Tea (rec.drink.tea) Discussion relating to tea, the world's second most consumed beverage (after water), made by infusing or boiling the leaves of the tea plant (C. sinensis or close relatives) in water.

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
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Default Open letter to Ms. Rebecca Brown (Ore)

Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
cc. Usenet.


You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET forum. I
respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of my
own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press and
Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the subject.
This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not answer it
in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel as
soon as I figure out how their media works.
I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources would
be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read this
letter.

As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I proposed
and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.

Regards,

Alex Chaihorsky.
5774 Tappan Dr.
Reno, NV 89523


  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

So now what are we suppose to think? We'll say something else that
will trip your hot button and threaten us with punitive actions.
Calling someone in Usenet a Liar is like calling them a Troll. It is
meaningless and used for dramatic punctuation. If the accused suspects
you of tall tales and calls them a lie that's her opinion. Usenet is
nothing more than opinions that barely rise above the background noice
of slurs and innuendos. I'd be more concerned about what this
community thinks than the media. I hound the guy and he's still here.
He has a thick hide. You need one in Usenet. It ain't for the
sensitive or squeemish. I think you have it in for us liberals. I'm
the only liberal between here and Chinatown.

Jim

Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
> cc. Usenet.
>
>
> You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
> potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET forum. I
> respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of my
> own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press and
> Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the subject.
> This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not answer it
> in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel as
> soon as I figure out how their media works.
> I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources would
> be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read this
> letter.
>
> As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I proposed
> and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
> apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.
>
> Regards,
>
> Alex Chaihorsky.
> 5774 Tappan Dr.
> Reno, NV 89523


  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

That is your opinion and I respect it. Mine's different. You can say
anything you want and question anything I say. But if you call me a liar or
a rapist or a thief, I will take measures similar to these. USENET or not
USENET, this is public record. If most people choose to wipe the spit off
their faces, spitting back, I don't. That is my personal and legal choice.
BTW, there is no legal definition of "troll" and calling someone that is
meaningless outside USENET. "Liar" is different. And you know that.

Sasha.


"Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> So now what are we suppose to think? We'll say something else that
> will trip your hot button and threaten us with punitive actions.
> Calling someone in Usenet a Liar is like calling them a Troll. It is
> meaningless and used for dramatic punctuation. If the accused suspects
> you of tall tales and calls them a lie that's her opinion. Usenet is
> nothing more than opinions that barely rise above the background noice
> of slurs and innuendos. I'd be more concerned about what this
> community thinks than the media. I hound the guy and he's still here.
> He has a thick hide. You need one in Usenet. It ain't for the
> sensitive or squeemish. I think you have it in for us liberals. I'm
> the only liberal between here and Chinatown.
>
> Jim
>
> Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
>> Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
>> cc. Usenet.
>>
>>
>> You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
>> potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET forum. I
>> respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of my
>> own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press
>> and
>> Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the
>> subject.
>> This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not answer
>> it
>> in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel as
>> soon as I figure out how their media works.
>> I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources
>> would
>> be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read
>> this
>> letter.
>>
>> As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I proposed
>> and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
>> apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Alex Chaihorsky.
>> 5774 Tappan Dr.
>> Reno, NV 89523

>



  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

It's not a criminal act to call someone a liar. It is a criminal act
to lie under oath. Applying libel and copyright laws to USENET is so
far a waste of time in court. You have no real legal remedy. Instead
you're taking your case to the media. You can't lose. Is liar,
rapist, and thief the extent of pursuable measures on your part? I
want you to state the full extent for the public record since you made
the threat to me and others.

Jim

Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> That is your opinion and I respect it. Mine's different. You can say
> anything you want and question anything I say. But if you call me a liar or
> a rapist or a thief, I will take measures similar to these. USENET or not
> USENET, this is public record. If most people choose to wipe the spit off
> their faces, spitting back, I don't. That is my personal and legal choice.
> BTW, there is no legal definition of "troll" and calling someone that is
> meaningless outside USENET. "Liar" is different. And you know that.
>
> Sasha.
>
>
> "Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
> ups.com...
> > So now what are we suppose to think? We'll say something else that
> > will trip your hot button and threaten us with punitive actions.
> > Calling someone in Usenet a Liar is like calling them a Troll. It is
> > meaningless and used for dramatic punctuation. If the accused suspects
> > you of tall tales and calls them a lie that's her opinion. Usenet is
> > nothing more than opinions that barely rise above the background noice
> > of slurs and innuendos. I'd be more concerned about what this
> > community thinks than the media. I hound the guy and he's still here.
> > He has a thick hide. You need one in Usenet. It ain't for the
> > sensitive or squeemish. I think you have it in for us liberals. I'm
> > the only liberal between here and Chinatown.
> >
> > Jim
> >
> > Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> >> Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
> >> cc. Usenet.
> >>
> >>
> >> You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
> >> potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET forum. I
> >> respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of my
> >> own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press
> >> and
> >> Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the
> >> subject.
> >> This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not answer
> >> it
> >> in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel as
> >> soon as I figure out how their media works.
> >> I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources
> >> would
> >> be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read
> >> this
> >> letter.
> >>
> >> As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I proposed
> >> and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
> >> apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Alex Chaihorsky.
> >> 5774 Tappan Dr.
> >> Reno, NV 89523

> >


  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

And I never called it a criminal act. And I never threatened anyone with a
criminal action. So, do not make it look like I did.

The situation is very simple. I am amazed that as a lawyer you do not see
it.:
1. One insults someone to the extent that he/she is now angry enough to take
a counteraction. It was your free will to insult, be prepared to find
yourself on a receiving end of someone exercising his fee will too. All
within legal boundaries, of course.
2. One is offered several remedies to satisfy the insulted and one neither
agree to them, no offer alternative solution. One understands that this will
put him (or her) in an unfavorable position when such situation will be in
front of a judge or a court of public opinion. One has chosen a path of war.
3. In that case one needs to be prepared that one's opponent will take steps
within legal or public system to get satisfaction. That is called
"responsibility for your actions" and is part of the natural justice system.

Depending on the jurisdiction, legal situation and money/time available to
the angry party it could be anything. I do not go through an American law
school and cannot represent anyone but myself, but I went through many legal
business proceedings and studied law to the extent that I am comfortable
representing myself in non-criminal cases or cases that does not involve
potential serious damages against me.
As soon as I get off "the boat" onto these shores, I understood almost
instantaneously that a person here can be taken to court for any, however
stupid and miniscule reason and that translated immediately into huge legal
bills. Comparing to these expenses the outcome of the case may be completely
irrelevant. That was an implicit attack on my freedom (you may not agree)
and I dedicated a certain amount of time and money to investigate the
situation and acquire enough knowledge to be my own lawyer, thus taking
(albeit only partially) my freedom not to be robbed by some petty lawsuit
back.

You (and nobody else) is in any danger from my stance -
1. Do not knowingly insult me (your mother should have told you that
already)
2. When you do and I offer you a way out (an apology or retraction or
arbitration of any sort) take it.
3. If you did not take it - do not be surprised by my actions.

I think if more people will follow my example, USENET would become a much
more civilized, informative an in general humane place.
I also think if more people would study law just not to be scared of a petty
lawsuits, this country will definitely be better off and the amount of
freedom will increase. And, most probably, we will become more civil, polite
and respectful of others.
Should I call White House about this?

Cheers,

Sasha.



"Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> It's not a criminal act to call someone a liar. It is a criminal act
> to lie under oath. Applying libel and copyright laws to USENET is so
> far a waste of time in court. You have no real legal remedy. Instead
> you're taking your case to the media. You can't lose. Is liar,
> rapist, and thief the extent of pursuable measures on your part? I
> want you to state the full extent for the public record since you made
> the threat to me and others.
>
> Jim
>
> Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
>> That is your opinion and I respect it. Mine's different. You can say
>> anything you want and question anything I say. But if you call me a liar
>> or
>> a rapist or a thief, I will take measures similar to these. USENET or not
>> USENET, this is public record. If most people choose to wipe the spit off
>> their faces, spitting back, I don't. That is my personal and legal
>> choice.
>> BTW, there is no legal definition of "troll" and calling someone that is
>> meaningless outside USENET. "Liar" is different. And you know that.
>>
>> Sasha.
>>
>>
>> "Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
>> ups.com...
>> > So now what are we suppose to think? We'll say something else that
>> > will trip your hot button and threaten us with punitive actions.
>> > Calling someone in Usenet a Liar is like calling them a Troll. It is
>> > meaningless and used for dramatic punctuation. If the accused suspects
>> > you of tall tales and calls them a lie that's her opinion. Usenet is
>> > nothing more than opinions that barely rise above the background noice
>> > of slurs and innuendos. I'd be more concerned about what this
>> > community thinks than the media. I hound the guy and he's still here.
>> > He has a thick hide. You need one in Usenet. It ain't for the
>> > sensitive or squeemish. I think you have it in for us liberals. I'm
>> > the only liberal between here and Chinatown.
>> >
>> > Jim
>> >
>> > Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
>> >> Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
>> >> cc. Usenet.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
>> >> potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET
>> >> forum. I
>> >> respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of
>> >> my
>> >> own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press
>> >> and
>> >> Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the
>> >> subject.
>> >> This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not
>> >> answer
>> >> it
>> >> in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel
>> >> as
>> >> soon as I figure out how their media works.
>> >> I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources
>> >> would
>> >> be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read
>> >> this
>> >> letter.
>> >>
>> >> As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I
>> >> proposed
>> >> and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
>> >> apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Alex Chaihorsky.
>> >> 5774 Tappan Dr.
>> >> Reno, NV 89523
>> >

>





  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

You're just a loose cannon waiting to go off. One man's insult is
another man's compliment. There are no standards to determine an
insult. Just ethnic bigotry on your part about a Russian concept of
honor which got transmuted over time to include whatever aspecs of
American culture you don't like. We use to choose pistols to settle
insults. It turns out the better shot won. The dueling matches had a
QUID PRO QUO arrangement where the Second could offer the apology. I
apologize for whoever insulted you in the past or in the future.
You're the one being uncivil using intimidation. Save me the immigrant
whine about how you will save us from us. My Mom said you are being an
asshole. That wasn't an insult just her opinion.

Jim

Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> You (and nobody else) is in any danger from my stance -
> 1. Do not knowingly insult me (your mother should have told you that
> already)


  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
P_b
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article > ,
"Alex Chaihorsky" > wrote:
>
> I think if more people will follow my example, USENET would become a much
> more civilized, informative an in general humane place.
> I also think if more people would study law just not to be scared of a petty
> lawsuits, this country will definitely be better off and the amount of
> freedom will increase. And, most probably, we will become more civil, polite
> and respectful of others.


Your naivete extends to operatic proportions.
Usenet will NEVER be civil or polite. Usenet
is anarchy x's 100.

A lawsuit brought from a Usenet complaint
wouldn't even make it into court.
  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> You're just a loose cannon waiting to go off. One man's insult is
> another man's compliment. There are no standards to determine an
> insult.


Irrelevant - because I do not seek legal remedy. But I have my own standards
and my own lines. And the line is - libel. It is irrelevant how people
define insults. Libel - a different story. Calling someone a liar is libel
and that is why I GET INSULTED.

>Just ethnic bigotry on your part about a Russian concept of
> honor which got transmuted over time to include whatever aspecs of
> American culture you don't like. We use to choose pistols to settle
> insults.


And at that time - everyone in "civilized world" did that too. So, what's
the point? How is my Russian origin relevant in this? Just to create context
to bring he words "ethnic bigotry"? What for? To show me my "place"? The
more you try to irritate me the less you do, because you move yourself in my
mind from intellectually equal to someone who cannot win an argument without
childish anger spewing, name calling, attempts to insult... in short -
intellectually inferior. Which I do not think you are. So - why?

>It turns out the better shot won. The dueling matches had a
> QUID PRO QUO arrangement where the Second could offer the apology. I
> apologize for whoever insulted you in the past or in the future


You are a doll. But the only apology that makes sense is from an offender.
Unless she feels so ashamed of herself that she cannot type.

> You're the one being uncivil using intimidation.


With all due respect, Cowboy - you should see the irony of you commenting on
civility. I just hear laughter all over, honestly. Look back at your posts
in this group and really understand what you said from this angle. I think
you made my point for me, thank you. It may not entirly be your personal
fault. You may just fall into one of the traps of your profession. Because
practicing law is all intimidation and almost nothing but intimidation. That
is why, I think, so many schoolyard weaklings go to law schools - to get
their revenge for being bulled around by stronger boys. Law profession allow
one to feel powerful and intimidating without the need to be powerful and
intimidating. Same I saw many times in young policemen. I was surprised to
see almost none of that in young Westpoint cadets and young officers when I
had an honor of teaching some training courses there.. may be because they
are taught the concepts of honor and take it quite seriously, as opposed to
Police Academies.

Intimidation is attempting to make someone timid. I do not want her to be
timid - just to answer for her libelous insult. There are many ways to do
that and end this thing right away, but she (at least for now) choses the
confrontation. Whose fault is that?


>Save me the immigrant
> whine about how you will save us from us.


This also shows how civil you are. Yes, I am an immigrant and see no reason
to be shy about it (or proud of it, either). Whining? When? Who? Saving you
from you? What have you been smoking? Rest assured, Cowboy, I plan no such
thing. Sleep well.

>My Mom said you are being an
> asshole. That wasn't an insult just her opinion.


My regards to your Mom. She must be a very classy lady. Certainly she is
entitled to an opinion. Next time tell us also what she thinks about you. I
have a suspicion that she just adores you and think you are a cutest little
angry puppy on the planet. Tell he I agree wholeheartedly.

>
> Jim


Sasha.


  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Jules Dubois
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Thursday 23 June 2005 15:42, Space Cowboy >
s.com>) wrote:

> You're the one being uncivil using intimidation.


Plonk
  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"P_b" > wrote in message
...
> In article > ,
> "Alex Chaihorsky" > wrote:
>>
>> I think if more people will follow my example, USENET would become a much
>> more civilized, informative an in general humane place.
>> I also think if more people would study law just not to be scared of a
>> petty
>> lawsuits, this country will definitely be better off and the amount of
>> freedom will increase. And, most probably, we will become more civil,
>> polite
>> and respectful of others.

>
> Your naivete extends to operatic proportions.
> Usenet will NEVER be civil or polite. Usenet
> is anarchy x's 100.


And you are entitled to your opinion. But the fact that you use the word
"never" shows who is naive here.

>
> A lawsuit brought from a Usenet complaint
> wouldn't even make it into court.


Why don't you read what I said before you post? I do not seek legal remedy.
I am not interested in legal remedy. I think there are other remedies
(societal, corporate, cultural) that can be capable of making certain people
civil more so than rude intimidation of the punishment by law.

Sasha.





  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Michael Plant
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Would somebody who cares enough PLEASE write a short synopsis of the Rebecca
controversy. I don't want to sift through 2000 posts, but I'm curious to
know what's going down. An executive summary, please. Thanks much. Michael


Space 6/23/05


> So now what are we suppose to think? We'll say something else that
> will trip your hot button and threaten us with punitive actions.
> Calling someone in Usenet a Liar is like calling them a Troll. It is
> meaningless and used for dramatic punctuation. If the accused suspects
> you of tall tales and calls them a lie that's her opinion. Usenet is
> nothing more than opinions that barely rise above the background noice
> of slurs and innuendos. I'd be more concerned about what this
> community thinks than the media. I hound the guy and he's still here.
> He has a thick hide. You need one in Usenet. It ain't for the
> sensitive or squeemish. I think you have it in for us liberals. I'm
> the only liberal between here and Chinatown.
>
> Jim
>
> Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
>> Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
>> cc. Usenet.
>>
>>
>> You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
>> potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET forum. I
>> respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of my
>> own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press and
>> Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the subject.
>> This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not answer it
>> in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel as
>> soon as I figure out how their media works.
>> I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources would
>> be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read this
>> letter.
>>
>> As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I proposed
>> and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
>> apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Alex Chaihorsky.
>> 5774 Tappan Dr.
>> Reno, NV 89523

>


  #13 (permalink)   Report Post  
toci
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Caffeine poisoning and paranoia. toci

  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Michael Plant" > wrote in message
...
> Would somebody who cares enough PLEASE write a short synopsis of the
> Rebecca
> controversy. I don't want to sift through 2000 posts, but I'm curious to
> know what's going down. An executive summary, please. Thanks much. Michael
>


Executive Summary (2 pages).
This may be a little bit longer than you wanted, but

Sasha.

===============================================
Thread Bao vs. ...
By Rebecca O
5/19
...

One of the problems of jumping into a flame war is that the person being
attacked (kuri and Sasha were the main people saying the undefensible
things) doesn't tend to at that point distinguish between people
offering polite suggestions and people trying to score points. Mydnight
withdrew at that point. Sasha tried to continue the attack like the
person he has appeared to be all through this -- someone whose own
stories about his travels in China and his experiences with the captured
Japanese tea person sound to this teacher of English like stories that
he made up. I am willing to call him a liar until proven otherwise.
================================================== ======

<>Sasha: She also added in another message the same day:

(I know some of you have met Sasha and like him, but I think of him as a
ne-kulturni vez umni malchik c deneg, if I'm remembering my russki yazik
correctly. You guys are free to have another opinion).

I mostly ignore him unless he's trying to wrangle up support for his
unverifiable stories (and for me, his own word isn't good enough).
================================================== ================

<>Sasha: To which I answered a month later after I came back from Asia:

I have been traveling and working during this priceless exchange and missed
these peals of Rebecca's wisdom.
I am willing to prove the provable (my travel and work in ex-military
formerly closed territories in China) of what I was claiming with plane
tickets, original work agreements, official films of local TV stations
(featuring yours truly) about opening of our offices in rural towns just
south of Inner Mongolia and other things. But she has to step up to the
plate and put her money where her mouth is. We both shell send a money order
for say $5,000 to Michael Plant, Lew or DogMa (or any other well known
member of the group) and let him or some other group of judges decide if I
ever lied about my travel and work in China. The winning side will gets the
money. Until she does that, her baseless accusations remain what they are -
empty barkings. But as Turks say "It khurer, karavan kecher" - "The bitch
barks, but the caravan goes". So be it in our case too.

Certainly I cannot prove what happened almost 30 years ago on the shores of
Olenek river in Northern Siberia. And I do not intend to. This was my
personal experience and I do not give a flying puer cake if some
self-absorbed, yet another "professor" from CUNY believes me or not. But not
believing me is one thing and calling me a liar - another. Notice how this
"teacher of English" and an American, I presume, throws away ever so easily
the time honored Western tradition of presuming innocence until proven
guilty. She calls me a liar "until proven otherwise"! She feels that she has
a right to call a person a liar and demand that the only way she would
retract from that accusation if I "prove" myself to be right? No, lady, you
will have to risk some money on the table if you want proof. Until you do
that, your empty accusations only show others what you are made of.
I leave it to the public on this forum to judge why she would be so angry at
someone who she never met in her life? May be some of my remarks on her
ridiculous posts had something to do with it? But there were several posters
who ridiculed her "educated" opinion and she never attacked them... Eureka!
May be she had a Russian boyfriend who run away from her self-absorbed
attitude? That would at least explain her awful, louty Russian.

I think that she does have some alternative motives (like assuming in her
other post that I am rich, which I guess in CUNY's world is the biggest sin
in the universe). I have to disappoint her - I am not rich (moneywise) at
all - by any standards (unfortunately). However I lived a very rich life
filled with love, friendship, adventures and love again. And I think I have
done it honorably. I made a lot of lifetime friends (God bless them) and
certainly some envious enemies, (God bless them too). And that is why all I
feel toward the poor "linguist" is a deep sense of pity.

Sasha.
================================================== ========

To which she answered next day:

I have no doubt that you have more money than sense.

I don't believe you. Live with it. I don't want to meet you, don't
want to play games with you.

I don't care if you aren't lying, either. It sure sounds like bullshit
to me.

<Plonk>
================================================== =======

The rest is in recent threads that I started with hre name in the subject
line.

Sasha.


  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In Usenet an insult is called a flame. If you can't stand the heat get
out of the kitchen. All I proved in this post is you can hurl with the
best of them. You specifically refer to your intellectual superiority
and then call everyone else a moron, etc,etc. You stand guilty of
using the very same tactics used by the occused. What is good for the
goose is good for the gander. Essentially you GET INSULTED by anybody
who disagrees with you and then rig the debate by arbitarily deciding
the rigueur of any arguments in your favor. Calling someone a liar in
this culture in not an insult. You can tell a lie without lying. It
falls under not telling the truth or disinformation. You have failed
on the two accounts of your foundational integrity which you call in so
many words INTELLECTAL HONESTY. You won't recognize that there are
other valid points because you dismiss them as being inconsequential to
the weight of your own and you fish around in other posts looking for
non sequitors to prove your point. You're just another Usenet poster
mouthing off about some pre ordained vision of the world typical of the
intolerant and bigot right in this country. Please publish the name of
your employer and pertinent contact information so in libel action I
can go after deep pockets proving they should have fired your ass a
long time ago because they knew of your propensity to bully others
which the Supreme Court has ruled is part of the Civil Rights Act. I
usually stay out of other people's flame but you are a threat to us
all.

Jim

Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> "Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> > You're just a loose cannon waiting to go off.


> Irrelevant - because I do not seek legal remedy. But I have my own standards
> and my own lines. And the line is - libel. It is irrelevant how people
> define insults. Libel - a different story. Calling someone a liar is libel
> and that is why I GET INSULTED.




  #16 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I love you Jim.
But you have to think about your health. Put some cold water on your
backside.

1. Never called neither you nor her a moron. Don't have to. Did you have a
bad dream?

2. I will stay or not stay in the kitchen according to my own desire and
plans. Thanks for the advice. This was truly profound.

3. Never get insulted by people who disagree with me - evidence all over
this forum, too numerous to quote. Never was accused of such by anyone
before.

4. My employer, etc - do your own research, buddy. You mention libel
action - have I ever published anything libelous about you? Besides sending
you some Tibet teas? Please, clarify, because if I did, I will definitely
retract and apologize. If not, you disqualified your action by threatening
me with frivolous lawsuit based on non-event. That would actually be an
interesting thing to discuss at Colorado Bar Association.
BTW, are there any public ethical conduct rules that would be applicable to
our discussion here?

5.Re-read your words: "...so in libel action I can go after deep pockets
proving they should have fired your ass a long time ago because they knew of
your propensity to bully others which the Supreme Court has ruled is part of
the Civil Rights Act". This is priceless. "Libel action based on.. my bully
record?!" Civil Rights Act?! Are you sure you ARE a lawyer or this is just
a game you and Mommy play?

6. I enjoy this. This is better than Chris Rock. I am sure Mike Petro is
laughing his puer ass off. Thank you, Jim!

Sasha.

"Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> In Usenet an insult is called a flame. If you can't stand the heat get
> out of the kitchen. All I proved in this post is you can hurl with the
> best of them. You specifically refer to your intellectual superiority
> and then call everyone else a moron, etc,etc. You stand guilty of
> using the very same tactics used by the occused. What is good for the
> goose is good for the gander. Essentially you GET INSULTED by anybody
> who disagrees with you and then rig the debate by arbitarily deciding
> the rigueur of any arguments in your favor. Calling someone a liar in
> this culture in not an insult. You can tell a lie without lying. It
> falls under not telling the truth or disinformation. You have failed
> on the two accounts of your foundational integrity which you call in so
> many words INTELLECTAL HONESTY. You won't recognize that there are
> other valid points because you dismiss them as being inconsequential to
> the weight of your own and you fish around in other posts looking for
> non sequitors to prove your point. You're just another Usenet poster
> mouthing off about some pre ordained vision of the world typical of the
> intolerant and bigot right in this country. Please publish the name of
> your employer and pertinent contact information so in libel action I
> can go after deep pockets proving they should have fired your ass a
> long time ago because they knew of your propensity to bully others
> which the Supreme Court has ruled is part of the Civil Rights Act. I
> usually stay out of other people's flame but you are a threat to us
> all.
>
> Jim
>
> Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
>> "Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>> > You're just a loose cannon waiting to go off.

>
>> Irrelevant - because I do not seek legal remedy. But I have my own
>> standards
>> and my own lines. And the line is - libel. It is irrelevant how people
>> define insults. Libel - a different story. Calling someone a liar is
>> libel
>> and that is why I GET INSULTED.

>



  #17 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

It doesn't matter. He just insulted my Mom. He called her a "Classy
Lady" which in the cultural context of the cowboy West also means a
whore. You know Miss Kitty and Gunsmoke. In Indian parlance he
speakes with forked tongue or in southern drawl where I grew up both
sides of his mouth.

Jim

Michael Plant wrote:
> Would somebody who cares enough PLEASE write a short synopsis of the Rebecca
> controversy. I don't want to sift through 2000 posts, but I'm curious to
> know what's going down. An executive summary, please. Thanks much. Michael
>
>
> Space 6/23/05
>
>
> > So now what are we suppose to think? We'll say something else that
> > will trip your hot button and threaten us with punitive actions.
> > Calling someone in Usenet a Liar is like calling them a Troll. It is
> > meaningless and used for dramatic punctuation. If the accused suspects
> > you of tall tales and calls them a lie that's her opinion. Usenet is
> > nothing more than opinions that barely rise above the background noice
> > of slurs and innuendos. I'd be more concerned about what this
> > community thinks than the media. I hound the guy and he's still here.
> > He has a thick hide. You need one in Usenet. It ain't for the
> > sensitive or squeemish. I think you have it in for us liberals. I'm
> > the only liberal between here and Chinatown.
> >
> > Jim
> >
> > Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> >> Dear Ms. Brown (Ore),
> >> cc. Usenet.
> >>
> >>
> >> You have exercised your First Amendment right and posted numerous
> >> potentially libelous statements about me on international USENET forum. I
> >> respect your Constitutional right and would like to excursive same of my
> >> own, by sending letters about what happened to Temple University Press and
> >> Temple University Public Radio who appeared to be interested in the subject.
> >> This is just a letter or courtesy, you are free to answer or not answer it
> >> in any way you find appropriate. I am also planning to contact Drexel as
> >> soon as I figure out how their media works.
> >> I have not yet figured out what other publications and media resources would
> >> be interested in such a subject but I am doing my research as you read this
> >> letter.
> >>
> >> As you rejected my offer to resolve this issue with the remedy I proposed
> >> and never offered a different one or a public retraction with a proper
> >> apology, I will seek satisfaction the way I see fit.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Alex Chaihorsky.
> >> 5774 Tappan Dr.
> >> Reno, NV 89523

> >


  #18 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alex Chaihorsky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dear Rebecca -

You called me a liar EXPLICITLY. I quote:"I am willing to call him a liar
until proven otherwise." You should at least be truthful about these things
if you believe them to be true.
I would not ever even pay attention at you not believing me (I truly do not
care) having seen your record of being banned on other forums. Please, do
not hide behind that pathetic girlish "His honor has been deeply and
grievously offended by a female who only makes $25K a year as an adjunct
instructor of English" and stop playing poor old lady who was robbed on the
streets by a big bad Russian guy! How can you sink to this level? You are a
well-known feminist, for God's sake, have some pride in it!

Hiding behind your low salary is beyond pathetic. It has nothing to do with
the subject. Does you low salary makes you rude? Or it forces you to insult
others?
Retract, apologize and go about your life. That is how easy it is. Believe
or not believe anything you want, but be careful calling people liars.

Sasha.


"Rebecca Ore" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> Michael Plant > wrote:
>
>> Would somebody who cares enough PLEASE write a short synopsis of the
>> Rebecca
>> controversy. I don't want to sift through 2000 posts, but I'm curious to
>> know what's going down. An executive summary, please. Thanks much.
>> Michael
>>

>
> I said I didn't believe half of what he said and he took serious
> exception to that, offered a wager to prove he did travel in places
> forbidden to other Westerners. I said I didn't really care. He
> Googled, found my resume on line and decided to contact my employers to
> tell them what a bad bad person I was to have said I didn't believe him
> in a Usenet group.
>
> Or at least he says he did.
>
> Alex thought because I was a published writer, I had tons of money and
> could put up $5,000 to have his friends verify this proof that he'd
> travelled where no Westerner had gone before, etc. At least once other
> person observed that this wasn't an offer that I was likely to take him
> up on, whether or not I had a spare $5K to send to have one of his
> friends say that his proof was good.
>
> His honor has been deeply and grievously offended by a female who only
> makes $25K a year as an adjunct instructor of English. I didn't realize
> earlier that he was that much of a crank (Google him; I should have done
> that earlier).
>
> I'm sure he did indeed travel in China, just not sure how one would
> prove that he travelled in China in places previously forbidden to
> Westerners and knew that the level of literacy there was higher than
> what Mydnight was reporting from the areas of China where he was
> visiting.
>
> I apologize to the group for calling Alex a person who embellishes both
> reality and his importance. I'm genuinely sorry I did this and stuff.



  #19 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I love you and in our culture I have to qualify that by saying I am not
***. At least I can find what you sent. No he isn't. You're
welcome. I watched a movie called Earth last night about the 1947
division of India. There a poignant where a group of friends who were
Muslim,Hindu,Shik are calling each other liars based on historical
mistrust. Have you read "Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them: A
Fair and Balanced Look at the Right" by Al Franken. There is nothing
more dangerous than a lie presented as a truth.

Jim

Alex Chaihorsky wrote:
> I love you Jim.
> 4. Besides sending you some Tibet teas?
> 6. I am sure Mike Petro is laughing his puer ass off.
> Thank you, Jim!
>
> Sasha.


  #20 (permalink)   Report Post  
kuri
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Space Cowboy" > wrote in message

> There is nothing more dangerous than a lie presented as a truth.


A truth presented as a lie ?

Kuri




  #21 (permalink)   Report Post  
Scott Dorsey
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Michael Plant > wrote:
>Would somebody who cares enough PLEASE write a short synopsis of the Rebecca
>controversy. I don't want to sift through 2000 posts, but I'm curious to
>know what's going down. An executive summary, please. Thanks much. Michael


In the Empire of Zee,
They grew tea.
And in the Yalek State,
Their biscuits were great.
And so a great war had to be
Over teatime supremacy.
They fought with knife and gun and bomb
They fought most hard, they fought most long.
So now a wasteland is all you see
Where once was Yalek and was Zee.
And merchants from the land of Zotz
Find no sales for their teapots.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  #22 (permalink)   Report Post  
Derek
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 12:17:53 GMT, Rebecca Ore wrote:

> I apologize to the group for calling Alex a person who embellishes both
> reality and his importance.


What you did was call him a liar. And when he suggested that he had proof
he wasn't (even if I disagree with how he did it), you stated:

>> I don't care if you aren't lying, either. It sure sounds like bullshit
>> to me.


So you called him a liar and then stated that you didn't even care if that
accusation was true.

You and Sasha are both digging your own holes.

> I'm genuinely sorry I did this and stuff.


Somehow, I honestly doubt that.

--
Derek

The tallest blade of grass is the first to be cut by the lawn mower.
  #23 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

That's not what I said but it can work that way also. Eulogys are lies
presented as truth or just about anything a politician says. I guess
any example of disinformation is the truth presented as a lie.

Jim

kuri wrote:
> "Space Cowboy" > wrote in message
>
> > There is nothing more dangerous than a lie presented as a truth.

>
> A truth presented as a lie ?
>
> Kuri


  #24 (permalink)   Report Post  
Marlene Wood
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thanks Scott,
I love it. Perfect analogy.
Marlene


>
> In the Empire of Zee,
> They grew tea.
> And in the Yalek State,
> Their biscuits were great.
> And so a great war had to be
> Over teatime supremacy.
> They fought with knife and gun and bomb
> They fought most hard, they fought most long.
> So now a wasteland is all you see
> Where once was Yalek and was Zee.
> And merchants from the land of Zotz
> Find no sales for their teapots.
> --scott
> --
> "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."



  #25 (permalink)   Report Post  
pilo_
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article >,
Rebecca Ore > wrote:

> I came here to get away from ****heads and trolls. If I'm being one now
> or contributing to the noise, I should unsubscribe the group. I don't
> find braggart blowhards worth reading and since I appear to be egging
> the problem on, I'll leave.


oh christ - don't martyr yourself. coming
here to get away from trolls and '****heads'
and then calling someone a liar in stark and
vehement terms - rightly or wrongly - is not
probably the best way to foster good will.
and look what's happened - a big fight, with
you smack dab in the middle of it.

bet you haven't left yet.


  #26 (permalink)   Report Post  
Derek
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 19:05:03 GMT, Rebecca Ore wrote:

> In article >, Derek > wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 12:17:53 GMT, Rebecca Ore wrote:
>>
>>> I apologize to the group for calling Alex a person who embellishes both
>>> reality and his importance.

>>
>> What you did was call him a liar. And when he suggested that he had proof
>> he wasn't (even if I disagree with how he did it), you stated:
>>
>>>> I don't care if you aren't lying, either. It sure sounds like bullshit
>>>> to me.

>>
>> So you called him a liar and then stated that you didn't even care if that
>> accusation was true.

>
> I didn't know his history before. Google on him. He's quite the
> cantankerous fellow.


And this justifies your behavior how, exactly? He's cantankerous, so you
get to make unsubstantiated accusations?

>> You and Sasha are both digging your own holes.
>>
>>> I'm genuinely sorry I did this and stuff.

>>
>> Somehow, I honestly doubt that.

>
> I came here to get away from ****heads and trolls. If I'm being one now
> or contributing to the noise, I should unsubscribe the group. I don't
> find braggart blowhards worth reading and since I appear to be egging
> the problem on, I'll leave.


No one is forcing you to read his posts. If you doubt their veracity, don't
read them. But don't try to play the innocent victim who's been forced from
the group.

You chose your words, and you chose to state your opinions. If you don't
like the response you've gotten, perhaps you should consider learning to
choose your words more carefully.

--
Derek

The journey of a thousand miles sometimes ends very, very badly.
  #27 (permalink)   Report Post  
Space Cowboy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The only reason I keep coming back is where else are you going to find
kindred spirits interested in sharing their experiences with tea. I'll
put up with the crap because it is a wasteland trying to connect with
others in the real world. I made a run to Chinatown yesterday to pick
up some roasted duck for a get together today. All I'll do is reheat
it on a grill. I'm going to make some Yunnan Black Gold for ice tea.
I think the wonderful smoky vanilla flavor will go great with the duck
plus sooth the stomach. I found a box with 48 green Xiao(mini) tuocha.
It was packed in HongKong and $4 for the total weight of 8 ounces.
You can peel the tuocha by hand. It isn't the best cheap green pu'rh
I've tasted. I've noticed the grindstone tuochas has the best taste.

Jim

Rebecca Ore wrote:
> I came here to get away from ****heads and trolls. If I'm being one now
> or contributing to the noise, I should unsubscribe the group. I don't
> find braggart blowhards worth reading and since I appear to be egging
> the problem on, I'll leave.


  #28 (permalink)   Report Post  
Michael Plant
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Scott /24/05

> Michael Plant > wrote:
>> Would somebody who cares enough PLEASE write a short synopsis of the Rebecca
>> controversy. I don't want to sift through 2000 posts, but I'm curious to
>> know what's going down. An executive summary, please. Thanks much. Michael

>
> In the Empire of Zee,
> They grew tea.
> And in the Yalek State,
> Their biscuits were great.
> And so a great war had to be
> Over teatime supremacy.
> They fought with knife and gun and bomb
> They fought most hard, they fought most long.
> So now a wasteland is all you see
> Where once was Yalek and was Zee.
> And merchants from the land of Zotz
> Find no sales for their teapots.


Thanks, Scott. I was waiting for someone who could express it in a few well
chosen lines. Saves me a LOT of useless reading. Again, thanks much.

Michael

  #29 (permalink)   Report Post  
Michael Plant
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Rebecca 6/24/05


> In article >, Derek > wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 12:17:53 GMT, Rebecca Ore wrote:
>>
>>> I apologize to the group for calling Alex a person who embellishes both
>>> reality and his importance.

>>
>> What you did was call him a liar. And when he suggested that he had proof
>> he wasn't (even if I disagree with how he did it), you stated:
>>
>>>> I don't care if you aren't lying, either. It sure sounds like bullshit
>>>> to me.

>>
>> So you called him a liar and then stated that you didn't even care if that
>> accusation was true.

>
> I didn't know his history before. Google on him. He's quite the
> cantankerous fellow.
>
>>
>> You and Sasha are both digging your own holes.
>>
>>> I'm genuinely sorry I did this and stuff.

>>
>> Somehow, I honestly doubt that.

>
> I came here to get away from ****heads and trolls. If I'm being one now
> or contributing to the noise, I should unsubscribe the group. I don't
> find braggart blowhards worth reading and since I appear to be egging
> the problem on, I'll leave.


Nobody should leave. Just cut the crap and get back to the business at hand:
Leaves.
Michael
Speaking of which I'm drinking from a 3 gram button (little tuocha) of old
tree Pu'erh from 101 Plantation, which started out as nothing, but developed
with the third steep into something almost pleasant. Still not much to
recommend it. It is the most beautiful little tuocha I've ever seen, though.

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