Hi everyone

If this post is totally crazy, I apologise in advance!

I could've sworn in the last few days, I have seen information relating
to caffiene in tea that puzzles me. In short, it is, if you want to
feel the full effects of caffiene in tea, you brew for a short period
of time, but that the longer you brew, the more the effects of caffiene
subside, and a more calming beverage prevails.

I know that if you can reduce the caffiene content by doing a short
brew and discarding the liquid, and then rebrewing, but the above
method doesn't call for throwing away anything. Did I dream this, or is
there truth behind this?

Thanks!!

Linda

Linda > wrote:
>
>I could've sworn in the last few days, I have seen information relating
>to caffiene in tea that puzzles me. In short, it is, if you want to
>feel the full effects of caffiene in tea, you brew for a short period
>of time, but that the longer you brew, the more the effects of caffiene
>subside, and a more calming beverage prevails.

This doesn't make a lot of sense to me, except in that since the caffeine
comes out very quickly, using a smaller amount of tea and steeping for
longer will result in a cup with less caffeine.

That is, as you continue steeping, after the first minute the caffeine
has pretty much mostly come out, but other things still keep coming out.

>I know that if you can reduce the caffiene content by doing a short
>brew and discarding the liquid, and then rebrewing, but the above
>method doesn't call for throwing away anything. Did I dream this, or is
>there truth behind this?

The question is how you like your tea to taste.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

It's true that most of the caffeine is released in the first 15-30
seconds of steeping. I think that the posts and/or information you're
thinking of are in support of reducing the caffeine by doing a quick
short steep, tossing it out, and brewing a second cup (which then would
have less caffeine).

A longer steep will have just as much caffeine as a shorter steep,
perhaps more if there's any of it lingering around in the leaf after
that first 30 seconds.

I mean to say, tea can never have any more caffeine, but it certainly
can have less.

"Linda" > wrote in message

> I could've sworn in the last few days, I have seen information relating
> to caffiene in tea that puzzles me. In short, it is, if you want to
> feel the full effects of caffiene in tea, you brew for a short period
> of time, but that the longer you brew, the more the effects of caffiene
> subside, and a more calming beverage prevails.

I have seen the same story, but article didn't say the cafeine disappeared,
its effect was only compensating by other elements (tanins ?) that have a
calming effect and are released in the brew later than the cafeine.

Kuri

kuri wrote:
> "Linda" > wrote in message
>
> > I could've sworn in the last few days, I have seen information relating
> > to caffiene in tea that puzzles me. In short, it is, if you want to
> > feel the full effects of caffiene in tea, you brew for a short period
> > of time, but that the longer you brew, the more the effects of caffiene
> > subside, and a more calming beverage prevails.
>
> I have seen the same story, but article didn't say the cafeine disappeared,
> its effect was only compensating by other elements (tanins ?) that have a
> calming effect and are released in the brew later than the cafeine.

And I could have sworn I saw something somewhere -- maybe in the FAQ to
this group, maybe elsewhere -- wherein the writer described the process
for decaffeinating tea with the 30-second rinse, and added that a
friend preferred to actually drink the results of the wash because it
was the only thing that gave him a "clean burn" -- all the caffeine,
without the other compounds that give tea its sedative effects.

stePH
now drinking: Red Hook IPA

Linda schrieb:

> I could've sworn in the last few days, I have seen information relating
> to caffiene in tea that puzzles me. In short, it is, if you want to
> feel the full effects of caffiene in tea, you brew for a short period
> of time, but that the longer you brew, the more the effects of caffiene
> subside, and a more calming beverage prevails.

Hi Linda,

I suppose it refers to the old story, that tannins (which infuse more
the longer the tea steeps) alter biochemically the coffein so that it
is no longer active. Despite this is total rubbish, esp. in Germany
this story ist VERY popular (even the German wikipedia article cites it
as a fact). Maybe you read or saw something similar?

In Germany it is also very popular to think (because of this mentioned
above, and because of the idea tannins should work like a mild
sedative) that tea with a long infusion time has a sedating effect. So
people go to their doctors or even to a sleep lab and complain they
can't sleep at all anymore despite they drink a pot of long-steeped tea
every evening. And they all know someone who does that too and for
him/her that works fine. If you ask, it is mostly an old lady, which is
likeliy because caffein in older people has a paradox effect. But
anybody else gives himself a good strong caffeine shot - no question
why they cannot sleep ...

Btw the only thing on what tannins have a "sedating" effect, is your
gastro-intestinal tract.


Greetz, Dieter

Scott Dorsey wrote:
> That is, as you continue steeping, after the first minute the caffeine
> has pretty much mostly come out, but other things still keep coming out.

Just to beat this horsefly dead scientifically:

For a given amount of tea flavor, you can do one of two things:

Steep 10 g of tea in a cup of water for 30 seconds.
Steep 2 g of tea in a cup of water for 3 mnutes.

But the first of these will give you nearly 5 times as much caffeine,
because almost all the caffeine is released in the first 30 seconds.

(Actually, I think the first cup will still taste and look rather weak;
I may have to try it and see...but it's a lot of tea to use up in a
hurry...and the only inexpensive leaf tea I have right now is decaf, so
other chemical effects may be altered in it as well...)

--Blair

Blair P. Houghton wrote:
> Just to beat this horsefly dead scientifically:
>
> For a given amount of tea flavor, you can do one of two things:
>
> Steep 10 g of tea in a cup of water for 30 seconds.
> Steep 2 g of tea in a cup of water for 3 mnutes.
>
> But the first of these will give you nearly 5 times as much caffeine,
> because almost all the caffeine is released in the first 30 seconds.
>
> (Actually, I think the first cup will still taste and look rather weak;
> I may have to try it and see...but it's a lot of tea to use up in a
> hurry...and the only inexpensive leaf tea I have right now is decaf, so
> other chemical effects may be altered in it as well...)

Isn't the first procedure you describe basically gong-fu?


stePH
in cup: Stash ginger peach (black)

"kuri" > writes:

> "Linda" > wrote in message
>
> > I could've sworn in the last few days, I have seen information relating
> > to caffiene in tea that puzzles me. In short, it is, if you want to
> > feel the full effects of caffiene in tea, you brew for a short period
> > of time, but that the longer you brew, the more the effects of caffiene
> > subside, and a more calming beverage prevails.
>
> I have seen the same story, but article didn't say the cafeine disappeared,
> its effect was only compensating by other elements (tanins ?) that have a
> calming effect and are released in the brew later than the cafeine.

The component you're thinking of isn't tannins, but theanine, which is
an amino acid. It not only modulates caffeine's stimulant effect, it
also counteracts astringency.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

"Jason F in Los Angeles" > writes:

> It's true that most of the caffeine is released in the first 15-30
> seconds of steeping.

Lots of people believe this, but I've never seen the record of an
actual measurement supporting the idea. Can you point to one?

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

I stand corrected!

http://www.nobleharbor.com/tea/caffiene.html
points to a study from Food Research International (A solid-seeming
peer-reviewed journal publishing research papers -
http://authors.elsevier.com/JournalD...70&Precis=DESC
) that has three interesting conclusions:

1) there is no discernible difference in brewed caffeine contents in
different types of tea.
2) A second brewing of tea yields 65-70% of the caffeine that was
present in the first brew of 1 minute, so it's by no means
decaffeinated.
3) "Caffeine content does depend on brew technique and leaf size and
variety, and that without an accurate analysis as such available from a
qualified laboratory, one cannot assert that some teas have a lower or
greater caffeine dose."

Anyone know any other studies?

~j

Lewis Perin wrote:
> "Jason F in Los Angeles" > writes:
>
> > It's true that most of the caffeine is released in the first 15-30
> > seconds of steeping.
>
> Lots of people believe this, but I've never seen the record of an
> actual measurement supporting the idea. Can you point to one?
>
> /Lew
> ---
> Lew Perin /
> http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

A 2001 paper by a Unilever Research team from Bedford, England, found
that anything from growing conditions to the age of leaves, plant
cultivars and methods of cultivation affects tea's caffeine content.
All these things remaining equal, the temperature of water, leaves to
water ratio and steeping times also have a big impact on caffeine in
the end brew.

When it comes to steeping times specifically, it is true that a lot of
the caffeine content is extracted in the first thirty seconds. As the
brew time increases, the rate at which caffeine is extracted from the
leaves slows down-but that's doesn't mean that the longer leaves are
steeped, the less caffeine content the brew will have. In fact, it's
quite the opposite.

According to this study, 34.6% of caffeine is extracted from the
average teabag in the first 30 seconds of infusion. This figure will go
up to just over 50% after a minute. After 5 minutes, the total caffeine
extracted from the leaves will have gone up to more than 90%. By
contrast, polyphenols are extracted more slowly, with just 19.9%
extracted in the first 30 seconds. So the longer you steep your tea,
the lower you push the rate of caffeine extraction per second and the
ratio of caffeine to polyphenols--but the overall amount of caffeine
will go up. Of course, if you are discarding the first infusion, the
subsequent brews will have less caffeine and comparatively more
polyphenols. Although the study looked specifically at teabags, I
believe they said its results could be extended to loose leaves too.

The Linus Pauling Institute
(http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocente...chemicals/tea/) has a quick
overview of caffeine in tea with links to the abstracts of a number of
studies, if anyone is interested.