


Here's the liar's site

The CEDRIC Centre. Community eating disorder and related issues
counselling.


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* Newsletter

Vegetarianism or Politically Correct Eating Disorder?

Written by Brooke Finnigan for The National Eating Disorder Information
Bulletin

Whether vegetarian for health, religion or for ethics, research exists
about the benefits of a plant based diet. Recent research also shows
that a growing number of people, especially women in their late teens,
are adopting vegetarian and vegan diets in order to lose weight,
maintain low body weight, and mask restrictive eating patterns.

A study from the University of Minnesota found teen vegetarians are more
likely to have eating disorders than non-vegetarians. In this study,
vegetarians were more likely to contemplate and attempt suicide, and
vegetarian males were noted as an especially high risk group for
unhealthy weight control practices. The research indicated that teens
who were already susceptible to emotional difficulties were drawn to
vegetarianism as a means to lose weight and fit in, but that
vegetarianism itself had no correlation with emotional difficulties.

In a nother study, conducted at California State University-Northridge,
researchers found college women who claimed to be vegetarians had a
significantly greater risk of developing eating disorders than their
meat-eating peers. The overlap between eating disorders and
vegetarianism occurs because vegetarianism is a way for men and women to
openly control their food choices, without attracting negative attention
to their behaviour. Also, many believe that restricting meat from a diet
will lead to weight loss, believes Michelle Morand, founder of The
CEDRIC Centre, an eating disorder counselling centre in Victoria, B.C.

"Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
eating disorder," Morand said. This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a vegetarian
lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling with
food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating behaviours.

Carol Tickner, R.D. Nutrition Therapist with the Eating Disorders
Program in the Capital Region cites two possibilities for the increase
in popularity of vegetarianism. " Vegetarianism has been promoted as a
healthy way of managing weight. With weight being such a focus in our
society, it makes sense to some as a way of managing weight, and health,
at the same time," she says. "For those teenagers who have disordered
eating tendencies, becoming vegetarian can be a way of trying to respond
to a changing body, (weight gain due to puberty), in a healthy way, vs.
dieting like their friends." However, this is just dieting for
weight-loss in another form.

In many ways, beliefs about animal protein in diets versus plant-only
diets are similar to the messages we hear about physical appearance in
North American culture. In both cases, we are given conflicting
messages. In one breath we're admonished not to judge a book by its
cover, and in the next, we can never be too rich or too thin . In a
similar vein, we say one thing about the humane treatment of animals,
and treat our pets as mini-humans, but frequently farm animals for food
under dreadful conditions. This cultural hypocrisy is increasingly in
the media with stories of unsanitary conditions and contamination of
foods. And, at this stage in their lives, young adults are acutely aware
of societal doubletalk.

"Teenagers are searching for meaning and a way of being in the world
that expresses their individuality. This is exactly what they are meant
to do at this stage in development." says Morand. "They're in the
process of individuation, separating from their parents, developing and
testing their own value systems, and learning about who they are. By
choosing a plant-based diet, they're choosing to exist on the planet in
a different way than most of their parents' generation. For many
teenagers, becoming a vegetarian may be the first informed, adult
decision they make."
Why Go Veggie?

Vegeterian diets can r educe risk from certain cancers by up to 40%,
decrease the possibility of heart disease by over 30%, and lower high
blood pressure, and cholesterol levels.

A plant-based diet can also be environmentally friendly. By eating a
diet rich in fruits and vegetables, less packaging and processing is
needed. On the other hand, as popularity for vegetarian diets increases,
more packaged foods are available to supplement and complement the
traditional vegetarian diet, which means more waste from packaging.

Some religions advocate a vegetarian lifestyle. Some people choose a
vegetarian diet over an omnivorous one out of ethical concerns for
animals. Many vegetarians are concerned about the wide spread usage of
factory farming, growth hormones, and abuse of animals designated for
human consumption. It is also cheaper to consume a vegetarian diet than
to include animal products in one's shopping basket.

" There is an increased societal awareness about where our food comes
from and more people taking an interest in how animals are treated. This
was especially brought to the forefront last year with mad cow disease
and the chicken flu," says Tickner.

In addition to eschewing meat and animal by-products in their diets, a
large number of vegetarians purchase animal friendly cosmetics, and
cleaning products that haven't been tested on animals, as well as
alternative sources for leather, silk and wool products.
The Incredible Lightness of Being Vegetarian

Adherents of a vegetarian lifestyle have always touted the health
benefits, and in recent years, as coverage of the obesity crisis
continues to influence public policy, some organizations have linked a
plant based diet with slenderness. Given our cultural preference and
pressure around thinness, (which is seen as an indication of a person's
worthiness in North American culture), it seems inevitable that
vegetarianism would be adopted as yet another tool in the quest for
weight loss.

In his book, The Obesity Myth , author Paul Campos argues that we use
body weight as an indication of "moral fitness". Culturally, we idealize
people who have managed to sublimate their appetites and become, or
remain, slender. In this puritanical atmosphere, fatness isn't just a
body type description, but an alleged indication of how a person really
is: undisciplined, stupid, and unworthy. Fatness is one of the last
socially sanctioned forms of discrimination in our culture, and avoiding
fatness is often used as an added allure to becoming vegetarian.

On vegetarian websites, in magazines and books, weight loss is often
included as a benefit of switching to a plant based diet.

PETA, (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals), in particular,
correlates a vegetarian diet with being thin. Recent advertising
campaigns have included "jokes" about fat passengers needing two airline
seats as a reason to go vegetarian,and equating letting children eat
meat to child abuse.

While PETA is notorious for its overstated style of linking health, body
weight, and vegetarianism, most other groups are subtler. But the
connection between health and weight continues to thrive in the minds of
many people. In fact, for many, health and thinness are synonymous.

The reality is, it's possible to be a healthy, happy person, at any
size, vegetarian or not. And creating false categories for health based
on body size is one way in which the health and weight loss industry
overlap, and, reap sizable profits.

A person's weight will tend to fall into a certain range that the body
is happiest and healthiest at, called our "set point" or "natural"
weight, and will tend to want to return to this weight range despite
strict calorie restriction or excessive exercise. Many other factors
affect a person weight, not only the type of food they eat, but the
quantity of food they eat, the amount of activity they get, and their
genetics.

A healthy vegetarian, Carol Tickner explains, is someone who "t akes the
time to ensure that they are getting all the nutrients their body needs.
This person would be eating vegetarian sources of protein at all meals
and making sure they find alternate sources of protein, which is
required to maintain a healthy metabolism, repair and build new tissue,
and boost immunity, calcium, iron, zinc, and Vitamin D & B12 as well as
omega-3 fatty acids."

Morand adds, "To me, a healthy vegetarian is someone at peace with their
decision to avoid animal products, and is committed to enjoying foods
that nurture their bodies and spirits. A healthy person is someone who
has energy, listens to his or her body, and feeds it accordingly."
Feeding the soul

Morand has worked with many young women over the years who have used
vegetarianism to cloak an eating disorder. "Typically, they don't want
to worry people in their lives, and saying they can't eat something
because of their moral commitment to vegetarianism is a safe way to
avoid conflict or suspicion, especially since many people aren't
educated on the topic."

"Some are in denial about their behavior, or if they have just begun
down the path of disordered eating, they are still in that period where
they believe they are "benefiting" from the behavior. They may be
getting positive attention and reinforcement from their family and peers
for their commitment and/or weight loss." In any case, Morand continues,
"it's important to remember that the eating disorder, whether masked by
vegetarianism or not, is a coping mechanism, and the person struggling
has adopted it to camouflage other, more painful issues in their lives.
They aren't lying or manipulating, they're just trying to cope in the
best way they know how."

It isn't necessary to give up vegetarianism in order to recover from an
eating disorder. However, an honest exploration of the motivations
behind the choice to cut animal products from one's diet is fundamental
to the recovery process. If someone is truly dedicated to a vegan or
vegetarian lifestyle for ethical reasons, then he/she has to be true to
themselves and honor their decision. But, if the original impetus was
weight loss or gaining a sense of control over their relationship with
food, the greatest gift that they can give to themselves is to
authentically explore what may be currently taking place in their lives,
or what may have occurred in the past, to lead them to feel that they
lack control to the extent that they are seeking it in their
relationship with food. Then they are in a position to solve the real
problem, and no longer expend their energy trying to control the symptom.



* Neumark-Sztainer D., et al. Adolescent vegetarians : a behavioral
profile of a school-based population in Minnesota . Archives of
Pediatrics and Adolescent Medicine 1997 Aug; 151(8): 833-838.
* Klop, Sheree, et al Self-reported vegetarianism may be a marker
for college women at risk for disordered eating, Archives of Journal of
American Dietetic Association , 2003, June, 103:745-747
* http://www.vegsoc.org/health/

It hardly calls vegetarianism an eating disorder, but can be used to
hide one.
>
> Non sequitur.



  #21 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Beach Runner" > wrote in message
. ..
> You said he called it an eating disorder. He did not. He said that
> people with eating disorders can hide behind a vegan diet. A far cry.


You're right. The thing is though,
he thinks that all vegans have it.
His quotes don't word it that way,
but Usual has made it very clear
that he considers all vegans to
be 'orthorexic'.

> And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
> term "Kosher"? Are they sick too? They pay special attention to their
> food.
>
> What about Italian cooks who delight in their foods? Are they also sick?


Usual himself has bragged about
being a good cook and therefore
must enjoy it. Maybe he's sick.

>
> Scented Nectar wrote:
>
> > "usual suspect" > wrote in message
> > .. .
> >
> >>Bumbling Twit can't figure out how to read a thread so he replied to
> >>himself:
> >>
> >>>>>>>>You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
> >>
> >>>>>>>bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
> >>>>>numb nuts:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>www.orthorexia.com
> >>>
> >>>He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism
> >>
> >>It’s great to eat healthy food, and most of us could benefit by
> >>paying a little more attention to what we eat. However, some
> >>people have the opposite problem: they take the concept of
> >>healthy eating to such an extreme that it becomes an obsession.
> >>I call this state of mind orthorexia nervosa: literally,
> >>"fixation on righteous eating."
> >>http://www.orthorexia.com/index.php?page=katef
> >>
> >>He continues on that page with a series of questions, nearly all of
> >>which are apropos to veganism:
> >>
> >>Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat, and not think
> >>about whether it’s good for you? Has your diet made you
> >>socially isolated? Is it impossible to imagine going through a
> >>whole day without paying attention to your diet, and just living
> >>and loving? Does it sound beyond your ability to eat a meal
> >>prepared with love by your mother – one single meal – and not
> >>try to control what she serves you? Do you have trouble
> >>remembering that love, and joy, and play and creativity are more
> >>important than food?

> >
> >
> > What the above describes is
> > simply the situation of someone
> > who is the only vegan for miles
> > around. Of course they are
> > going to feel out of place and
> > awkward when having to deal
> > with what others try to insist on
> > feeding them. That's only part
> > of the above though. This bull
> > about love, joy, etc. makes it
> > sound like automatically a
> > person is doing something
> > wrong if they don't give them
> > priority over their food, as
> > though all can't exist at the
> > same level of priority as each
> > other. It makes it sound like
> > there is something wrong
> > with anyone who pays a lot of
> > attention to their diet.
> >
> >
> >>Consider the question asked in the "party ideas" thread, and one of the
> >>replies to me in it. Ordinary people don't have a dilemma when it comes
> >>to having a party. They provide a variety of foods which should appeal
> >>to most people. Here we have a vegan who insists others adopt her eating
> >>habit (disorder) when visiting her new home or apartment. It's nothing
> >>at all like someone who doesn't like a particular kind of food, it's a
> >>blanket objection to entire groups of food most people in our society
> >>don't find objectionable.

> >
> >
> > If a vegan is holding a party
> > that you are attending, of course
> > you should expect to be served
> > vegan food. Just as when you
> > go to a meat eater's party, you
> > should expect that if you're
> > vegan, you might or might not
> > find stuff to eat (eat a bit before
> > going out just in case).
> >
> >
> >>I politely stated that I cater to my guests' tastes rather than my own
> >>in situations like that. There are certain foods which I don't like, but
> >>I know my guests do. *I*'m entertaining *them*. They wouldn't be
> >>entertained by off-putting statements about my likes or dislikes, nor
> >>should they be subjected to disapproval of their own choices of food (or
> >>drink; I provide alcohol at most of my parties and gatherings, but I
> >>don't drink).

> >
> >
> > You need meat and booze to
> > lure people to your parties.
> > Considering your personality,
> > I'm not surprised.
> >
> >
> >>The reply from Ron was typical of the vegan eating disorder: "So you go
> >>out and slaughter a steer just to appease the blood hunger of your

> >
> > guests?"
> >
> >>Mentally disturbed people like Ron believe they should subject guests in
> >>their homes to irrational lectures about veganism. Not only do they
> >>forbid themselves of certain foods, they deny it to others and impugn
> >>them incessantly for even wanting it.

> >
> >
> > Who said anything about lecturing
> > guests?
> >
> >
> >>They have disorders their pursuit is so extreme that they, and those
> >>around them (e.g., party guests), don't enjoy themselves. They're too
> >>busy trying to avoid micrograms of animal parts that enjoyment is
> >>completely lost.

> >
> >
> > And you know this because.....
> > how many vegan parties have
> > you attended?
> >
> >
> >>>>>See also:
> >>>>>

> >
> >

http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
> >
> >>>"Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
> >>>that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
> >>>eating disorder," Morand said.
> >>
> >>Correct.
> >>
> >>
> >>>This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
> >>>cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a

vegetarian
> >>>lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling

with
> >>>food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating

> >
> > behaviours.
> >
> >>>He does not call it a eating disorder.
> >>
> >>Dr Bratman does.
> >>
> >>
> >>>There are plenty of healthy vegans.
> >>
> >>Irrelevant to the issue at hand. Veganism is an eating disorder.

> >
> >
> > According to the questions you
> > quoted near the top of this page,
> > if a vegan is still feeling love and
> > joy etc. in her/his life, then they
> > don't have this (non medically
> > accepted) disease.
> >
> >
> >>>There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart

desease.
> >>
> >>Vegans die of cancer and heart disease, too, dummy.

> >
> >
> > Not as much. You know that too.
> > The reason you used to eat
> > vegan was for health and
> > aesthetics. Even now you only
> > have a little fish infrequently.
> > The rest is vegan food you eat.
> >
> >



  #22 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I sent to the site and posted what was said. Unusual Suspects lied. It
did not call vegetarianism an eating disorder. In fact, he said people
could go on becoming vegetarianism.

It said people can hide eating disorders behind vegetarianism.

Unusual Suspects is a liar.

You can not trust any of his URLs or even facts. He is a sick
homophobic individual.

usual suspect wrote:

> Bumbling Twit wrote:
>
>>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
>>>>> bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
>>>
>>>
>>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
>>> numb nuts:
>>>
>>> www.orthorexia.com
>>>
>>> See also:
>>> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m

>>
>>
>>
>> Anyone who calls vegan an eating disorder

>
>
> It is.
>
>> in the vegan group

>
>
> It's true in the vegan group, it's true outside the vegan group. That's
> the nature of truth, nitwit.
>
>> is like spreading fire in a crowded circus.

>
>
> Non sequitur.

  #23 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Skanky wrote:
>>>>>>>>You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or

>>
>>>>>>>bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
>>>>>
>>>>>Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
>>>>>numb nuts:
>>>>>
>>>>>www.orthorexia.com
>>>
>>>He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism

>>
>>It’s great to eat healthy food, and most of us could benefit by
>>paying a little more attention to what we eat. However, some
>>people have the opposite problem: they take the concept of
>>healthy eating to such an extreme that it becomes an obsession.
>>I call this state of mind orthorexia nervosa: literally,
>>"fixation on righteous eating."
>>http://www.orthorexia.com/index.php?page=katef
>>
>>He continues on that page with a series of questions, nearly all of
>>which are apropos to veganism:
>>
>>Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat, and not think
>>about whether it’s good for you? Has your diet made you
>>socially isolated? Is it impossible to imagine going through a
>>whole day without paying attention to your diet, and just living
>>and loving? Does it sound beyond your ability to eat a meal
>>prepared with love by your mother – one single meal – and not
>>try to control what she serves you? Do you have trouble
>>remembering that love, and joy, and play and creativity are more
>>important than food?

>
> What the above describes is
> simply the situation of someone
> who is the only vegan for miles
> around.


No, it does not. It describes a situation in which an individual's
preoccupation with healthful eating becomes an unhealthful obsession.
Whether that person has others around her with a similar eating disorder
is irrelevant. They're equally dysfunctional. Birds of a feather.

> Of course they are
> going to feel out of place and
> awkward when having to deal
> with what others try to insist on
> feeding them.


The more you write, Skanky, the more I know you're orthorexic. The
operative part isn't *feeling awkward*, it's that someone even feels
someone else is insisting on feeding her something she considers "bad."
This is true regardless of what someone's repulsion is: fat, sweets,
meat, or micrograms of animal-derived ingredients. In that sense,
veganism is the apex of orthorexia because the disordered eater is
trying to avoid foods which may not even be of animal origin; and, if
the ingredients are of animal origin, they're in such small quantity
that virulent objections are irrational and completely out of place.

> That's only part
> of the above though. This bull
> about love, joy, etc. makes it
> sound like automatically a
> person is doing something
> wrong if they don't give them
> priority over their food, as
> though all can't exist at the
> same level of priority as each
> other.


Food offered out of love, such as when a mother cooks a meal or treat
for her child, should not be rejected because it contains small amounts
of ingredients which the child would never use. The child is not
shunning the objectionable ingredients, but the love with which such
food is offered. Similarly, one is very disturbed when she obsesses over
the inclusion of certain ingredients rather than over enjoyment of the
food. That is the disorder, Skanky. It's an obsession, and it's unhealthy.

> It makes it sound like
> there is something wrong
> with anyone who pays a lot of
> attention to their diet.


There *is* something wrong with irrational obsessions like vegans have
in rooting out every microgram of animal ingredient -- even to the point
of eliminating ingredients which one isn't sure are of animal origin.

Do you think this "buzz" clown is mentally healthy with his obesession
about whether or not honey might be in his incense? And how about his
response where he seems to indicate he's more concerned about bees than
his own health? Nevermind. I remember your response to information about
the toxins in your marijuana smoke.

>>Consider the question asked in the "party ideas" thread, and one of the
>>replies to me in it. Ordinary people don't have a dilemma when it comes
>>to having a party. They provide a variety of foods which should appeal
>>to most people. Here we have a vegan who insists others adopt her eating
>>habit (disorder) when visiting her new home or apartment. It's nothing
>>at all like someone who doesn't like a particular kind of food, it's a
>>blanket objection to entire groups of food most people in our society
>>don't find objectionable.

>
> If a vegan is holding a party
> that you are attending, of course
> you should expect to be served
> vegan food.


If vegans will be the only ones in attendance. Some party that would be.

> Just as when you
> go to a meat eater's party, you
> should expect that if you're
> vegan, you might or might not
> find stuff to eat (eat a bit before
> going out just in case).


I've never gone to any party where I couldn't find something I could eat.

>>I politely stated that I cater to my guests' tastes rather than my own
>>in situations like that. There are certain foods which I don't like, but
>>I know my guests do. *I*'m entertaining *them*. They wouldn't be
>>entertained by off-putting statements about my likes or dislikes, nor
>>should they be subjected to disapproval of their own choices of food (or
>>drink; I provide alcohol at most of my parties and gatherings, but I
>>don't drink).

>
> You need meat and booze to
> lure people to your parties.


No, I don't.

> Considering your personality,
> I'm not surprised.


I have more friends than you, and I've no fears which prevent me from
being with any number of them at any given time.

>>The reply from Ron was typical of the vegan eating disorder: "So you go
>>out and slaughter a steer just to appease the blood hunger of your
>> guests?"

>
>>Mentally disturbed people like Ron believe they should subject guests in
>>their homes to irrational lectures about veganism. Not only do they
>>forbid themselves of certain foods, they deny it to others and impugn
>>them incessantly for even wanting it.

>
> Who said anything about lecturing
> guests?


That goes hand-in-hand with veganism. It's not enough to say, "No,
thanks." Vegans ALWAYS condemn and impugn others for their dietary choices.

>>They have disorders their pursuit is so extreme that they, and those
>>around them (e.g., party guests), don't enjoy themselves. They're too
>>busy trying to avoid micrograms of animal parts that enjoyment is
>>completely lost.

>
> And you know this because.....
> how many vegan parties have
> you attended?


Quite a few, and I was so put off by the holier-than-thou attitudes at
the Vegetarian Network of Austin pot-luck I attended that I refuse to
ever go to one again. I see they haven't changed:
All are invited to our potlucks for fun and fellowship with
other vegetarians and those interested in learning more about
it. Families, couples and single folks are welcome!

Please bring a vegan (no dairy or other animal products) dish to
serve 8 to share. Also, no diningware is provided, so please
bring a plate and utensils.

In respect of those folks with allergies, please refrain from
wearing perfume or heavy scents.
http://www.vegnetaustin.org/

>>>>>See also:
>>>>>

>
> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
>
>>>"Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
>>>that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
>>>eating disorder," Morand said.

>>
>>Correct.
>>
>>
>>>This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
>>>cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a vegetarian
>>>lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling with
>>>food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating

>
> behaviours.
>
>>>He does not call it a eating disorder.

>>
>>Dr Bratman does.
>>
>>
>>>There are plenty of healthy vegans.

>>
>>Irrelevant to the issue at hand. Veganism is an eating disorder.

>
> According to the questions you
> quoted near the top of this page,
> if a vegan is still feeling love and
> joy etc. in her/his life, then they
> don't have this (non medically
> accepted) disease.


No, and I'm not surprised your reading comprehension is so poor that you
would say that. Pay attention to this: "Do you wish that occasionally
you could just eat, and not think about whether it’s good for you?"
Similarly, one could ask a vegan, "Do you wish that occasionally you
could just eat, and not think about whether or not it has micrograms of
animal parts?" And the part about eating A SINGLE MEAL cooked by your
mother is also important. Not a "vegan" meal cooked by your mother, but
A SINGLE MEAL without any consideration for the ingredients but only for
the love your mother is showing you. Vegans have a rigidly unhealthy
obsession with food. It is an eating disorder.

>>>There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart desease.

>>
>>Vegans die of cancer and heart disease, too, dummy.

>
> Not as much.


Ipse dixit. What's the death rate of meat-eaters? 100%. What's the death
rate of veg-ns? 100%. Both groups die of the same diseases; some meat
eaters, particularly those indisciminate in their choices, tend to die a
bit younger. Veg-ns, though, can also die younger because they're at
higher risk of certain cancers. Show the whole picture, Skanky, and
there's really no difference especially if you compare apples to apples
by comparing healthful diets which include meat to healthful vegetarian
diets. (You've always refused to do that.)

> You know that too.


I know enough to distinguish between healthful diets which include meat
and unhealthful ones which exclude meat.

> The reason you used to eat
> vegan was for health and
> aesthetics. Even now you only
> have a little fish infrequently.


The fish I've eaten was healthful. I've not turned down meals prepared
for me by family members or my friends just because they use foods I
normally don't. I don't obsess about my food like you do.

> The rest is vegan food you eat.


Food is not vegan. Food is food. Like vegans, you have an unhealthy
obsession with food. You're not a "vegan wannabe," you're an "eating
disorder wannabe." You have orthorexia, Skanky.
  #24 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Beach Runner wrote:
> You said he called it an eating disorder. He did not. He said that
> people with eating disorders can hide behind a vegan diet. A far cry.


Strawman. His definition would include veganism.

> And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
> term "Kosher"?


Yes.

> Are they sick too?


Yes.

> They pay special attention to their food.


And to the extent that observant Jews have two sets of cookware and a
list of rules about what can and can't be eaten together, it is orthorexic.

> What about Italian cooks who delight in their foods? Are they also sick?


Ahh, "delighting" is different from nitpicking. Italians don't have a
set of rules like kashrut or veganism whereby they eliminate or obsess
about what can or can't be eaten, either alone or with other foods.

Your top-posting is poor netiquette.

<...>
  #25 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Scented Nectar wrote:
>>You said he called it an eating disorder. He did not. He said that
>>people with eating disorders can hide behind a vegan diet. A far cry.

>
> You're right.


No, he isn't.

> The thing is though,
> he thinks that all vegans have it.


They do.

> His quotes don't word it that way,


I believe I've written that all vegans are orthorexic.

...[Vegans are] also out of touch with reality (which is one
reason why I suspect AR/veganism are symptoms of deeper mental
illness; perhaps it will one day be used diagnostically as a
syndrome capturing those who are anti-social, out of touch with
reality, and who have a peculiar eating disorder -- the latter
being orthorexia).
usual suspect: Jun 5 2004

Imbalanced people don't make balanced decisions. That's why
people become "vegans" in the first place.
usual suspect: Dec 4 2004

Veganism is a mental illness. I realize it isn't treated as
such at the moment, but it eventually will be. It's an extreme
form of orthorexia.
usual suspect: Jun 12 2004

> but Usual has made it very clear
> that he considers all vegans to
> be 'orthorexic'.


Correct, and they are.

>>And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
>>term "Kosher"? Are they sick too? They pay special attention to their
>>food.
>>
>>What about Italian cooks who delight in their foods? Are they also sick?

>
> Usual himself has bragged about
> being a good cook and therefore
> must enjoy it. Maybe he's sick.


I am a good cook and I do enjoy cooking. I have a balanced approach,
though, about what I'll eat, etc., which distinguishes me from
orthorexics and vegans (who are all, 100%, orthorexics).

<...>


  #26 (permalink)   Report Post  
Derek
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 13:15:51 GMT, usual suspect > wrote:

>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>normally don't.


You DO turn down such meals prepared FOR YOU by
your friends by giving them away behind their backs after
pretending to gratefully accept them, you condescending
queer, and, if offered meat by family members, you get
aggressive and tell them where to shove it.

"My sweet, elderly neighbor bakes me a rum cake every
year for Christmas despite knowing I don't consume eggs,
milk, saturated fats, rum, or sweets. I kindly smile, thank
her for such a sweet gift, and let my friends and/or family
enjoy it (and do they ever). If my brother, though, were to
ask me if I want some venison jerky, I'd just tell him where
he could put it."
usual suspect Jul 15 2003 http://tinyurl.com/7p2xg


  #27 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Claire's fat Uncle Dreck wrote:
>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>>normally don't.

>
> You DO turn down such meals


No, I don't refuse anything. I accepted the rum cake and shared it with
friends and family who like that kind of thing. As far as my brother
goes, the issue was framed with "IF." He knows I wouldn't eat it, so he
won't offer it. We respect each other that way, something which appears
to be foreign in your Jerry Springer-esque dysfunctional family. Did you
hear David's belly slapping against Belinda's?
  #28 (permalink)   Report Post  
Derek
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 14:10:47 GMT, usual suspect > wrote:
>Derek wrote:
>>
>>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>>>normally don't.

>>
>> You DO turn down such meals

>
>No, I don't refuse anything.


You TURNED THEM DOWN, queer boy; something
you claimed never to have done. You lied.

>I accepted the rum cake and shared it with
>friends and family who like that kind of thing.


You do not share it; you give it ALL away, liar. You
turn it down behind her back every year, and while
not having the decency to explain why you want to
reject her offer, you make a fool out of her instead
and use her foolishness and good will as a handy
anecdote.

>As far as my brother goes, the issue was framed
>with "IF." He knows I wouldn't eat it, so he won't
>offer it.


Yet IF he did, you would tell him where to shove
it. Here's the quote you don't want SN to read;

<unsnip>
"My sweet, elderly neighbor bakes me a rum cake every
year for Christmas despite knowing I don't consume eggs,
milk, saturated fats, rum, or sweets. I kindly smile, thank
her for such a sweet gift, and let my friends and/or family
enjoy it (and do they ever). If my brother, though, were to
ask me if I want some venison jerky, I'd just tell him where
he could put it."
usual suspect Jul 15 2003 http://tinyurl.com/7p2xg


  #29 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Claire's shit-stirring fat uncle Dreck wrote:
>>>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>>>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>>>>normally don't.
>>>
>>>You DO turn down such meals

>>
>>No, I don't refuse anything.

>
> You TURNED THEM DOWN,


No, fatso, I don't refuse anything. I gratefully accepted the rum cake
and shared it with friends and family who like that kind of thing. As
far as my brother goes, the issue was framed with "IF." He knows I
wouldn't eat it, so he won't even offer it. We respect each other that
way, something which appears to be foreign in your Jerry Springer-esque
dysfunctional family. I find it amusing that you object more to sharing
a rum cake than sharing your wife with your own twin brother. Did you
hear David's belly slapping against Belinda's?
  #30 (permalink)   Report Post  
Derek
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 14:32:17 GMT, usual suspect > wrote:

>Derek wrote:
>>>>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>>>>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>>>>>normally don't.
>>>>
>>>>You DO turn down such meals
>>>
>>>No, I don't refuse anything.

>>
>> You TURNED THEM DOWN,

>
>No


Your quote proves that you did and still do, so it's
no surprise to see you snip it away at every turn
and dismiss it.

<unsnip>
"My sweet, elderly neighbor bakes me a rum cake every
year for Christmas despite knowing I don't consume eggs,
milk, saturated fats, rum, or sweets. I kindly smile, thank
her for such a sweet gift, and let my friends and/or family
enjoy it (and do they ever). If my brother, though, were to
ask me if I want some venison jerky, I'd just tell him where
he could put it."
usual suspect Jul 15 2003 http://tinyurl.com/7p2xg

<unsnip>
>I accepted the rum cake and shared it with
>friends and family who like that kind of thing.


You do not share it; you give it ALL away, liar. You
turn it down behind her back every year, and while
not having the decency to explain why you want to
reject her offer, you make a fool out of her instead
and use her foolishness and good will as a handy
anecdote.
<endsnip>

I just knew you'd snip that away, you pathetic little
queer.


  #31 (permalink)   Report Post  
usual suspect
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Claire's self-crippled and morbidly obese Uncle Dreck wrote:
>>>>>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>>>>>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>>>>>>normally don't.
>>>>>
>>>>>You DO turn down such meals
>>>>
>>>>No, I don't refuse anything.
>>>
>>>You TURNED THEM DOWN,

>>
>>No

>
> Your


No, fatso, I don't refuse anything. I gratefully accepted the rum cake
and shared it with friends and family who like that kind of thing. As
far as my brother goes, the issue was framed with "IF." He knows I
wouldn't eat it, so he won't even offer it. We respect each other that
way, something which appears to be foreign in your Jerry Springer-esque
dysfunctional family. I find it amusing that you object more to sharing
a rum cake than sharing your wife with your own twin brother. Did you
hear David's belly slapping against Belinda's? Why do you object to
sharing rum cake but not to other blokes -- much less your own brother
-- shagging your wife?
  #32 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"usual suspect" > wrote in message
. ..
> Scented Nectar wrote:
> >>You said he called it an eating disorder. He did not. He said that
> >>people with eating disorders can hide behind a vegan diet. A far cry.

> >
> > You're right.

>
> No, he isn't.
>
> > The thing is though,
> > he thinks that all vegans have it.

>
> They do.
>
> > His quotes don't word it that way,

>
> I believe I've written that all vegans are orthorexic.


Do you believe that you had an
eating disorder back when you
identified as vegan?

> ...[Vegans are] also out of touch with reality (which is one
> reason why I suspect AR/veganism are symptoms of deeper mental
> illness; perhaps it will one day be used diagnostically as a
> syndrome capturing those who are anti-social, out of touch with
> reality, and who have a peculiar eating disorder -- the latter
> being orthorexia).
> usual suspect: Jun 5 2004
>
> Imbalanced people don't make balanced decisions. That's why
> people become "vegans" in the first place.
> usual suspect: Dec 4 2004
>
> Veganism is a mental illness. I realize it isn't treated as
> such at the moment, but it eventually will be. It's an extreme
> form of orthorexia.
> usual suspect: Jun 12 2004
>
> > but Usual has made it very clear
> > that he considers all vegans to
> > be 'orthorexic'.

>
> Correct, and they are.
>
> >>And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
> >>term "Kosher"? Are they sick too? They pay special attention to their
> >>food.
> >>
> >>What about Italian cooks who delight in their foods? Are they also

sick?
> >
> > Usual himself has bragged about
> > being a good cook and therefore
> > must enjoy it. Maybe he's sick.

>
> I am a good cook and I do enjoy cooking. I have a balanced approach,
> though, about what I'll eat, etc., which distinguishes me from
> orthorexics and vegans (who are all, 100%, orthorexics).


You're pretty ****ed up, Usual.


--
SN
http://www.scentednectar.com/veg/



  #33 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
Posts: n/a
Default

You have a serious case of fear
of non-conformity. All the below
quotes prove that.


--
SN
http://www.scentednectar.com/veg/

"usual suspect" > wrote in message
...
> Skanky wrote:
> >>>>>>>>You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic or
> >>
> >>>>>>>bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
> >>>>>numb nuts:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>www.orthorexia.com
> >>>
> >>>He calls sever underweight a desease. He does not mention veganism
> >>
> >>It’s great to eat healthy food, and most of us could benefit by
> >>paying a little more attention to what we eat. However, some
> >>people have the opposite problem: they take the concept of
> >>healthy eating to such an extreme that it becomes an obsession.
> >>I call this state of mind orthorexia nervosa: literally,
> >>"fixation on righteous eating."
> >>http://www.orthorexia.com/index.php?page=katef
> >>
> >>He continues on that page with a series of questions, nearly all of
> >>which are apropos to veganism:
> >>
> >>Do you wish that occasionally you could just eat, and not think
> >>about whether it’s good for you? Has your diet made you
> >>socially isolated? Is it impossible to imagine going through a
> >>whole day without paying attention to your diet, and just living
> >>and loving? Does it sound beyond your ability to eat a meal
> >>prepared with love by your mother – one single meal – and not
> >>try to control what she serves you? Do you have trouble
> >>remembering that love, and joy, and play and creativity are more
> >>important than food?

> >
> > What the above describes is
> > simply the situation of someone
> > who is the only vegan for miles
> > around.

>
> No, it does not. It describes a situation in which an individual's
> preoccupation with healthful eating becomes an unhealthful obsession.
> Whether that person has others around her with a similar eating disorder
> is irrelevant. They're equally dysfunctional. Birds of a feather.
>
> > Of course they are
> > going to feel out of place and
> > awkward when having to deal
> > with what others try to insist on
> > feeding them.

>
> The more you write, Skanky, the more I know you're orthorexic. The
> operative part isn't *feeling awkward*, it's that someone even feels
> someone else is insisting on feeding her something she considers "bad."
> This is true regardless of what someone's repulsion is: fat, sweets,
> meat, or micrograms of animal-derived ingredients. In that sense,
> veganism is the apex of orthorexia because the disordered eater is
> trying to avoid foods which may not even be of animal origin; and, if
> the ingredients are of animal origin, they're in such small quantity
> that virulent objections are irrational and completely out of place.
>
> > That's only part
> > of the above though. This bull
> > about love, joy, etc. makes it
> > sound like automatically a
> > person is doing something
> > wrong if they don't give them
> > priority over their food, as
> > though all can't exist at the
> > same level of priority as each
> > other.

>
> Food offered out of love, such as when a mother cooks a meal or treat
> for her child, should not be rejected because it contains small amounts
> of ingredients which the child would never use. The child is not
> shunning the objectionable ingredients, but the love with which such
> food is offered. Similarly, one is very disturbed when she obsesses over
> the inclusion of certain ingredients rather than over enjoyment of the
> food. That is the disorder, Skanky. It's an obsession, and it's unhealthy.
>
> > It makes it sound like
> > there is something wrong
> > with anyone who pays a lot of
> > attention to their diet.

>
> There *is* something wrong with irrational obsessions like vegans have
> in rooting out every microgram of animal ingredient -- even to the point
> of eliminating ingredients which one isn't sure are of animal origin.
>
> Do you think this "buzz" clown is mentally healthy with his obesession
> about whether or not honey might be in his incense? And how about his
> response where he seems to indicate he's more concerned about bees than
> his own health? Nevermind. I remember your response to information about
> the toxins in your marijuana smoke.
>
> >>Consider the question asked in the "party ideas" thread, and one of the
> >>replies to me in it. Ordinary people don't have a dilemma when it comes
> >>to having a party. They provide a variety of foods which should appeal
> >>to most people. Here we have a vegan who insists others adopt her eating
> >>habit (disorder) when visiting her new home or apartment. It's nothing
> >>at all like someone who doesn't like a particular kind of food, it's a
> >>blanket objection to entire groups of food most people in our society
> >>don't find objectionable.

> >
> > If a vegan is holding a party
> > that you are attending, of course
> > you should expect to be served
> > vegan food.

>
> If vegans will be the only ones in attendance. Some party that would be.
>
> > Just as when you
> > go to a meat eater's party, you
> > should expect that if you're
> > vegan, you might or might not
> > find stuff to eat (eat a bit before
> > going out just in case).

>
> I've never gone to any party where I couldn't find something I could eat.
>
> >>I politely stated that I cater to my guests' tastes rather than my own
> >>in situations like that. There are certain foods which I don't like, but
> >>I know my guests do. *I*'m entertaining *them*. They wouldn't be
> >>entertained by off-putting statements about my likes or dislikes, nor
> >>should they be subjected to disapproval of their own choices of food (or
> >>drink; I provide alcohol at most of my parties and gatherings, but I
> >>don't drink).

> >
> > You need meat and booze to
> > lure people to your parties.

>
> No, I don't.
>
> > Considering your personality,
> > I'm not surprised.

>
> I have more friends than you, and I've no fears which prevent me from
> being with any number of them at any given time.
>
> >>The reply from Ron was typical of the vegan eating disorder: "So you go
> >>out and slaughter a steer just to appease the blood hunger of your
> >> guests?"

> >
> >>Mentally disturbed people like Ron believe they should subject guests in
> >>their homes to irrational lectures about veganism. Not only do they
> >>forbid themselves of certain foods, they deny it to others and impugn
> >>them incessantly for even wanting it.

> >
> > Who said anything about lecturing
> > guests?

>
> That goes hand-in-hand with veganism. It's not enough to say, "No,
> thanks." Vegans ALWAYS condemn and impugn others for their dietary

choices.
>
> >>They have disorders their pursuit is so extreme that they, and those
> >>around them (e.g., party guests), don't enjoy themselves. They're too
> >>busy trying to avoid micrograms of animal parts that enjoyment is
> >>completely lost.

> >
> > And you know this because.....
> > how many vegan parties have
> > you attended?

>
> Quite a few, and I was so put off by the holier-than-thou attitudes at
> the Vegetarian Network of Austin pot-luck I attended that I refuse to
> ever go to one again. I see they haven't changed:
> All are invited to our potlucks for fun and fellowship with
> other vegetarians and those interested in learning more about
> it. Families, couples and single folks are welcome!
>
> Please bring a vegan (no dairy or other animal products) dish to
> serve 8 to share. Also, no diningware is provided, so please
> bring a plate and utensils.
>
> In respect of those folks with allergies, please refrain from
> wearing perfume or heavy scents.
> http://www.vegnetaustin.org/
>
> >>>>>See also:
> >>>>>

> >
> >

http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
> >
> >>>"Family, friends, clinicians, and vegetarians themselves, need to know
> >>>that the potential exists for vegetarianism and veganism to mask an
> >>>eating disorder," Morand said.
> >>
> >>Correct.
> >>
> >>
> >>>This doesn't mean vegetarianism is the
> >>>cause of an eating disorder, or that people shouldn't adopt a

vegetarian
> >>>lifestyle, but it may be a way for the individual who is struggling

with
> >>>food and weight issues to justify her or his restrictive eating

> >
> > behaviours.
> >
> >>>He does not call it a eating disorder.
> >>
> >>Dr Bratman does.
> >>
> >>
> >>>There are plenty of healthy vegans.
> >>
> >>Irrelevant to the issue at hand. Veganism is an eating disorder.

> >
> > According to the questions you
> > quoted near the top of this page,
> > if a vegan is still feeling love and
> > joy etc. in her/his life, then they
> > don't have this (non medically
> > accepted) disease.

>
> No, and I'm not surprised your reading comprehension is so poor that you
> would say that. Pay attention to this: "Do you wish that occasionally
> you could just eat, and not think about whether it’s good for you?"
> Similarly, one could ask a vegan, "Do you wish that occasionally you
> could just eat, and not think about whether or not it has micrograms of
> animal parts?" And the part about eating A SINGLE MEAL cooked by your
> mother is also important. Not a "vegan" meal cooked by your mother, but
> A SINGLE MEAL without any consideration for the ingredients but only for
> the love your mother is showing you. Vegans have a rigidly unhealthy
> obsession with food. It is an eating disorder.
>
> >>>There are more unhealthy meat eaters dieing of cancer and heart

desease.
> >>
> >>Vegans die of cancer and heart disease, too, dummy.

> >
> > Not as much.

>
> Ipse dixit. What's the death rate of meat-eaters? 100%. What's the death
> rate of veg-ns? 100%. Both groups die of the same diseases; some meat
> eaters, particularly those indisciminate in their choices, tend to die a
> bit younger. Veg-ns, though, can also die younger because they're at
> higher risk of certain cancers. Show the whole picture, Skanky, and
> there's really no difference especially if you compare apples to apples
> by comparing healthful diets which include meat to healthful vegetarian
> diets. (You've always refused to do that.)
>
> > You know that too.

>
> I know enough to distinguish between healthful diets which include meat
> and unhealthful ones which exclude meat.
>
> > The reason you used to eat
> > vegan was for health and
> > aesthetics. Even now you only
> > have a little fish infrequently.

>
> The fish I've eaten was healthful. I've not turned down meals prepared
> for me by family members or my friends just because they use foods I
> normally don't. I don't obsess about my food like you do.
>
> > The rest is vegan food you eat.

>
> Food is not vegan. Food is food. Like vegans, you have an unhealthy
> obsession with food. You're not a "vegan wannabe," you're an "eating
> disorder wannabe." You have orthorexia, Skanky.




  #34 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"usual suspect" > wrote in message
.. .
> Claire's fat Uncle Dreck wrote:
> >>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
> >>members or my friends just because they use foods I
> >>normally don't.

> >
> > You DO turn down such meals

>
> No, I don't refuse anything. I accepted the rum cake and shared it with
> friends and family who like that kind of thing. As far as my brother
> goes, the issue was framed with "IF." He knows I wouldn't eat it, so he
> won't offer it. We respect each other that way, something which appears
> to be foreign in your Jerry Springer-esque dysfunctional family. Did you
> hear David's belly slapping against Belinda's?


Ohhh, so it's ok when YOU and
some non vegan respect each
others differences, but not ok
when others do it.


--
SN
http://www.scentednectar.com/veg/



  #35 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Derek" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 14:10:47 GMT, usual suspect >

wrote:
> >Derek wrote:
> >>
> >>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
> >>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
> >>>normally don't.
> >>
> >> You DO turn down such meals

> >
> >No, I don't refuse anything.

>
> You TURNED THEM DOWN, queer boy; something
> you claimed never to have done. You lied.
>
> >I accepted the rum cake and shared it with
> >friends and family who like that kind of thing.

>
> You do not share it; you give it ALL away, liar. You
> turn it down behind her back every year, and while
> not having the decency to explain why you want to
> reject her offer, you make a fool out of her instead
> and use her foolishness and good will as a handy
> anecdote.
>
> >As far as my brother goes, the issue was framed
> >with "IF." He knows I wouldn't eat it, so he won't
> >offer it.

>
> Yet IF he did, you would tell him where to shove
> it. Here's the quote you don't want SN to read;
>
> <unsnip>
> "My sweet, elderly neighbor bakes me a rum cake every
> year for Christmas despite knowing I don't consume eggs,
> milk, saturated fats, rum, or sweets. I kindly smile, thank
> her for such a sweet gift, and let my friends and/or family
> enjoy it (and do they ever). If my brother, though, were to
> ask me if I want some venison jerky, I'd just tell him where
> he could put it."
> usual suspect Jul 15 2003 http://tinyurl.com/7p2xg


I think we have a serious case
here of 'do as I say but not as
I do'. Usual's obsession with
'orthorexia' makes me think that
when he was vegan, he must have
been one of those rare cases
that cover an eating disorder.
Did you feel fat, Usual?


--
SN
http://www.scentednectar.com/veg/





  #36 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scented Nectar
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"usual suspect" > wrote in message
.. .
> Claire's self-crippled and morbidly obese Uncle Dreck wrote:
> >>>>>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
> >>>>>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
> >>>>>>normally don't.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>You DO turn down such meals
> >>>>
> >>>>No, I don't refuse anything.
> >>>
> >>>You TURNED THEM DOWN,
> >>
> >>No

> >
> > Your

>
> No, fatso, I don't refuse anything. I gratefully accepted the rum cake
> and shared it with friends and family who like that kind of thing. As
> far as my brother goes, the issue was framed with "IF." He knows I
> wouldn't eat it, so he won't even offer it. We respect each other that
> way, something which appears to be foreign in your Jerry Springer-esque
> dysfunctional family. I find it amusing that you object more to sharing
> a rum cake than sharing your wife with your own twin brother. Did you
> hear David's belly slapping against Belinda's? Why do you object to
> sharing rum cake but not to other blokes -- much less your own brother
> -- shagging your wife?


You snipped the evidence of your
lies away again. You seem to
have a preoccupation with fatness.
Is that where your own eating
disorder comes into the picture?
The only reason that you could
possibly think that all vegans have
your disorder must be because
through your eyes that's all you
see, due to having it yourself.


--
SN
http://www.scentednectar.com/veg/



  #37 (permalink)   Report Post  
Derek
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 8 Aug 2005 11:32:43 -0400, "Scented Nectar" > wrote:
>"Derek" > wrote in message ...
>> On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 14:10:47 GMT, usual suspect >wrote:
>> >Derek wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>I've not turned down meals prepared for me by family
>> >>>members or my friends just because they use foods I
>> >>>normally don't.
>> >>
>> >> You DO turn down such meals
>> >
>> >No, I don't refuse anything.

>>
>> You TURNED THEM DOWN, queer boy; something
>> you claimed never to have done. You lied.
>>
>> >I accepted the rum cake and shared it with
>> >friends and family who like that kind of thing.

>>
>> You do not share it; you give it ALL away, liar. You
>> turn it down behind her back every year, and while
>> not having the decency to explain why you want to
>> reject her offer, you make a fool out of her instead
>> and use her foolishness and good will as a handy
>> anecdote.
>>
>> >As far as my brother goes, the issue was framed
>> >with "IF." He knows I wouldn't eat it, so he won't
>> >offer it.

>>
>> Yet IF he did, you would tell him where to shove
>> it. Here's the quote you don't want SN to read;
>>
>> <unsnip>
>> "My sweet, elderly neighbor bakes me a rum cake every
>> year for Christmas despite knowing I don't consume eggs,
>> milk, saturated fats, rum, or sweets. I kindly smile, thank
>> her for such a sweet gift, and let my friends and/or family
>> enjoy it (and do they ever). If my brother, though, were to
>> ask me if I want some venison jerky, I'd just tell him where
>> he could put it."
>> usual suspect Jul 15 2003 http://tinyurl.com/7p2xg

>
>I think we have a serious case
>here of 'do as I say but not as
>I do'.


One of many serious cases, I'm delghted to say.

>Usual's obsession with
>'orthorexia' makes me think that
>when he was vegan, he must have
>been one of those rare cases
>that cover an eating disorder.


His obsession with everything, from homosexuality
to orthorexia and beyond tells me he probably qualifies
as a candidate for all them.

>Did you feel fat, Usual?


Don't offer him venison jerky; there's no telling what
he'll do if you do something like that. Pity his "sweet,
elderly neighbor"; what WOULD that sweet old girl
be thinking if she knew about usual suspect's use
of her yearly kindness for a sneering anecdote.
  #38 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default

So Ususual Suspects invents diseases, points to web pages that don't say
what he tries to convince you of (I posted the web page)

I agree a person might high behind being vegan, but then they are just
as likely to hide beind weight loss.


Scented Nectar wrote:

> "usual suspect" > wrote in message
> . ..
>
>>Scented Nectar wrote:
>>
>>>>You said he called it an eating disorder. He did not. He said that
>>>>people with eating disorders can hide behind a vegan diet. A far cry.
>>>
>>>You're right.

>>
>>No, he isn't.
>>
>>
>>>The thing is though,
>>>he thinks that all vegans have it.

>>
>>They do.
>>
>>
>>>His quotes don't word it that way,

>>
>>I believe I've written that all vegans are orthorexic.

>
>
> Do you believe that you had an
> eating disorder back when you
> identified as vegan?
>
>
>>...[Vegans are] also out of touch with reality (which is one
>>reason why I suspect AR/veganism are symptoms of deeper mental
>>illness; perhaps it will one day be used diagnostically as a
>>syndrome capturing those who are anti-social, out of touch with
>>reality, and who have a peculiar eating disorder -- the latter
>>being orthorexia).
>>usual suspect: Jun 5 2004
>>
>>Imbalanced people don't make balanced decisions. That's why
>>people become "vegans" in the first place.
>>usual suspect: Dec 4 2004
>>
>>Veganism is a mental illness. I realize it isn't treated as
>>such at the moment, but it eventually will be. It's an extreme
>>form of orthorexia.
>>usual suspect: Jun 12 2004
>>
>>
>>>but Usual has made it very clear
>>>that he considers all vegans to
>>>be 'orthorexic'.

>>
>>Correct, and they are.
>>
>>
>>>>And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
>>>>term "Kosher"? Are they sick too? They pay special attention to their
>>>>food.
>>>>
>>>>What about Italian cooks who delight in their foods? Are they also

>
> sick?
>
>>>Usual himself has bragged about
>>>being a good cook and therefore
>>>must enjoy it. Maybe he's sick.

>>
>>I am a good cook and I do enjoy cooking. I have a balanced approach,
>>though, about what I'll eat, etc., which distinguishes me from
>>orthorexics and vegans (who are all, 100%, orthorexics).

>
>
> You're pretty ****ed up, Usual.
>
>

  #39 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default



usual suspect wrote:

>> And as far as people take unusual attention to food, have you hear the
>> term "Kosher"?

>
>
> Yes.
>
>> Are they sick too?

>
>
> Yes.
>
>> They pay special attention to their food.

>
>
> And to the extent that observant Jews have two sets of cookware and a
> list of rules about what can and can't be eaten together, it is orthorexic.
>

So your an anti Semite too.

Hitler would agree with you.
  #40 (permalink)   Report Post  
Beach Runner
 
Posts: n/a
Default



Beach Runner wrote:

> I sent to the site and posted what was said. Unusual Suspects lied. It
> did not call vegetarianism an eating disorder. In fact, he said people
> could go on becoming vegetarianism.
>
> It said people can hide eating disorders behind vegetarianism.
>
> Unusual Suspects is a liar.
>
> You can not trust any of his URLs or even facts. He is a sick
> homophobic individual.
>
> usual suspect wrote:
>
>> Bumbling Twit wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> You don't need to know much nutrition to go veg*n
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Just like one doesn't need to know much nutrition to go anorexic
>>>>>> or bulimic or to go any other eating disorder.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Eating vegetarian is not an eating disorder. That is a lie.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Veganism IS an eating disorder. You want a website? Try this one,
>>>> numb nuts:
>>>>
>>>> www.orthorexia.com
>>>>
>>>> See also:
>>>> http://www.compulsiveeating.com/vege...disorder.ht m
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Anyone who calls vegan an eating disorder

>>
>>
>>
>> It is.
>>
>>> in the vegan group

>>
>>

aonly you all is it disorder. Your web sites didn't.

You are also an anti semite.
>>
>> It's true in the vegan group, it's true outside the vegan group.
>> That's the nature of truth, nitwit.
>>
>>> is like spreading fire in a crowded circus.

>>
>>
>>
>> Non sequitur.

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