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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC
http://yahoo.sbc.com said: >That's exactly why this person's case is raising concern. Personally I think >a person's health should come as a higher priority than the life of another >animal. > He follows a vegan diet for health reasons, himself. Makes it a bit odd, the way he talks about how meat, dairy products, and such, are healthy, when he avoids those things for health reasons, himself (he has said so, himself, directly, so I'm not making any assumptions here; I'm just pointing out what he has said, himself). -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC
http://yahoo.sbc.com said: >Well chocolate isn't bad for people if they don't eat too much of it. If >it wasn't fattening and full of sugar I'd eat it every day. *L* But I know >that's not really healthy. I don't crave big amounts (especially not if it's the stuff with 70% cocoa), but the craving is quite strong around that time, even if relatively small amount suffices. I've also agreed with myself to not buy chocolate when it's not that time of month, or my birthday, and I keep it fairly well. > >> BTW: I found a pretty good non-dairy "yoghurt", which wasn't overly >> sweet, as non-dairy "yoghurt" tends to be, today. It was called >> "Beneviva", in case anyone wanted to know. Beneviva also makes a >> non-dairy "cheese" spread, which I think is quite good too. > >Cool. > Yeah, I'm thinking of writing them to ask if they'd think if selling their "yoghurt" in cartons of 1 liter, like ordinary yoghurt. That would be really nice, and I imagine other people would like it too. -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
"MEow" > wrote in message ... > While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC > http://yahoo.sbc.com said: > > >That's exactly why this person's case is raising concern. Personally I think > >a person's health should come as a higher priority than the life of another > >animal. > > > He follows a vegan diet for health reasons, himself. Makes it a bit > odd, the way he talks about how meat, dairy products, and such, are > healthy, when he avoids those things for health reasons, himself (he > has said so, himself, directly, so I'm not making any assumptions > here; I'm just pointing out what he has said, himself). Well I don't think they're poison but I do think that if someone eats too many foods loaded with cholesterol it can't be good for them. -Rubystars |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
"MEow" > wrote in message <snip> > Yeah, I'm thinking of writing them to ask if they'd think if selling > their "yoghurt" in cartons of 1 liter, like ordinary yoghurt. That > would be really nice, and I imagine other people would like it too. I wish there was a health food shop that carried things like that in my neighborhood. Kroger has a health foods section but they don't get much more exotic than soy milk, tofu, sea salt, and sugar substitutes, along with energy bars and things like that. I mean they have some soy cheese but it has casein so that doesn't help vegans too much were they to try to shop there. I'd like to be able to go in and buy the stuff I've heard about in this group but at the moment it looks like ordering things online would be my only option as far as that goes. The only health store I've been able to find sells a bunch of quack "homeopathic" crap and "coral calcium" crap and hardly anything that's actually useful. I think the only food product they even carry is Stevia. -Rubystars |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
The message from kirchoff apparently expired, so I went to Google for
it. I'm addressing it all (i.e., my replies to kirchoff, Rubystars, and the large androgynous spawn of leftist Danes) here. me.kirchoff wrote: > Why do you continue to encourage the consumption of meat? I encouraged the OP to see a dietician. I also advised someone who has bonafide health problems to eat in a manner which is most likely to bring about good health rather than one which will lead to further complications. Too bad your hypersensitivities and dietary extremism leads you to care less about the OP and his/her wellness. With repect to diabetes, including a protein-rich food with carbohydrate-rich foods is one way to keep the glycemic load of the carbs from causing a rapid glucose spike. The iron deficiency the OP really complicates this. Phytate-rich foods like legumes and soy, though protein-rich and low GI, will further *prevent* iron absorption. The OP needs iron fairly quickly and bio-availability is a factor since he or she is already borderline anemic. > There are plenty of non-flesh sources of iron, and even though > non-heme iron is not as readily absorbed as heme, Thanks for admitting this. Now tell us why the OP should only consume the least bio-available form rather than gradually find a healthful balance between heme and non-heme sources? Do you encourage people to go cold turkey when they "go vegan" or do you encourage gradualism? What's the ****ing difference in this case where someone has underlying medical issues? > the absorption rate can be improved by eating a good source of Vitamin > C in addition. Can it be? Consider the following study: Effect of ascorbic acid intake on nonheme-iron absorption from a complete diet.... CONCLUSIONS: The facilitating effect of vitamin C on iron absorption from a complete diet is far less pronounced than that from single meals. These findings may explain why several prior studies did not show a significant effect on iron status of prolonged supplementation with vitamin C. http://tinyurl.com/wwpr The OP is already borderline anemic. How much longer do you want him or her to try to self-medicate with an extremist diet before you agree it's okay for him or her to consume something beneficial for his or her underlying medical condition? The OP already has diabetes, which is a pretty serious imbalance of the hormone insulin. If the OP wants to be vegan for some reason, let him or her do it with professional guidance. > I agree that she should consult a professional given the complications > involved with diabetes What about the borderline anemia? > but your constant pleas for consuming animal products is absurd; That's not my position, dipstick. I advise (a) moderation and (b) guidance. I'm recommending moderation -- a concept apparently at odds with activists pushing dietary extremism. > veganism is first and foremost a matter of ethics, It's not ethical. Veganism is mere hypocrisy. Your diet still kills animals (animals are killed in the course of farming; from pesticides and herbicides; during transportation and storage; during processing), you just don't eat animal flesh. Your cotton clothing comes from the most toxic form of agriculture in the world. Your hemp clothing, too, involves mass animal casualties. Wanna play the counting game and rely on moral relativism to make your claim? I'll win that one, too. > *not* health. Health should be one's only criterion for any significant dietary change. Rubystars wrote: >>That's exactly why this person's case is raising concern. Personally I think >>a person's health should come as a higher priority than the life of another >>animal. I agree, which is why I've been steadfast that the OP needs professional guidance if he/she is going to make radical dietary changes. In the interim, the OP will be better off employing moderation. Moo wrote: > He follows a vegan diet for health reasons, himself. Makes it a bit > odd, the way he talks about how meat, dairy products, and such, are > healthy, Knock on wood. I don't have diabetes or an iron deficiency. If I had anything out of balance, and meat or dairy could restore that balance, I would consume it. > when he avoids those things for health reasons, Non sequitur. I could eat meat (if I liked it) and dairy (outside of allergy season) and remain healthy. The issues isn't the animals, it's saturated fat. I think I've been pretty consistent on that -- you'd know that if you'd paid attention to my remarks about all the deep fried recipes on afv lately. Anyway, consider the fact that I abstain from all products made with shortening, margarine, hydrogenated vegetable oils, and tropical oils. I would still abstain from those even were I to eat animal products again. > himself (he > has said so, himself, directly, so I'm not making any assumptions > here; I'm just pointing out what he has said, himself). You're ignorant, you fat unshaven cow. Lean meats can be part of a healthy diet, particularly for people with insulin issues (resistance or diabetes) and various types of anemia (B12 or iron deficiency). |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
Rubystars wrote:
> Well I don't think they're poison but I do think that if someone eats too > many foods loaded with cholesterol it can't be good for them. The issue isn't cholesterol, it's saturated fat. Many high cholesterol foods, like fish, are beneficial for reducing LDL. From an earlier thread (remember?): Cholesterol from food doesn't have a direct link to *serum* cholesterol levels. The more important culprits in raising serum LDL (the bad cholesterol) are saturated fats and transfats, regardless of their source. It's true that much of the fat from animal-based foods is saturated. Many vegetable oils and related products are also saturated naturally or artificially (hydrogenation). Many of the recipes offered on afv call for margarine, which usually contains saturated fats and/or transfats. This is one of my chief complaints. It makes no difference if one avoids the cholesterol found in animal products if one's diet *still* contains saturated fats. Those sat-fats and trans-fats will elevate one's cholesterol levels whether one eats animal foods or not. Unsaturated fats, be they from vegetable oils like olive or canola or from animal fats like the healthy ones found in oily fish like salmon, elevate HDL (good cholesterol) which helps transport and reduce LDL. Fiber is also beneficial in controlling LDL levels. The distinction on controlling cholesterol, specifically LDL, should be on dietary fats, not on dietary cholesterol. In general, saturated fats tend to raise the serum-cholesterol level, while unsaturated fats and fiber tend to lower the serum-cholesterol level. Therefore, it is prudent to lower one’s intake of saturated fat, use your fat allowance primarily for unsaturated fats, and eat more high-fiber foods. Foods which contain saturated fat, unsaturated fat, or fiber may or may not contain cholesterol. http://www.unm.edu/~shc1/cholesterol.html Also, meat DOES contain many vitamins and minerals, some of which are deficient or missing in a veg-n diet. Eating fish and lean cuts is much healthier than consuming foods with hydrogenated oils or naturally saturated vegetable oils. ------ Let me further add that some saturated fats have beneficial qualities: Stearic Acid in Chocolate and Its Neutral Effect on Cholesterol The fat in chocolate, derived from cocoa butter, contains the saturated fatty acids, stearic acid and palmitic acid, as well as the unsaturated fatty acid, oleic acid. Although, historically, it was found that SFA may raise cholesterol, it has become apparent that all SFA do not have the same hypercholesterolemic effect (1). In fact, research indicates that stearic acid is unique. Unlike other saturated fats, stearic acid may have a neutral effect on blood cholesterol similar to oleic acid, which is important when considering maintaining cardiovascular health (2). A proposed mechanism for the similarity between oleic acid and stearic acid is the rapid conversion of stearic acid to oleic acid by action of a delta-9 desaturase in the liver (3). http://www.chocolateinfo.com/sr/sr_article_11.jsp And: Unlike most saturated fats, stearic acid does not seem to increase cholesterol levels in the blood, because liver enzymes convert it to an unsaturated fat during digestion. http://sci-toys.com/ingredients/stearic_acid.html Stearic acid is found in most animal fats. I wouldn't call beef or chocolate health foods, but they're acceptably healthy for most people in moderation. And finally (more to **** off vegans who make unfounded health claims), here's more information on the benefits of beef from a beef industry site. Note the info on CLAs (anti-cancer benefits) and especially the part about iron. http://www.betterbeef.com/heart_friendly_enjoy.html |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
You have a huge brain 'defficiency'
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
Something else to be aware of is that calcium and magnesium reduce iron
absorption. If you're taking a calcium or magnesium supplement, go off it until your iron deficiency is eliminated. Sulfur increases iron loss via the kidneys, in addition to increasing losses of calcium, magnesium, zinc, and other odds and ends. The main dietery sources of sulphur are the methionine and cystine in protein. On average, plant protein is lower in sulfur than animal protein, but it still has a considerable amount. Corn, rice, and wheat protein is high in sulfur. If you've been purposely eating foods high in protein, as many vegans seem to think they have to, stop. Tannins (which are found at high levels in tea) reduce iron absorption. In addition, phytic acid (found in all seeds, including beans, nuts and whole grains) also reduces iron absorption by bonding with iron molecules. (Phytates can't be absorbed. Obviously, eliminating it from your diet's not an option, but it something to keep in mind, especially if you've been trying to eat lots of beans, tofu, and whole grain foods. Oxalic acid bonds with iron as well, reducing its absorbability. It's found in all foods at varying levels. It's not as big a deal as some people think it is, but I'd suggest that you not eat cooked or frozen spinich. (Because of its high oxalic acid content, and because much of its iron hass already bonded to oxalic acid either during cooking or while the leaves are alive, cooked spinich actually reduces iron absorption.) "§odapop" > wrote in message 58... > (Jupiter) wrote in > om: > > > TIA, > > Jupiter > > this is from a web site > http://animal-ingredients.hypermart.net/ > the web site is a booklet that is for vegans so they will know about animal > ingredients and what to avoid. > > "IRON is for proper formation of red blood cells and regulation of body > processes. Vegetable sources of iron are not as easily absorbed as animal > sources, but a good intake of vitamin C will enhance absorption. Iron can > be found in: prunes, whole grain cereals, black treacle, raisins, nuts, > leafy green vegetables, sesame seeds, soya flour, pulses, cocoa, curry > powder, wholemeal bread, molasses, dried fruits (especially apricots and > figs). Cook in cast iron." > > Here are a couple of other web pages that might be of help > http://www.veganhealth.org/shv/ (click on the Iron link) > http://www.viva.org.uk/Viva!Guides/nutshell-2.htm > and > http://www.vegansociety.com/html/food/nutrition/ > (again click onthe Iron link) > > Here is a web page with Vegan acceptable vitamins and iron suppliments > http://www.veganessentials.com/front.html > > Hope this helps! > peace! > sodapop > ((=-0 |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC
http://yahoo.sbc.com said: >The only health store I've been able to find sells a bunch of quack >"homeopathic" crap and "coral calcium" crap and hardly anything that's >actually useful. I think the only food product they even carry is Stevia. > Yeah, I still can't get over the irony of health food shops which don't sell food. I can be hard to find a good health food shop in some places. When I lived in Denmark, the one I found was 45 minutes away, by train, but it was close to where my mother lived, so I combined 2 visits. Here, there's a pretty good one about 15 minutes away, by bus (plus 10-15 minutes walking to the bus), and a really good one further away, by train. When I go to the second one, I tend to combine it with a visit to the Asian shop, my favourite cafe, or something like that, and make a trip out of it. If you manage to find a good health food shop, which is a bit away, maybe you have the time to do something similar once in a while. Otherwise, ordering online might be your only option. -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, sgdunn of Cox
Communications said: > Oxalic acid bonds with iron as well, reducing its absorbability. It's >found in all foods at varying levels. It's not as big a deal as some people >think it is, but I'd suggest that you not eat cooked or frozen spinich. >(Because of its high oxalic acid content, and because much of its iron hass >already bonded to oxalic acid either during cooking or while the leaves are >alive, cooked spinich actually reduces iron absorption.) "§odapop" Does the idea that you shouldn't reheat spinach, or at least not freeze it again once you've thawed it, hold any truth to it? -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
sgdunn top-posted (dammit):
> Something else to be aware of is that calcium and magnesium reduce iron > absorption. If you're taking a calcium or magnesium supplement, go off it > until your iron deficiency is eliminated. Better yet, ask a dietician who has access to his/her last blood profile. Many people who have one deficiency often have another. What good is it to increase one mineral at the expense of another? You people would amuse me if someone's health weren't at stake here. > Sulfur increases iron loss via the kidneys, in addition to increasing > losses of calcium, magnesium, zinc, and other odds and ends. The main > dietery sources of sulphur are the methionine and cystine in protein. On > average, plant protein is lower in sulfur than animal protein, but it still > has a considerable amount. Corn, rice, and wheat protein is high in sulfur. > If you've been purposely eating foods high in protein, as many vegans seem > to think they have to, stop. Geez, you perverted fruitcake. The OP needs a dietician. He or she has at least two underlying health issues, both of which are too serious for a bunch of vegan activists on usenet to play doctor. One of the first things a dietician is going to stress is how the OP can control his/her diabetes. Protein is an important part of reducing glycemic load in diabetics, asshole. Stop playing with someone else's health. > Tannins (which are found at high levels in tea) reduce iron absorption. > In addition, phytic acid (found in all seeds, including beans, nuts and > whole grains) also reduces iron absorption by bonding with iron molecules. > (Phytates can't be absorbed. Obviously, eliminating it from your diet's not > an option, but it something to keep in mind, especially if you've been > trying to eat lots of beans, tofu, and whole grain foods. > Oxalic acid bonds with iron as well, reducing its absorbability. It's > found in all foods at varying levels. It's not as big a deal as some people > think it is, but I'd suggest that you not eat cooked or frozen spinich. > (Because of its high oxalic acid content, and because much of its iron hass > already bonded to oxalic acid either during cooking or while the leaves are > alive, cooked spinich actually reduces iron absorption.) So what can the OP eat, Dr Einstein? Remember, he/she has diabetes as well as being borderline anemic. Come on, be a good little quack and give him/her some menu ideas. |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
"MEow" > wrote in message ... > While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC > http://yahoo.sbc.com said: > > >The only health store I've been able to find sells a bunch of quack > >"homeopathic" crap and "coral calcium" crap and hardly anything that's > >actually useful. I think the only food product they even carry is Stevia. > > > Yeah, I still can't get over the irony of health food shops which > don't sell food. Well they're fine if you like duck, because they're full of quack products. >I can be hard to find a good health food shop in some > places. When I lived in Denmark, the one I found was 45 minutes away, > by train, but it was close to where my mother lived, so I combined 2 > visits. Here, there's a pretty good one about 15 minutes away, by bus > (plus 10-15 minutes walking to the bus), and a really good one further > away, by train. When I go to the second one, I tend to combine it with > a visit to the Asian shop, my favourite cafe, or something like that, > and make a trip out of it. That sounds fun. >If you manage to find a good health food > shop, which is a bit away, maybe you have the time to do something > similar once in a while. Otherwise, ordering online might be your only > option. Yeah, I think it probably would be. -Rubystars |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC
http://yahoo.sbc.com said: >>I can be hard to find a good health food shop in some >> places. When I lived in Denmark, the one I found was 45 minutes away, >> by train, but it was close to where my mother lived, so I combined 2 >> visits. Here, there's a pretty good one about 15 minutes away, by bus >> (plus 10-15 minutes walking to the bus), and a really good one further >> away, by train. When I go to the second one, I tend to combine it with >> a visit to the Asian shop, my favourite cafe, or something like that, >> and make a trip out of it. > >That sounds fun. > It tends to be, though there's some danger in going to an area which has all of those thing, and a veggie-restaurant, so I don't do it too often ;0) -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC
http://yahoo.sbc.com said: >Well I don't think they're poison but I do think that if someone eats too >many foods loaded with cholesterol it can't be good for them. > Well, you don't first say that you avoid animal products for health-reasons, and then tell other people to include same in their diet, for health reasons, so there's no contradiction there. There's many people who go by meat in moderation, and if it works for them, fine by me. People should eat what they think is right for them. -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
"MEow" > wrote in message news > While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC > http://yahoo.sbc.com said: > > >Well I don't think they're poison but I do think that if someone eats too > >many foods loaded with cholesterol it can't be good for them. > > > Well, you don't first say that you avoid animal products for > health-reasons, and then tell other people to include same in their > diet, for health reasons, so there's no contradiction there. What might be healthy for one person might not for another. For example, when my grandmother was sick and she was losing weight even though she was drinking ensure and eating toast, the nurses told us to give her ice cream mixed in with the ensure to add in extra calories. That did the trick and she went back to her normal weight. Now we know that ice cream generally isn't considered health food, but in that case it was healthy and it helped her to recover. In general people should avoid consuming too much red meat and probably not eat too much meat anyway. However, for someone with an iron deficiency and who knows what else, a big juicy steak might be what helps them, even if it's generally considered to be an unhealthy choice. Someone who is allergic to peanut butter and who avoids it for health reasons, may recommend peanut butter to someone else if they need a little extra protein, for example. > There's many people who go by meat in moderation, and if it works for > them, fine by me. People should eat what they think is right for them. Yeah. I'd like to eat less meat than I do right now. That's why I'm looking into a lot more vegetarian type recipes. -Rubystars |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
While frolicking around in alt.food.vegan, Rubystars of SBC
http://yahoo.sbc.com said: >What might be healthy for one person might not for another. > >For example, when my grandmother was sick and she was losing weight even >though she was drinking ensure and eating toast, the nurses told us to give >her ice cream mixed in with the ensure to add in extra calories. That did >the trick and she went back to her normal weight. > >Now we know that ice cream generally isn't considered health food, but in >that case it was healthy and it helped her to recover. > >In general people should avoid consuming too much red meat and probably not >eat too much meat anyway. However, for someone with an iron deficiency and >who knows what else, a big juicy steak might be what helps them, even if >it's generally considered to be an unhealthy choice. > >Someone who is allergic to peanut butter and who avoids it for health >reasons, may recommend peanut butter to someone else if they need a little >extra protein, for example. > I see your point. >> There's many people who go by meat in moderation, and if it works for >> them, fine by me. People should eat what they think is right for them. > >Yeah. I'd like to eat less meat than I do right now. That's why I'm looking >into a lot more vegetarian type recipes. > Good move. I'm trying to cut down on sugar, myself, as it's the main Bad Thing in my diet. I don't know if eating lots of clementines goes against that, but I do enjoy clementines, and the supermarkets have begun selling them now. I don't know how it is where you are, but it's a christmassy thing here; outside November/December you hardly ever see them. -- Nikitta a.a. #1759 Apatriot(No, not apricot)#18 ICQ# 251532856 Unreferenced footnotes: http://www.nut.house.cx/cgi-bin/nemwiki.pl?ISFN "Benighted lot, them RLers." Sn!pe (Sheddie) |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
"MEow" > wrote in message <snip> > > >> There's many people who go by meat in moderation, and if it works for > >> them, fine by me. People should eat what they think is right for them. > > > >Yeah. I'd like to eat less meat than I do right now. That's why I'm looking > >into a lot more vegetarian type recipes. > > > Good move. I'm trying to cut down on sugar, myself, as it's the main > Bad Thing in my diet. > > I don't know if eating lots of clementines goes against that, but I do > enjoy clementines, and the supermarkets have begun selling them now. I > don't know how it is where you are, but it's a christmassy thing here; > outside November/December you hardly ever see them. I had to go look them up to find out what clementines were, but I see they're mandarin oranges. A lot of people here like to eat citrus fruits and nuts this time of year. -Rubystars |
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I have a small iron defficiency- which food should I eat?
Rubystars wrote:
<snip> > In general people should avoid consuming too much red meat and probably not > eat too much meat anyway. It's not too big of an issue if it's lean. Not all "red meat" is the same. > However, for someone with an iron deficiency and > who knows what else, a big juicy steak might be what helps them, even if > it's generally considered to be an unhealthy choice. Even a little meat in moderation should benefit someone with anemia. One of the studies I didn't cite before showed that nonheme iron was absorbed more easily in the presence of heme iron from meat. The study showed that just eating 50 or 75 grams (about an eighth of a pound) of pork increased nonheme absorption by 44% to 57% (respectively on 50g and 75g trials). http://tinyurl.com/x8b2 <snip> |
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